# The Trump Administration: A Clusterfuck in the Making **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 7, 2016, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070 "2016-12-07T00:25:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 415
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2017, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8284 "2017-07-19T20:32:18Z")
He loves playing with trucks, though. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Devil\_s\_Grandmother](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/74df32/32.png) [@The\_Devil\_s\_Grandmother](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Devil_s_Grandmother)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2017, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8285 "2017-07-19T20:41:56Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > Fund raising, is that like a golf tournament? Yes, golf tournaments are used for fundraising. It’s also where people who need funding go to find rich people to chat up. It’s sort of like going to museum openings, only with more sunshine and walking. Yes, RickJay, out of the million reasons to criticize Trump, I chose that one. At the moment it seemed emblematic of the lack of knowledge Trump is famous for. If he had run his comments past \*any \*competent staffer, he might have made a speech that didn’t offend the very people he is trying to get to cooperate with him. But he’s too stupid to know how stupid he is. G-d help us. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2017, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8286 "2017-07-19T20:46:46Z")
> [@kambuckta](#): > > This is posited ‘somewhat’ tongue in cheek, but maybe not? How long until the US is classified as a ‘Rogue State’? The USA already is a rogue state. The USA is militarily and economically powerful enough to pretty much do what it wants, regardless of what other first world nations would prefer (for example, Bush II’s Iraq II, which was opposed by Germany, France and Canada, and proved to be 1. started under false pretenses, and 2. disastrously destabilizing for the region in both the short and long terms, e.g. the rise of ISIS). Trump’s pulling the USA out of the Paris Agreement that it had signed is about a rogue as it gets, putting the USA and Syria (which did not sign the agreement) in the same camp in opposition to the rest of the world. The single greatest problem that the world faces is climate change, and the USA is the world’s second greatest producer of CO2, which is causing a hellacious increase in climate change and net global warming. The result will be massive environmental harm, triggering resource scarcity, which will lead both indirectly and directly to economic and political instability, which in turn will lead to armed conflicts. As Margaret Robinson, a previous UN Special Envoy for climate change, put it: “[The US reneging on its commitment to the Paris Agreement renders it a rogue state on the international stage.](http://theelders.org/article/elders-condemn-us-quitting-paris-climate-agreement-no-one-country-can-dismantle-it)” [The USA is a flawed rather than full democracy](https://infographics.economist.com/2017/DemocracyIndex/) that has fallen behind the first world in protecting its citizens (e.g. % population incarcerated, % population killed by state actors, lack of universal health care, resistence to human rights – i.e. black, women, gay, trans) led by a legislative branch dominated by bat-shit-crazy Republicans with no moral compass and an executive branch controlled by a bat-shit-crazy pussy-grabber whose idea of foreign relations is to enjoy being pissed on by Russian prostitutes while laying on a bed previously used by his predicessor whom he claimed was ineligible to be president due some ludicrous conspiracy theory right up there with the National Enquirer’s Bat Boy. So no, the US president is not the leader of the free world, the USA is taken seriously by the free world because of the harm the USA can cause, not because of the good the USA can cause, and when it comes to the single most important issue facing the world – the effect climate change will have on the biosphere and humanity’s peace and prosperity – the USA is indeed a rogue nation. Relative to other leading nations, you once were one of the leaders of the free world. Now you are the leading danger to the free world – a great power that is a rogue state hell bent and determined to destroy yourselves and drag the rest of us down with you while you are at it. My hope is that enough Americans will support state initiatives to meet the Paris goals and move the USA forward despite the Republicans’ best efforts to ruin their own country and drag the rest of the world down while they are at it, and that enough Americans will start taking what remains of their freedom seriously enough to vote the Republicans out of the state and federal legislatures and out of the presidency. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2017, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8287 "2017-07-19T21:57:48Z")
