# The Trump Impeachment Inquiry **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [September 24, 2019, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771 "2019-09-24T20:23:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 37
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/721 "2019-09-26T19:59:25Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > Shoe’s on the other foot now. That’s how Republicans feel about virtually all the investigations the dems have been calling for / pursuing for the past couple of years. What a load of bullshit. Remind us: how many Benghazi investigations were there? How many Obama birth certificate investigations? ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/722 "2019-09-26T20:02:51Z")
> [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](#): > > Look, while I appreciate that many here are looking for **HurricaneDitka** to have a “come to Jesus” moment, there is zero way this happens. He is convinced that Trump can do no wrong, and even an admission from Trump that he did do wrong is met with contortions. And pinning him down on what it would take is useless - he’ll just move goalposts or say “that’s not what happened” just as he can deny what actually happened in that phone call that Trump admitted to doing. > > This thread will be great for sharing updates on the impeachment. But I humbly suggest that we not waste our time trying to get HurricaneDitka to believe anything and spend even less time caring when he inevitably doesn’t. This, this, and a thousand times this. Why are you all giving HD this much airtime? It’s a distraction from the main discussion and BTW who cares? Almost every post of his gets a reply or even multiple replies. Why? It’s not like he adds anything substantive to the conversation, and \*everyone knows that. \*😕 ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/723 "2019-09-26T20:03:22Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Do you have a full link? Those squashed links don’t work for me. They work for me. [first](https://today.yougov.com/opi/surveys/results#/survey/72f3bf66-dee3-11e9-b4a9-9f0e9e31e4a3/question/9b91b2b7-dee3-11e9-ba0e-c7fcd6994022/politics) [second](https://twitter.com/brianklaas/status/1177278120820387840/photo/1) [third](https://www.npr.org/2019/09/25/764453663/pentagon-letter-undercuts-trump-assertion-on-delaying-aid-to-ukraine-over-corrup?utm_campaign=storyshare&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_medium=social) ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/724 "2019-09-26T20:06:40Z")
> [@Skywatcher](#): > > They work for me. > > [first](https://today.yougov.com/opi/surveys/results#/survey/72f3bf66-dee3-11e9-b4a9-9f0e9e31e4a3/question/9b91b2b7-dee3-11e9-ba0e-c7fcd6994022/politics) > > [second](https://twitter.com/brianklaas/status/1177278120820387840/photo/1) > > [third](https://www.npr.org/2019/09/25/764453663/pentagon-letter-undercuts-trump-assertion-on-delaying-aid-to-ukraine-over-corrup?utm_campaign=storyshare&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_medium=social) Thanks! ---
**Author:** ![eschrodinger](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschrodinger/32/122_2.png) [@eschrodinger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschrodinger)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/725 "2019-09-26T20:08:06Z")
I think the answer to the Biden was doing something shady argument is, as already mentioned, to say that if there is any evidence.of that, it should be provided to the FBI for them to investigate. I think it is detrimental to get sidetracked into a defense of Biden. Because the legitimate way for any evidence of wrongdoing by Joe Biden to be investigated would be to hand it over to the FBI, I don’t think the request to Ukraine can be viewed as anything but a request to “manufacture dirt” on Biden. The first bit of dirt would be to be able to say, “Biden is being investigated by the Ukraine anticorruption prosecutor for interfering in an investigation of his son’s employer.” ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/726 "2019-09-26T20:08:10Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > You. > > Are. > > WRONG. You just fell into his literal trap. ---
**Author:** ![YamatoTwinkie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/cc9497/32.png) [@YamatoTwinkie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YamatoTwinkie)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/727 "2019-09-26T20:11:04Z")
> [@The President](#): > > A lot of the European countries are the same way so I think it’s something you want to look at but the United States has been very very good to Ukraine. I wouldn’t say that it’s reciprocal necessarily because things are happening that are not good but the United States has been very very good to Ukraine. While its not an _overt_ Quid-pro-quo, I think it’s heavily implied. As I read it, the exchange is basically: 1. We’ve been good to you. 2. It’s not reciprocal. 3. I have a favor to ask. But perhaps there are completely innocent explanations for this. I haven’t heard them yet. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/728 "2019-09-26T20:11:55Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > Shoe’s on the other foot now. That’s how Republicans feel about virtually all the investigations the dems have been calling for / pursuing for the past couple of years. Wait a second. The Muller report concludes that there were instances where any other person than the President would have been investigated for obstruction of justice – and that Trump could face prosecution after his term – you can’t call that entirely political. Trump’s call for investigation of Hunter Biden is based on a thorough – and likely intentional – misrepresenation of facts. There are not the same shoes, or feet. Look, I understand that it hurts your feelings when you see political attacks on your guy. But there’s no reason to state egregiously wrong things in a feeble defense. ---
**Author:** ![Malleus\_Incus\_Stapes](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/malleus_incus_stapes/32/3293_2.png) [@Malleus\_Incus\_Stapes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malleus_Incus_Stapes)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/729 "2019-09-26T20:12:10Z")
I’m practically melting from schadenfreude here. I’m hate-angry to a level that scares me. (And I’m sad, because people I know and love live in the Fox News bubble and won’t ever believe it). ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/730 "2019-09-26T20:13:57Z")
