# The Trump Administration: A Clusterfuck in the Making **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 7, 2016, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070 "2016-12-07T00:25:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1999
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2020, 5:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/39965 "2020-01-17T05:35:56Z")
> [@drad\_dog](#): > > Did the “Fox news all that bad” thread get deleted? I can’t find it. It’s in GD ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2020, 5:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/39966 "2020-01-17T05:49:02Z")
> [@drad\_dog](#): > > Did the “Fox news all that bad” thread get deleted? I can’t find it. [here you go](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=667548); been pretty quiet for a while. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2020, 9:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/39967 "2020-01-17T09:59:00Z")
> [@Kobal2](#): > > Well yes. Because of Epstein’s connection with the uranium. Dude, that’s just obvious. Wait till you make the connection with the covert Teletubbies reference in the second episode of The Witcher. That’s a definite countdown sign for The Event. Oh God. I just pictured the dryads fighting over who gets to wear purple today. Please don’t do this to me! ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2020, 1:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/39968 "2020-01-17T13:46:43Z")
The New York Times has a [review](https://www.nytimes.com/2020/01/16/books/review-very-stable-genius-donald-trump-philip-rucker-carol-leonnig.html) (paywall warning) of a new book, A Very Stable Genius, by Philip Rucker and Carol Leonnig, Pulitzer Prize-winning journalists with the Washington Post. Among other things, the review says, "At a later meeting in the White House Situation Room, Trump began speaking, not for the first time, about his desire to make a profit from the deployment of American soldiers. Tillerson had finally had enough. The authors describe the moment. The secretary of state stood, facing away from the president and toward officers and aides in the room. ‘I’ve never put on a uniform, but I know this,’ the authors quote Tillerson saying. ‘Every person who has put on a uniform, the people in this room, they don’t do it to make a buck. They did it for their country, to protect us. I want everyone to be clear about how much we as a country value their service.’ Trump grew red in the face, but saved his fire for later. The chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff later called Tillerson, his voice unsteady with emotion, to thank him." He wanted, essentially, to turn the US armed forces into a mercenary force. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2020, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/39969 "2020-01-17T14:15:52Z")
I don’t believe that exchange happened at all. And if it did happen, Tillerson AND the CJCS are both even bigger morons for not resigning right then and there. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2020, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/39970 "2020-01-17T14:22:25Z")
Well, one reason not for them to resign is that they were able to quash that ridiculous idea. Someone weaker in the job might not have been able to do so. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2020, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/39971 "2020-01-17T16:02:29Z")
There are a lot of stories like that from this administration, of the more responsible members like Mattis and Tillerson doing end-runs around Trump’s worst excesses (Gary Cohn swiping NAFTA papers off Trump’s desk, Mattis keeping Trump from pursuing a more aggressive Iran policy) until either they got fired or left in frustration. And now there’s are no grown-ups left to stop him. ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2020, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/39972 "2020-01-17T17:05:28Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > … > > ‘I’ve never put on a uniform, but I know this,’ the authors quote Tillerson saying. ‘Every person who has put on a uniform, the people in this room, they don’t do it to make a buck. They did it for their country, to protect us. I want everyone to be clear about how much we as a country value their service.’ > > … :dubious: No wonder Tillerson didn’t last five minutes in the administration. That [book](https://www.amazon.com/Very-Stable-Genius-Testing-America/dp/1984877496?utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=newsletter_axiosam&stream=top#_ga=2.190704427.1606126493.1579280143-1709446777.1576334234)is going to be all over everywhere with excerpts galore. Here’s one at [axios](https://www.axios.com/steve-bannon-nancy-pelosi-assassin-trump-book-f1ed1040-7479-4629-9b8d-c59bcb5a7f50.html): > [@](#): > > _[At trump’s first meeting with House & Senate leaders, the Monday after the election]_ … the new president began with a lie: “You know, I won the popular vote.” He claimed that there had been widespread fraud, with three to five million illegal votes for Clinton. Pelosi interjected. “Well, Mr. President, that’s not true,” she said. "There’s no evidence to support what you just said, and if we’re going to work together, we have to stipulate to a certain set of facts. > > "Watching Pelosi challenge Trump, Bannon whispered to colleagues, “She’s going to get us. Total assassin. She’s an assassin.” ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2020, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/39973 "2020-01-17T17:50:47Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > I don’t believe that exchange happened at all. And if it did happen, Tillerson AND the CJCS are both even bigger morons for not resigning right then and there. Whether it happened or not, there’s no way to know, but I could definitely see the story as possible. One unmistakable pattern that’s plainly visible in this administration is that many of Trump’s aides have remained on the job far longer than they wanted to, forced to make choices they never imagined they’d have to, trying to be the guardrails against this president’s impulsiveness and manifest corruption. From Sessions to Mattis, to Cohn, to McMaster, to Bolton, to Kelly, Nielsen, to Tillerson…almost to a man (woman), they agreed to join the administration because they believed that they could find a way to make meaningful contributions - not necessarily to their country as a whole, but to their cause at least. In each case, they all wore out their welcome because there was ultimately a moment at which they realized they were asked to live and work in the realm of the absurd. And don’t tell me that this is just the media sensationalizing these accounts. If it’s one or two anecdotes, okay, maybe the media are working with unreliable sources, or maybe it’s a case of a “source” and sour grapes. But in every case, this pattern has played itself out over and over and over again. We have a pretty good understanding of how this White House operates. ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Lendervedder](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_lendervedder/32/8488_2.png) [@Happy\_Lendervedder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Lendervedder)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2020, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/39974 "2020-01-17T18:08:28Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > :dubious: No wonder Tillerson didn’t last five minutes in the administration. > > That [book](https://www.amazon.com/Very-Stable-Genius-Testing-America/dp/1984877496?utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=newsletter_axiosam&stream=top#_ga=2.190704427.1606126493.1579280143-1709446777.1576334234)is going to be all over everywhere with excerpts galore. Here’s one at [axios](https://www.axios.com/steve-bannon-nancy-pelosi-assassin-trump-book-f1ed1040-7479-4629-9b8d-c59bcb5a7f50.html): Honestly, I have a hard time believing that Bannon quote. That one line from Pelosi sent shivers down his neck? Nope. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2020, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/39975 "2020-01-17T18:21:13Z")
Phil Rucker is the White House Bureau Chief for the Washington Post. Carol Loennig is an admired staff writer for the same paper. Both have won Pulitzer prizes for their work in journalism. AIUI, their sources are meticulously vetted and they are not likely to sacrifice their hard-won reputations to make controversial assertions without multiple confirmations. If the tale is in their book, I have no problem taking them at their word – especially on this particular subject. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2020, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/39976 "2020-01-17T19:09:58Z")
> [@Happy\_Lendervedder](#): > > Honestly, I have a hard time believing that Bannon quote. That one line from Pelosi sent shivers down his neck? Nope. It was probably just some head lice making a run for it. ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2020, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/39977 "2020-01-17T19:30:41Z")
> [@Happy\_Lendervedder](#): > > Honestly, I have a hard time believing that Bannon quote. That one line from Pelosi sent shivers down his neck? Nope. All-right-y then! YOU have a hard time believing it. Good enough for me! :rolleyes: Both sides make up shit all the time, amirite? :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Lendervedder](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_lendervedder/32/8488_2.png) [@Happy\_Lendervedder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Lendervedder)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2020, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/39978 "2020-01-17T20:00:12Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > All-right-y then! YOU have a hard time believing it. Good enough for me! :rolleyes: Both sides make up shit all the time, amirite? :dubious: Good lord ThelmaLou, what the fuck is wrong with you sometimes? ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2020, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/39979 "2020-01-17T20:07:06Z")
