# The Trump Administration: A Clusterfuck in the Making **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 7, 2016, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070 "2016-12-07T00:25:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 662
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2017, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/13225 "2017-11-04T22:34:00Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > AF1 lands in Hawai’i, is [greeted appropriately](https://mobile.twitter.com/Incognitah_/status/926841851495243777/photo/1) “I’m not orange! Impeach!” :D:D:D ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2017, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/13226 "2017-11-04T22:40:05Z")
Yes, ‘no pardon’ would be a much more plausible pitch, to the average person, than would be ‘we’ll make you AG!’ (Though of course Carter Page isn’t precisely average. It’s not nice to pick on the neuro-atypical, but, heavens that boy is irregular.) In re the Welcome to Kenya signs protest (that eschereal and Merneith linked to): if Trump saw them, he won’t have understood the reference. ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2017, 11:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/13227 "2017-11-04T23:36:55Z")
I am re-reading “It Can’t Happen Here” by Sinclair Lewis, written in 1935, about a fascist takeover of America via the democratic process. The parallels are frightening. ---
**Author:** ![John\_DiFool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_difool/32/19543_2.png) [@John\_DiFool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_DiFool)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2017, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/13228 "2017-11-05T00:06:15Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > Your optimism is based on assumptions. And your pessimism is based on pure fucking logic, eh? Give me a fucking break. :rolleyes: Then you had to go and play the race card, as if my being white would mean that my perspective is automatically skewed, while yours is perfectly centered. I was right, you’re just a concern troll, a secret right winger who is here solely to spread you spew of uncertainty, fear, and doubt and demoralize everyone. It won’t work on me, putzface. Scuttle back to your bridge and please hose the fuck off. Back on my list you go, jerkwad. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2017, 12:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/13229 "2017-11-05T00:34:28Z")
> [@Catamount](#): > > And while you’re banging on your sad drum, others are getting up off their asses, going out, and working to make the world a better place. Why? Because they remember that the Trumpists aren’t the majority in this country. They’re just louder than usual right now. We can shut them up if we all do something. > > BTW? Your sad drumbeat? Not doing something. Put up or shut up. What makes you think I haven’t? I’ve participated in political campaigns, called hundreds of people I don’t know, knocked door to door, told to get off people’s porches and how my candidate ought to be thrown in fucking jail. I’ve given money to the candidates I’ve supported. What have you done exactly? Maybe you’re the one who oughtta shut up. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2017, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/13230 "2017-11-05T00:51:48Z")
> [@John\_DiFool](#): > > And your pessimism is based on pure fucking logic, eh? Give me a fucking break. :rolleyes: > > Then you had to go and play the race card, as if my being white would mean that my perspective is automatically skewed, while yours is perfectly centered. > > I was right, you’re just a concern troll, a secret right winger who is here solely to spread you spew of uncertainty, fear, and doubt and demoralize everyone. It won’t work on me, putzface. Scuttle back to your bridge and please hose the fuck off. > > Back on my list you go, jerkwad. ROFLMAO! You have no idea why I “played the race card” do you? You would only understand it if you are of another race or of another minority religion or culture. I don’t expect you to get it though. Hell, I forgive you. How’s that for being magnanimous? But I’ll put it this way. In Nazi Germany there were Jews - yes, Jews - who actually VOTED for the Nazis and Adolph Hitler. Why? Because they thought he was just talking shit. The smart Jews were the ones who believed Hitler when he said he was going to exterminate them – they left the country. At least two of the smart Jews who did were life-long family friends of mine. Their friends, their neighbors were saying “Why are you leaving? It’s not that bad now.” And why wouldn’t they have felt that way? Despite a few incidents here and there, Jews had established themselves in Germany for centuries. But the smart ones saw what was happening. They left. Those who didn’t leave…ended up in the ovens. The whole point of being the Chicken Little that rings the fire bell in the night is to make those who adaptive and are otherwise comfortable with the new normal - whatever the fuck it is - to understand that this new “normal” perpetually pushes the boundaries of what ‘normal’ means. What’s outrageous eventually becomes normal. We’re seeing that now - well, at least some of us are. Authoritarians rely on people like you to be optimistic and to shut people like me up. You don’t understand that because you’ve never lived or obviously even been to an authoritarian society. I’ve literally walked on mass graves where, each year, monsoons wash up the bones of the dead who believed they could foolishly trust a superman to transform their society into what it once was or what it could become. Americans have no clue because they’re ignorant as hell and have no knowledge of history beyond what they see on History channel. I’m sure the non-Americans here could back me up on this. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2017, 12:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/13231 "2017-11-05T00:54:26Z")
