# The Trump Administration: A Clusterfuck in the Making **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 7, 2016, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070 "2016-12-07T00:25:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 758
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2018, 1:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/15145 "2018-01-09T13:14:47Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > I think the idea that Trump is being restrained by the Pentagon is probably fake news. There are probably people in the Pentagon who are seriously considering an attack on North Korea. There are also probably those who think it’s a bad idea. I suspect it’s a real debate at various levels along the chain of command and it’s just a matter of which side convinces the Donald to act or not. Even if we assume this to be true, I feel moved to ask again : **what’s the fucking point ?!** North Korea has always been “heh, too much bother”, as in, yeah at this point they can probably be safely shot to shit but before that happens they’ll have enough time to cause immense havoc on South Korea and possibly lob a few missiles here and there, some of which may or may not be nukes. But it’s not like North Korea has ample oil resources or fertile poppy fields, and it’s not like their sabre rattling ever goes anywhere either. There’s no downside whatsoever to let Best Korea be Best Korea ; and all upside. I mean, every weirdass Kim Jong Un story, photo-op or propaganda video is entertainment gold. I suppose a humanitarian case could be made for the plight of Joe Korean, but a) don’t pretend like you give a shit, that ship has sailed, sunk, been dredged back out and sailed \*again \*and b) the plan is to _bomb the shit out of them_. To misquote a famous photo, starting wars for peace and humanitarian concerns is akin to fucking for virginity. Also c), you’ve been there before and we don’t want to know what Korean ISIS looks like. Suicide bomber training videos set to accordion K-Pop ? The world doesn’t need that. I guess what I’m saying is : please, America. Find out who in the administration, the Pentagon or the State Dept. is angling for that war. Then shoot them right in the face. There you go : peace on fucking earth. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2018, 2:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/15146 "2018-01-09T14:05:45Z")
> [@AI\_Proofreader](#): > > So that leaves us at President Paul “Suffocate the homeless with their blankets, you don’t want them getting dependent on air” Ryan? As it stands now. There’s kind of a big event coming up in November that might change that. ---
**Author:** ![John\_DiFool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_difool/32/19543_2.png) [@John\_DiFool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_DiFool)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2018, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/15147 "2018-01-09T14:09:26Z")
> [@mhendo](#): > > As one commenter noted: of course he doesn’t; his name isn’t in it. O say can you see, by the Don’s early light, What so proudly we hail’d at the Trump’s last gleaming… ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2018, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/15148 "2018-01-09T14:15:45Z")
> [@El\_Kabong](#): > > My COBRA coverage is gonna run out in a few months. Someone want to point me to one of these associations President Very Stable Genius is going on about? It’s a proposed rule from the DoL: > **[Trump Proposes New Health Plan Options for Small Businesses (Published 2018)](https://www.nytimes.com/2018/01/04/us/politics/trump-association-health-plans-obamacare.html)** > > The Trump administration proposed rules that could expand access to lower-cost insurance exempt from some requirements of the Affordable Care Act. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2018, 2:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/15149 "2018-01-09T14:17:21Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > I think Trump expected to lose but wanted to lose ‘respectably’, but I don’t think he entirely ruled out winning with the assumption that he could just hand over the important stuff to people with more interest in actual presidentin’ I am totally unconvinced Trump wanted to lose. I don’t believe he did. I also don’t believe that he was sure he would lose. Every indication so far is that Trump doesn’t understand how the job of President works. He didn’t know how hard it was, didn’t understand (and may still not) that members of Congress do not report to him, doesn’t understand what the various departments do, doesn’t get how the Justice Department works, didn’t grasp that he had to do the job from Washington, and on and on. For Trump to have not wanted to do the job based on the specifics of the job would require he knew what those specifics were, and he clearly didn’t. Conversely, however, Trump would have understood how the job would be profitable; even a guy who can’t pass a civics exam WOULD understand that the job of President could allow for him to loot the government. Trump would have known full well he could use his properties to fleece the government. He would have known he’d have some sort of influence over taxation and spending. He would damn well have known he could pay back his Russian lenders in favors/following orders. So if he wanted to win, did he think he was sure to lose? Again, I just don’t believe that. I can quite believe many in his inner circle thought he’d lose. If you could show me proof Kellyanne Conway or Mike Pence were sure he’d lose, that would not surprise me in the least - but that would speak poorly of them, because of course they were quite wrong, and it was evident in the polls they were wrong. At every point in the campaign, Trump had a chance to win. He was an underdog but he was never dead in the water and in fact he won in precisely the fashion he, his campaign, and the smarter prognosticators said he could. But that said, was Donald Trump sure he would lose? I see no evidence of that and it is not consistent with his character. Trump is shallow, narcissistic, and a sexist pig; he would never in a bazillion years have been convinced he’d lose a competition to a woman. The fact he was shocked AFTER THE FACT doesn’t mean he was convinced before the fact. Lots and lots and lots of people, after accomplishing or getting something, are stunned after the fact and don’t know what to do next. ---
