# The Trump Administration: A Clusterfuck in the Making **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 7, 2016, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070 "2016-12-07T00:25:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 991
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2018, 1:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/19805 "2018-05-01T01:19:59Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > So he knows she’s a “horrible human being”, a loathsome creature thru and thru… and yet he knows nothing about her. :rolleyes: > > And he’s somehow considered the “smart” and “intellectual” “comedian” on the right? It’s a low bar. ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2018, 1:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/19806 "2018-05-01T01:53:31Z")
> [@Zakalwe](#): > > My “strategy” is to sell something positive, not something negative. Negative plays into THEIR hands. They’re better at it, fucking accept that. …no they aren’t better at “being negative.” They are better at playing the victim. They are better at being fucking hypocrites. They are better at spin. They are better at lying. “Being negative” is not why they win. They win because “things aren’t that bad” for them and fuck everybody else. They win because they can turn everything on a dime into a talking point, and they win because they get everybody on their side singing to the same tune, not matter how much of a lie that tune happens to be. They win because they can take a relatively tame joke and turn it the most evilist thing of all time. And as this incident demonstrates: many people in the “so-called-main-stream-media” are absolutely complicit with these actions because they rely on people like SHS to give them inside access to the White House. > [@](#): > > If we become the party of NOT TRUMP, we lose. Fuck that. Just quit it with the fucking drama. We are talking about a joke at the expense of the propaganda arm of the Trump administration. That’s it. > [@](#): > > I’d like to win. Do you think shutting up, censoring your peers, and being complicit is “winning?” > [@](#): > > Idealism is wonderful and feels good. Pragmatism gets shit done. How is telling a comedian “to shut up and do what you are told” pragmatism? How is captituating in the face of a bunch of whining snowflakes pragmatism? How is that “getting shit done?” There was no “idealism” on display at the correspondents dinner. Nothing felt “wonderful and good” about Wolf’s performance. > [@](#): > > Yes, we’ve lost the True Believers. This election will be fought at the margins and the margins care about perception. If this performance gained you 100,000 votes each in NY and CA and lost you 10,000 each in Michigan, Wisconsin, Ohio, and Pennsylvania, it’s a net loss. And if we tell the likes of Michelle Wolf to shut up, and if we tell the late night talk hosts to shut up, and everytime Trump and his enablers start whining we capitulate and apologize, and the Republicans still win the midterms (as they are very likely to do) then what do you propose we do then? You can’t turn off the fucking internet. People say what they are going to say. > [@](#): > > Defense Exhibit 1: [Democrats lose ground with millennials](https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-election-millennials/exclusive-democrats-lose-ground-with-millennials-reuters-ipsos-poll-idUSKBN1I10YH) Its hilarious that you put the blame for this on the likes Michelle Wolf instead of accepting that you live in a country with a lot of fucked up privileged individuals who are simply voting to look after themselves. > [@](#): > > That’s not due to the WHCD, but it is indicative that we still lack a damn message other than “fuck this bullshit”. And is it Michelle Wolf’s fault the democrats apparently “don’t have a message?” Because that’s the point. Wolf did what she was paid to do that night. She’s a comedian, invited to do exactly the same thing as every other comedian has done since Colbert has at these dinners, and she did it perfectly. She doesn’t represent the democrats. She doesn’t represent the American people. She wasn’t elected. The amount of responsibility you put on her shoulders is complete fucking bullshit. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2018, 2:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/19807 "2018-05-01T02:14:36Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > I may have to start a thread about Michelle Wolf at the correspondent’s dinner, maybe it deserves that, but I’ll try commenting here: > > 1. As a comic performance, Michelle Wolf’s set was outstanding. Speaking as a comedian of sorts, I was very impressed. I realize the timing and delivery wasn’t entirely perfect, but bear in mind that a command performance like this is unusually difficult; the comic must write bespoke jokes for the event, and doesn’t have the usual period of time to practice them so they can be part of a seamless set. That’s nearlyu as good as you can be in such a circumstance. I didn’t know Wolf before this and now I’d pay to see her live. > > 2. Wolf simply did not throw any sort of vicious attack at Sarah Sanders’s apperance. That is plainly false and evey person in politics and the media saying she did is either a liar or is just parroting hearsay without checking