# The Trump Impeachment Inquiry **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [September 24, 2019, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771 "2019-09-24T20:23:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 266
**Author:** ![cmosdes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a587f6/32.png) [@cmosdes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmosdes)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 2:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/5301 "2019-11-21T02:48:37Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > The polls over the next few weeks will be interesting. The cynic in me thinks that the truth just doesn’t matter. If we don’t see a significant drop in the polls, I think that’s pretty indicative that there is no reaching these people and that we are stuck with them. I was reading the comments on FoxNews and the needle won’t move. So many comments that just follow along the usual talking points. The fact all those points have been utterly refuted doesn’t seem to have changed much. I can sorta get why lunch pale Gary doesn’t follow along and get some of this, but I wonder if the Senators really believe what they are saying. It is one thing for a defense lawyer to put up a smoke screen to try and protect a client, but this should not be this way. It kills me to see party over country. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/5302 "2019-11-21T02:52:19Z")
> [@Airbeck](#): > > **Max** - Why do you think they haven’t raised that question yet? They are literally throwing everything against the wall including batshit insane and already debunked conspiracy theories, but they haven’t asked the one important question you think they need to? **Do you think it’s because they are dumb?** Or maybe because they know damn well there was no legitimate investigation? What is the most logical reason you can think of that they have not asked this yet? In **Max S.** ’s defense, if they weren’t dumb they wouldn’t be Republicans. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 2:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/5303 "2019-11-21T02:55:00Z")
> [@Sage\_Rat](#): > > To be fair, allowing your favorite commentators to get between the original sources and your brain is how a large percentage of the population had ended up where they are. It’s also the way the world has worked since the beginning of a multi-town sized society. There is no way any of you are paying full attention even if you have it on tv the entire time. I gotta assume y’all have a couple of other obligations through the day? It is impossible for the populace to absorb days and days of testimony while also, you know, keep society functioning. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/5304 "2019-11-21T02:58:32Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > How do they think that’s going to work, exactly? I mean, is there anyone else in the entire government who has the authority to withhold Congressionally-approved, tax-payer-funded aid to another nation other than a president? I’ve yet to hear any explanation for withholding the aid up to the point of the whistleblower’s complaint, when it was suddenly released. > > (I don’t expect you to defend this on behalf of Fox “News,” obviously. Just pointing out a glaring obstacle for Fox. Not that their viewers much care about ginormous inconsistencies.) Well you know how it is. If you spend all yer time looking for plot holes, yer gonna mss all the good parts of the movie. ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 3:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/5305 "2019-11-21T03:19:12Z")
Opinion | Gordon Sondland Leaves Us With No Other Option - The New York Times > **[Opinion | Gordon Sondland Leaves Us With No Other Option (Published 2019)](https://www.nytimes.com/2019/11/20/opinion/gordon-sondland-impeachment-ukraine.html?action=click&module=Opinion&pgtype=Homepage)** > > The case is simple, and the evidence supporting impeachment is now crystal clear. > [@](#): > > History will remember Wednesday as the day a United States ambassador testified under oath before Congress and laid out a clear, simple and damning case that President Trump abused the power of his office and committed bribery, an act for which the Constitution leaves but one outcome. > > The evidence was already overwhelming, but now there can be no question about it: Ambassador Gordon Sondland’s testimony was the smoking gun. > > …The facts are not meaningfully in dispute, because Mr. Sondland’s testimony corroborates the accounts of multiple strong and reliable witnesses. > … All-righty then! ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/5306 "2019-11-21T03:42:51Z")
> [@MulderMuffin](#): > > We’re four hours in today, and we’re haven’t even gotten to member questions. I have things to do today, but I can’t stop watching. The morning sessions are usually done by now. I wouldn’t even mind if they weren’t asking the same four questions over and over and over (exaggerating, but not by much). > > If I started a drinking game to take a shot every time Nunes brought up the whistleblower, my liver would have moved to Paraguay by now in protest. Heck, I’M ready to move to Paraguay in protest. Always good to spend most of your time within a few miles of your liver, I always say. