# The Trump Impeachment Trial
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-trial/846524
**Category:** Politics & Elections
**Created:** [January 16, 2020, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-trial/846524 "2020-01-16T20:12:52Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 32
### Author:  [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)
#### Post date: [January 30, 2020, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-trial/846524/621 "2020-01-30T20:20:01Z")
What did I miss? Why is CBS reporting that it is almost certain that no witnesses will be called when yesterday it was reported that Cocaine Mitch didn’t have the votes? Who came out against witnesses?
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### Author:  [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)
#### Post date: [January 30, 2020, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-trial/846524/622 "2020-01-30T20:30:00Z")
> [@MikeF](#):
>
> This whole thing is a sham and I can only pray that Trump is not re-elected (and I expect that he will be). Actually, I don’t pray so I can’t even do that.
> **[Do Americans Support Impeaching Trump?](https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/impeachment-polls/)**
>
> FiveThirtyEight is tracking polls that ask whether respondents support impeaching President Trump.
Things used to be different:
> **[Marriage](https://xkcd.com/1431/)**
>
> People often say that same-sex marriage now is like interracial marriage in the 60s. But in terms of public opinion, same-sex marriage now is like interracial marriage in the 90s, when it had already been legal nationwide for 30 years.
[ ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1gEz__sMVaY)
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### Author:  [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)
#### Post date: [January 30, 2020, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-trial/846524/623 "2020-01-30T20:34:03Z")
> [@UltraVires](#):
>
> What did I miss? Why is CBS reporting that it is almost certain that no witnesses will be called when yesterday it was reported that Cocaine Mitch didn’t have the votes? Who came out against witnesses?
To me it sounded like Cruz and a few others would flip in return for Hunter.
The Democrats turned it down.
Either they’re happy to let the ship sink, so they can point at the captain or they’re overly optimistic about the idea that the facts will affect the general public, and that will persuade the Republicans. Personally, I think that they’re better with a slow sink than a fast one, and it’s worth the trade.
As it is, even if the case has moved the public, if the vote for witnesses goes up this week, it will end before surveys showing the impact of the trial come through.
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### Author:  [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)
#### Post date: [January 30, 2020, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-trial/846524/624 "2020-01-30T20:38:31Z")
> [@Sage\_Rat](#):
>
> To be it sounded like Cruz and a few others would flip in return for Hunter.
>
> The Democrats turned it down.
>
> Either they’re happy to let the ship sink, so they can point at the captain or they’re overly optimistic about the idea that the facts will affect the general public, and that will persuade the Republicans.
>
> As it is, even if the case has moved the public, if the vote for witnesses goes up this week, it will end before surveys showing the impact of the trial come through.
But it wasn’t about Cruz. I thought the Dems had at least Romney, Collins, Murkowski, and Alexander. Hell, they only need 50 as it seems they have Roberts. :eek:
Just yesterday, the story was that Mitch did not have the votes. The story today is that he does. Something had to have changed, but I don’t see any underlying story.
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### Author:  [@Fiddle\_Peghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiddle_Peghead)
#### Post date: [January 30, 2020, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-trial/846524/625 "2020-01-30T21:41:36Z")
> [@KidCharlemagne](#):
>
> Could it paradoxically be better for Dems if the Pugs vote against witnesses since the latter would be defying the wishes of 75% of the voting public, and the Bolton revelations are already known and will be made public again in a few months?
I’m not sure it would be better, as there is nothing like hearing it “from the horse’s mouth”. But, since it’s a foregone conclusion that Trump will be acquitted, at least this way would provide what you say, as well as giving the Democrats the talking point that the Republicans made the trial a \*complete \*sham by not allowing witnesses.
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### Author:  [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)
#### Post date: [January 30, 2020, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-trial/846524/626 "2020-01-30T21:48:21Z")
> [@UltraVires](#):
>
> But it wasn’t about Cruz. I thought the Dems had at least Romney, Collins, Murkowski, and Alexander. Hell, they only need 50 as it seems they have Roberts. :eek:
>
> Just yesterday, the story was that Mitch did not have the votes. The story today is that he does. Something had to have changed, but I don’t see any underlying story.