> [@Rick\_Kitchen](#): > > I am re-reading “It Can’t Happen Here” by Sinclair Lewis, written in 1935, about a fascist takeover of America via the democratic process. The parallels are frightening. It’s . fucking . happening. Now. Believe me. There’s a reason that Sinclair Lewis wrote that book (two reasons actually). 1. Sinclair Lewis had a very good understanding of American culture. 2. Americans in the 1930s were actually a) anti-semitic and b) surprisingly supportive of fascism. What’s remarkable about the Founding Fathers - one of the many things - is that they proposed the idea of liberty in the Constitution to begin with. They certainly didn’t have to, and indeed not every member of the Congress was a true democrat. But the reason that the American Revolution succeeded was that it was a Revolution of intellectuals. The Civil War was in some ways Abraham Lincoln’s revolution. Lincoln, too, was an intellectual. As was FDR, who perhaps gave us our third revolution. Right now, we’re out of intellectuals. We’re in serious danger right now. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2017, 1:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/13232 "2017-11-05T01:04:11Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > Maybe take a nice long walk in a park. Pet a few dogs and feed the ducks. Breathe in through your nose and out through your mouth. > > You’re going to be okay. You don’t understand what’s happening. ---
**Author:** ![Catamount](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/catamount/32/2840_2.png) [@Catamount](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Catamount)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2017, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/13233 "2017-11-05T01:28:02Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > What makes you think I haven’t? I’ve participated in political campaigns, called hundreds of people I don’t know, knocked door to door, told to get off people’s porches and how my candidate ought to be thrown in fucking jail. I’ve given money to the candidates I’ve supported. What have you done exactly? Maybe you’re the one who oughtta shut up. If that’s how you tried to persuade people to vote for your candidate then no wonder you failed. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2017, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/13234 "2017-11-05T01:28:43Z")
> [@Catamount](#): > > If that’s how you tried to persuade people to vote for your candidate then no wonder you failed. Hey, I’m not trying to persuade anyone. Fuck you, okay? ---
**Author:** ![Sunny\_Daze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunny_daze/32/438_2.png) [@Sunny\_Daze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunny_Daze)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2017, 1:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/13235 "2017-11-05T01:48:18Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > Maybe take a nice long walk in a park. Pet a few dogs and feed the ducks. Breathe in through your nose and out through your mouth. > > You’re going to be okay. > [@asahi](#): > > You don’t understand what’s happening. I think what **QuickSilver** is saying is that you need to calm down. He’s being less direct, because nothing pisses people off faster than being told to “calm down”. I’m just putting it out there, because you seem very upset and I’m fairly certain that engaging on this thread right now isn’t helping you. Taking a break is a very good idea. ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2017, 2:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/13236 "2017-11-05T02:23:40Z")
> [@Sunny\_Daze](#): > > I think what **QuickSilver** is saying is that you need to calm down. He’s being less direct, because nothing pisses people off faster than being told to “calm down”. I’m just putting it out there, because you seem very upset and I’m fairly certain that engaging on this thread right now isn’t helping you. Taking a break is a very good idea. Now is not the time to either calm down or take a break. Being upset is an appropriate reaction to current events. Calming down and taking a break are not. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2017, 2:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/13237 "2017-11-05T02:25:31Z")
> [@Sunny\_Daze](#): > > I think what **QuickSilver** is saying is that you need to calm down. He’s being less direct, because nothing pisses people off faster than being told to “calm down”. I’m just putting it out there, because you seem very upset and I’m fairly certain that engaging on this thread right now isn’t helping you. Taking a break is a very good idea. I don’t give a fuck if you or anyone else is upset by what I am saying. If you are, you’re too fucking sensitive and are part of the problem. I’m not trying to persuade anyone. Do I really think that I can persuade anyone in a country where tens (hundreds) of millions of people live in an anti-factual world? No, not really. I’m trying to explain what WILL happen in the future, so that, hopefully, when you experience it, you can say “Holy crap! That asahi guy called it. This is happening just like he said it would.” But hell, I don’t expect that to work either. Sometimes, people just have to sleep in the bed that they’ve made for themselves. That’s what I believe will happen to this country. Americans believe that they’re powerful and wealthy because of some magical shit they’ve done. In reality, it’s because European powers fought themselves half to death and Americans were uninvolved. ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2017, 2:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/13238 "2017-11-05T02:36:18Z")
In other news: [ **Experts Urge Trump: ‘Stick To The Script’ In Asia, Don’t Provoke North Korea** _Washington and Pyongyang have engaged in an escalating war of words._](https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/trump-asia-trip-north-korea_us_59fc8281e4b0415a420b43e4?ncid=inblnkushpmg00000009) > [@](#): > > As President Donald Trump makes his journey to Asia for a 12-day, five-country trip, international security experts are urging him to “stick to the script” and avoid making incendiary comments while discussing North Korea. > > The “America first” leader has engaged in an escalating war of words with North Korean dictator Kim Jong Un in recent months. In September, Trump threatened to “totally destroy” the rogue nation, which is home to an estimated 25 million people, if provoked. > … > As tensions rise, experts fear Trump’s response to the situation is only fanning the flames, not dousing the fire. > …“Trumpian rhetoric to ‘totally destroy’ North Korea is not helpful at a time when, alarmingly, the likelihood of all-out war on the Korean Peninsula has moved from remotely possible to almost palpable,” William Choong and Alexander Neill, senior fellows at the International Institute for Strategic Studies, wrote in a report published Friday. > > “It is critically important for Asia-Pacific security that Trump does not fly off the handle,” they warned. > > On Thursday, national security adviser H.R. McMaster told reporters Trump is unlikely to moderate his remarks overseas. > > “The president will use whatever language he wants to use, obviously,” McMaster said. “I don’t think the president really modulates his language. I mean, have you noticed him do that? He has been very clear about that.” > … We know how Thump loves to change the subject and provide a distraction when he is under fire. And of course, he’s known for his ironclad self-control. :rolleyes: TWELVE-DAYS? :smack: There’s a lot of room in there to do some serious damage. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2017, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/13239 "2017-11-05T02:59:45Z")
