# The Trump Impeachment Inquiry **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [September 24, 2019, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771 "2019-09-24T20:23:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 63
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1241 "2019-09-30T16:50:43Z")
“The lawyers for a whistleblower whose complaint triggered a US presidential impeachment inquiry say Donald Trump’s words are endangering their client. … The letter from the whistleblower’s legal team - in which the lawyers call attention to Mr Trump’s language - was sent to Acting Director of National Intelligence Joseph Maguire on Saturday, and made public on Sunday. “The events of the past week have heightened our concerns that our client’s identity will be disclosed publicly and that, as a result, our client will be put in harm’s way,” wrote lawyer Andrew Bakaj. … The letter also references a $50,000 (£40,600) “bounty” that two conservative Trump supporters have offered as a “reward” for information about the whistleblower. “Unfortunately, we expect this situation to worsen, and to become even more dangerous for our client and any other whistleblowers, as Congress seeks to investigate this matter,” Mr Bakaj’s letter adds.” > **[Trump impeachment: Whistleblower 'endangered' by Trump criticism](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-49881847)** > > The lawyers say they are alarmed by the US president's comments as he faces an impeachment inquiry. ---
**Author:** ![DinoR](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dinor/32/2821_2.png) [@DinoR](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DinoR)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1242 "2019-09-30T16:54:04Z")
> [@Max\_S](#): > > That would require a (bipartisan) supermajority to overcome the filibuster before a rule change can be voted on. in In practice while McConnell is majority leader likely so. In theory though the majority leader can implement the nuclear option and decide rule changes by a bare majority. For those that aren’t aware, without the nuclear option the rule making filibuster takes a 2/3 vote to overcome not merely 3/5 of the vote like the legislative filibuster. 67 votes vs 60 with every seat full and voting. ---
**Author:** ![Max\_S](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/46a35a/32.png) [@Max\_S](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_S)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1243 "2019-09-30T17:00:13Z")
> [@DinoR](#): > > in > In practice while McConnell is majority leader likely so. > > In theory though the majority leader can implement the nuclear option and decide rule changes by a bare majority. For those that aren’t aware, without the nuclear option the rule making filibuster takes a 2/3 vote to overcome not merely 3/5 of the vote like the legislative filibuster. 67 votes vs 60 with every seat full and voting. It is my understanding that the so-called “nuclear option” requires the Vice President’s assistance. Thus it would not be an option when trying to remove the Vice President from the picture. ~Max ---
**Author:** ![Max\_S](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/46a35a/32.png) [@Max\_S](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_S)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1244 "2019-09-30T17:02:36Z")
> [@steronz](#): > > Exactly, if Trump wants to go to trial in front of the senate and explain why he himself released a fake transcript of a call, explain what was actually said on the call, and why he didn’t catch the error before and why we should now believe him, he’s free to do that. > > Until then, the transcript of the call is his own version of events, and it’s repugnant. There’s really no further corroboration or investigation required, as far as I’m concerned. That is a good point, and I’ll concede the argument as Mr. Trump seems to think the memorandum helps his cause. ~Max ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1245 "2019-09-30T17:14:51Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > **[How Mitch McConnell could give impeachment the Merrick Garland treatment](https://www.politico.com/news/2019/09/28/mitch-mcconnell-trump-impeachment-007689)** Well,[McConnell himself](https://www.marketwatch.com/story/mcconnell-says-senate-has-no-choice-but-to-hold-trial-if-house-impeaches-trump-2019-09-27) is on the record saying that if the House votes to impeach, the Senate has no choice but to hold a trial. He could try and weasel out of it the same way he changed his tune about confirming supreme court justices a year before the election, but the fact that he made this statement in the first place, suggests that he views not holding a trial as more politically damaging than holding one. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1246 "2019-09-30T17:21:46Z")
> [@Max\_S](#): > > Mr. Trump seems to think the memorandum helps his cause. Not even a lawyer of Giuliani’s level could have thought it was a good idea. It had to come right from the Extremely Stable Genius, somehow thinking it shows there was \*no \*quid pro quo when that is \*exactly \*what it shows. ---
