# The Trump Impeachment Inquiry **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [September 24, 2019, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771 "2019-09-24T20:23:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 22
**Author:** ![Dale\_Sams](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/779978/32.png) [@Dale\_Sams](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dale_Sams)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2019, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/421 "2019-09-25T23:47:49Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > But let’s zoom out for a second here: Trump puts the hold on Ukraine aid in advance of the phone call, has the phone call, and still doesn’t release the aid. Why? > > Reports are that Bolton and the Pentagon are urging the aid to be released. If there is no quid pro quo, why not release it? > > Or… is it because that Zelensky didn’t hand over the smokking gun (or however Trump spells it) that links Hillary’s emails to Hunter Biden to Warren’s birth certificate to the child sex ring at the Comet Ping Pong pizza parlor? > > Clearly, this story is not told only through this phone call. As damning as it is, there’s more to be learned here. [Pepe Silvia](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_nTpsv9PNqo) ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2019, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/422 "2019-09-25T23:48:22Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > That’s funny, your article doesn’t say anything about “quid pro quo”. It says they understood it as a “precondition”. Do you understand that those are two different things? They really aren’t. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2019, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/423 "2019-09-25T23:48:23Z")
> [@bobot](#): > > I hope they also added: > Not that a quid pro quo is required for your so-called president to have wiped his ass with his so-called oath of office, ha ha! > Best friends, > Ukraine Ok, that’s hilarious. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2019, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/424 "2019-09-25T23:51:31Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > But let’s zoom out for a second here: Trump puts the hold on Ukraine aid in advance of the phone call, has the phone call, and still doesn’t release the aid. Why? … Perhaps because the “hold on Ukraine aid” wasn’t related to the imagined quid pro quo that you guys think you’re reading between the lines of the phone call.’ ---
**Author:** ![Dale\_Sams](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/779978/32.png) [@Dale\_Sams](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dale_Sams)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2019, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/425 "2019-09-25T23:51:39Z")
> [@wolfpup](#): > > That’s pretty devastating. And I’m kind of imagining some Ukrainian officials being thrown under Ukrainian buses, Trump style, for leaking this kind of stuff. Because judging from that phone call, Zelensky himself appears to be a sycophantic Trump toady, having been suitably bribed. I wonder…and I’m being serious…if right now Putin isnt asking himself “WHyyyyy arn’t I invading the Ukraine right now? I mean…it would be the perfect time no? Somebody convince me not to cause if you don’t I’m gonna.” ---
**Author:** ![squidfood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a87d85/32.png) [@squidfood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/squidfood)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2019, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/426 "2019-09-25T23:53:01Z")
> [@wolfpup](#): > > That’s pretty devastating. And I’m kind of imagining some Ukrainian officials being thrown under Ukrainian buses, Trump style, for leaking this kind of stuff. Because judging from that phone call, Zelensky himself appears to be a sycophantic Trump toady, having been suitably bribed. As I’m not the leader of a smallish country facing a looming existential military threat, I’m not gonna judge if such a leader says “sure sure whatever you say” to get the aid, especially since he could do a token non-investigation and say “oh hey sorry, nothing there” afterwards. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2019, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/427 "2019-09-25T23:54:26Z")
If you indeed did that, would it be a … 🆒 Squid pro quo? YEEAAAAAHHHH! ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2019, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/428 "2019-09-25T23:55:13Z")
Again, the bribe is not just the release of the authorized funds but the additional $140m in funds Zelensky claims was promised to Ukraine this month. > **[Ukraine's president: US will give extra $140 million in aid](https://apnews.com/d472bf98c8ad45a1aa8ce1bcdc68adb3)** > > KYIV, Ukraine (AP) — Ukraine's president said Friday that the United States hasn't only released $250 million in military aid to his country but will also extend an additional $140... Interact with HD about definitions and the statistical significance of 38% vs 42% for your own amusement, but he’s not really bringing anything to the table here. ---
**Author:** ![Dale\_Sams](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/779978/32.png) [@Dale\_Sams](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dale_Sams)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2019, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/429 "2019-09-25T23:58:10Z")
> [@AlsoNamedBort](#): > > [According to CNN](https://www.cnn.com/2019/09/25/politics/donald-trump-incredulous-nancy-pelosi-impeachment/index.html), it was Trump himself who pushed for the release, and is shocked that it didn’t make everything better. Ahhh…The Reynolds Pamphlet Gambit. ---
**Author:** ![Dale\_Sams](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/779978/32.png) [@Dale\_Sams](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dale_Sams)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2019, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/430 "2019-09-25T23:59:38Z")
> [@Ludovic](#): > > If you indeed did that, would it be a … > > 🆒 > > Squid pro quo? > > YEEAAAAAHHHH! Trump: Its a trap! ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/431 "2019-09-26T00:03:59Z")
> [@Dale\_Sams](#): > > I wonder…and I’m being serious…if right now Putin isnt asking himself “WHyyyyy arn’t I invading the Ukraine right now? I mean…it would be the perfect time no? Somebody convince me not to cause if you don’t I’m gonna.” I’m pretty sure that would end up raising the sanctions to “it’s now illegal to do business with Russians” levels. So that’s one reason. Russia would probably go broke paying for that war and occupation is another dandy reason not to. ---
