# The Trump Impeachment Inquiry **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [September 24, 2019, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771 "2019-09-24T20:23:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 64
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1261 "2019-09-30T19:49:03Z")
So if DT is impeached and convicted, will he go to jail under further prosecution, and does he forfeit his pension and other ex-presidential benefits? ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1262 "2019-09-30T19:54:40Z")
> [@drad\_dog](#): > > So if DT is impeached and convicted, will he go to jail under further prosecution, and does he forfeit his pension and other ex-presidential benefits? Well, if he’s removed from office, the DoJ policy regarding not indicting or prosecuting a sitting president would immediately cease to apply. One can imagine that there are Federal prosecutors who have indictments against Trump sitting in a folder, waiting to be filed as soon as this is the case. “Will he go to jail” is, of course, subject to the outcomes of any potential criminal indictments and trials. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1263 "2019-09-30T19:54:52Z")
The most impeachment can do is make him give up his day job. I hope that the NY AG has something in store for him. Also, just speculation, aren’t there still unsealed Mueller indictments waiting for…something? ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1264 "2019-09-30T19:55:01Z")
As expected, Ghouliani is subpoenaed by the House [https://twitter.com/AaronBlake/status/1178759410996453378?s=20](https://twitter.com/AaronBlake/status/1178759410996453378?s=20) ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1265 "2019-09-30T20:14:42Z")
Secretary of State Pompeo was on the call, the WSJ reports: > “NEW: Secretary of State Mike Pompeo was on the July 25 call between President Trump and Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky, a senior State Department official said Monday, a disclosure that ties the State Department more closely to an ongoing congressional inquiry.” ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1266 "2019-09-30T20:15:02Z")
> [@bobot](#): > > The most impeachment can do is make him give up his day job. I hope that the NY AG has something in store for him. Also, just speculation, aren’t there still unsealed Mueller indictments waiting for…something? Agreed. Article 1, Section 3 says: “Judgment in Cases of Impeachment shall not extend further than to removal from Office, and disqualification to hold and enjoy any Office of honor, Trust or Profit under the United States; but the Party convicted shall nevertheless be liable and subject to Indictment, Trial, Judgment and Punishment, according to Law.” ---
**Author:** ![Fiddle\_Peghead](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiddle_peghead/32/3506_2.png) [@Fiddle\_Peghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiddle_Peghead)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1267 "2019-09-30T20:15:17Z")
> [@Fiddle\_Peghead](#): > > I could have multi-quoted others, but there’s no need, if the following is correct. Ahem: > > Not even a subhuman like McConnell would try to subvert a Senate trial after a president has been impeached. What he did as far as Garland does not even merit discussion here. Nomination hearings are a dime a dozen. As we all know, impeachment is as rare as hen’s teeth, and is undeniably one of the most important parts of the constitution. No, even McConnell wouldn’t fuck with that. While being a guarantee of nothing, McConnell is saying he would not [screw](https://www.cnn.com/2019/09/30/politics/senate-impeachment-plans-mitch-mcconnell/index.html) around with trying to block a Senate trial… ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1268 "2019-09-30T20:26:01Z")
I don’t mean to be spamming the thread, but in 1 hour the news has come out: 1. Giuliani subpoenaed 2. Pompeo was on the call 3. Oh, and the same shit was done with Australia: > **[Trump Pressed Australian Leader to Help Barr Investigate Mueller Inquiry’s...](https://www.nytimes.com/2019/09/30/us/politics/trump-australia-barr-mueller.html)** > > The discussion was another instance of the president using American diplomacy for potential personal gain. > [@](#): > > — President Trump pushed the Australian prime minister during a recent telephone call to help Attorney General William P. Barr gather information for a Justice Department inquiry that Mr. Trump hopes will discredit the Mueller investigation, according to two American officials with knowledge of the call. > > The White House restricted access to the call’s transcript to a small group of the president’s aides, one of the officials said, an unusual decision that is similar to the handling of a July call with the Ukrainian president that is at the heart of House Democrats’ impeachment inquiry into Mr. Trump. Like that call, the discussion with Prime Minister Scott Morrison of Australia shows the extent to which Mr. Trump sees the attorney general as a critical partner in his goal to show that the Mueller investigation had corrupt and partisan origins, and the extent that Mr. Trump sees the Justice Department inquiry as a potential way to gain leverage over America’s closest allies. > > And like the call with the Ukrainian president, Volodymyr Zelensky, the discussion with Mr. Morrison shows the president using high-level diplomacy to advance his personal political interests. ---