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/5307 "2019-11-21T03:44:07Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > It’s also the way the world has worked since the beginning of a multi-town sized society. There is no way any of you are paying full attention even if you have it on tv the entire time. I gotta assume y’all have a couple of other obligations through the day? It is impossible for the populace to absorb days and days of testimony while also, you know, keep society functioning. > **[Amazon.com: Speed Reading For Dummies: 9780470457443: Sutz, Richard, Weverka,...](https://www.amazon.com/Speed-Reading-Dummies-Richard-Sutz/dp/0470457449)** > > Amazon.com: Speed Reading For Dummies: 9780470457443: Sutz, Richard, Weverka, Peter: Books My parents regularly suggest that I should watch so-and-so documentary. Those documentaries are liable to be 90-120 minutes in length and, generally, cover material that I could find in a single article on the Wikipedia which I could likely read in 5-10 minutes at most. The documentary will almost always - by virtue of being a documentary - have some angle on the topic at hand for which the content has been selected and edited together. The Wikipedia is reasonably likely to be unbiased or at least contain a smattering of datum from competing editors. If your primary source of information is audible, you can probably beat it handily by reading. And if your favorite pundits are writers, probably you can identify the content that you want to know about, inside a large text, and scoop it out, in about the same amount of time as reading an op-ed of it. Usually, what you want is just a few sentences or paragraphs. Op-eds take that and bloat it out to ten times the size with material that has no factual merit. This isn’t to say that you shouldn’t read other people’s thoughts on a text, nor choose good people to review, but relying on it solely is a path to madness. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 3:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/5308 "2019-11-21T03:49:35Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > Opinion | Gordon Sondland Leaves Us With No Other Option - The New York Times > > [https://www.nytimes.com/2019/11/20/opinion/gordon-sondland-impeachment-ukraine.html?action=click&module=Opinion&pgtype=Homepage](https://www.nytimes.com/2019/11/20/opinion/gordon-sondland-impeachment-ukraine.html?action=click&module=Opinion&pgtype=Homepage) > All-righty then! Once the Republicans in the Senate start making quiet shuffling movements, we can call the smoking gun. And, to be sure, that could happen - I’m sure he gave them a strong kick in the teeth at any rate - but I’d wait to see the actual movement before announcing a win. For the moment, though, I would view Sondland’s key gift being a new list of names - closer to the President - and an on-the-record note of the existence of certain documents and recordings. ---
**Author:** ![Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/try2b_comprehensive/32/65_2.png) [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Try2B_Comprehensive)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 4:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/5309 "2019-11-21T04:28:44Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > Re: Parnas and the company “Fraud Guarantee” > > What’s next for Republican con-men? Is someone in the future going to start a company designed to fleece Republican supporters out of their cash, and name it “We Are Stealing Your Money You Stupid Rubes”??? Reminds me of [this](https://condenaststore.com/featured/he-tells-it-like-it-is-paul-noth.html). ---
**Author:** ![John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_stamos_left_ear/32/3198_2.png) [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Stamos_Left_Ear)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 1:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/5310 "2019-11-21T13:18:19Z")
> [@Kron](#): > > Poe’s Law? Nope. True believer. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_stamos_left_ear/32/3198_2.png) [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Stamos_Left_Ear)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 1:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/5311 "2019-11-21T13:22:35Z")
> [@Sage\_Rat](#): > > To be fair, allowing your favorite commentators to get between the original sources and your brain is how a large percentage of the population had ended up where they are. Some of us pick commentators who don’t lie. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 1:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/5312 "2019-11-21T13:22:37Z")
I ran into some friends last night who play in a bluegrass band. Discussing the day’s events, I suggested the band begin practicing [_In The Jailhouse Now_](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/In_the_Jailhouse_Now), you know, just in case. Turns out they’ve played around with that song already, but will add it to their set list now.🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/5313 "2019-11-21T14:08:35Z")
A very real possibility is that Trump gets impeached, is not removed by the Senate and is re-elected in 2020. Can you imagine how emboldened a Trump who got away with this would be in a second term? He would know that he really could shoot someone on fifth avenue and the minority party running the United States would let him get away with it. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/5314 "2019-11-21T14:12:27Z")
I think this may emerge as a key issue in the campaign: “Can you imagine a Trump presidency where he has nothing left to lose?” ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/5315 "2019-11-21T14:49:15Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > I think this may emerge as a key issue in the campaign: “Can you imagine a Trump presidency where he has nothing left to lose?” Sounds like the making of a country song. I’m waiting for Nunes to lead his faithful in a rousing chant of “Hillary lied- people died- BENGHAZI!” The voters should remember this well in 2020. ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/5316 "2019-11-21T15:42:55Z")
[Geoff Bennett](https://twitter.com/GeoffRBennett/status/1197484807283822593), _NBC News_: > [@](#): > > Fiona Hill will tell Congress that domestic partisan politics have driven a “fictional alternative narrative” about Ukraine that is “misguided” and wrong, a source familiar tells NBC. Hill will also warn about the threat to the democracy posed by Moscow. [Josh Lederman](https://twitter.com/JoshNBCNews/status/1197534559434366977), _NBC News_: > [@](#): > > Fiona Hill testifies that Putin and his underlings operate “like a super PAC,” pouring in money to divide Americans [Josh Dawsey](https://twitter.com/jdawsey1/status/1197535719184576515), _Washington Post_: > [@](#): > > “This is exactly what the Russian government was hoping for … that they would pit one side of our electorate against the other,” Fiona Hill says, adding that the Russians just want Americans to question the legitimacy of any president & create chaos. [David Lauter](https://twitter.com/DavidLauter/status/1197535638758793217), _LA Times_: > [@](#): > > “The goal of the Russians” is to put any U.S. president “under a cloud” by delegitimizing the presidency, itself, Fiona Hill says. Their goal is to “have everybody questioning” the system. [Jonathan Lemire](https://twitter.com/JonLemire/status/1197167558169956352), _AP_: > [@](#): > > “Thank God,” Putin told an economic forum in the Russian capital on Wednesday, “no one is accusing us of interfering in the U.S. elections anymore; now they’re accusing Ukraine.” ---
