# The Trump era - what's surprised you the most? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [June 17, 2018, 3:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-era-whats-surprised-you-the-most/816246 "2018-06-17T03:38:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 13
**Author:** ![Evil\_Economist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2018, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-era-whats-surprised-you-the-most/816246/241 "2018-07-11T15:08:02Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > Let’s try, as a ground rule, you **LEAVE MY KID THE FUCK OUT OF YOUR DELUSIONS** If you genuinely care about kids you should stay away from the news, because the Trump administration is doing some depraved fucking shit to a lot of innocent children. ---
**Author:** ![BeepKillBeep](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/9e8a1a/32.png) [@BeepKillBeep](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BeepKillBeep)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2018, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-era-whats-surprised-you-the-most/816246/242 "2018-07-11T16:31:55Z")
I think what has surprised me the most is that the USA is\* a fascist country and many Americans, not just some very small minority, are ok with it\*\*. \*or at least has been rapidly becoming one since, in my opinion, 9/11. I go back and forth on this in my head as to whether it is or is simply becoming. Today, I happen to be on the “is” side. \*\* I presume ok in the sense that they are ignorant that it has happened or is happening. Probably because few people are putting that label on what’s happening. I’m sure if you asked Americans “Do you think the USA should be fascist?” most would say no, but ask Americans if the USA should implement various fascist ideologies without the word fascism attached, and it seems like a fairly large number are ok with it. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2018, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-era-whats-surprised-you-the-most/816246/243 "2018-07-11T18:44:34Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > False. The Constitution gives the president the power to nominate. No one told the president he couldn’t nominate. In fact, he _did_ exercise his Constitutional power and made a nomination. Then the Senate chose how to utilize the power the Constitution gives to them\*\* to offer advice\*\* & consent to the president’s nomination (in this case by not voting). Hmmm. ISTM, that telling the POTUS _in advance_ of him putting forth a nominee, that any nomination he puts forward will NOT be consented to (or even considered) doesn’t _REALLY_ count as “advice” in the sense that the Founders intended. Does it seem otherwise to you? ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2018, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-era-whats-surprised-you-the-most/816246/244 "2018-07-11T18:55:10Z")
Well, “Go fuck yourself” \*is \*advice, of a sort. ---
**Author:** ![katgirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/6de8d8/32.png) [@katgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/katgirl)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2018, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-era-whats-surprised-you-the-most/816246/245 "2018-07-13T15:14:18Z")
> [@JB99](#): > > What surprised me the most about the Trump era is the extent to which people are simply impervious to facts. > > Hillary has been investigated and re-investigated over and over. And yet I’ll still hear people making the same claims and conspiracies (Murder! Benghazi! Pedophilia!) Long after they have been disproven. I still see people, even now, making these same discredited claims. It is pathetic beyond all belief. > > The other thing that surprised me is the overt racism. I was one of the poor fools who thought that racism was inherently and self-evidently wrong, and that it was all but expired in America. How wrong I was. I’m consistently astonished to see people saying racist things - often repeating Trump verbatim - and simultaneously blaming OBAMA as if he is somehow responsible for their racism. I didn’t know how evil America really was until the Trump gave people a license to go public with their hate. Yeah, I don’t get why people believe the lies about Hilary and ignore the truth about Trump. He gets a free pass for everything he does that’s bad just because he’s “not Hilary”. And he speaks like a dork. ---
**Author:** ![JB99](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/439d5e/32.png) [@JB99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JB99)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2018, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-era-whats-surprised-you-the-most/816246/246 "2018-07-13T21:29:15Z")
> [@BeepKillBeep](#): > > I think what has surprised me the most is that the USA is\* a fascist country and many Americans, not just some very small minority, are ok with it\*\*. > > \*or at least has been rapidly becoming one since, in my opinion, 9/11. I go back and forth on this in my head as to whether it is or is simply becoming. Today, I happen to be on the “is” side. > > \*\* I presume ok in the sense that they are ignorant that it has happened or is happening. Probably because few people are putting that label on what’s happening. I’m sure if you asked Americans “Do you think the USA should be fascist?” most would say no, but ask Americans if the USA should implement various fascist ideologies without the word fascism attached, and it seems like a fairly large number are ok with it. They don’t care about freedom and they never did. They only care about freedom for themselves and support fascist policies as long as they agree with them. The idea that one day a fascist might impose a policy they DON’T agree with never seems to enter their tiny little skulls. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2018, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-era-whats-surprised-you-the-most/816246/247 "2018-07-13T22:03:26Z")