> [@VinylTurnip](#): > > I’ve come to an unsettling realization, or maybe more accurately, been forced to admit the existence of something that’s been in plain sight for a long time. Namely, that many of our norms, values, customs, laws— ideals that are supposed to define and bind us together, as Americans— are still in place due to inertia, and not because they are something everyone wants. As you say, a frighteningly large portion of the population doesn’t care about, or want these things, and never has. They want to see Hillary Clinton arrested and imprisoned, whether or not she broke any laws. The rule of law and due process are distractions, if not impediments. They wholeheartedly support vigilantism. They would be fine with Trump commanding the DOJ, or even the military, against his enemies because they share those enemies. They would be thrilled to see Trump remove “activist judges,” or even have them arrested, if they rule in ways deemed unacceptable. > > These are not fringe notions anymore— and it’s misguided, even dangerous, to assume they are. You’re not wrong, IMO. Why do you think people feel this way, tho? Let’s see if we both think the same about this. ---
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2017, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/13240 "2017-11-05T03:13:57Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > You’re not wrong, IMO. Why do you think people feel this way, tho? Let’s see if we both think the same about this. You’re actively trying to get someone to wax eloquent on their worldview in a thread about the acts of this administration? Please, I’d vote for starting a new thread. Invite anyone who wants to make this thread about their emotions… but don’t encourage another tangent on a tangent of a derailment of a side bar. Thanks. ---
**Author:** ![Sunny\_Daze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunny_daze/32/438_2.png) [@Sunny\_Daze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunny_Daze)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2017, 3:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/13241 "2017-11-05T03:40:11Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > I don’t give a fuck if you or anyone else is upset by what I am saying. If you are, you’re too fucking sensitive and are part of the problem. I’m not trying to persuade anyone. Do I really think that I can persuade anyone in a country where tens (hundreds) of millions of people live in an anti-factual world? No, not really. I’m trying to explain what WILL happen in the future, so that, hopefully, when you experience it, you can say “Holy crap! That asahi guy called it. This is happening just like he said it would.” But hell, I don’t expect that to work either. Sometimes, people just have to sleep in the bed that they’ve made for themselves. That’s what I believe will happen to this country. Americans believe that they’re powerful and wealthy because of some magical shit they’ve done. In reality, it’s because European powers fought themselves half to death and Americans were uninvolved. Oh FFS, I’m not upset. I’m saying you are, and as a consequence you sound hysterical, and your argument is getting lost in the noise. I’m not saying you’re wrong. I was trying to help. Today just sucks. I’d like a do over. ---
**Author:** ![Sunny\_Daze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunny_daze/32/438_2.png) [@Sunny\_Daze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunny_Daze)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2017, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/13242 "2017-11-05T03:42:45Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > Now is not the time to either calm down or take a break. Being upset is an appropriate reaction to current events. Calming down and taking a break are not. There is a difference between keeping the energy up in the larger battle, and taking a break to re-energize. You need to do the latter (read a book, smell the flowers, ride a bike), if you want to keep doing the former. That is the only point I was trying to make. I am certainly NOT advocating lying down and accepting Trump. (That sounds wrong on so many levels.) ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2017, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/13243 "2017-11-05T03:44:13Z")
Oh let’s not jump to the “you sound hysterical” accusations against anyone. Old, tired, broken. People read emotions into writing and that accusation has always said more about the accuser and how they choose to read things, especially from people they’re arguing with. I mean, do you do that to people in real life too? Just throw out “you sound hysterical” and walk away feeling triumphant? :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![dalebeshansky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c37758/32.png) [@dalebeshansky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dalebeshansky)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2017, 3:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/13244 "2017-11-05T03:50:44Z")
I always thought the GOP was on the right track with McCain… maybe not the best choice for many conservatives, but at least a ‘reasonable’ man when things did not go his way. (I would not expect him to be that reasonable today. for obvious reasons). But then they ‘saddle’ him with Palin, maybe hoping to boost votes among women. Wow, that assumption was lost on the public. She became someone to ridicule (whether one thinks that was justified or not)…maybe it’s just me but McCain’s demeanor changed noticeably after she was picked as his running mate. And it was not a look of content. Why not pick a conservative running mate, but one with enough appeal to be acceptable to most of McCain supporters. The 2nd GOP foible after Romney. And we know the 3rd… who did win. I don’t think you could find odds like this in a drunken poker game. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070.md?page=661) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070.md?page=663)