**Author:** ![JKellyMap](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jkellymap/32/15880_2.png) [@JKellyMap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKellyMap)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/5317 "2019-11-21T15:53:00Z")
Well, now I know that people from County Durham (like Fiona Hill) speak English with a “mid-vowel” **e** sound — something difficult for most other English speakers when they’re learning Spanish, Italian, or Portuguese. ---
**Author:** ![steronz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steronz/32/11765_2.png) [@steronz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steronz)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/5318 "2019-11-21T16:06:19Z")
How did Russia manage to make Trump hold up security assistance in exchange for a sham investigation against Joe Biden? Amazing, the powers they hold… Is that what she’s saying here? ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/5319 "2019-11-21T16:12:14Z")
> [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](#): > > Some of us pick commentators who don’t lie. a) Being told what to think is just as bad as being lied to. b) Omission is a form of lying and one that occurs largely as a matter of what that individual finds bolsters their argument rather than as an intent to lie. c) You can find articles of interviews between the media and Trump’s DHS before the “child separations” issue was released where they are calmly discussing the implications of a mandatory criminal prosecution on illegal immigrants and how that would require that you separate the families since children aren’t allowed in prison. And then, there was an article that stated that the DHS had lost track of which kids belonged to which parents and, upon encountering that article, the readers, who had not picked up on the earlier news about the minutiae of what all implications there were of the mandatory prosecution policy, went, “What the hell?? They’re separating children from their parents!!!?” And then the media looked at the view counts on those articles and said, “Yes. Yes, they are. Separating children from their parents, that’s their policy. We didn’t know before, but gee do we now!” Whereas, say, for example we had that time when the New York Times spent two years and massive labor looking through Trump’s finances and they largely determined that the way Trump was able to buy Mar-A-Lago and his other holdings is, in essence, by liquidating the much larger fortune that his dad had built, after his death. That article was too long, too boring, and buried the most important details midway through the article. Probably not intentionally - just journalists who were overly optimistic about the average reader’s ability to read a long article - but, in general, that article was a flop and most people probably never read to the part where it actually said what it was trying to say. As a side effect of that, your average person - even those on the left - is still mystified about how it can be that Trump can be such a “success” and how that must mean that he’s smart and canny. But, no, “dying wealthy relative” is not a smart business strategy. That’s called “luck”. Importantly, though, that article didn’t get nearly as high a view count as, say, child separations. So did others re-report the NYT, helping to boost the main message? Did they allude to the key details later, to ensure that everyone knew? Did they hammer on the topic thousands and thousands of times so that you couldn’t help but know the truth? Nope. Because they are a business and because journalists are people, too. The business is not interested in articles that don’t sell and the journalists have a limited amount of time and don’t know everything, they just know what the business tells them they should write about. If the business tells them to write about the “child separation policy” because it’s getting maybe clicks, then the journalist jumps in, does two seconds of research to get what they need to support the story, and they crank out an article. They don’t really think about it or go in-depth. And they plaster over earlier articles on the subject, which were more nuanced, so that you can’t find them. But they aren’t asked to write about the fortune of Fred Trump, which appears to have been about 10X the size of Donald’s. And so, no one knows that. Journalism is a business. The business goes with the clicks and the clicks are not based on rationality. They’re based on emotions, catchy headlines, ignorance, and impatience. If the sources you read are keeping you entertained and happy… Well, they have the numbers they need to know what makes you entertained and happy. The media on the left and right are vastly different and that is, likely, less driven by management so much as its pushed a particular direction in reward for a particular presentation of the material that appeals to that reader base. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/5320 "2019-11-21T16:14:25Z")
> [@steronz](#): > > How did Russia manage to make Trump hold up security assistance in exchange for a sham investigation against Joe Biden? Amazing, the powers they hold… > > Is that what she’s saying here? Offhand, I’d say it’s because Putin controls the White House. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771.md?page=265) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771.md?page=267)