# The Trump Administration: A Clusterfuck in the Making **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 7, 2016, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070 "2016-12-07T00:25:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 307
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2017, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/6122 "2017-06-06T16:07:13Z")
When reminded that London mayor Sadiq Khan had called him “ignorant”, Trump retorted, “let’s do an IQ test”, thereby again revealing his ignorance by not understanding what an IQ test is intending to measure. In any case, I would place money on Sadiq Khan beating Donald Trump in an IQ test and hope that the contest can be arranged in the near future. ---
**Author:** ![bikerdruid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bcef8e/32.png) [@bikerdruid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bikerdruid)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2017, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/6123 "2017-06-06T16:11:15Z")
> [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](#): > > When reminded that London mayor Sadiq Khan had called him “ignorant”, Trump retorted, “let’s do an IQ test”, thereby again revealing his ignorance by not understanding what an IQ test is intending to measure. In any case, I would place money on Sadiq Khan beating Donald Trump in an IQ test and hope that the contest can be arranged in the near future. When I first heard about this, I had the same thought. Ignorance is lack of knowledge, not “intelligence.” ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2017, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/6124 "2017-06-06T16:16:42Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > I think this is potentially a big story because it potentially involves catching a US President lying to his own country about something and doing it on the world stage in a very public manner. If the allegations that there is no deal are true, Mr. Trump may have compromised his own ability to further engage the American public. > > People will put up with a lot, but not with “being played”. No one likes to feel like they’ve been lied to and used by another, not even if the other is President. Are you serious? Trump supporters are fine with that, and the rest of you already know he’s full of shit but put up with it because bodily removing presidents from office is generally frowned upon. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2017, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/6125 "2017-06-06T16:21:26Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > I think this is potentially a big story because it potentially involves catching a US President lying to his own country about something and doing it on the world stage in a very public manner. If the allegations that there is no deal are true, Mr. Trump may have compromised his own ability to further engage the American public. > > People will put up with a lot, but not with “being played”. No one likes to feel like they’ve been lied to and used by another, not even if the other is President. One word: Iraq. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2017, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/6126 "2017-06-06T16:41:29Z")
Apparently the Big Orange Cheese is finding it difficult to hire legal help: > [@](#): > > [Four top law firms turned down requests to represent Trump](https://www.yahoo.com/news/four-top-law-firms-turned-requests-represent-trump-122423972.html) > > …The lawyers and their firms cited a variety of factors in choosing not to take on the president as a client. Some, like Brendan Sullivan, said they had upcoming trials or existing commitments that would make it impossible for them to devote the necessary time and resources to Trump’s defense. > > Others mentioned potential conflicts with clients of their firms, such as financial institutions that have already received subpoenas relating to potential money-laundering issues that are part of the investigation. > > But a consistent theme, the sources said, was the concern about whether the president would accept the advice of his lawyers and refrain from public statements and tweets that have consistently undercut his position. > > “The concerns were, ‘The guy won’t pay and he won’t listen,’” said one lawyer close to the White House who is familiar with some of the discussions between the firms and the administration, as well as deliberations within the firms themselves… ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2017, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/6127 "2017-06-06T16:41:32Z")
[Four top law firms](http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/336489-four-top-law-firms-turned-down-trump-report)reportedly turned down requests to represent President Trump in the investigation into ties between his administration and Russia. > [@](#): > > … lawyers reportedly said they were concerned Trump would make public statements against their legal advice that hurt his position in the investigation. > “The concerns were, ‘ **The guy won’t pay and he won’t listen,** ’ ” one lawyer close to the White House told Yahoo. bolding mine ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2017, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/6128 "2017-06-06T16:45:25Z")
Wow. You know you’re no good when even lawyers want nothing to do with you. ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2017, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/6129 "2017-06-06T17:11:47Z")
> [@](#): > > Originally Posted by Walken After Midnight View Post > When reminded that London mayor Sadiq Khan had called him “ignorant”, Trump retorted, “let’s do an IQ test”, thereby again revealing his ignorance by not understanding what an IQ test is intending to measure. In any case, I would place money on Sadiq Khan beating Donald Trump in an IQ test and hope that the contest can be arranged in the near future. Sadiq Khan’s left shoe could beat Trump in an IQ test. > [@The\_Tooth](#): > > Are you serious? Trump supporters are fine with that, and the rest of you already know he’s full of shit but put up with it because bodily removing presidents from office is generally frowned upon. And the Republicans (so far) are okay with it, too. Do the Repubs even HAVE a last straw? If Trump addressed both houses of Congress with his XXXL underpants on his head, would \*anyone \*even comment on it? Now _I_ need brain bleach. > [@Steve\_MB](#): > > Apparently the Big Orange Cheese is finding it difficult to hire legal help: > > > [@](#): > > > > Four top law firms turned down requests to represent Trump > > > > …The lawyers and their firms cited a variety of factors in choosing not to take on the president as a client. Some, like Brendan Sullivan, said they had upcoming trials or existing commitments that would make it impossible for them to devote the necessary time and resources to Trump’s defense… “The lawyers and their firms cited a variety of factors…” Um… have to wash my hair that night. Taking the dog to the vet. Getting my toenails cleaned. Haven’t got a thing to wear. Mama won’t let me. All very good reasons. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2017, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/6130 "2017-06-06T17:21:25Z")
