# The two Obamas: Dr. Barack and Fast Eddie Obama **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 22, 2008, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-two-obamas-dr-barack-and-fast-eddie-obama/453802 "2008-06-22T16:57:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Lakai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/9de0a6/32.png) [@Lakai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lakai)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2008, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-two-obamas-dr-barack-and-fast-eddie-obama/453802/21 "2008-06-22T19:06:15Z")
[QUOTE=Whack-a-Mole] What this article really highlights for me is just how little the conservative side has actually got to throw at Obama. - Voting “present” - Rev. Wright - Town Hall Meetings - Public campaign financing What’s more is the overt screeching to make many of those into HUGE deals of epic proportions that prove what a slime Obama is. They’ve got almost nothing so are reduced to making mountains out of mole hills. [sub]–This message paid for by smart people who want a smart president.[/sub] [/QUOTE] The Rev. Wright thing, while nauseously dishonest, was a tough attack to beat. A lesser politician would not have survived it. Think how bad Howard Dean got hit by just screaming. I don’t think any naive politician could have survived it. The public financing thing is just lame. If you listened to conservatives talk this past week you’d think that they have been champions of public financing for the past decade or so. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2008, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-two-obamas-dr-barack-and-fast-eddie-obama/453802/22 "2008-06-22T19:19:39Z")
[QUOTE=Marley23] I’m not impressed with Brooks’ arguments or his grasp on cliches. I think you could write an equally long article on McCain’s “split personality.” [/QUOTE] Steve Benen (Carpetbagger Report) has done so, and updates it on a monthly basis. [Here’s his latest update.](http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/15924.html) An excerpt: > [@](#): > > The past couple of weeks have been especially difficult when it comes to McCain flip-flops. > > - McCain supported the drilling moratorium; now he’s against it. > > - McCain strongly opposes a windfall-tax on oil company profits. Three weeks earlier, he was perfectly comfortable with the idea. > > - McCain thought Bush’s warrantless-wiretap program circumvented the law; now he believes the opposite. > > - McCain defended “privatizing” Social Security. Now he says he’s against privatization (though he actually still supports it.) > > Wait, I’m not done with the last two weeks yet…. > > - McCain wanted to change the Republican Party platform to protect abortion rights in cases of rape and incest. Now he doesn’t. > > - McCain thought the estate tax was perfectly fair. Now he believes the opposite. > > - He opposed indefinite detention of terrorist suspects. When the Supreme Court reached the same conclusion, he called it “one of the worst decisions in the history of this country.” > > - McCain said he would “not impose a litmus test on any nominee.” He used to promise the opposite. > > And these come after these other reversals from April and May: It’s best to read them on Benen’s blog, because each instance comes with a link. Not to mention, I only C&P’d a fraction of his list. As I said in comments there on another day, it’s one thing to change your mind on one thing, or even a few things. People do that, and even pols should have the freedom to do so every now and then. But when you’re regularly changing your mind on _a whole slew of issues_, how on earth are voters supposed to know what you’ll stand for after you’re elected? If you just changed your mind on two dozen issues between last year and now, who’s to say you’re not going to do the same thing between now and next year? Not to mention, if you’re 70 years old and have been in politics for over 25 years, shouldn’t you have really thought through your positions on most major issues in some depth by now, and as a result, shouldn’t your positions mostly be pretty robust? If you haven’t, and they’re not, then something is really wrong with you, and you have no business being President. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2008, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-two-obamas-dr-barack-and-fast-eddie-obama/453802/23 "2008-06-22T19:25:59Z")
McCain wouldn’t be doing all this flip-flopping unless he were under the illusion he actually has a chance to win. It’s rather sad, really. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2008, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-two-obamas-dr-barack-and-fast-eddie-obama/453802/24 "2008-06-22T19:30:47Z")
[QUOTE=Great Dave] Brooks is a hack. [/QUOTE] I’m **jayjay** , and I endorse this message. ---