> [@Nava](#): > > UHC isn’t what one could call a leftist invention, despite American beliefs to the contrary; countries that started implementing it did so after some industrialists had noticed that having a healthy workforce required some up-front costs but paid back a lot more (that is, those companies which provided adequate medical care and made sure their people could eat properly had less absenteeism, less people leaving without a fare-thee-ill, etc.). That’s one of many examples where grabbing one’s money pouch is actually a bad long-term strategy. > > Maybe those wealthy lefties are the kind of people who can think beyond the next five minutes, akin to those industrialists of yore. In Canada, universal health care was very much a leftist creation. [The Greatest Canadian](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Greatest_Canadian), Tommy Douglas, [was the father of medicare and a member of the Co-operative Commonwealth Federation](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tommy_Douglas), whose > [@](#): > > manifesto outlined a number of goals, including public ownership of key industries, universal public pensions, universal health care, children’s allowances, unemployment insurance, and workers’ compensation. Its conclusion read, “No CCF Government will rest content until it has eradicated capitalism and put into operation the full programme of socialized planning which will lead to the establishment in Canada of the Co-operative Commonwealth.” The party affiliated to the Socialist International. > [@](#): > > In 1944, the CCF formed the first social-democratic government in North America when it was elected to form the provincial government in Saskatchewan. Yes, there are examples of good employer/labour relations in North America, but historically for the most part relations were god-awful, with even the most basic workers’ rights being fought for in blood. Read up on the [Western Federation of Miners](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_Federation_of_Miners) / [International Union of Mine, Mill and Smelters’ Union](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Union_of_Mine,_Mill_and_Smelter_Workers), and the [IWW (Wobblies).](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Industrial_Workers_of_the_World#Canada) BTW, [banned SDMB poster SmashTheState was a leader of the IWW Ottawa Panhandlers’ Union](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=526595). ---
**Author:** ![davidm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidm/32/225_2.png) [@davidm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidm)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2017, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8288 "2017-07-19T22:05:52Z")
MSNBC just announced that Manafort, Trump Jr., and Kushner will be Senate witnesses next week. Kushner will testify in a closed session, the other two in open session. ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2017, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8289 "2017-07-19T22:07:34Z")
Yup, I think some of these right wing republican people in coal and mining country would get the taste smacked out of their mouths by their ancestors who fought so hard for the stuff we now take for granted, such as the 8 hour day, unions, pensions, health insurance and the like. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2017, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8290 "2017-07-19T22:56:13Z")
> [@davidm](#): > > MSNBC just announced that Manafort, Trump Jr., and Kushner will be Senate witnesses next week. Kushner will testify in a closed session, the other two in open session. I hope the feds play them … question them separately, offer each one “something” to turn against the others - and then fuck them all. For treason. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2017, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8291 "2017-07-19T23:09:30Z")
I was going to ask why Kushner was allowed a closed session, but overlooked the leverage angle. ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2017, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8292 "2017-07-19T23:13:20Z")
> [@davidm](#): > > MSNBC just announced that Manafort, Trump Jr., and Kushner will be Senate witnesses next week. Kushner will testify in a closed session, the other two in open session. …I’ve only ever heard Kushner speak [once](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W0SP0T9nS9A). So of course he gets to testify in closed session. Because the Trump administration is entirely normal, and not a sitcom or a reality show. ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2017, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8293 "2017-07-19T23:25:44Z")
[![]( " - YouTube") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5RnTBt1QAsY) …CNN interview with former Ethics Chief Walter Shrub. Point made at 5min 35 seconds is both absolutely unbelievable and entirely in keeping with this administration. Trumps attorney asks “can Trump sign the financial disclosure without having to sign it to certify that it is true?” ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2017, 11:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8294 "2017-07-19T23:42:32Z")
> [@Banquet\_Bear](#): > > …I’ve only ever heard Kushner speak [once](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W0SP0T9nS9A). **So of course he gets to testify in closed session.** Because the Trump administration is entirely normal, and not a sitcom or a reality show. Maybe because he’s an employee and has knowledge of classified materials? ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2017, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8295 "2017-07-20T00:01:35Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > Maybe because he’s an employee and has knowledge of classified materials? …I was making a joke. I’m perfectly aware there would be good reasons why Kushner would testify behind closed doors. But Kushner is probably the most powerful person in the Trump regime. He is responsible for negotiating peace in the Middle East. He is going to solve the opioid epidemic. He’s responsible for diplomacy with Mexico and China. He is reforming and reimagining veteran affairs. He is going to reform the criminal justice system. And he is going to reinvent the entire government and make it run like a business. And we’ve only ever heard him talk _once_. Thats just fucking crazy. And him testifying in closed session is like a running joke in a sitcom. “Oh look! Dean Pelton’s wearing an outrageous outfit!” “Oh look! Kushner’s not talking…again!” ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2017, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8296 "2017-07-20T00:13:38Z")