> [@The\_Tooth](#): > > Wow. You know you’re no good when even lawyers want nothing to do with you. Lawyers will happily take on scumbag, guilty, asshole clients, as long as they: 1. Listen to advice, and know when to shut up 2. Pay their bills Two strikes for the Trumpster. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2017, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/6131 "2017-06-06T17:26:23Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > “The Bird Heard 'Round the World” 🙂 Everybody knows that the Bird is the word! Poppa Ooo Mao Mao, Poppa Ooo Mao Mao Mao… ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2017, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/6132 "2017-06-06T17:34:19Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > Lawyers will happily take on scumbag, guilty, asshole clients, as long as they: > > 1. Listen to advice, and know when to shut up > 2. Pay their bills > > Two strikes for the Trumpster. Number two trumps number one. Sure, they hate to hurt their batting average by taking on a client hell-bent on self-destruction. But the guy who won’t pay, they just can’t abide by. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2017, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/6133 "2017-06-06T17:35:06Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > People will put up with a lot, but not with “being played”. No one likes to feel like they’ve been lied to and used by another, not even if the other is President. Are you kidding? Trump supporters are practically begging to be “played” at this point. Between the “take Trump seriously but not literally,” and Trump’s redupation of essentially every campaign pledge and promise that he rallied his supporter over, from draining the swamp to jailing Hillary Clinton, Trump has demonstrated that his only art is bullshitting. > [@Crotalus](#): > > What does a real arms deal look like, anyway? Does the US government sell the stuff to the Saudis, or do the various defense contractors sign individual sales agreements? Are there bids, contracts, purchase orders? So, sales to allies generally come in the form of negotiated or subsidized agreements where the buyer agrees to purchase a certain weapon system, and pay for logistics and maintenance support for the operational timeframe. The US government gives export approvals and may provide certain benefits to the seller such as tax breaks or additional domestic purchase agreements, and in some cases may outright buy hardware and transfer it to the foreign power although this generally required Congressional approval since it requires the use of discretionary monies. There are also transfer and end user agreements intended to assure that information and technology is not transferred to third parties or reverse engineered for domestic manufacture unless licensed, and there may be a whole other host of associated ‘offset’ agreements for basing, military and intelligence cooperation, et cetera. The State Department has to review the agreement to assure that it doesn’t violate any current treaty stipulations and that all export licenses are complete. It is not the sort of thing the White House on its own can carry out in the span of a couple of days. This sounds more like a commitment to agree to approve weapon sales that were already in discussion from the past presidential administration; certainly none of the defense contractors have put out notices announcing billions of dollars in new sales as you would expect them to do. Furthermore, the US Defense Security Cooperation Agency (DSCA) is required to make a public announcement of approvals of foreign weapon system sales above some dollar amount (in the tens of millions of dollars). Here are literally the only two notices on the DSCA website following the announcement of this “agreement”: [Transmittal No: 16-77](http://www.dsca.mil/major-arms-sales/saudi-arabia-blanket-order-training) WASHINGTON, Jun. 5, 2017 - The State Department has made a determination approving a possible Foreign Military Sale to the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia for a blanket order training program for the Royal Saudi Air Force (RSAF) and other Saudi forces. The estimated cost is $750 million. The Defense Security Cooperation Agency delivered the required certification notifying Congress of this possible sale on June 2, 2017. [Transmittal No: 16-84](http://www.dsca.mil/major-arms-sales/kingdom-saudi-arabia-antpq-53v-radar-systems-and-related-support) WASHINGTON, Jun. 5, 2017 - The State Department has made a determination approving a possible Foreign Military Sale to the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia for AN/TPQ-53(V) radar systems and related support. The estimated cost is $662 million. The Defense Security Cooperation Agency delivered the required certification notifying Congress of this possible sale today. That is it. Those are the only approval determinations since the announcement of an agreement. Of course, you can also go the other route and set up your own private espionage agency and shift black funds to sell weapons in contravention to export restrictions. That worked out pretty well for the Reagan Adminstration. I mean, it was a huge scandal, but almost nobody went to prison except the guy who stole the “John Poindexter St.” sign in protest. But this bus of clowns isn’t bright enough to pull off an actual conspiracy. > [@The\_Tooth](#): > > Wow. You know you’re no good when even lawyers want nothing to do with you. Well, given his history, I suspect they all know that they’re not going to get paid. Never mind conflicts of interest or appearance of defending the indefensible; if the client isn’t going to pay his bills, the firm isn’t interested. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2017, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/6134 "2017-06-06T17:58:50Z")