People wavered. When the wavering settled, nothing had changed.
Or, the media is relaying the gossip of a small number of people and doesn’t know the truth. The gossip might be correct. The gossip might be strategic lies.
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### Author:  [@Fiddle\_Peghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiddle_Peghead)
#### Post date: [January 30, 2020, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-trial/846524/627 "2020-01-30T21:54:07Z")
Jim Jordan:
> [@](#):
>
> “I’m hoping that this is all over tomorrow night and **we get an acquittal for the President** ,” Jordan added.
I don’t know there, Jimbo. Haven’t you been watching? The Republicans are putting on a pretty fair trial over in the Senate. I think it could go either way! :rolleyes:
Do these people have no shame? Btw, that is a rhetorical question.
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### Author:  [@Moriarty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moriarty)
#### Post date: [January 30, 2020, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-trial/846524/628 "2020-01-30T21:54:54Z")
Regarding the witness vote, it’s also possible that the Democrats aren’t in lockstep. How are Joe Manchin (West Virginia) Doug Jones (Alabama) and Kyrsten Sinema (Arizona) voting?
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### Author:  [@MulderMuffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MulderMuffin)
#### Post date: [January 30, 2020, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-trial/846524/629 "2020-01-30T22:33:11Z")
> [@Moriarty](#):
>
> Regarding the witness vote, it’s also possible that the Democrats aren’t in lockstep. How are Joe Manchin (West Virginia) Doug Jones (Alabama) and Kyrsten Sinema (Arizona) voting?
Or maybe someone displayed a few pikes in the Republican cloakroom…
Honestly, they probably browbeat anyone thinking of voting for witnesses with dire predictions of a months- long trial with no change in result and they decided against tilting at windmills.
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### Author:  [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)
#### Post date: [January 30, 2020, 10:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-trial/846524/630 "2020-01-30T22:55:50Z")
I just realized that I hadn’t included this other shitty, craven part of Alan Dershowitz’s performance last night (helpfully bolded)
> [@Alan Dershowitz](#):
>
> Every public official that I know believes that his election is in the public interest. **And mostly you’re right. Your election is in the public interest.** And if a president did something that he believes will help him get elected, in the public interest, that cannot be the kind of quid pro quo that results in impeachment.
See how he strokes their egos AND simultaneously implies “you could do this kind of thing too, if you just help Donald Trump get away with it now”?
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### Author:  [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)
#### Post date: [January 30, 2020, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-trial/846524/631 "2020-01-30T23:23:38Z")
Being a democrat? Impeachable!
Reichstag fire? Not impeachable anymore.
I want to see the dems get just as passionate as Jay Sekulow. The indignance has ruled the day since before Kavanaugh. If we let the rebupkis win on “indignance” again I don’t think I can take it.
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### Author:  [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)
#### Post date: [January 30, 2020, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-trial/846524/632 "2020-01-30T23:26:56Z")
> [@MulderMuffin](#):
>
> Or maybe someone displayed a few pikes in the Republican cloakroom…
>
> Honestly, they probably browbeat anyone thinking of voting for witnesses with dire predictions of a months- long trial with no change in result and they decided against tilting at windmills.
Schiff made a proposal today that would kill off the “months-long trial” bugaboo:
> [@](#):
>
> House Impeachment Manager Adam Schiff (D-CA) made an offer to Republicans on Thursday: a limit of one week for witness depositions in the impeachment trial of President Donald Trump.
>
> The proposal is intended to appeal to Republicans who are skittish that if witnesses are allowed at the trial, it could drag on for weeks.
>
> “I will make an offer to opposing counsel, who have said that this will stretch on indefinitely if you decide to have a single witness,” Schiff said. “Let’s cap the depositions to one week.”
>
> “In the Clinton trial, there was one week of depositions, and you know what the Senate did during that week? They did the business of the Senate. The Senate went back to its ordinary legislative business while the depositions were being conducted. You want the Clinton model? Let’s use the Clinton model. Let’s take a week. Let’s take a week to have a fair trial. …"
[Schiff Offer to GOP: One Week For Witness Depositions](https://www.mediaite.com/politics/adam-schiff-makes-offer-to-republicans-limit-witness-depositions-to-one-week/)
It’s a smart move, because it takes away the main excuse Republicans have been making to their constituents. Now they won’t be able to say (without fear of contradiction, anyway) ‘I voted down witnesses because a yes vote would mean a trial that dragged on and on.’