**Author:** ![Fiddle\_Peghead](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiddle_peghead/32/3506_2.png) [@Fiddle\_Peghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiddle_Peghead)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1269 "2019-09-30T20:29:54Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > I’m heartened by y’all’s belief that the public at large would give a rat’s ass if Moscow Mitch did refuse to hold a vote in the Senate. The Dems would make some impotent noise, but who’s gonna stop him? > > **Aspenglow** , I fear the country already IS a lost cause. I hope I’m wrong. Keep being optimistic-- I need it. Relax. 🙂 This new CNN [poll](https://www.cnn.com/2019/09/30/politics/cnn-poll-impeachment-ukraine/index.html) is suggestive that people are starting to come around to the idea that Trump should be impeached. This number will only increase, I predict, and as I have predicted elsewhere, the hearing/trial will cause even more to come on board that he needs to be ousted. > [@](#): > > Americans are about evenly split over impeaching President Donald Trump and removing him from office, **as support for that move has risen among independents and Republicans** > … > The survey also finds 48% say Trump used the presidency improperly to gain political advantage against a potential 2020 opponent in his interactions with the president of Ukraine, 39% say he did not use his office improperly and 10% say they don’t know enough to say. ---
**Author:** ![Defensive\_Indifference](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/defensive_indifference/32/6502_2.png) [@Defensive\_Indifference](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Defensive_Indifference)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1270 "2019-09-30T20:33:22Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > I don’t mean to be spamming the thread, but in 1 hour the news has come out: > > 1. Giuliani subpoenaed > 2. Pompeo was on the call > 3. Oh, and the same shit was done with Australia: > > [https://www.nytimes.com/2019/09/30/us/politics/trump-australia-barr-mueller.html](https://www.nytimes.com/2019/09/30/us/politics/trump-australia-barr-mueller.html) And it’s only Monday. And Monday ain’t even over yet! ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1271 "2019-09-30T20:35:26Z")
I can’t find the story now, but Barr is supposedly claiming that he was furious to find out that Individual 1 tried to get him involved in the Ukraine crap, but in fact, AFTER he found out, he went and booked his $30,000 Christmas party at the Trump Hotel. ---
**Author:** ![Fiddle\_Peghead](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiddle_peghead/32/3506_2.png) [@Fiddle\_Peghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiddle_Peghead)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1272 "2019-09-30T20:35:37Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > I don’t mean to be spamming the thread, but in 1 hour the news has come out: > > 1. Giuliani subpoenaed > 2. Pompeo was on the call > 3. Oh, and the same shit was done with Australia: > > [https://www.nytimes.com/2019/09/30/us/politics/trump-australia-barr-mueller.html](https://www.nytimes.com/2019/09/30/us/politics/trump-australia-barr-mueller.html) “Spamming”? If this is Spam, fry me up a mess and slather it with mustard! ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1273 "2019-09-30T20:35:45Z")
Yeah, it looks like Trump and the Attorney General are just bullying world leaders everywhere so they can declare the Russia investigation a hoax. Which is what you do when you’re completely innocent. ---
**Author:** ![BeepKillBeep](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/9e8a1a/32.png) [@BeepKillBeep](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BeepKillBeep)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1274 "2019-09-30T20:38:52Z")
> [@Fiddle\_Peghead](#): > > “Spamming”? If this is Spam, fry me up a mess and slather it with mustard! Yeah, I appreciate JohnT’s posts. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1275 "2019-09-30T20:42:07Z")
Thanks. The above three things came out in 30 minutes. Wow. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1276 "2019-09-30T20:42:31Z")