**Author:** ![Dale\_Sams](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/779978/32.png) [@Dale\_Sams](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dale_Sams)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/432 "2019-09-26T00:06:23Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > I’m pretty sure that would end up raising the sanctions to “it’s now illegal to do business with Russians” levels. So that’s one reason. Russia would probably go broke paying for that war and occupation is another dandy reason not to. Again being serious not snarky…I wasn’t aware the west kept Russia at the end of a financial leash. That’s good to know. And relieving. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/433 "2019-09-26T00:08:28Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > Perhaps because the “hold on Ukraine aid” wasn’t related to the imagined quid pro quo that you guys think you’re reading between the lines of the phone call.’ I’m literally saying that the phone call can not explain Trump’s corrupt actions, and you say that I’m “reading between the lines of the phone call?” You’re not even reading the actual lines of my post. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/434 "2019-09-26T00:09:19Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > Again, the bribe is not just the release of the authorized funds but the additional $140m in funds Zelensky claims was promised to Ukraine this month. > > [Ukraine's president: US will give extra $140 million in aid | AP News](https://www.apnews.com/d472bf98c8ad45a1aa8ce1bcdc68adb3) > > … Here’s what that $141.5 million was announced a few weeks ago: > [@](#): > > The latest approval for funding comes from fiscal 2018 foreign military financing and overseas contingency operations accounts ($26.5 million) and from fiscal 2019 foreign military financing funds ($115 million). > > The projects break down like this: > > $10 million to the Countering Russian Influence Fund, which helps provide “advisors, equipment, spare parts and training to build maritime domain awareness, secure communications, command and control, marksmanship, night vision disaster preparedness and special operations and territorial defense units.” Some money may also be used for cyber resiliency efforts. > $16.5 million in Europe and Eurasia regional funds, targeted to Black Sea maritime security efforts with a focus on “detecting, identifying and tracking Russian surface, subsurface and long-range aircraft combatants.” This may include funding for naval special warfare training. > $115 million in foreign military financing funding for FY19. Included in that funding are English language training, medical equipment, an improvised explosive device simulator and urban operations simulation equipment. Other areas of focus include naval and maritime capability support, refurbishment of equipment, airfield defense, night vision devices, radars, vehicles and tactical communication equipment. More specifically, funding “seeks to improve anti-armor, anti-personnel and counter-sniper capabilities against Russian-led separatists by modernizing Ukraine’s small arms weapons inventory with more precise and capable weapons, including sniper rifles and rocket-propelled grenade launchers.” [source](https://www.defensenews.com/global/europe/2019/09/12/trump-admin-clears-ukraine-security-assistance-funding-but-pentagon-money-still-in-limbo/) How is that in any way, shape, or form, a “bribe”? Are you just throwing out random words and hoping something sticks? ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/435 "2019-09-26T00:09:20Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > That’s funny, your article doesn’t say anything about “quid pro quo”. It says they understood it as a “precondition”. Do you understand that those are two different things? That’s hysterical. They have to actually utter the magical phrase “quid pro quo” for this to be wrong? Is that where you’ve planted your flag? ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/436 "2019-09-26T00:11:30Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > That’s funny, your article doesn’t say anything about “quid pro quo”. It says they understood it as a “precondition”. Do you understand that those are two different things? That’s funny, the article says that Ukraine’s “most important benefactor” – the President of the USA – wouldn’t even talk to Zelensky unless he agreed to the Biden investigation. What do you suppose they were thinking about implications to the military aid that had been promised but not yet provided if Trump wouldn’t even talk to them, especially knowing Trump’s childlike impetuousness? Are you really being serious here? This is the guy who cancelled a state visit to Denmark because they wouldn’t sell him Greenland. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/437 "2019-09-26T00:12:20Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > They really aren’t. No, he’s right. It was a _quo pro quid_. Totally different. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/438 "2019-09-26T00:12:55Z")
dems: President Trump is a Russian stooge. He’s doing Putin’s bidding. Also dems: President Trump is giving lethal military aid to Ukraine to help them kill Russians and that’s a “bribe”. :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Lendervedder](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_lendervedder/32/8488_2.png) [@Happy\_Lendervedder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Lendervedder)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 12:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/439 "2019-09-26T00:14:01Z")
Hey, as long as he hasn’t been spotted in a tan suit, everything else can be hand-waved away. ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/440 "2019-09-26T00:15:12Z")
> [@squidfood](#): > > As I’m not the leader of a smallish country facing a looming existential military threat, I’m not gonna judge if such a leader says “sure sure whatever you say” to get the aid, especially since he could do a token non-investigation and say “oh hey sorry, nothing there” afterwards. This is a reasonable point, but reading the transcript gives the distinction impression that Zelensky is going far, far beyond simply being respectful, and fawning over Trump to a degree that’s literally embarrassing to read. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771.md?page=21) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771.md?page=23)