# The tyranny of Words. Iraqi Terrorists or Freedom Fighters. **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 19, 2003, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tyranny-of-words-iraqi-terrorists-or-freedom-fighters/196238 "2003-08-19T17:32:31Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 8\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Milum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ea666f/32.png) [@Milum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Milum)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2003, 3:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tyranny-of-words-iraqi-terrorists-or-freedom-fighters/196238/41 "2003-08-25T03:16:43Z")
Hey Salam and Aldebaran, I can only assume that your earlier lives have been lacking in worldly sophistication. Shoot, fellows, don’t you know that if it wasn’t for the constraints of the antiquated social system that you enjoyed, you might even be smarter than me. Maybe smarter. Maybe. ---
**Author:** ![This\_Bike\_Is\_A\_Pipebomb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/71e660/32.png) [@This\_Bike\_Is\_A\_Pipebomb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/This_Bike_Is_A_Pipebomb)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2003, 4:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tyranny-of-words-iraqi-terrorists-or-freedom-fighters/196238/42 "2003-08-25T04:10:39Z")
Usually I just spy on topics on the SDMB, but for the first time this particular thread made me feel the need to put my two cents in. To everyone who claims these people are terrorists, remember that not 250 years ago, a bunch of terrorists tarred and feathered British tax collectors, raided ships carrying tea, and organized an entire revolution based on not liking a foreign occupying power. Their Osama Bin Laden was Thomas Jefferson, who gave them the ideas to die for. Their Saddam Hussein was George Washington, who realized a war could not be fought and won against the British using the current rules of war at the time. Not all of America was behind the revolution. In fact, only about a third of people wanted independance. Another third actually favored British rule, and another third did’t really care either way. I would say that in Iraq, far less than a third of the people like the Baath party. And just because we are helping them get rid of the former oppressive regieme, don’t think they will feel indebted to us. We certainly didn’t like the British, even though they helped us in the French and Indian War. In fact, we hated them because they rolled the cost over onto the colonies. You think the Iraqis are going the all get low taxes and free handouts from the US? I’ll believe it when I see it… ---
**Author:** ![Phoenix\_Dragon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/65b543/32.png) [@Phoenix\_Dragon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Phoenix_Dragon)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2003, 4:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tyranny-of-words-iraqi-terrorists-or-freedom-fighters/196238/43 "2003-08-25T04:48:44Z")
I see little difference between what Iraqi resistance is doing now and what the French resistance did some 60 years ago. Both were fighting an occupying force through guerilla tactics, ambush, and sabotauge of both military and economic/infrastructure targets. It seems two-faced and self-serving to make the only differences between “legitimate resistance” and “terrorist attacks” be that of wether they’re fighting against the good guys or the bad guys. Or would you call the French resistance of the early 40s “terrorists” as well? ---
**Author:** ![Milum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ea666f/32.png) [@Milum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Milum)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2003, 5:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tyranny-of-words-iraqi-terrorists-or-freedom-fighters/196238/44 "2003-08-25T05:01:42Z")
Hmm…if folk here can make comparisons but can’t make distinctions then why are we talking. ---
**Author:** ![Avenger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9de0a6/32.png) [@Avenger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Avenger)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2003, 6:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tyranny-of-words-iraqi-terrorists-or-freedom-fighters/196238/45 "2003-08-25T06:21:13Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Milum \* > \*\*Hmm…if folk here can make comparisons but can’t make distinctions then why are we talking. \*\* What distinctions would you like to make **Milum**? If you were answering **Phoenix Dragon**'s point then it seems to be in agreement with your earlier point that “terrorists” and “freedom fighters” should be defined by their actions, not who they are. ---
**Author:** ![Latro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a87d85/32.png) [@Latro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Latro)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2003, 9:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tyranny-of-words-iraqi-terrorists-or-freedom-fighters/196238/46 "2003-08-25T09:35:31Z")
I would have to go with the distinctions already made by **Dissonance**. > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Dissonance \* > \*\*My take on the tyranny of words: > > **terrorist** : Non-state forces that one objects to and considers illegitimate for political reasons. > > **guerilla** : Non-state forces that one may or may not object to, but admits to some degree of legitimacy, perhaps grudgingly. > > **freedom fighter** : Non-state forces who one considers to be good guys for political reasons. The government they are fighting is illegitimate. > > There’s nothing that prevents the same groups from sliding through the classifications over time. Witness, for example, the mujahideen in Afghanistan who went through all three classifications in the minds of the same people: Freedom fighters and guerillas against the USSR, later becoming terrorists once Afghanistan was over and they went overseas. \*\* All three groups can use _tactics_ that are terrorist and/or guerilla, what you call them depends on whether you see the US invasion and occupation as good or bad. Another distinction, I haven’t seen made clear yet… Despite Bush’s “ I now declare the war over.”, as far as Saddam is concerned the war is still on and these are the troops he is fighting it with… If these people are indeed what is often called ‘remnants of Saddam’s regime’, that just means they are loyalist troops. There hasn’t been a peace treaty or official surrender, therefore they can’t really be called illegitimate. They would be official troops still fighting for their government, using guerilla tactics. Seen that way, of the three terms ‘terrorists’ seems the least appropriate. ---
**Author:** ![Mehitabel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8797f3/32.png) [@Mehitabel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mehitabel)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2003, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tyranny-of-words-iraqi-terrorists-or-freedom-fighters/196238/47 "2003-08-25T14:49:08Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Latro \* > > \*\*Despite Bush’s “ I now declare the war over.”, as far as Saddam is concerned the war is still on and these are the troops he is fighting it with… > \*\* Actually, **Latro** , he never quite[said that.](http://www.kansascity.com/mld/kansascity/news/breaking_news/5765128.htm) “Major combat operations in Iraq have ended,” is the exact quote. Rather different and pretty accurate. If what you said is what was reported in the Dutch press, it must have been very confusing. And oh yeah, some translator didn’t earn his money. ---
**Author:** ![Latro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a87d85/32.png) [@Latro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Latro)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2003, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tyranny-of-words-iraqi-terrorists-or-freedom-fighters/196238/48 "2003-08-25T15:04:37Z")
Ah, you are right, I see. That was however the impression. > [@](#): > > Bush stopped short of declaring victory or an end to the war. Such declarations could trigger international laws requiring the speedy release of prisoners of war, limiting efforts to go after deposed Iraqi leaders and designating the United States as an occupying power. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tyranny-of-words-iraqi-terrorists-or-freedom-fighters/196238.md?page=2)