**Author:** ![Shayna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shayna/32/17976_2.png) [@Shayna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shayna)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2008, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-two-obamas-dr-barack-and-fast-eddie-obama/453802/25 "2008-06-22T19:36:52Z")
[QUOTE=Marley23] I’m not impressed with Brooks’ arguments or his grasp on cliches. I think you could write an equally long article on McCain’s “split personality.” [/QUOTE] [Seems even the Republicans themselves agree with you on McCain](http://thepage.time.com/2008/06/22/republicans-concerned-by-mccain-camp-schizophrenia/). Re the article in the OP, I just have to roll my eyes. Whenever I read one of these trash pieces and find an error of fact in the very first point they try to make, I know I can easily dismiss the entire piece as nothing but garbage without merit. For those reading here who haven’t participated in past discussions on the topic, the allegation that a “Present” vote in the Illinois legislature amounts to “not taking a position” on an issue is a flat out lie. It evinces an utter ignorance of how the Illinois legislature works, and what a “Present” vote actually signifies. In short, voting “Present” _is_ a “No” vote. It counts among all the “No” votes, and can work towards defeating a bill just like a “No” vote does. So why not just vote “No”, then? Because voting “Present”, while _acting_ as a “No” vote, signals the authors of the legislation that the objection isn’t on the subject or nature of the bill itself, but some aspect of it that could be problematic, and if the bill fails as a result, triggers the authors to look at rewriting the problematic portions, not dropping the legislation entirely. For further clarification and supporting links, see the following posts: [Post](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=9484251&postcount=301) [Post](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=9484300&postcount=304) [Post](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=9487152&postcount=390) [Post](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=9488528&postcount=395) The rest of the article is just as much crap as this. ---
**Author:** ![Oy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bc8723/32.png) [@Oy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oy)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2008, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-two-obamas-dr-barack-and-fast-eddie-obama/453802/26 "2008-06-22T20:45:01Z")
On Charlie Rose, Ted Sorenson (JFK’s press secretary and major speech writer) described John F Kennedy as a “pragmatist masquerading as an idealist,” while his brother Bobby was an “idealist pretending to be a pragmatist.” I think the JFK description is very apt for Obama. ---
**Author:** ![AHunter3](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ahunter3/32/368_2.png) [@AHunter3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AHunter3)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2008, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-two-obamas-dr-barack-and-fast-eddie-obama/453802/27 "2008-06-22T22:06:11Z")
[QUOTE=Liberal] He’s saying what I’ve said for weeks now. Republicans aren’t dealing with John Kerry this year. Obama is no wimp. Good on the Democrats for finally fielding a leader with balls. [/QUOTE] As a Hillary Clinton supporter in the primary seasion, I _hope_ the characterization is decently close to the truth. The presence of such characteristics is a bit part of what I liked about her. If Obama does not have a streak of the calculating politician in him, Og help us all. ---
**Author:** ![Frostillicus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e9bcb4/32.png) [@Frostillicus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frostillicus)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2008, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-two-obamas-dr-barack-and-fast-eddie-obama/453802/28 "2008-06-22T22:37:44Z")
[QUOTE=BrainGlutton] BTW, what is this “Scarlett Johansson set”? [/QUOTE] I don’t know, but I would like to apply for membership. ---
**Author:** ![Phlosphr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c68b51/32.png) [@Phlosphr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Phlosphr)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2008, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-two-obamas-dr-barack-and-fast-eddie-obama/453802/29 "2008-06-22T22:47:17Z")
[QUOTE=AHunter3] As a Hillary Clinton supporter in the primary seasion, I _hope_ the characterization is decently close to the truth. The presence of such characteristics is a bit part of what I liked about her. If Obama does not have a streak of the calculating politician in him, Og help us all. [/QUOTE] I’d venture to say Obama’s calculating politician side won him the nomination, and will more than likely win him the oval office. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2008, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-two-obamas-dr-barack-and-fast-eddie-obama/453802/30 "2008-06-22T23:18:43Z")
A gentleman would not comment on Scarlett Johansson’s set you know. No matter how admirable they may be. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2008, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-two-obamas-dr-barack-and-fast-eddie-obama/453802/31 "2008-06-22T23:52:23Z")
You are quite mistaken. I am in every respect a gentleman, and hers is a kicking rack of the pert and perky variety. ---