the facts. Wolf said exactly two things that alluded to Sander’s appearance: > > - She said Sanders burns lies to make the perfect eye shadow. That is not an insult about her appearance, it’s a compliment about her appearance to set up an insult about her honesty. > - She compared her to Ann Dowd, who plays Aunt Lydia on “The Handmaid’s Tale.” The comparison was not made because Ann Dowd is ugly - she’s normal looking - but because Sanders’s demeanor is reminiscent of the character. Aunt Lydia isn’t memorable for her looks, she’s memorable for her cruelty towards women. > > 1. The only reason the media is supported butt-hurt Republicans in criticizing Wolf is because Wolf ripped the media, too. > > To her further credit, Wolf has adamantly refused to apologize. This will do her career good, it’s really raised her profile. It might do Wolf’s career good, but it hurts the people who organized the event: the free press. To the average uninterested person following the story, it’s another example of the blurred lines between entertainment and journalism. And it’s more proof that both entertainers and journalists, all of whom are far removed form the reality of the average Joe sitting at home, are collaborating to undermine a political populist. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2018, 2:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/19808 "2018-05-01T02:21:15Z")
> [@Sherrerd](#): > > ^ Yes. This. > > At some point the right is going to realize that the “if you’d just be nice to us and speak respectfully and deferentially to us and flatter us and give us everything, then things will work out great for you” message ISN’T WORKING. (Or maybe they’ll never realize it. But, yeah: it isn’t working.) > > Authoritarianism-fans always whine and cry when criticized, and make threats of crack-downs and civil war and continued attacks on freedom of the press if the criticism doesn’t stop. But non-fans of authoritarianism know perfectly well that no amount of ‘being nice to the right’ will stop the attacks on freedom of the press. Because attacking the free press and freedom of speech _ **is what authoritarians do** _. I think you’re missing the point. The people who organized this event know damn well – or they ought to – that the Trump administration is at war with them. The Trump administration represents a clear and present danger to freedom of the press, and yet they invite Sarah Huckabee Sanders to be the butt of jokes. How does that strengthen the credibility of the free press? I think that’s what the media has to understand here. They’re fighting a war against an authoritarian, and what they’re fighting over is credibility. The time for jokes, the time for lighthearted bullshit dinner parties is over. More than half this country gets its “news” from light night TV comedy. In the minds of many, they’re already one and the same and they’re biased. I’m telling you: Trump won this round. Bigly. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2018, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/19809 "2018-05-01T02:42:14Z")
> [@Moriarty](#): > > When she repeats the word “lies” twice, she probably was making a joke about facts, not fats. They thought she said “lipids”. ---
**Author:** ![China\_Guy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/779978/32.png) [@China\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/China_Guy)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2018, 3:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/19810 "2018-05-01T03:05:10Z")
Instead of pivoting to whatever appeasement of the day seems to make sense, I’d suggest the Democrats focus first and foremost on getting out the vote (and doing all they can to reverse the gerrymandering and vote suppression). Secondly, IMHO most folks want the democratic party to go for things such as universal health care and a fiscally responsible government. The Millennial’s and others got sucked into “all politicians are the same” “doesn’t matter who’s in the white house” or Trumpy’s masterpiece “black people, what do you have to lose”? Having lived through Reagan vs Carter, Bush vs Gore, I’m of the belief every generation has to have it proven to them that while it may be a difference of warm shit versus cold shit in the White House, it makes a difference if you have to eat a shit sandwich. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2018, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/19811 "2018-05-01T03:13:31Z")
> [@Zakalwe](#): > > … (at a dinner that is NOT a roast) … Huh. I must have been following a completely different event all these years. > [@Zakalwe](#): > > Defense Exhibit 1: [Democrats lose ground with millennials](https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-election-millennials/exclusive-democrats-lose-ground-with-millennials-reuters-ipsos-poll-idUSKBN1I10YH) Both parties are on a long-term downward trend that is an almost identical rate since '04. The Democrats are higher because they started out higher. The steady increase in the Independent column is a tad more than the decrease in the Ds or Rs. If the Millennials are less inclined to pick a D over a R, that still does not necessarily translate to an increase in support for Rs. Add an I into the mix and all bets are off. ---
