# The Trump Impeachment Inquiry **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [September 24, 2019, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771 "2019-09-24T20:23:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 83
**Author:** ![Akaj](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/akaj/32/145_2.png) [@Akaj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Akaj)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2019, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1641 "2019-10-03T15:33:06Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > Well, [this](https://www.cnn.com/2019/10/03/politics/gop-senators-echoed-biden-on-ukraine-reforms-kfile/index.html) certainly makes the Republican conspiracy theory around Biden a bit awkward. > > _“CNN’s KFile found a February 2016 bipartisan letter signed by several Republican senators that urged then-Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko to “press ahead with urgent reforms to the Prosecutor General’s office and judiciary.” > The letter shows that addressing corruption in Ukraine’s Prosecutor General’s office had bipartisan support in the US and further undercuts a baseless attack made by President Donald Trump and his allies that Biden pressured the Ukrainian government to fire then Prosecutor General Viktor Shokin to stop investigations into a Ukrainian natural gas company that his son, Hunter Biden, sat on the board of. There is no evidence of wrongdoing by either Joe or Hunter Biden, nor is it clear whether Hunter was under investigation at all.”_ “Those RINOs were part of the conspiracy all along!” ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2019, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1642 "2019-10-03T15:34:54Z")
[USA TODAY/Ipsos Poll](https://eu.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2019/10/03/poll-trump-impeachment-support-grows-removal-over-ukraine/3846565002/): 45% v 38% plurality now support a vote by the House of Representatives to impeach President Donald Trump. 44% v 35% of those surveyed say the Senate, which would then be charged with holding a trial of the president, should convict Trump and remove him from office. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2019, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1643 "2019-10-03T15:42:35Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > [https://twitter.com/ryanstruyk/status/1179775190827503617?s=20](https://twitter.com/ryanstruyk/status/1179775190827503617?s=20) > > "Trump at 10:37:24 a.m., talking about trade negotiations: “I have a lot of options on China, but if they don’t do what we want, we have tremendous power.” > > Trump at 10:37:54 a.m., asked about Ukraine probe: “Likewise, China should start an investigation into the Bidens.”" He put that in a tweet on the internet forever, huh? Republicans: WTF? ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2019, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1644 "2019-10-03T15:43:41Z")
"I never asked a foreign country to investigate American citizens. Come on, I got a little more sense than that. Yeah, I remember asking China to investigate American citizens" ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2019, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1645 "2019-10-03T15:43:56Z")
No, these quotes were in a presser held by Trump earlier this morning. They’re of the spoken variety, not the tweeted kind. ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2019, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1646 "2019-10-03T15:54:39Z")
At this point, everything that the Mueller report was meant to uncover with Russia has been publicly admitted for Ukraine and now China. How does this not matter to the GOP? ---
**Author:** ![Max\_S](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/46a35a/32.png) [@Max\_S](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_S)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2019, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1647 "2019-10-03T16:07:07Z")
> [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](#): > > [USA TODAY/Ipsos Poll](https://eu.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2019/10/03/poll-trump-impeachment-support-grows-removal-over-ukraine/3846565002/): > > 45% v 38% plurality now support a vote by the House of Representatives to impeach President Donald Trump. > > 44% v 35% of those surveyed say the Senate, which would then be charged with holding a trial of the president, should convict Trump and remove him from office. That IPSOS/USA Today poll was of 1,006 adults over October 1-2, and comprised of 412 Democrats, 403 Republicans, and 115 Independents across the fifty states. The sampling was drawn from some weird sources that I couldn’t find information about (it says follow the link below but there is no such link). Notably, 65% of the Republican respondents answered “No” to the question “Is there enough reliable information or evidence to decide if President Trump should be impeached?”, which almost matches the 68% of Republicans who then said he shouldn’t be impeached, and matches the 65% of Republicans who say the Senate shouldn’t convict. Also note that 80% of Republican respondents - more than the 73% of Democrat respondents - said “Yes, a president is subject to all laws just like any citizen”. Only 30% of Republicans agree that “President Trump asking Ukraine to investigate Biden is an abuse of power” (39% disagree and 30% don’t know or neither agree nor disagree), and 65% of Republicans agree that “There are valid reasons to look into Hunter and Joe Biden’s behavior in Ukraine”. Presumably the 35% of Republicans who think there aren’t valid reasons to look into Biden’s behavior overlap with the 30% of Republicans who think the President abused his power. If this poll is to be trusted, for the most part Democrats should attempt to convince their Republican colleagues that there are not valid reasons to look into Biden’s behavior in the Ukraine. ~Max ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2019, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1648 "2019-10-03T16:11:26Z")
> [@Max\_S](#): > > …Democrats should attempt to convince their Republican colleagues that there are not valid reasons to look into Biden’s behavior in the Ukraine. You’re talking about other countries conducting investigations like Trump asked Ukraine and China to do, right? Democrats should not have to work to convince Republicans of the obvious. ---
**Author:** ![Akaj](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/akaj/32/145_2.png) [@Akaj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Akaj)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2019, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1649 "2019-10-03T16:12:55Z")
> [@Max\_S](#): > > …Democrats should attempt to convince their Republican colleagues that there are not valid reasons to look into Biden’s behavior in the Ukraine. (major snip) Maybe they should start with the GOP senators who signed the February 2016 bipartisan letter that backed Joe Biden’s actions with regard to the Ukrainian prosecutor. Surely some of them are still in office. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2019, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1650 "2019-10-03T16:15:14Z")