**Author:** ![DesertDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desertdog/32/11503_2.png) [@DesertDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DesertDog)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2018, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/15150 "2018-01-09T14:31:00Z")
> [@jasg](#): > > I’ve got an idea! The Whitehouse could send a chef to Hamburger University and then apply to be a McDonald’s franchise. > > (To flatter the boss, use real gold for the Arches and drop the ‘Mc’…) I can’t remember who it was, but years ago I read a memoir by a journalist active during WWII. He mentioned that he’d been invited to the White House on the eve of D-day for a deep background briefing by FDR himself. Arriving about 10pm, he and the Big Guy talked about forty-five minutes when Roosevelt said, “Say, I’m hungry; you hungry? Let’s get something to eat,” picked up the phone and ordered a couple of hamburgers. Two covered dishes arrived a bit later and, “It was the best damn hamburger I’ve ever had in my life.” After the briefing, as he was being led out he said he’d like to talk to the chef. When he gushed about the burger, the guy just pointed to the large chunk of prime rib that hadn’t gone through the grinder yet. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2018, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/15151 "2018-01-09T14:44:37Z")
> [@Kobal2](#): > > Even if we assume this to be true, I feel moved to ask again : **what’s the fucking point ?!** I would think that preserving American power in East Asia is probably the point. If Kim Jung Un finally, once and for all establishes that he not only has nukes that can reach Seoul and Tokyo, but also reach Washington and New York, then that’s a game-changer. What some might conclude - and I think it’s a reasonable conclusion - is that Kim wants to use his nuclear weapons program not only as a deterrent but also as future leverage. KJL could continue firing missiles into the Sea of Japan, and the US chimes in and says “Cut it out” but this time, instead of KJL’s usual threats to wipe out the US military personnel in the region, he could threaten the homeland. And Washington would, at that point, have to take that threat more seriously. KJL could demand the end of sanctions and escalate tensions until there are talks. The US would hate to give into demands by an ‘evil’ regime but would also be weighing that threat against continued provocations which would only escalate. My guess is that, among some, the thinking is, let’s just deal with Kim now before he puts the US in this position. The implications of this situation and its ultimate resolution go beyond just North Korea. One way of looking at this - not necessarily the only way but one way - is that if the US is put in the position of potentially being forced to give in to North Korean demands, then that could make the US look weaker in the region. It might encourage Japan and South Korea to start being more self-reliant - they could still partner with the US but rely less and less on protection and influence, which would over a 10-20 year period weaken the US politically (and even militarily) in the region. You could see a more assertive Japan, for instance, pushing troop bases out of Okinawa and Honshu and replacing them with their own beefed up resources (which would not go unnoticed by Japan’s neighbors of course). There are probably some in the Pentagon and State Department who view this as an unacceptable situation, regardless of Trump’s thoughts on the matter. This naturally goes back to “the China problem” in the region, from the viewpoint of the US. A weaker America would embolden China. There’s probably not an insignificant number of people in the Pentagon and State Dept who also see a direct challenge for regional and even global supremacy coming from China, which is why they want to remain in China’s neighborhood and be respected as a dominant power there. Just as there are probably some in the establishment who believe that North Korea is inevitably going to become a nuclear power and that we should just accept it, there are probably those who believe that China is going to gradually displace the US and that we should accept that as well . At the same time, there are those who probably have the exact opposite feeling, who believe that it’s only ‘inevitable’ if the US allows it to happen and that a war - even a costly one - is a necessary price to pay for the preservation of American dominance. ---
**Author:** ![CurtC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ce73a5/32.png) [@CurtC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CurtC)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2018, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/15152 "2018-01-09T17:10:54Z")
re: Associations > [@Smapti](#): > > My best guess is that he’s trying to take credit for the healthcare exchanges Obamacare established, because he’s a senile moron and has no idea what he’s talking about. [Remember Trump’s Pitch on Health Care Associations? Now We Know What He Meant](https://www.nytimes.com/2018/01/05/upshot/remember-trumps-pitch-on-health-care-associations-now-we-know-what-he-meant.html) ---
**Author:** ![Anny\_Middon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/bc79bd/32.png) [@Anny\_Middon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anny_Middon)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2018, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/15153 "2018-01-09T20:23:45Z")
> [@CurtC](#): > > re: Associations > > [Remember Trump’s Pitch on Health Care Associations? Now We Know What He Meant](https://www.nytimes.com/2018/01/05/upshot/remember-trumps-pitch-on-health-care-associations-now-we-know-what-he-meant.html) (Apology first – I haven’t yet figured out how to give cites on my pad. If anyone is interested I’ll provide them when I get on a real computer.) Anyway, it seems like these associations will be able to provide cheaper insurance because they won’t be required to provide the essential health benefits mandated by the ACA. You know, stuff like maternity ad newborn coverage. So a few months ago Money magazine reported what childbirth costs on average in each state. Numbers vary of course, but it looks like $6000 is about typical for a vaginal delivery. That’s not so much, you might say. (I admit I was surprised – I thought it would be much higher). But that’s just the delivery – it doesn’t take into account prenatal care or care for the newborn. And according to that survey done by the Federal Reserve in 2016, almost half of American families can’t scrape up $400 in an emergency. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2018, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/15154 "2018-01-09T21:20:35Z")