**Author:** ![cosmosdan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a6a055/32.png) [@cosmosdan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cosmosdan)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2008, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-two-obamas-dr-barack-and-fast-eddie-obama/453802/32 "2008-06-22T23:55:50Z")
[QUOTE=elucidator] You are quite mistaken. I am in every respect a gentleman, and hers is a kicking rack of the pert and perky variety. [/QUOTE] Very nice to meet you Scarlett , please excuse me while I go turn up the AC, I’ll be right back, I promise. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2008, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-two-obamas-dr-barack-and-fast-eddie-obama/453802/33 "2008-06-22T23:58:16Z")
I wouldn’t advise taking the risk of walking, you might step on your tongue and suffer serious injury. ---
**Author:** ![cosmosdan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a6a055/32.png) [@cosmosdan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cosmosdan)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2008, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-two-obamas-dr-barack-and-fast-eddie-obama/453802/34 "2008-06-23T00:06:23Z")
[QUOTE=elucidator] I wouldn’t advise taking the risk of walking, you might step on your tongue and suffer serious injury. [/QUOTE] If I fall forward I won’t go far. ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Dave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/46a35a/32.png) [@Great\_Dave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Dave)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2008, 2:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-two-obamas-dr-barack-and-fast-eddie-obama/453802/35 "2008-06-23T02:07:33Z")
[QUOTE=Great Dave] Brooks is a hack. I wish NPR/PBS would find someone better to represent the right. [/QUOTE] I want to add on- How can E.J. Dionne stand the guy? Dionne is a regular on Diane Rehm, and his analysis is so much better- he actually analyzes the situation, while Brooks struggles to find a metaphor that shoehorns how he perceives the situation into his predetermined opinion. SOP for right-wing media types, but c’mon, isn’t there someone out there how can competently balance Mark Shields? ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2008, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-two-obamas-dr-barack-and-fast-eddie-obama/453802/36 "2008-06-23T03:13:40Z")
[QUOTE=BrainGlutton] BTW, what is this “Scarlett Johansson set”? [/QUOTE] Scarlett Johansson has been an early supporter of Obama and has been emailing him frequently. In a recent interview, she marveled that Obama took the time to answer her emails personally despite how busy he is. A few other celebrities have mentioned that he takes the time to write personally respond to emails they have written him. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2008, 3:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-two-obamas-dr-barack-and-fast-eddie-obama/453802/37 "2008-06-23T03:19:30Z")
[QUOTE=madmonk28] Scarlett Johansson has been an early supporter of Obama and has been emailing him frequently. In a recent interview, she marveled that Obama took the time to answer her emails personally despite how busy he is. A few other celebrities have mentioned that he takes the time to write personally respond to emails they have written him. [/QUOTE] Well, celebs swing influence and $. If I were Obama, I would be sure to answer all Scarlett Johannson’s e-mails personally. Come to think of it, if I were **me,** I would be sure to answer all Scarlett Johansson’s e-mails personally. And in great anatomical detail. ---
**Author:** ![Oy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bc8723/32.png) [@Oy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oy)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2008, 3:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-two-obamas-dr-barack-and-fast-eddie-obama/453802/38 "2008-06-23T03:24:10Z")
[QUOTE=BrainGlutton] Well, celebs swing influence and $. If I were Obama, I would be sure to answer all Scarlett Johannson’s e-mails personally. Come to think of it, if I were **me,** I would be sure to answer all Scarlett Johansson’s e-mails personally. And in great anatomical detail. [/QUOTE] Yes, because most of us women are just waiting with bated breath to hear the exactly dimensions and description of men’s naughty bits. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2008, 3:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-two-obamas-dr-barack-and-fast-eddie-obama/453802/39 "2008-06-23T03:25:57Z")
[QUOTE=Oy!] Yes, because most of us women are just waiting with bated breath to hear the exactly dimensions and description of men’s naughty bits. :rolleyes: [/QUOTE] Oh, no, the detail wouldn’t be about **my** naughty bits! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2008, 3:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-two-obamas-dr-barack-and-fast-eddie-obama/453802/40 "2008-06-23T03:31:51Z")
[QUOTE=BrainGlutton] Well, celebs swing influence and $. If I were Obama, I would be sure to answer all Scarlett Johannson’s e-mails personally. Come to think of it, if I were **me,** I would be sure to answer all Scarlett Johansson’s e-mails personally. And in great anatomical detail. [/QUOTE] You think Michelle isn’t vetting those email exchanges with ScarJo like a hawk? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-two-obamas-dr-barack-and-fast-eddie-obama/453802.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-two-obamas-dr-barack-and-fast-eddie-obama/453802.md?page=3)