**Author:** ![Zakalwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zakalwe/32/270_2.png) [@Zakalwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zakalwe)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2018, 3:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/19812 "2018-05-01T03:26:29Z")
> [@Banquet\_Bear](#): > > …no they aren’t better at “being negative.” > > They are better at playing the victim. > > They are better at being fucking hypocrites. > > They are better at spin. > > They are better at lying. > > “Being negative” is not why they win. They win because “things aren’t that bad” for them and fuck everybody else. They win because they can turn everything on a dime into a talking point, and they win because they get everybody on their side singing to the same tune, not matter how much of a lie that tune happens to be. They win because they can take a relatively tame joke and turn it the most evilist thing of all time. And as this incident demonstrates: many people in the “so-called-main-stream-media” are absolutely complicit with these actions because they rely on people like SHS to give them inside access to the White House. I actually agree with most of this, but I also think that most of what they lie about is negative (“we must stop Obamacare before it kills people”, “you must stop Democrats before they take your jobs and ship them to China!”). These are lies in that none of those things were going to happen, but they’re also not positive. It’s all about preventing something. There’s nothing in there about making things better. And it sold. > [@](#): > > Fuck that. > Just quit it with the fucking drama. We are talking about a joke at the expense of the propaganda arm of the Trump administration. That’s it. > Do you think shutting up, censoring your peers, and being complicit is “winning?” > How is telling a comedian “to shut up and do what you are told” pragmatism? > How is captituating in the face of a bunch of whining snowflakes pragmatism? How is that “getting shit done?” Where did I advocate any of that? I just said (paraphrased) “I wish she hadn’t done that.” If she had said to SHS, “Dosvaydana comrade Sanders!..What too soon?” I would have laughed. Had she said, “I think it’s wonderful that SHS took time out of her busy schedule preparing to be deposed by Special Counsel Mueller to be with us here.” I would have smiled. “In honor of the President, all of the chicken tonight was cooked over a fire made with real American coal, so ask for seconds, you’re making America great again!” And no, none of these are “hysterical”, but then, I’m not a professional comedian. > [@](#): > > There was no “idealism” on display at the correspondents dinner. Nothing felt “wonderful and good” about Wolf’s performance. That’s true. Nothing did and it wasn’t Wolf’s responsibility to make it that way, but I wish she would have anyway. Am I allowed that much or do I get censored? Dude, I’m on your side. I have never in my life (and I’m 50) voted for a member of the GOP for President. I can actually recall only one member of the GOP I voted for for ANYTHING (and that was only because the Dem running was an old acquaintance - we knew each other in high school and he was a dick then and still is). I give to Democrat candidates and causes. I’M ON YOUR SIDE. > [@](#): > > Its hilarious that you put the blame for this on the likes Michelle Wolf instead of accepting that you live in a country with a lot of fucked up privileged individuals who are simply voting to look after themselves. Actually, I do accept that. And I happen to think we have a lot to offer them and we’re doing a lousy job of telling them that. And cheering people saying things that can easily be perceived as cruel to Sarah Sanders doesn’t really advance the ball, does it? > [@](#): > > The amount of responsibility you put on her shoulders is complete fucking bullshit. Well, I’m sorry I’m did that. Could you point out where I did that? I mean, I _AM_ 50 and I must have forgotten. I thought I simply said that I couldn’t support it while acknowledging that she had a right to say it. ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2018, 4:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/19813 "2018-05-01T04:55:09Z")
> [@Zakalwe](#): > > I actually agree with most of this, but I also think that most of what they lie about is negative (“we must stop Obamacare before it kills people”, “you must stop Democrats before they take your jobs and ship them to China!”). These are lies in that none of those things were going to happen, but they’re also not positive. It’s all about preventing something. There’s nothing in there about making things better. And it sold. …they don’t just lie about “negative stuff.” They lie about everything. It sold. The lies sold. > [@](#): > > Where did I advocate any of that? I just said (paraphrased) “I wish she hadn’t done that.” That is a seriously fucked up paraphrase. That isn’t close to what you said. > [@](#): > > If she had said to SHS, “Dosvaydana comrade Sanders!..What too soon?” I would have laughed. Had she said, “I think it’s wonderful that SHS took time out of her busy schedule preparing to be deposed by Special Counsel Mueller to be with us here.” I would have smiled. “In honor of the President, all of the chicken tonight was cooked over a fire made with real