> [@Skywatcher](#): > > You just fell into his literal trap. That’s true, but since we are talking about shoes being on the other foot, let’s try this out: there is no person named Hunter Biden. He does not exist. Trump is calling for an investigation into an imaginary person. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/731 "2019-09-26T20:18:29Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > You. > > Are. > > WRONG. No, nothing there mentions the $250M / $391M in aid that was supposedly President Trump’s leverage in his quid pro quo. “I will say that we do a lot for Ukraine. We spend a lot of effort and a lot of time.” “Effort” & “time”; he didn’t mention the money. “… the United States has been very very good to Ukraine.” Again, no mention of aid money. The US was helping Ukraine in lots of ways: sanctions on Russia, condemning Russia’s aggression on the global stage, etc. You are imagining that he _must_ be referring to the aid money because that’s what you _want_ it to be about. You’re hearing something that’s not there, that you badly _want_ to be there. Try to take another look at the bit you quoted through a less partisan lens, and then consider again my statement: “He didn’t even mention the financial aid at all on the call” ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/732 "2019-09-26T20:19:00Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > What a load of bullshit. Remind us: how many Benghazi investigations were there? How many Obama birth certificate investigations? And way before either of those: impeachment proceedings which stemmed from a blowjob. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/733 "2019-09-26T20:24:47Z")
And a quid pro quo isn’t required for Trump to have violated his oath of office. It seems like that’s been mentioned already, but there it is again. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/734 "2019-09-26T20:34:42Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > It looks like there’s some shady shit that went on with the Biden boys in Ukraine, and I think it should be investigated thoroughly (you guys do support investigations, right?). Also you: > [@](#): > > I find it helpful to put it in terms of things you guys have claimed, without proof. If you could prove some of those things, then you’d really have something. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/735 "2019-09-26T20:35:19Z")
Saying it again, but let’s not forget that HD is arguing that we expect exactitude from a document written by an administration which took a sharpie to a weather map… for a week. An interesting exercise: Grab a partner and act the transcript out\*. One of you is Trump, one is Zelensky. Did this with my daughter last night, she was like “Dad, that’s intimidating as hell.” \*To act out a phone call, sit in chairs, back to back, and read your assigned roles. Don’t look at each other. ---
**Author:** ![steatopygia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steatopygia/32/3132_2.png) [@steatopygia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steatopygia)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/736 "2019-09-26T20:39:56Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > Saying it again, but let’s not forget that HD is arguing that we expect exactitude from a document written by an administration which took a sharpie to a weather map… for a week. > > An interesting exercise: Grab a partner and act the transcript out\*. One of you is Trump, one is Zelensky. Did this with my daughter last night, she was like “Dad, that’s intimidating as hell.” > > \*To act out a phone call, sit in chairs, back to back, and read your assigned roles. Don’t look at each other. And one of you, pretend to be a comic who accidentally got elected to be president of a country that Russia is invading. The other one pretends to be a stupider version of Don Corleone. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/737 "2019-09-26T20:40:03Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > No, nothing there mentions the $250M / $391M in aid that was supposedly President Trump’s leverage in his quid pro quo. > > “I will say that we do a lot for Ukraine. We spend a lot of effort and a lot of time.” “Effort” & “time”; he didn’t mention the money. > > “… the United States has been very very good to Ukraine.” Again, no mention of aid money. The US was helping Ukraine in lots of ways: sanctions on Russia, condemning Russia’s aggression on the global stage, etc. You are imagining that he _must_ be referring to the aid money because that’s what you _want_ it to be about. You’re hearing something that’s not there, that you badly _want_ to be there. Try to take another look at the bit you quoted through a less partisan lens, and then consider again my statement: “He didn’t even mention the financial aid at all on the call” Ok, then Hunter Biden does not exist. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/738 "2019-09-26T20:43:26Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > No, nothing there mentions the $250M / $391M in aid that was supposedly President Trump’s leverage in his quid pro quo. > > “I will say that we do a lot for Ukraine. We spend a lot of effort and a lot of time.” “Effort” & “time”; he didn’t mention the money. The effort he was talking about was no doubt all the 4-H club volunteers who have gone over to the Ukraine along with the Lady’s Auxiliary from Moose Lodge Local 34 and their bake sale–efforts which cost the US taxpayer no money. Generally when we talk about “spending a lot of effort” in international diplomacy we’re discussing non-pecuniary efforts. Excellent point. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/739 "2019-09-26T20:43:31Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Also you: I’m not calling for Biden to be impeached, or jailed. I’m calling for an investigation. If he’s really done nothing wrong, why would he / you be concerned about / oppose an investigation? ---
**Author:** ![steronz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steronz/32/11765_2.png) [@steronz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steronz)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/740 "2019-09-26T20:46:20Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > I’m not calling for Biden to be impeached, or jailed. I’m calling for an investigation. If he’s really done nothing wrong, why would he / you be concerned about / oppose an investigation? Checks thread title. Scratches head. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771.md?page=36) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771.md?page=38)