Schiff is talking about it again, right this minute, by the way.
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### Author:  [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)
#### Post date: [January 30, 2020, 11:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-trial/846524/633 "2020-01-30T23:49:29Z")
Pam Bondi really has a stick up her butt about Hunter Biden making $50,000 (or is it $81,000? The number varies) a month from Burisma even though he doesn’t speak Ukrainian. She seems to gloss over that she makes $115,000 a month as a lobbyist for Qatar, even though she doesn’t speak Arabic.
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### Author:  [@Max\_S](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_S)
#### Post date: [January 30, 2020, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-trial/846524/634 "2020-01-30T23:50:18Z")
> [@Ann\_Hedonia](#):
>
> Have you see this letter than Guiliani presented to Zelensky?
>
> [Giuliani sought private meeting with Ukrainian president, documents show](https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/trump-impeachment-inquiry/giuliani-sought-private-meeting-ukrainian-president-documents-show-n1115691)
>
> So is it your position that Guiliani was a super double secret envoy and that he misrepresented himself to Zelensky?
If you are interested, I would love to continue this particular debate in a dedicated thread, “[THREAD=889315]Should Donald Trump be convicted & removed for sending Rudy Giuliani to Ukraine?[/THREAD]”
~Max
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### Author:  [@Max\_S](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_S)
#### Post date: [January 30, 2020, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-trial/846524/635 "2020-01-30T23:51:30Z")
accidental post
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### Author:  [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)
#### Post date: [January 30, 2020, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-trial/846524/636 "2020-01-30T23:57:34Z")
> [@Max\_S](#):
>
> If you are interested, I would love to continue this particular debate in a dedicated thread, “[THREAD=889315]Should Donald Trump be convicted & removed for sending Rudy Giuliani to Ukraine?[/THREAD]”
>
> ~Max
Whoa! Why are you dodging this in this thread? That letter demolishes the premises of arguments you posted here, in this thread. Defend them or acknowledge that you were wrong, please.
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### Author:  [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)
#### Post date: [January 30, 2020, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-trial/846524/637 "2020-01-30T23:57:44Z")
“Talk to Rudy” Was that the President or Donald Trump?
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### Author:  [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)
#### Post date: [January 31, 2020, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-trial/846524/638 "2020-01-31T00:06:11Z")
Of all the bullshit excuses that Republicans are making to vote to acquit, the bullshittiest has to be that this impeachment is not bipartisan. “We can’t vote for this because we aren’t voting for this,” seems like a difficult circular argument to make with a straight face.
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### Author:  [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)
#### Post date: [January 31, 2020, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-trial/846524/639 "2020-01-31T00:11:25Z")
> [@Ann\_Hedonia](#):
>
> I suspect he will soon be investigating the rampant corruption of Bernie and Jane Sanders, and revealing “evidence” that Bernie is deep cover Commie agent planted by Joesph Stalin circa 1950.
Vlad should be able to produce some “authentic” Russian documents showing such. And he’d be happy to help!
> [@drad\_dog](#):
>
> The rebupkis have fetishized the wb and used him to mislead and distract gullible americans. They refer to him all the time, and not in the context of timing. Rand Paul tried to out him yesterday. I watch all the news networks. The defense does not only consist of timing or logic arguments. it has to do with woo.
Oh, yes. And woo favorite THE DOSSIER showed up right on schedule in the Q&A, today. Christopher Steele! Sinister foreign agent of a foreign nation, paid by history’s greatest monster Hillary Clinton, to malign the Dear Leader!
The facts are not on their side. Luckily, fantasy has stepped up to the plate.
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### Author:  [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)
#### Post date: [January 31, 2020, 12:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-impeachment-trial/846524/640 "2020-01-31T00:20:48Z")
> [@Rick\_Kitchen](#):
>
> Rand Paul sent up his whistleblower question to Roberts, and he declined to ask it.
Rand Paul is a fucking stooge.
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