American coal, so ask for seconds, you’re making America great again!” And no, none of these are “hysterical”, but then, I’m not a professional comedian. You are correct: you aren’t a professional comedian. That’s why Michelle Wolf has a new show coming out on Netflix and you are here, in the BBQ Pit, telling lame-as-fuck jokes. > [@](#): > > That’s true. If that’s true: why did you say it in the first place? > [@](#): > > Nothing did and it wasn’t Wolf’s responsibility to make it that way, but I wish she would have anyway. Am I allowed that much or do I get censored? Where have I suggested we curtail your right to spout nonsense? > [@](#): > > Dude, I’m on your side. Are you really? Michelle Wolf, the woman you want to silence, is “on your side.” And rather than stick up for her, you’ve bought into the narrative that Trump and his enablers have set. So if you are “on my side” then how about you stop falling for GOP talking points hook, line and sinker? > [@](#): > > I have never in my life (and I’m 50) voted for a member of the GOP for President. I can actually recall only one member of the GOP I voted for for ANYTHING (and that was only because the Dem running was an old acquaintance - we knew each other in high school and he was a dick then and still is). I give to Democrat candidates and causes. I’M ON YOUR SIDE. I don’t live in America. I don’t get a vote. Neither do the rest of the world. To the rest of the world it is pretty fucking obvious what needs to be done. Vote the fuckers out. Sensible gun regulations. Universal health care. Instead: there is a very good chance they are going to get voted back in. That is fucking madness. > [@](#): > > Actually, I do accept that. And I happen to think we have a lot to offer them and we’re doing a lousy job of telling them that. And cheering people saying things that can easily be perceived as cruel to Sarah Sanders doesn’t really advance the ball, does it? It isn’t Michelle Wolf’s job to offer anyone anything. She called it as she saw it. If one minute of jokes is enough to turn an election then the reality is that your country is fucked. Wolf isn’t the problem. YOU are the problem. Waiting around, waiting for someone to “offer them” something, while those very same people are spitting in your face. > [@](#): > > Well, I’m sorry I’m did that. Could you point out where I did that? I mean, I _AM_ 50 and I must have forgotten. I thought I simply said that I couldn’t support it while acknowledging that she had a right to say it. > [@Zakalwe](#): > > **Her performance will be used to increase GOP turnout in the midterms.** The Democratic Party’s chances of taking the House (and the Good Lord willing the Senate) went down because of her performance. > [@Zakalwe](#): > > If this performance gained you 100,000 votes each in NY and CA and lost you 10,000 each in Michigan, Wisconsin, Ohio, and Pennsylvania, it’s a net loss. And to think you have the gall to paraphrase this as simply “I wish she hadn’t done that.” Pathetic. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2018, 5:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/19814 "2018-05-01T05:14:03Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > …are collaborating to undermine a political populist. Yeah, right, the blue-collar billionaire. Sure. Hugh Betcha. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2018, 5:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/19815 "2018-05-01T05:30:01Z")
Fuck Chump and all his minions. When they apologize for their hundreds if not thousands of disgraceful insults, then we can talk about Wolf apologizing for her fantastic performance. Idiot Republicans. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2018, 9:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/19816 "2018-05-01T09:18:43Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > Huh. I must have been following a completely different event all these years. > > Both parties are on a long-term downward trend that is an almost identical rate since '04. The Democrats are higher because they started out higher. The steady increase in the Independent column is a tad more than the decrease in the Ds or Rs. If the Millennials are less inclined to pick a D over a R, that still does not necessarily translate to an increase in support for Rs. Add an I into the mix and all bets are off. But that’s a problem in the near-term. We’re entering what amounts to a multiparty dynamic, which favors those on the fringes. The fringe right is more powerful than the fringe left. Without a strong, unified alliance between the left, the center left, and the moderates, the extreme right has a path to power. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2018, 9:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/19817 "2018-05-01T09:48:41Z")