> [@Banquet\_Bear](#): > > …I’m quietly proud of my fellow Wellingtonians. > > [Stuff](http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/93382262/birdflipping-welcome-for-us-secretary-of-state-rex-tillerson-in-new-zealand) > > We are on the other side of the world: we are a tiny nation, and there really isn’t very much we can do down under. But at the very least we can flip the bird. A small, silent spontaneous protest in solidarity. > > (Unfortunately there was no video of all this bird flipping, so just imagine a city of people doing [this](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IBG8UtgD0m8).) > > And even our right-wing government was relatively frosty. Wait. Tillerson is traveling with media people? That’s a surprise. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2017, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/6135 "2017-06-06T18:47:59Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > People will put up with a lot, but not with “being played”. No one likes to feel like they’ve been lied to and used by another, not even if the other is President. > [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > Are you kidding? Trump supporters are practically begging to be “played” at this point. Between the “take Trump seriously but not literally,” and Trump’s redupation of essentially every campaign pledge and promise that he rallied his supporter over, from draining the swamp to jailing Hillary Clinton, Trump has demonstrated that his only art is bullshitting. No, nobody likes being played, but it’s far, far worse, and far more difficult, to \*admit \*having been played. Even to admit it to oneself. And it’s worse by far to admit it to those who never were played, and spent some effort trying to explain it. It’s far more attractive to grab at any rationalization available, even if it’s just a way to say “Yeah, but \*your \*guys did yada yada” or “You’re being dismissive of opinions that differ from your own and it doesn’t help you”. Fortunately for the GOP, they have leaders and a propaganda network with many years of practice in coming up with cover stories that work on their rationalization-hungry base. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2017, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/6136 "2017-06-06T19:15:04Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > > [@](#): > > > > [“The concerns were, ‘ **The guy won’t pay and he won’t listen,** ’ ” one lawyer close to the White House told Yahoo.](http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/336489-four-top-law-firms-turned-down-trump-report) Funny, that’s what my ex-wife said, too. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2017, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/6137 "2017-06-06T19:18:56Z")
Forbes. Holy shit. > **[How Donald Trump Shifted Kids-Cancer Charity Money Into His Business](https://www.forbes.com/sites/danalexander/2017/06/06/how-donald-trump-shifted-kids-cancer-charity-money-into-his-business/)** > > Donald Trump is one of the least charitable billionaires in the > world. Eric Trump is far more altruistic. In a clash of values, the > president directed hundreds of thousands of dollars from his > son's kids-with-cancer foundation into his company... > [@](#): > > That’s not the case. In reviewing filings from the Eric Trump Foundation and other charities, it’s clear that the course wasn’t free–that the Trump Organization received payments for its use, part of more than $1.2 million that has no documented recipients past the Trump Organization. Golf charity experts say the listed expenses defy any reasonable cost justification for a one-day golf tournament. > > Additionally, the Donald J. Trump Foundation, which has come under previous scrutiny for self-dealing and advancing the interests of its namesake rather than those of charity, apparently used the Eric Trump Foundation to funnel $100,000 in donations into revenue for the Trump Organization. > > And while donors to the Eric Trump Foundation were told their money was going to help sick kids, more than $500,000 was re-donated to other charities, many of which were connected to Trump family members or interests, including at least four groups that subsequently paid to hold golf tournaments at Trump courses. > > All of this seems to defy federal tax rules and state laws that ban self-dealing and misleading donors. It also raises larger questions about the Trump family dynamics and whether Eric and his brother, Don Jr., can be truly independent of their father. > > Especially since the person who specifically commanded that the for-profit Trump Organization start billing hundreds of thousands of dollars to the nonprofit Eric Trump Foundation, according to two people directly involved, was none other than the current president of the United States, Donald Trump. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2017, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/6138 "2017-06-06T19:21:53Z")
You don’t seem to understand. Republicans can do anything… Absolutely anything, up to and including shooting someone in the face while drunk. It just does not matter. ---
**Author:** ![jsc1953](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/5daacb/32.png) [@jsc1953](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jsc1953)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2017, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/6139 "2017-06-06T19:33:11Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > Forbes. > > Holy shit. > > [How Donald Trump Shifted Kids-Cancer Charity Money Into His Business](https://www.forbes.com/sites/danalexander/2017/06/06/how-donald-trump-shifted-kids-cancer-charity-money-into-his-business/amp/) In a just and rational world there would be parallel investigations-- treasonous dealings with the Russians, and financial shenanigans–racing to see who could impeach him first. In this world, with Republicans in charge, we’ll be lucky if anything gains traction. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2017, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/6140 "2017-06-06T19:45:38Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > You don’t seem to understand. > > Republicans can do anything… Absolutely anything, up to and including shooting someone in the face while drunk. > > It just does not matter. I think you just quoted up their 2020 Campaign slogan. ---
**Author:** ![Superdude](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/superdude/32/13450_2.png) [@Superdude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Superdude)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2017, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/6141 "2017-06-06T20:11:00Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > \Do the Repubs even HAVE a last straw?\ Sure, they have last straws. If he was black/a democrat, his sizable ass would be in trouble. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070.md?page=306) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070.md?page=308)