# The Trump Administration: A Clusterfuck in the Making **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 7, 2016, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070 "2016-12-07T00:25:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 422
**Author:** ![PatriotX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c4cdca/32.png) [@PatriotX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatriotX)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2017, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8424 "2017-07-22T01:30:23Z")
> [@Ann\_Hedonia](#): > > So, what do you call a cracker that’s just been thrown under a bus? crumbs? ---
**Author:** ![Guest-starring\_Id](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guest-starring_id/32/21736_2.png) [@Guest-starring\_Id](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guest-starring_Id)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2017, 2:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8425 "2017-07-22T02:05:46Z")
> [@Ann\_Hedonia](#): > > So, what do you call a cracker that’s just been thrown under a bus? Definitely the start of a good apple pie crust. ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2017, 2:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8426 "2017-07-22T02:40:12Z")
> [@Ann\_Hedonia](#): > > Latest speculation is that the White House leaked the Sessions story. They want him gone because he recused himself from Russia and therefore, can’t fire Mueller. > > So, what do you call a cracker that’s just been thrown under a bus? Wouldn’t it be weird to leak information that confirmed your campaign’s collusion? ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2017, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8427 "2017-07-22T02:42:15Z")
The Kush “inadvertently” forgot to mention 77 holdings on his financial disclosure forms. > **[Jared Kushner Discloses Dozens More Assets in Revised Financial Filing](https://www.wsj.com/articles/jared-kushner-discloses-dozens-more-assets-in-revised-financial-filing-1500678017)** > > Jared Kushner, President Donald Trump’s son-in-law and adviser, released revised personal financial disclosures showing 77 previously omitted assets including real estate, an art collection and a New Jersey liquor license. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2017, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8428 "2017-07-22T02:42:34Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > Wouldn’t it be weird to leak information that confirmed your campaign’s collusion? Nothing is too weird for the Howling Yam and His Gang Of Idiots. ---
**Author:** ![Merneith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/57b2e6/32.png) [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2017, 2:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8429 "2017-07-22T02:57:39Z")
> [@Ann\_Hedonia](#): > > Latest speculation is that the White House leaked the Sessions story. They want him gone because he recused himself from Russia and therefore, can’t fire Mueller. > > So, what do you call a cracker that’s just been thrown under a bus? Donald can fire Sessions any time he wants. He doesn’t even need a reason. Of course, if he does it to obstruct the investigation into his criminal Russian money, that raises new problems. It’s obvious that Donal wants Sessions to resign on his own. Curious that Sessions is so commited to hanging on … as I said elsewhere, I think Sessions has already flipped and staying in his job as a mole is part of his agreement with the Feds in that conversation that led him to recuse himself. What today’s leak does, like the leak earlier this week about Mueller investigating Donald’s personal finances, is it’s now public news that Sessions & Mueller are personally involved in examining the Donald’s Russia connection. That makes it harder for Donnie to fire either of them, without admitting that he’s trying to obstruct the investigation (although everyone is, and he doens’t really care, he’s just trying to avoid saying the magic words.) Still - Sessions is a nasty piece of work. And he’s got friends in the Senate, even if they’re aggravated, which Donald doesn’t. And Sessions is a lifetime politician and lawyer. Donald should think carefully before he puts Sessions in a position where he has nothing to lose. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2017, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8430 "2017-07-22T02:59:25Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > Re pardoning himself, I heard it put this way: A pardon trumps (har!) indictment. Impeachment trumps a pardon. So… there’s that. Much simpler than that: he can only pardon someone for a crime that that person has been convicted of. If he were to be impeached, he would then be tried in the Senate. This would put him at the level of “defendant”, not “convict”. Once he is actually convicted by the Senate, he is stripped of presidential authority, at which point it would no longer be possible for him to pardon himself, as he no longer has that power. He cannot pardon himself while he has the power to pardon because he has no convictions that can be pardoned. And no reasonable person would accept that he could issue the pardon between the time of the vote to convict and the delivery, to him, of the verdict. Which is not to suggest that any Republicans would fall into the “reasonable” category. ---