> [@Dr.Colossus](#): > > Well this is interesting. Do you have any links or discussing this further? These links should get you started: [Deutsche Bank Has Tax Records Congress is Seeking](https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/legal-issues/trumps-bank-has-tax-records-congress-is-seeking-in-subpoenas-targeting-the-presidents-finances/2019/08/27/1f2533a4-c8f3-11e9-a4f3-c081a126de70_story.html) (WaPo) [Deutsche Bank, Trump Unlikely to Succeed in Stopping Release of Tax Records](https://www.apnews.com/7e5107a81256421faa0934653f31d855) (AP News) [Feds Have until Today to Decide Whether They Will Join Trump’s Fight to Block the State Grand jury Subpoena for Tax Records that was Served on his Longtime Accountant Before Ordering Compliance with the New York State Case](https://www.apnews.com/d2802715cb3b41c3ab15767530465536) (AP News) [Bill Barr All In as Trump Personal Fixer, Filed Bullshit Amicus Brief to Prevent Mazars from Releasing Tax Records – Not Likely to Succeed](https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2019/08/justice-department-mazars-subpoena-trump-barr.html) (Slate) I can’t find anything that expressly says Don McGahn has stated he will comply with a court’s order to testify, but I have read that somewhere along the way over these past many months. My reading comprehension isn’t too bad. ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Lendervedder](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_lendervedder/32/8488_2.png) [@Happy\_Lendervedder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Lendervedder)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1277 "2019-09-30T20:43:47Z")
Man this is gettin’ juicy! ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1278 "2019-09-30T20:44:33Z")
Ye gods. Are they really this stupid, or do they know something about a fix being in? This is alarming. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1279 "2019-09-30T20:45:08Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > Thanks. > > The above three things came out in 30 minutes. Wow. Man, no kidding. You take your attention off this story for 30 minutes to compile a request for links, and… all hell breaks loose!! ---
**Author:** ![RioRico](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f04885/32.png) [@RioRico](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RioRico)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2019, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1280 "2019-09-30T20:45:14Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > The court rulings on document subpoenas, executive privilege and witness compliance are expected in November and December. The rulings are anticipated to favor Congress, because the bases for non-compliance were so idiotic/non-existent. **Deutsche Bank** , Mazars and Don McGahn have all said they will comply with whatever rulings the courts make. That’s all the House Committees were waiting for before proceeding with their other inquiries into Trump’s impeachable acts. Deutsche Bank may be the most significant. Tramp has ferociously guarded his financials - because they’re the smoking gun, the evidence of his dealings with mafiyas and ownership by hostile foreign powers. With the other whistleblower, on subverting the IRS, he has financial crimes in and out of office to answer for. (Hostile power: Senior Tramp and Putin cabinet officers have declared that Russia is waging war on the US. Consider the constitutional definition of treason.) Was his Ukraine effort criminal? I neither know nor care. It’s politically toxic and thus a nice target to probe. But impeachment-trial-removal is not a criminal-justice process. It’s entirely political. Has POTUS so demeaned, disgraced, and damaged the nation that the populace can’t tolerate the continued obscenity? (Life proceeds much the same for most, no matter the furore. National disgrace affects us less than tariff-boosted prices and cut services and protections. And more fear.) Tramp has bragged of obstruction (“I don’t obstruct unless I’m fighting back - and I’m fighting!”) and Team Tramp’s most likely response to Congressional interrogations is stonewalling, refusal to reply, outright lying - obstruction. Nixon’s first impeachment charge was obstruction. Look for the House to impeach (indict) on obstruction, and the Senate to obstruct national outrage by not convicting. (Obstructors and perjurers can feel safe if the GOP retains control of any branch. But if Tramp feels REALLY threatened, watch out. He still has The Power.) I see much speculation here of possible interplays amongst Trampworld actors, but a truth-table outcome matrix isn’t useful. Too volatile. House probers, or more leakers, whistlers, or plea-bargainers, may divulge bombshells that totally warp the playing field… taking down POTUS, NRA, GOP, and other owned entities. Jeff Greenfield wrote [5 Ways Impeachment Could Play Out](https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2019/09/29/donald-trump-impeachment-guide-228756) but many more paths remain. Prepare for unsurprising surprises. (Playing field? “PRESIDENCY. -n. The greased pig in the field game of American politics.” -Ambrose Bierce) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771.md?page=63) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771.md?page=65)