> [@Banquet\_Bear](#): > > It isn’t Michelle Wolf’s job to offer anyone anything. She called it as she saw it. If one minute of jokes is enough to turn an election then the reality is that your country is fucked. Wolf isn’t the problem. YOU are the problem. Waiting around, waiting for someone to “offer them” something, while those very same people are spitting in your face. Maybe what Zakalwe is really trying to point out is that Michelle Wolf actually made Sanders seem like a sympathetic character, which I think we can all agree that this is not at all what we want. If this had been a roast by comedians and entertainers, there wouldn’t be a problem. Unfortunately, though, this was an event of journalists, by journalists, and for journalists. It comes at a time when political figures, both in the US and outside of our borders, are openly assaulting the idea of a free press. It also comes at a time when ordinary people are increasingly skeptical of conventional press figures and outlets. Suit-and-tie events like the WHCD just smack of insider elitism. They have access to political insiders the rest of us don’t. They seemingly have information, and hence power, the average person doesn’t. They are the ones who feed us information and they claim to do so in a manner that is unbiased. And then they throw a dinner party where they invite a comedian to maul the White House press secretary. Like it or not, agree or not, crass jokes about Trump have unfortunately potentially demonstrated in the eyes of some that the professional press corps are not really professional and impartial journalists merely reporting what happens in Washington, but rather brutal, personal partisans. They should avoid blurring lines by not inviting comedians and entertainers to their events in the future. If they want to be taken seriously as journalists and not partisans or activists, then they’re going to have to raise their game and take more of a no-nonsense approach to journalism. But at a time when so much of American journalism incorporates and seemingly depends on entertainment to attract viewers, that might be asking a lot. What’s worse is, this event actually could have been used a lot more effectively. They didn’t need a comedian or a “personality” at all to rally around the cause of good journalism; they simply needed good journalism on display. They could have produced a viral video just as easily by simply inviting Sarah Huckabee Sanders to a dinner of journalists and used that opportunity to ask hard questions - like “Why do you say things that are demonstrably false every fucking day?” The dinner event itself would have been remarkably boring, but it is anyway. Conflict is still interesting, though. Challenging people in power is interesting. Demanding answers to serious questions can be interesting - it can be entertaining to watch people squirm. The real problem with the WHCD isn’t the fact that Michelle Wolf made cringe-worthy comments; it’s the apparent fact that the 225 year-old American institution of the professional free press is in a very real war, fighting against a populist with very authoritarian tendencies, and it doesn’t know how to fight him. I agree with your assessment: this country is in grave danger, but I think what’s happening here proves that the corrosion of democratic institutions is something that can happen in many parts of the world. With information channels such as social media, people can get “news” from any source. It doesn’t have to be the New York Times or the Washington Post. The president understands that, which is why he keeps finding ways to confound his critics in the press, and it’s how he weakens them. And it’s why we’re all in very serious trouble. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2018, 10:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/19818 "2018-05-01T10:17:40Z")
Can we please not keep with this right-wing bullshit about how being mean to Republicans is how Trump won? That’s the bullshit they came up with to excuse themselves, when we weren’t being mean to them until they started attacking us. They chose the guy who was attacking everyone. It also plays into the nonsense that there was something particularly mean about what this comedian said. There’s a reason they’re having to make up this bullshit about attacking a woman’s appearance in order to condemn her. When you make up shit, you admit there is no real argument. It is true that the right wing is largely fueled by anger. But you don’t respond to that by letting them take control of the narrative. You can’t give up the fight and constantly cede ground. You can’t let them turn anything negative about them into a taboo. You can’t let them dictate comedy having to be non-PC with things they hate but PC with anything that would hurt them. You can work on trying to understand them and getting through. But they do NOT get to silence us. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2018, 10:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/19819 "2018-05-01T10:24:58Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > Maybe what Zakalwe is really trying to point out is that Michelle Wolf actually made Sanders seem like a sympathetic character, which I think we can all agree that this is not at all what we want. Except it very much didn’t, because she didn’t say anything that made her out to be sympathetic. What happened is that she attacked the press, and thus the press made up some absolute bullshit in order to attack her back. Stop letting the right-wing fake outrage control the narrative. These are the people who say much worse things all the time. They aren’t really offended by this. The press has said more harmful things. They aren’t really offended by what they said. Stop falling for the bullshit narrative that it’s the liberals who are being too mean. Don’t let them gaslight you. And, no, the entire fucking point of the White House Correspondents Dinner is that they have a comedian who attacks them. Stop with the bullshit narrative that the right is making up as what should be done. Fuck it, I’ll make it plain. Stop defending Trump. When you play into their narrative and treat the Trump supporters as the victims, you are defending Trump. You’re giving him legitimacy. Stop it. ---