**Author:** ![Guest-starring\_Id](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guest-starring_id/32/21736_2.png) [@Guest-starring\_Id](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guest-starring_Id)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2017, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8431 "2017-07-22T03:02:31Z")
Probably already posted. Quite impressed with Trump’s [legal Taekwondo](http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-40678397) so far. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2017, 3:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8432 "2017-07-22T03:03:19Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > Wouldn’t it be weird to leak information that confirmed your campaign’s collusion? I thought about this, too, but I think Donnie Two Scoops counts on his supporters to not be able to connect so many dots. All this is being done to stop the Russia investigation, which most of his supporters already believe is a hoax. They won’t question the pretext he uses to fire Sessions, so long as it accomplishes what they want. The ends always justify the means, with this crowd. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2017, 3:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8433 "2017-07-22T03:05:15Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > Much simpler than that: he can only pardon someone for a crime that that person has been convicted of. Nope. Ford pardoned Nixon for anything he might have done, even if the crime(s) weren’t known at the time. ---
**Author:** ![davidm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidm/32/225_2.png) [@davidm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidm)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2017, 3:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8434 "2017-07-22T03:07:08Z")
> [@Typo\_Negative](#): > > Couple of things. > Presidential Pardons are only for Federal crimes. > People who who are compelled to testify and refuse are not charged, but held in contempt of court. IIRC, Contempt is not an offense against the United States, and is not pardonable. > Trump has never had anyone’s back. > > But I may be mistaken. I’m aware that they’re only for federal crimes. I never said otherwise. If state AGs were to bring charges then of course they could be compelled to testify. There is such a thing as criminal contempt. [http://criminal.findlaw.com/criminal-charges/criminal-contempt-of-court.html](http://criminal.findlaw.com/criminal-charges/criminal-contempt-of-court.html) I’m not sure in this case if it would be civil or criminal contempt or whether either is pardonable, so you may be right. Trump might have someone’s back if he believes that it’s in his own best interest. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2017, 3:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8435 "2017-07-22T03:11:07Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > Much simpler than that: he can only pardon someone for a crime that that person has been convicted of. If he were to be impeached, he would then be tried in the Senate. This would put him at the level of “defendant”, not “convict”. Once he is actually convicted by the Senate, he is stripped of presidential authority, at which point it would no longer be possible for him to pardon himself, as he no longer has that power. He cannot pardon himself while he has the power to pardon because he has no convictions that can be pardoned. And no reasonable person would accept that he could issue the pardon between the time of the vote to convict and the delivery, to him, of the verdict. **Which is not to suggest that any Republicans would fall into the “reasonable” category.** That all makes perfect sense. Thanks for the clarification. It’s the bit I bolded that worries me the most. Sounds like Chuck Grassley and his minions are planning a counter attack that will try to paint the “real” collusion with Russians as being with the Democrats. Seems to be an orchestrated effort between Fox “News,” Trump’s cabal within the White House and other strategic supporters who hope to convince Trump’s rock solid base to stick with him, which he hopes will force Republicans in Congress to continue to overlook his criminal behavior. I hate to think they could pull it off. But they could. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2017, 4:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8436 "2017-07-22T04:53:01Z")
I see that there is an additional problem with the pardon thing, [QUOTE=“[FindLaw – Burdick v. US] ([http://caselaw.findlaw.com/us-supreme-court/236/79.html](http://caselaw.findlaw.com/us-supreme-court/236/79.html))”]This brings us to the differences between legislative immunity and a pardon.… The latter carries an imputation of guilt; acceptance a confession of it. [/QUOTE] ---
