# The Trump Administration: A Clusterfuck in the Making **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 7, 2016, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070 "2016-12-07T00:25:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 562
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2017, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/11224 "2017-09-18T01:24:18Z")
White House counsel Donald F. McGahn II and Trump personal lawyer Ty Cobb are feuding over how much to cooperate with the Mueller investigation. The animus got so hot that Cobb actually erupted in a conversation at a Washington lunch spot last week that was overheard at nearby tables, and caused John Kelly to “counsel” Cobb about talking publicly. > **[Trump Lawyers Clash Over How Much to Cooperate With Russia Inquiry (Published...](https://www.nytimes.com/2017/09/17/us/politics/trump-lawyers-white-house-russia-mcgahn-ty-cobb.html?smid=tw-share&_r=0&referer=)** > > The debate, which led to an angry confrontation between two members of the legal team, could shape the course of the special counsel’s investigation. ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2017, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/11225 "2017-09-18T15:33:21Z")
> [@jsc1953](#): > > This is interesting. Assuming that Trump has a strategy, and is not just pinballing from one idea to the next (bear with me, here): it’s a really stupid strategy. > > If he thinks he can broaden his appeal by pivoting to the left–it’s hopeless. Democrats and independents have written him off based on every other position he’s ever espoused and every other action he’s ever taken. So now he’s just pissing off his base. > > But we’ll see, when the next polls come out. Nate Silver made much the same argument [a six weeks ago](https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/why-a-trump-pivot-might-backfire/) backed up by polls that showed that of those who oppose Trump, over 80% do so strongly, while only about 55% of those who support him do so strongly. So a shift to the center will bump more voters from the weakly support to weakly oppose, than vis-versa. ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2017, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/11226 "2017-09-18T19:33:22Z")
Trump started out his speech to the UN by bragging about his hotel across the street. > **[Trump’s First United Nations Appearance Was a Clunker](https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2017/09/trumps-first-united-nations-appearance-was-a-clunker.html)** > > It would be charitable to describe the welcoming applause as “light.” ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2017, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/11227 "2017-09-18T20:08:47Z")
[[C]onsidering staging a U.S. military parade in Washington on the July 4 Independence Day holiday, inspired by the parade he saw on Bastille Day in Paris.](https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trump-macron/inspired-by-french-trump-considering-july-4-military-parade-in-washington-idUSKCN1BT2GX) I’m guessing he really wants to emulate the Red Army and is using France as a cover story. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2017, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/11228 "2017-09-18T20:23:46Z")
> [@Rick\_Kitchen](#): > > Trump started out his speech to the UN by bragging about his hotel across the street. > [Trump’s first United Nations appearance was a clunker.](http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/war_stories/2017/09/trump_s_first_united_nations_appearance_was_a_clunker.html) One hopes that there were a dozen language variations of “fuck you asshole” spoken under breath in the room. What a colossal jerk. ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2017, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/11229 "2017-09-18T20:48:04Z")
> [@Bayard](#): > > EJ Dionne made an interesting comment during his weekly appearance with David Brooks on NPR. When discussing Trump’s recent dealings with Democrats, Dionne said something like, _ **“Trump seems to view the Democrats as a competing business he can sometimes negotiate with, while he sees Congressional Republicans as bad employees so he treats them with contempt.”** _ (Heard on the radio; I’m probably mangling the quote.) I thought that was probably a pretty good assessmebt of Trump’s thinking, such as it is. That’s really smart of Dionne–I think he’s nailed it. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2017, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/11230 "2017-09-18T21:00:29Z")
> [@Buck\_Godot](#): > > Nate Silver made much the same argument [a six weeks ago](https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/why-a-trump-pivot-might-backfire/) backed up by polls that showed that of those who oppose Trump, over 80% do so strongly, while only about 55% of those who support him do so strongly. So a shift to the center will bump more voters from the weakly support to weakly oppose, than vis-versa. There is, and there will never be, any so called “pivot”. That would be assuming [ol] [li]Trump knows what he is doing (he doesn’t) and[/li][li]Trump intends to keep his word on something (his word isn’t worth SHIT).[/li][/ol] He only says what he expectes will bolster his “good press”, toss more red meat to his base of Deplorables and racists, and feed his ego at the moment. There is no thought, deliberation, or concern for consequences. He’s some sort of Permian Age proto-reptilian throwback, running on blind instinct and hunger (greed for more of everything). Talking about a “pivot” is hoping for something that will never be. ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2017, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/11231 "2017-09-18T21:29:00Z")