**Author:** ![Zakalwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zakalwe/32/270_2.png) [@Zakalwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zakalwe)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2018, 10:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/19820 "2018-05-01T10:44:57Z")
> [@Banquet\_Bear](#): > > That is a seriously fucked up paraphrase. That isn’t close to what you said. Funny you left this out: > [@Zakalwe](#): > > and I know that as a professional comedian she shouldn’t worry about this, but as someone who cares about more than her career, I do worry about it Thus the entire rest of the post should be read as with the knowledge that I am aware it’s not her responsibility to be a good Democrat on a public stage. > [@](#): > > Michelle Wolf, the woman you want to silence, is “on your side.” No. She’s on HER side. She’s trying to sell a new show (as you noted). Shock sells and any publicity is bad publicity and all that. And with that, I’m out. You stay happy in your little bubble where everybody agrees with you and somehow Wolf’s cuts at Sarah Huckabee Sanders wake up the country and result in a tidal wave of rainbows, kittens, and unicorns for the rest of the world. You’re awfully angry about this for someone who isn’t actually directly impacted by it. Some of us will keep on doing the work of actually convincing the people who can still be swayed that we’re the better option and trying to get them out to vote. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2018, 10:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/19821 "2018-05-01T10:46:05Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > Except it very much didn’t, because she didn’t say anything that made her out to be sympathetic. What happened is that she attacked the press, and thus the press made up some absolute bullshit in order to attack her back. > > Stop letting the right-wing fake outrage control the narrative. These are the people who say much worse things all the time. They aren’t really offended by this. The press has said more harmful things. They aren’t really offended by what they said. > > Stop falling for the bullshit narrative that it’s the liberals who are being too mean. Don’t let them gaslight you. > > And, no, the entire fucking point of the White House Correspondents Dinner is that they have a comedian who attacks them. Stop with the bullshit narrative that the right is making up as what should be done. > > Fuck it, I’ll make it plain. Stop defending Trump. When you play into their narrative and treat the Trump supporters as the victims, you are defending Trump. You’re giving him legitimacy. Stop it. I’m not defending Trump - far from it. But I _am_ pointing out that how SDMB sees the WHCD may be different than how others see it. ---
**Author:** ![SaneBill](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e68b1a/32.png) [@SaneBill](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SaneBill)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2018, 11:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/19822 "2018-05-01T11:22:50Z")
> [@CurtC](#): > > On the other hand, Tillerson lasted what, a few months, after doing that? He called trump a moron, not an idiot. Everybody knows right away what idiot means. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2018, 11:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/19823 "2018-05-01T11:33:56Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > I have a simpler explanation; they’re lying. > > They know that most of the people in their intended audience didn’t watch the show and will never check out the credibility of any accusations they make. So they’re free to make up a story about what Wolf said and their followers will accept it as gospel. I’m already seeing a lot of that on Facebook etc, with people posting the first half of the bit on abortion (with reference to “knocking the baby out”) and pretending it’s all about liberals being mean to women who’ve had abortions while selectively omitting the second part where she overtly explains that she’s referring to anti-abortionists who are perfectly fine getting their “secret mistresses” to abort babies when it suits them. But then it isn’t remotely the first time right-wingers have selectively edited something someone said and then pretended it meant something entirely different (e.g. “What difference does it make?” “You didn’t build that”, etc). ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2018, 12:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/19824 "2018-05-01T12:03:25Z")
> [@SaneBill](#): > > He called trump a moron, not an idiot. Most media omitted the preceding adjective that some reported Tillerson to have used as well. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070.md?page=990) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070.md?page=992)