Trump is the Sun and, no matter you are, if you get close to him you will fall: [Bannon kicked out of Breitbart](http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/steve-bannon-out-at-breitbart-news). ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2018, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/15155 "2018-01-09T21:25:36Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > Trump is the Sun and, no matter you are, if you get close to him you will fall: [Bannon kicked out of Breitbart](http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/steve-bannon-out-at-breitbart-news). :eek: ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2018, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/15156 "2018-01-09T21:33:02Z")
[Trump steps on his own [del]dick[/del] DACA, again and again and again…](http://www.cnn.com/2018/01/09/politics/donald-trump-immigration-contradictions/index.html) ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2018, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/15157 "2018-01-09T21:41:34Z")
> [@Kobal2](#): > > The fuck ?! What’d be the grounds for any kind of strike ? “Their leader made taunting tweets” ? And what’s the point, what’d that be trying to accomplish ? Donald may have heard that the accommodations in The Hague for those being tried by the International Criminal Court are right next to a McDonalds–no need to send a car to get the good stuff! ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2018, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/15158 "2018-01-09T21:43:28Z")
I’m sure Bannon can still get a job as Bat Boy with the Weekly World News. It would be a big step up for him from Breitbart. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2018, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/15159 "2018-01-09T21:45:06Z")
“Man who warned of global conspiracy between billionaires and White House fired by billionaire and White House.” [https://twitter.com/BenjySarlin/status/950844612356210688](https://twitter.com/BenjySarlin/status/950844612356210688) ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2018, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/15160 "2018-01-09T22:41:09Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > :eek: All I have to say about Bannon is… You nazi fuck, get the fuck out, never come back, I hope you die from something nasty and disgusting while living on the street in abject poverty and are denied healthcare. ---
**Author:** ![jsc1953](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/5daacb/32.png) [@jsc1953](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jsc1953)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2018, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/15161 "2018-01-09T22:47:47Z")
> [@SteveG1](#): > > All I have to say about Bannon is… > > You nazi fuck, get the fuck out, never come back, I hope you die from something nasty and disgusting while living on the street in abject poverty and are denied healthcare. I’m a bit conflicted. A not-insignificant part of me wanted Trump to be surrounded with an absolute clown show of the most ridiculously outrageous and unqualified idiots…you know, your Bannons, your Scaramuccis, your Gorkas…just to make the Trump Administration look extra bad, and hopefully end extra soon. ---
**Author:** ![Catamount](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/catamount/32/2840_2.png) [@Catamount](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Catamount)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2018, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/15162 "2018-01-10T00:03:47Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > Trump is the Sun and, no matter you are, if you get close to him you will fall: [Bannon kicked out of Breitbart](http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/steve-bannon-out-at-breitbart-news). I heard that on NPR on my way home. It made me channel my inner [Nelson](https://youtu.be/8_4bLNM0axE). ---
**Author:** ![AI\_Proofreader](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8dc957/32.png) [@AI\_Proofreader](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AI_Proofreader)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2018, 6:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/15163 "2018-01-10T06:48:56Z")
> [@jasg](#): > > I’ve got an idea! The Whitehouse could send a chef to Hamburger University and then apply to be a McDonald’s franchise. > > (To flatter the boss, use real gold for the Arches and drop the ‘Mc’…) You kid but… this actually made me wonder. “The Donald” is such an unbelievable narcissist…I wonder if the “Donald’s” part is what lead him to adopt it as his favorite restaurant, if just subconsciously? We know how obsessed he is with seeing and hearing his own name. I mean, c’mon… he grew up rich and only got richer. He must have tasted real beef at some point. There are hundreds of better burgers out there. Even if it has to be cheap (because he’s a cheap bastard), fast, and available everywhere (because he’s lazy) - literally any other fast food burger is better. Wendy’s. Burger King. Jack in the Box. Good Times. White Castle. Fatburger. And on and on… and heck, 15 minutes in any random diner, which he can certainly spare during the 1/4th of the year spent golfing, will get you a better burger than McDonald’s. The only explanation is psychology. ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2018, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/15164 "2018-01-10T14:13:14Z")
Trump made a blunder and accidentally agreed with Democrats on DACA. That line was “[unintentionally](https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/fifty-five-minutes-at-the-table-trump-tries-to-negotiate-and-prove-stability/2018/01/09/0b41af64-f570-11e7-a9e3-ab18ce41436a_story.html?tid=pm_pop_b&utm_term=.fd07d9ac1537)” left out of the official transcript: \* “McCarthy apparently was not the only one concerned by Trump’s seeming agreement with Feinstein. When the White House released its official transcript Tuesday afternoon, the president’s line — “Yeah, I would like to do it” — was missing.”\* [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070.md?page=757) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070.md?page=759)