> [@SteveG1](#): > > There is, and there will never be, any so called “pivot”. … > Talking about a “pivot” is hoping for something that will never be. Agree 1000%. Trump is an excellent example of WYSIWYG. He’s as deep as a paper plate. He has no core, no guiding principles, no inner life. He operates on whim in the moment. Has the attention span and the goal-setting ability of a goldfish. Someone asked a guest on NPR the other day if something-or-other that Trump did represented a change. The guest replied that Trump is a steady state of chaos, period. Nothing can be inferred from anything he does or says except what was in his mind (excuse the term) at the moment he did/said it. I do not understand why people can’t accept that he is dumb as a box of hair. If he accidentally does something that seems to indicate thought, it’s like looking up at clouds and thinking you’re seeing DaVinci’s Last Supper, the sinking of the Titanic, or your dog’s head. You’re imagining it. And it will pass and never be seen again. ---
**Author:** ![Superdude](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/superdude/32/13450_2.png) [@Superdude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Superdude)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2017, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/11232 "2017-09-18T21:44:15Z")
> [@SteveG1](#): > > Burn 'em! > > Oh their tears are so delicious. I could bathe in an ocean of their tears. Their anguished screams are music to me 😃😃😃😃 Something like [this](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jFqZhadwvG0)? ---
**Author:** ![Anny\_Middon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/bc79bd/32.png) [@Anny\_Middon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anny_Middon)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2017, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/11233 "2017-09-18T22:30:59Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > I do not understand why people can’t accept that he is dumb as a box of hair. If he accidentally does something that seems to indicate thought, it’s like looking up at clouds and thinking you’re seeing DaVinci’s Last Supper, the sinking of the Titanic, or your dog’s head. You’re imagining it. And it will pass and never be seen again. The people I know who think he’s smart seem to base it on the fact that he made a lot of money. You could point out in great detail how he started with a lot of money and with proper management would have made a lot more than even he claims to have made, you can reference the times he declared bankruptcy, but they’ll still hold that money = intelligence, and he has a lot of money. Plus of course he hosted his own reality TV show. I think some of these people believe that if you’re a reality TV star, you MUST be smart. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2017, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/11234 "2017-09-18T22:32:05Z")
> [@Anny\_Middon](#): > > The people I know who think he’s smart seem to base it on the fact that he made a lot of money. You could point out in great detail how he started with a lot of money and with proper management would have made a lot more than even he claims to have made, you can reference the times he declared bankruptcy, but they’ll still hold that money = intelligence, and he has a lot of money. It’s the just world theory again. ---
**Author:** ![Anny\_Middon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/bc79bd/32.png) [@Anny\_Middon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anny_Middon)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2017, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/11235 "2017-09-18T22:42:14Z")
> [@jsgoddess](#): > > It’s the just world theory again. I’m not at all familiar with just world theory. (In fact, I had to look it up to confirm that it means what I assumed it does.) How do Trump supporters view themselves and their families in light of JWT? OK, I’d guess that for themselves they think that riches are right around the corner, their fair reward for their efforts. But what about their parents and their grandparents? If Granny was born in modest working class circumstances and died with bedsores and bruises in the crappy nursing home that was all that was available on medicaid after her assets had been depleted, do they think Granny got a raw deal and JWT didn’t work? Or do they just assume the old bitch must have had it coming to her? ---