> [@Banquet\_Bear](#): > > And we’ve only ever heard him talk _once_. Thats just fucking crazy. If you sounded like Vanessa Bayer’s SNL character Jacob the Bar Mitzvah Boy, you wouldn’t talk in public either. ---
**Author:** ![PatriotX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c4cdca/32.png) [@PatriotX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatriotX)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2017, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8297 "2017-07-20T02:20:15Z")
> [@Banquet\_Bear](#): > > ...CNN interview with former Ethics Chief Walter Shrub. Point made at 5min 35 seconds is both absolutely unbelievable and entirely in keeping with this administration. Trumps attorney asks "can Trump sign the financial disclosure without having to sign it to certify that it is true?" That. Is fucking awesome. What fucking balls! I’m not even mad. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2017, 2:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8298 "2017-07-20T02:22:15Z")
[Trumpelthinskin says](http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/342843-trump-sessions-recusal-unfair-to-me) he never would have picked the Keebler Drow as Attorney General if he’d known he’d recuse himself from the Kremlin Connection investigation, and whines about how “very unfair” it was to not tell him about this up front. ---
**Author:** ![El\_Kabong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/el_kabong/32/496_2.png) [@El\_Kabong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Kabong)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2017, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8299 "2017-07-20T02:42:16Z")
> [@Steve\_MB](#): > > [Trumpelthinskin says](http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/342843-trump-sessions-recusal-unfair-to-me) he never would have picked the Keebler Drow as Attorney General if he’d known he’d recuse himself from the Kremlin Connection investigation, and whines about how “very unfair” it was to not tell him about this up front. In the same NYT interview, Der Trumpster apparently threatens Robert Mueller with firing if he launches an investigation into Trump family finances (beyond the scope of the probe into ties between his administration and Russia). Yeah, that should work out great. “No bodies in the hall closet; no need to look in there.” [http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/342845-trump-warns-mueller-against-investigating-his-familys-finances-beyond](http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/342845-trump-warns-mueller-against-investigating-his-familys-finances-beyond) ---
**Author:** ![Ukulele\_Ike](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/df788c/32.png) [@Ukulele\_Ike](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ukulele_Ike)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2017, 3:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8300 "2017-07-20T03:38:34Z")
I’m a Wobbly. If we all read up on them, many of us would probably be. ---
**Author:** ![aurora\_maire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aurora_maire/32/328_2.png) [@aurora\_maire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aurora_maire)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2017, 3:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8301 "2017-07-20T03:49:58Z")
Also from that interview: > [@](#): > > Describing a newly disclosed informal conversation he had with President Vladimir V. Putin of Russia during a dinner of world leaders in Germany this month, Mr. Trump said they talked for about 15 minutes, mostly about “pleasantries.” But Mr. Trump did say that they talked “about adoption.” Adoption? It just happened to come up during their “pleasantries”? Maybe they both have friends who have adopted kids? > [@](#): > > Mr. Trump acknowledged that it was “interesting” that adoptions came up since his son, Donald Trump Jr., said that was the topic of a meeting he had with several Russians with ties to the Kremlin during last year’s campaign. If I didn’t know Trump better I’d say he was seriously trolling there. Otherwise, it sounds like he’s saying that Putin brought up the Magnitsky Act. Why would he admit that? “We were just having an unimportant pleasant conversation about sanctions.” ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2017, 4:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8302 "2017-07-20T04:01:13Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > Robots don’t kill people. People kill people. With robots. ---
**Author:** ![BeepKillBeep](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/9e8a1a/32.png) [@BeepKillBeep](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BeepKillBeep)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2017, 4:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8303 "2017-07-20T04:50:41Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > With robots. Damn skippy! _beep_ [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070.md?page=414) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070.md?page=416)