**Author:** ![Kolak\_of\_Twilo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kolak_of_twilo/32/73_2.png) [@Kolak\_of\_Twilo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kolak_of_Twilo)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2017, 5:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8437 "2017-07-22T05:16:56Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > …Sounds like Chuck Grassley and his minions are planning a counter attack that will try to paint the “real” collusion with Russians as being with the Democrats. Seems to be an orchestrated effort between Fox “News,” Trump’s cabal within the White House and other strategic supporters who hope to convince Trump’s rock solid base to stick with him, which he hopes will force Republicans in Congress to continue to overlook his criminal behavior. > > I hate to think they could pull it off. But they could. I would encourage you to check datelines on stories a bit more closely. As I pointed out in [this post](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=20362820&postcount=1555) the story you are worrying about is from early March. This is old news and it doesn’t appear the story went anywhere then and has little life given recent events. Pretty sure that is a dead dead dead story. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2017, 5:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8438 "2017-07-22T05:22:43Z")
> [@Kolak\_of\_Twilo](#): > > I would encourage you to check datelines on stories a bit more closely. As I pointed out in [this post](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=20362820&postcount=1555) the story you are worrying about is from early March. This is old news and it doesn’t appear the story went anywhere then and has little life given recent events. > > Pretty sure that is a dead dead dead story. I corrected the link in the other thread. I first heard the story and then thought I’d found the link that supported it. I simply grabbed the wrong link. But I appreciate your guidance. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2017, 6:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8439 "2017-07-22T06:25:30Z")
Scaramucci looks like he stepped straight out of _The Sopranos_. ---
**Author:** ![Kolak\_of\_Twilo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kolak_of_twilo/32/73_2.png) [@Kolak\_of\_Twilo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kolak_of_Twilo)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2017, 7:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8440 "2017-07-22T07:43:45Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > I corrected the link in the other thread. I first heard the story and then thought I’d found the link that supported it. I simply grabbed the wrong link. But I appreciate your guidance. Fair enough. But looking at that corrected link I still have to say most of them look to go back to March or April. Yeah, Grassley has made some noise about this in the last week or so since Donnie Jr. slammed the door on his own dick but I still don’t see the story going much of anywhere. It’s been out there for months and didn’t get traction. Now, when the Trump Administration is dropping turds of gold every few hours for the media this is going to take off? Sorry, I don’t think so. ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2017, 8:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8441 "2017-07-22T08:23:42Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > Scaramucci looks like he stepped straight out of _The Sopranos_. The first thing I thought when I saw the guy was, “why would Trump hire [David Miscavige](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Miscavige) as his communication director?” Look on the bright side, maybe shoulder pads in suit jackets will make a comeback. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2017, 12:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8442 "2017-07-22T12:02:12Z")
> [@Rick\_Kitchen](#): > > The Kush “inadvertently” forgot to mention 77 holdings on his financial disclosure forms. > [https://www.wsj.com/articles/jared-kushner-discloses-dozens-more-assets-in-revised-financial-filing-1500678017](https://www.wsj.com/articles/jared-kushner-discloses-dozens-more-assets-in-revised-financial-filing-1500678017) I wish my finances were such that I could inadvertently “forget” to declare $10 million in holdings. Probably found it under the cushions when they were vacuuming the couch. ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2017, 12:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/8443 "2017-07-22T12:10:17Z")
> [@Merneith](#): > > … > Curious that Sessions is so commited to hanging on … as I said elsewhere, I think Sessions has already flipped and staying in his job as a mole is part of his agreement with the Feds in that conversation that led him to recuse himself… I think it’s because > [@](#): > > …Sessions is a nasty piece of work… and he’s got a mean, destructive, hurtful mission to accomplish with his _terrible, swift sword,_ Donald or no Donald. Kick those immigrants out! Especially those uppity _Dreamers_! Put that restitution money back in the Treasury (where it won’t make a bit of difference) instead of giving it to charity (where it could do some good). He’s right where he wants to be, and won’t be going anywhere any time soon. > [@Jack\_Batty](#): > > … > Look on the bright side, maybe shoulder pads in suit jackets will make a comeback. And concrete overshoes? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070.md?page=421) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070.md?page=423)