**Author:** ![JKellyMap](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jkellymap/32/15880_2.png) [@JKellyMap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKellyMap)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1247 "2019-09-30T17:24:02Z")
> [@JKellyMap](#): > > Finally, today, a bit of movement in the right direction: 42.8% approval (down from a high of 43.1%, on Sept. 24). > > In statistical combination with a couple earlier polls (e.g., YouGov’s 41% figure), this is just based on one C+ poll by Rasmussen/Pulse Opinion, conducted Sept 25-29. The raw number was 49% approval, adjusted to 43% presumably due to Rasmussen’s known, well-attested Republican bias. Though, see here for why we should be cautious when interpreting approval polls during a big news event: > **[How A Big Enough News Story — Like Impeachment — Could Warp The Polls](https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/how-a-big-enough-news-story-like-impeachment-could-warp-the-polls/)** > > The impeachment story is blowing up. It’s a high-stakes moment — for President Trump, for Democrats and for pollsters. It’s also a scary moment for polling. Ye… ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1248 "2019-09-30T17:24:50Z")
It’s funny because not only did Trump think that the transcript helped him, but he also thought that it was cause for those who oppose him to apologize. Sheesh. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1249 "2019-09-30T17:36:01Z")
> [@duality72](#): > > Based on [crazification factor](http://kfmonkey.blogspot.com/2005/10/lunch-discussions-145-crazification.html), 27%. That may be outdated. I think there’s reason to believe the number has risen in the last few years. > [@DWMarch](#): > > Isn’t that a novel idea? If ever I get in trouble with the law, I will declare that the judge’s politics are very partisan and are the exact opposite of mine and on that basis alone I’m under no obligation to cooperate. I’ll say “you’re not a legit judge, I’m the judge!” Rudy insists he “will be the hero!” How, by contempt of court? ---
**Author:** ![Tired\_and\_Cranky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a87d85/32.png) [@Tired\_and\_Cranky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tired_and_Cranky)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1250 "2019-09-30T17:36:29Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > **Saint Cad** , over in the first thread, INSISTED that Mitch couldn’t do this [i.e., refuse to hold a trial in the Senate after impeachment], after all, **Saint Cad** had read some senate rules, and told all of us, in no uncertainly terms we were wrong, wrong wrong. Apparently, **Saint Cad** is wrong. 😛 > [@Saint\_Cad](#): > > Yeah it is pretty clear under Rule VI. VP (Pence) notifies CJOTUS of when the trial is to be held and swears in CJ Roberts. After that CJ Roberts presides and calls them to order (implied by Rule VII). > > The people thinking McConnell has it in his power to stop the trial (NYT, politico) have never read the Senate Rules on Impeachment and thinks it’s like every other Senate procedure. > [@Procrustus](#): > > Okay, so Pence can stop the trial by never formally notifying Roberts that they want a trial to commence. I generally agree with Saint Cad that McConnell cannot stop the Senate trial of the President upon his impeachment. I’ll go one step further - the power to preside over the trial in the Constitution is given solely to the Chief Justice and the power to convict comes with the “concurrence of two thirds of the [Senate] members present.” In my view, if any Senate rule as applied were to restrict the Chief Justice’s power to preside over the trial, that Senate rule is unconstitutional and the Chief Justice can ignore it. If the Chief Justice were to insist, he could announce, “The Senate will convene at the Chinatown Five Guys at noon for the trial of the President. The Senate will vote at one o’clock as long as more than three Senators show up.” In the real world, the Chief Justice will probably accede to whatever reasonable rules the Senate has prescribed for presidential impeachment but, in my humble opinion, the Chief Justice is fully within his constitutional powers to completely disregard them if he chooses. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1251 "2019-09-30T17:38:08Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > Okay, so Pence can stop the trial by never formally notifying Roberts that they want a trial to commence. But why would he even want to, with the Oval Office and the chance to get to be his own man beckoning? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1252 "2019-09-30T17:57:06Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > But why would he even want to, with the Oval Office and the chance to get to be his own man beckoning? I don’t think Trump supporters are automatically Pence supporters. ---
**Author:** ![Lance\_Turbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lance_turbo/32/6156_2.png) [@Lance\_Turbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lance_Turbo)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1253 "2019-09-30T18:06:55Z")
> [@JKellyMap](#): > > Finally, today, a bit of movement in the right direction: 42.8% approval (down from a high of 43.1%, on Sept. 24). > > In statistical combination with a couple earlier polls (e.g., YouGov’s 41% figure), this is just based on one C+ poll by Rasmussen/Pulse Opinion, conducted Sept 25-29. The raw number was 49% approval, adjusted to 43% presumably due to Rasmussen’s known, well-attested Republican bias. Be careful. Some people get very upset at the mere suggestion that a Rasmussen poll can have a noticeable effect on the 538 model. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1254 "2019-09-30T18:40:10Z")
Anyway, while some may wish to focus on the issues of “hearsay” and whether it applies to official documents released by the White House as a response to the criticisms made (documents which show clearly that the criticisms were valid), let us not forget that this past Friday, three days ago, we learned that Donald Trump stood in the Oval Office with the Russian ambassador and told him that Trump’s official position regarding Russian interference in the 2016 election was that Trump didn’t care. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1255 "2019-09-30T18:43:44Z")