Individual 1 says he doesn’t know Lev Parnas. Ol’ Lev used to work for Fred Trump when Donnie was working for him. > **[Lev Parnas Worked For the Trump Organization in the 1980’s - HillReporter |](https://hillreporter.com/lev-parnas-worked-for-the-trump-organization-in-the-1980s-55935)** > > This time last week, Donald Trump was feeling pretty good about his impeachment prospects. The process was moving from the Democratic controlled House over to the Republican controlled Senate. Trump loyalists like Lindsey Graham and Mitch McConnell... ---
**Author:** ![Guest-starring\_Id](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guest-starring_id/32/21736_2.png) [@Guest-starring\_Id](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guest-starring_Id)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2020, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/39980 "2020-01-17T22:18:18Z")
> [@Rick\_Kitchen](#): > > Individual 1 says he doesn’t know Lev Parnas. Ol’ Lev used to work for Fred Trump when Donnie was working for him. > [https://hillreporter.com/lev-parnas-worked-for-the-trump-organization-in-the-1980s-55935](https://hillreporter.com/lev-parnas-worked-for-the-trump-organization-in-the-1980s-55935) > [@](#): > > **from link:** In a Fox News interview today, Kellyanne Conway said, “Look, I have never heard the president mention this person to me ever, a single time.” > Shortly **before** the Fox News interview, a picture was revealed of Conway and the Ukrainian. (my bold) So, she somehow didn’t see [the photo](https://www.rawstory.com/2020/01/kellyanne-conway-claims-she-doesnt-know-lev-parnas-but-his-lawyer-has-a-photo-showing-otherwise/) just before the interview? Or Faux couldn’t bother to show it to her? (They thought they’d lose ratings if they showed her up?) Or the Jawed One attempted a dodge by not saying, outright, “Don’t know him, never met him” and going instead with an evasive weaselling along the lines of never hearing his name mentioned to her “…ever, a single time!”? ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2020, 12:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/39981 "2020-01-18T00:56:08Z")
> [@Happy\_Lendervedder](#): > > Good lord ThelmaLou, what the fuck is wrong with you sometimes? It was my attempt to match your (IMHO) stupid comment with one of my own. Did I succeed? ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2020, 1:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/39982 "2020-01-18T01:27:37Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > I don’t believe that exchange happened at all. And if it did happen, Tillerson AND the CJCS are both even bigger morons for not resigning right then and there. Nobidy really cares what you do–or do not–believe. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2020, 1:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/39983 "2020-01-18T01:44:31Z")
> [@The\_Tooth](#): > > It was probably just some head lice making a run for it. That was funny as hell. 😃 Now we know why Bannon always wears at least 3 shirts. ---
**Author:** ![Moriarty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moriarty/32/49_2.png) [@Moriarty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moriarty)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2020, 2:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/39984 "2020-01-18T02:16:13Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > Phil Rucker is the White House Bureau Chief for the Washington Post. Carol Loennig is an admired staff writer for the same paper. Both have won Pulitzer prizes for their work in journalism. AIUI, their sources are meticulously vetted and they are not likely to sacrifice their hard-won reputations to make controversial assertions without multiple confirmations. > > If the tale is in their book, I have no problem taking them at their word – especially on this particular subject. This is apparently also the meeting when Tillerson (after Trump left) called him a ‘fucking moron’, which has been previously reported upon. What is added now is ‘context’. > [@](#): > > …Tillerson had openly disparaged the president, referring to him as a “moron,” after a July 20 meeting at the Pentagon with members of Trump’s national security team and Cabinet officials, according to three officials familiar with the incident. > **[Tillerson's fury at Trump required an intervention from VP Pence](https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/white-house/tillerson-s-fury-trump-required-intervention-pence-n806451)** > > Secretary of State Rex Tillerson intended to quit this past summer amid clashes with the White House. He didn't, and the feuds have not abated. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070.md?page=1998) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070.md?page=2000)