**Author:** ![PatriotX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c4cdca/32.png) [@PatriotX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatriotX)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2017, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/11236 "2017-09-18T22:49:05Z")
> [@Anny\_Middon](#): > > I’m not at all familiar with just world theory. (In fact, I had to look it up to confirm that it means what I assumed it does.) > > How do Trump supporters view themselves and their families in light of JWT? OK, I’d guess that for themselves they think that riches are right around the corner, their fair reward for their efforts. But what about their parents and their grandparents? If Granny was born in modest working class circumstances and died with bedsores and bruises in the crappy nursing home that was all that was available on medicaid after her assets had been depleted, do they think Granny got a raw deal and JWT didn’t work? Or do they just assume the old bitch must have had it coming to her? Maybe the old gal got real lucky considering how it might’ve been otherwise. w/e that may mean ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2017, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/11237 "2017-09-18T23:04:19Z")
> [@Anny\_Middon](#): > > I’m not at all familiar with just world theory. (In fact, I had to look it up to confirm that it means what I assumed it does.) > > How do Trump supporters view themselves and their families in light of JWT? OK, I’d guess that for themselves they think that riches are right around the corner, their fair reward for their efforts. But what about their parents and their grandparents? If Granny was born in modest working class circumstances and died with bedsores and bruises in the crappy nursing home that was all that was available on medicaid after her assets had been depleted, do they think Granny got a raw deal and JWT didn’t work? Or do they just assume the old bitch must have had it coming to her? I think it’s that if something bad happens to me or the “worthy,” it’s unlucky. When something bad happens to them, it’s because they deserve it. When something good happens to me or the worthy, we earned it. When something good happens to them, they ripped us off. And since more of the good stuff keeps accruing to the right people, that’s proof! ---
**Author:** ![Punoqllads](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/d2c977/32.png) [@Punoqllads](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Punoqllads)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2017, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/11238 "2017-09-19T00:31:22Z")
> [@Anny\_Middon](#): > > Plus of course he hosted his own reality TV show. I think some of these people believe that if you’re a reality TV star, you MUST be smart. Smart like Jessica Simpson. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2017, 12:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/11239 "2017-09-19T00:59:53Z")
> [@Punoqllads](#): > > Smart like Jessica Simpson. More like Homer Simpson. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2017, 1:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/11240 "2017-09-19T01:16:23Z")
So, Trump’s getting ready for his U.N. speech. I expect he’s doing a lot of middle-finger exercises. ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2017, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/11241 "2017-09-19T01:32:55Z")
> [@Skywatcher](#): > > [[C]onsidering staging a U.S. military parade in Washington on the July 4 Independence Day holiday, inspired by the parade he saw on Bastille Day in Paris.](https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trump-macron/inspired-by-french-trump-considering-july-4-military-parade-in-washington-idUSKCN1BT2GX) I’m guessing he really wants to emulate the Red Army and is using France as a cover story. Didn’t the city of Washington say that the streets don’t support large numbers of troops and heavy equipment marching down the streets? ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2017, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/11242 "2017-09-19T01:33:24Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > More like Homer Simpson. With or without the crayon up his nose? ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2017, 3:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/11243 "2017-09-19T03:32:53Z")
> [@Punoqllads](#): > > Smart like Jessica Simpson. > [@running\_coach](#): > > More like Homer Simpson. You mean these people? “For those in the Party of Trump, the Republicans — not the president — are to blame” > **[For those in the Party of Trump, the Republicans — not the president — are to...](https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/for-those-in-the-party-of-trump-the-republicans--not-the-president--are-to-blame/2017/09/18/124376d2-9a29-11e7-82e4-f1076f6d6152_story.html)** > > Die-hard Trump supporters don’t mind if he negotiates with Democrats or helps some immigrants. > [@](#): > > … > They are quick to explain away the compromises the former real estate developer and reality-TV star has made and the inconsistencies in many of his positions. They describe Washington as a swamp and speak of Democratic and Republican congressional leaders with the same levels of frustration and disappointment — while describing Trump as if he were a longtime neighbor. They have high hopes for his presidency, but they also fear he might be held back by his party. And they don’t expect their devotion to the president to waver, even a tiny bit, anytime soon. > > “He’s elected as our president. We need to give him our respect,” said Oakes, who has seven grandchildren and one great-grandchild. “I’ll vote for him four years from now because I think it will take longer for him to clean up the mess that was left by Obama.” > … :smack: [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070.md?page=561) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070.md?page=563)