Hearsay rings hollow when the phone log released by the White House verifies what the whistleblower said. You want first hand accounts? Then just have the whistleblower give you some names to talk to. The more I see Giuliani, the more I wonder how he graduated from high school, let alone law school. And McCarthy on 60 Minutes? What a fucking stooge! He obviously never read the transcript of the call in question. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 7:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1256 "2019-09-30T19:00:39Z")
So, suppose the House impeaches but the Senate doesn’t get the 2/3 to remove Trump from office. Will House Democrats try impeaching again, or will they just call it a day for the rest of his presidency? ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1257 "2019-09-30T19:11:09Z")
[Support For Impeachment Grows Quinnipiac University National Poll Finds; Majority Of Voters Approve Of Impeachment Inquiry](https://poll.qu.edu/national/release-detail?ReleaseID=3642) > [@](#): > > American voters are divided on impeaching and removing President Trump from office, 47 - 47 percent - closing a 20 point gap from less than a week ago, according to a Quinnipiac (KWIN-uh-pea-ack) University Poll released today. In the poll released on September 25th, voters said that the president should not be impeached and removed 57 - 37 percent. Among the political party subgroups, Democrats showed the greatest change from the last poll. Today, they show a virtual consensus on impeaching Trump, 90 - 5 percent, while last week they said Trump should be impeached 73 - 21 percent. The gap also closed among independents, who clearly said that the president should not be impeached last week 58 - 34 percent, and today are only slightly opposed to impeachment at 50 - 42 percent. Republicans feel much the same today as they did last week about impeachment; today, they say Trump should not be impeached 92 - 7 percent, and last week, they were opposed 95 - 4 percent. > > While voters are split on impeaching and removing President Trump from office, a slim majority of registered voters do approve of the impeachment inquiry opened by the U.S. House of Representatives 52 - 45 percent. Approval includes half of independents, who are split 50 - 45 percent on the inquiry. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1258 "2019-09-30T19:19:06Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > So, suppose the House impeaches but the Senate doesn’t get the 2/3 to remove Trump from office. Will House Democrats try impeaching again, or will they just call it a day for the rest of his presidency? I believe they’ll keep investigating and will bring additional articles of impeachment if warranted. The court rulings on document subpoenas, executive privilege and witness compliance are expected in November and December. The rulings are anticipated to favor Congress, because the bases for non-compliance were so idiotic/non-existent. Deutsche Bank, Mazars and Don McGahn have all said they will comply with whatever rulings the courts make. That’s all the House Committees were waiting for before proceeding with their other inquiries into Trump’s impeachable acts. Remember, Speaker Pelosi instructed her committee chairs to keep on working, irrespective of how the Ukraine investigation goes. And what those reveal may well be far worse than the Ukraine extortion racket. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1259 "2019-09-30T19:29:58Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > So, suppose the House impeaches but the Senate doesn’t get the 2/3 to remove Trump from office. Will House Democrats try impeaching again, or will they just call it a day for the rest of his presidency? I think you put everything you’ve got into the first impeachment attempt and if you come up short, put everything you’ve got in the campaign. Two weeks ago, impeachment was dead in the water. Thanks to the whistleblower, it’s a foregone conclusion. Before, we assumed an acquittal was a lock. Now, I think it’s 50-50. If the witness testimony is damning enough, I think McConnell will tell DJT to resign or be convicted. Then I hope they take his pension and his Secret Service guard away, and put his belongings out in the street. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Colossus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.colossus/32/9423_2.png) [@Dr.Colossus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Colossus)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1260 "2019-09-30T19:49:00Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > I believe they’ll keep investigating and will bring additional articles of impeachment if warranted. > > The court rulings on document subpoenas, executive privilege and witness compliance are expected in November and December. The rulings are anticipated to favor Congress, because the bases for non-compliance were so idiotic/non-existent. Deutsche Bank, Mazars and Don McGahn have all said they will comply with whatever rulings the courts make. That’s all the House Committees were waiting for before proceeding with their other inquiries into Trump’s impeachable acts. > > Remember, Speaker Pelosi instructed her committee chairs to keep on working, irrespective of how the Ukraine investigation goes. And what those reveal may well be far worse than the Ukraine extortion racket. Well this is interesting. Do you have any links or discussing this further? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771.md?page=62) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771.md?page=64)