> [@fiveyearlurker](#): > > at this point, everything that the mueller report was meant to uncover with russia has been publicly admitted for ukraine and now china. How does this not matter to the gop? iokiardi ---
**Author:** ![Max\_S](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/46a35a/32.png) [@Max\_S](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_S)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2019, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1651 "2019-10-03T16:16:23Z")
> [@bobot](#): > > Democrats should not have to work to convince Republicans of the obvious. I disagree. ~Max ---
**Author:** ![Max\_S](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/46a35a/32.png) [@Max\_S](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_S)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2019, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1652 "2019-10-03T16:18:57Z")
> [@Akaj](#): > > (major snip) > > Maybe they should start with the GOP senators who signed the February 2016 bipartisan letter that backed Joe Biden’s actions with regard to the Ukrainian prosecutor. Surely some of them are still in office. I also want to hear what those Senators have to say. ~Max ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2019, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1653 "2019-10-03T16:22:26Z")
Dear Republicans, asking other countries to investigate American citizens for your political gain is a fucked up thing to do. Sincerely, bobot How’s that? That’s as hard as I’m going to try. ---
**Author:** ![TroutMan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troutman/32/6721_2.png) [@TroutMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TroutMan)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2019, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1654 "2019-10-03T16:24:22Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > At this point, everything that the Mueller report was meant to uncover with Russia has been publicly admitted for Ukraine and now China. How does this not matter to the GOP? Sen. James Risch (IH) June 2017, during interrogation of Attorney General Jeff Sessions: “Collusion with the Russians—or any other government, for that matter, when it comes to our elections—certainly would be improper and illegal. Would that be a fair statement?” Risch now: “I looked at the transcript. This conversation that the president had with the head of Ukraine is a typical conversation…I saw nothing in the conversation that was inappropriate.” Lindsey Graham (SC) earlier this year: "The big thing for me, guys, has always been: Did Trump work with the Russians? And I told him to his face, almost two years ago: ‘If you did, that’s it between me and you. And anything that follows, you deserve.’ I will say that about any politician of any party.” Graham now: "I have zero problems with this phone call.” When asked “Do you think it was ethical for the president to bring up Joe Biden?” he replied, “Yes, absolutely.” Sen. Ron Johnson (WI), in March: “We should all be happy that after an extensive investigation, the Special Counsel did not establish that members of the Trump Campaign conspired or coordinated with the Russian government.” In April, asked if he agreed with Giuliani’s statement that it’s OK for Republican campaign members and candidates to welcome support from a foreign adversary: “No.” Johnson now: “We all kind of looked at it and said, ‘There’s nothing here.’… I never got any sense at all there was any kind of pressure him. I just put the best construction on the call.” ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2019, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1655 "2019-10-03T16:29:55Z")
Nice quotes, **Troutman**. Whatever one’s views, I would think it hard to imagine how to imagine how someone could be so morally bankrupt as to offer absolutely contradictory opinions based solely on one’s belief of potential political gain. ---
**Author:** ![Max\_S](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/46a35a/32.png) [@Max\_S](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_S)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2019, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1656 "2019-10-03T16:30:12Z")
> [@bobot](#): > > Dear Republicans, asking other countries to investigate American citizens for your political gain is a fucked up thing to do. > Sincerely, > bobot > > How’s that? That’s as hard as I’m going to try. The counterargument is that if “[t]here are valid reasons to look into Hunter and Joe Biden’s behavior in Ukraine”, then “President Trump asking Ukraine to investigate Biden” may not be “an abuse of power”. Therefore, as I said, the Democrats should work to convince Republicans that there are no valid reasons to look into Hunter and Joe Biden’s behavior in Ukraine. ~Max ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2019, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1657 "2019-10-03T16:34:26Z")
Disagree. There’s no reason to prove their innocent to show that Trump has abused the office. This is analogous to Hoover spying on MLK for purely political reasons: whether MLK had affairs is immaterial to the offense. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2019, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1658 "2019-10-03T16:34:36Z")
> [@Max\_S](#): > > …Therefore, as I said, the Democrats should work to convince Republicans that there are no valid reasons … for Ukraine, on Trump’s behalf > [@Max\_S](#): > > … to look into Hunter and Joe Biden’s behavior in Ukraine. > > ~Max Democrats should not. If this is what you’re saying. ---
**Author:** ![Akaj](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/akaj/32/145_2.png) [@Akaj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Akaj)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2019, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1659 "2019-10-03T16:36:03Z")
Sounds like the story the GOP is settling on is “This thing with the Bidens in Ukraine is so terribly, terribly corrupt that it’s entirely proper for the president to use any leverage he has to get to the bottom of it, and the fact that Joe is his likely opponent in 2020 is pure coincidence.” As absurd as that is in the face of actual evidence and events, a lot of poorly informed voters will at least be distracted enough by the idea to buy that the impeachment is just another political witchhunt. The Dems have to destroy this narrative. Maybe it’s time for Obama to speak up. ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2019, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771/1660 "2019-10-03T16:38:11Z")
But now we have a contemporaneously signed document by Republicans who agreed with Biden. So this argument makes even less sense. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771.md?page=82) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-inquiry/840771.md?page=84)