> [@katgirl](#): > > Yeah, I don’t get why people believe the lies about Hilary and ignore the truth about Trump. He gets a free pass for everything he does that’s bad just because he’s “not Hilary”. And he speaks like a dork. People just _assume_ refineries stopped adding lead to gasoline, don’t they. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2018, 11:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-era-whats-surprised-you-the-most/816246/248 "2018-07-13T23:32:24Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > FUCK THAT!!! She wrote: > > (emphasis mine) > > There was nothing “generic” about it! It’s not ours, so who cares? ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Economist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2018, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-era-whats-surprised-you-the-most/816246/249 "2018-07-24T01:20:39Z")
Apparently the Trump administration has lost track of the parents of more than 400 children. The parents may have been deported. The children are still being held in cages in the United States. Oh, and there are reports that guards are raping and molesting the children. I do not exaggerate at all when I say that every time I read about the evil shit that Trump is doing to these children I get a sick feeling in my stomach. Those poor poor kids. People get upset about Nazi comparisons, but there’s no question in my mind that at some point in my life some child is going to ask me what I did when I learned what was happening. God I hope I have a good answer. ---
**Author:** ![E-DUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/e-dub/32/403_2.png) [@E-DUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-DUB)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2018, 1:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-era-whats-surprised-you-the-most/816246/250 "2018-07-24T01:54:02Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](#): > > I genuinely don’t see the relevance. > > You say: if they’d so voted ‘no’, then the system would’ve worked as intended; the president would’ve exercised a power to nominate a guy — and if the nominee then didn’t get consent from enough senators, then, hey, the system worked! > > I can picture a world where that happens again and again: the president exercises that nominate-some-guy power in the wake of a ‘no’ vote, after which the second nominee fails to get consent from enough senators and then a third nominee fails to get consent from enough senators and, _well, the system worked!_ > > Imagine that playing out as many times as you like: the president exercises his power to nominate someone; each nominee then fails to get on the Supreme Court upon failing to get consent from enough senators; system worked! > > What changes if you get that exact same result, except somebody takes the time to clue in the president that, _uh, look, you get that it’ll always be ‘no’, right?_ The difference is that in your scenario, they’d have to actually _cast_ the no votes rather than being able to point at the Senator from KY and say it was all his doing. There might attach to that some political liability when their constituents see them voting no on qualified nominee after qualified nominee. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2018, 7:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-era-whats-surprised-you-the-most/816246/251 "2018-07-24T07:45:18Z")
> [@BeepKillBeep](#): > > I think what has surprised me the most is that the USA is\* a fascist country and many Americans, not just some very small minority, are ok with it\*\*. > > \*or at least has been rapidly becoming one since, in my opinion, 9/11. I go back and forth on this in my head as to whether it is or is simply becoming. Today, I happen to be on the “is” side. > > \*\* I presume ok in the sense that they are ignorant that it has happened or is happening. Probably because few people are putting that label on what’s happening. I’m sure if you asked Americans “Do you think the USA should be fascist?” most would say no, but ask Americans if the USA should implement various fascist ideologies without the word fascism attached, and it seems like a fairly large number are ok with it. If the USA, which still perhaps has more freedom of speech than any other nation in the world at the moment, and holds midterm and presidential elections every 4 years, and still has considerable freedom of the press, and still abides by a Constitution, and still has a Supreme Court and still has judges who can restrain/stay/stop presidential orders, is fascist, then I can’t think of many nations in the world that aren’t fascist. I understand that things have become concerning of late but this is like a patient in an ER, with a broken pinky, surrounded by patients with far worse injuries, muttering to himself, “So this is what death feels like.” ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2018, 10:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-era-whats-surprised-you-the-most/816246/252 "2018-07-24T10:41:36Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > If the USA, which still perhaps has more freedom of speech than any other nation in the world at the moment, and holds midterm and presidential elections every 4 years, and still has considerable freedom of the press, and still abides by a Constitution, and still has a Supreme Court and still has judges who can restrain/stay/stop presidential orders, is fascist, then I can’t think of many nations in the world that aren’t fascist. > > I understand that things have become concerning of late but this is like a patient in an ER, with a broken pinky, surrounded by patients with far worse injuries, muttering to himself, “So this is what death feels like.” Your post reflects your ignorance about how democracy lives, and how it ultimately dies. As RickJay said in another thread, even in dictatorships, there are usually elections; they’re just sham elections, with a majority realizing that the election was rigged and the majority ever more desperate to impose their will on their “enemies.” Authoritarian governments still have courts; they’re just courts that are increasingly stacked with ideologues and loyalists. Authoritarian governments still have constitutions; they just have their own interpretation of them, and decide which rules they wish to follow. Democracy doesn’t die right away; these things take time. But when ordinary people finally realize they don’t have a democracy anymore, it’s usually too late. It’s usually when they finally realize that inflation is out of control and there are food shortages and the current government has absolutely no idea how it got into this mess and no idea how to get out of it. And the problem is, once they come to that realization, you can’t just vote them out then. ---
**Author:** ![BeepKillBeep](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/9e8a1a/32.png) [@BeepKillBeep](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BeepKillBeep)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2018, 12:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-era-whats-surprised-you-the-most/816246/253 "2018-07-24T12:54:35Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > If the USA, which still perhaps has more freedom of speech than any other nation in the world at the moment, and holds midterm and presidential elections every 4 years, and still has considerable freedom of the press, and still abides by a Constitution, and still has a Supreme Court and still has judges who can restrain/stay/stop presidential orders, is fascist, then I can’t think of many nations in the world that aren’t fascist. > > I understand that things have become concerning of late but this is like a patient in an ER, with a broken pinky, surrounded by patients with far worse injuries, muttering to himself, “So this is what death feels like.” Those things can still exist in a fascist state. The USA is clearly at least in what Paxton would call stage 1. You could argue maybe up to stage 3. If nothing else, the USA is on the cusp of stage 1 (although I think it is deeper than that). Ignoring the movement towards fascism, refusing to call it what it is, is the best way for it to come about. Unfortunately too many Americans revel in ignorance and arrogance about 'merica, thus all but ensuring a steady decline. I hope I’m wrong but recents have shown me you cannot underestimate the American electorate. Sent from my SM-T580 using Tapatalk ---
**Author:** ![Crane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crane/32/3495_2.png) [@Crane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crane)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2018, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-era-whats-surprised-you-the-most/816246/254 "2018-07-24T13:54:03Z")
A trash talking, bungling oaf has become president of the US and appointed a cabinet of incompetent fools. Our most successful alliances have been cast aside in order to elevate the stature of our enemies. The president is daily reaping millions of dollars in benefits while he uses his position to personally punish anyone who voices criticism. He casually violates all social norms. What’s not to be amazed about? It’s an Altman/Sellers drama - M_O_R_O_N. ---
**Author:** ![JB99](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/439d5e/32.png) [@JB99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JB99)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2018, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-era-whats-surprised-you-the-most/816246/255 "2018-07-24T17:06:11Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > I understand that things have become concerning of late but this is like a patient in an ER, with a broken pinky, surrounded by patients with far worse injuries, muttering to himself, “So this is what death feels like.” A better metaphor might be patient who just discovered they have cancer. The problem with a broken bone is that the patient knows it is broken and can point to the trauma that caused the break. A cancer patient discovers their cancer when the disease has progressed to the point that the symptoms become visible. Sometimes it can be fixed, sometimes it cannot. Cancer is insidious and often unpredictable. And the worst part is that there is no easy cure because the body’s own cells are causing the problem to begin with. And being told other people have far more advanced cancer does not provide much comfort. Sad. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-era-whats-surprised-you-the-most/816246.md?page=12)