# The U.K. Is Done. The U.K. Is Also The Canary In The Coal Mine **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 20, 2008, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-u-k-is-done-the-u-k-is-also-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine/478097 "2008-12-20T18:43:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Racer1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ee59a6/32.png) [@Racer1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Racer1)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2008, 9:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-u-k-is-done-the-u-k-is-also-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine/478097/81 "2008-12-24T09:24:46Z")
> [@Rune](#): > > I think this one fits in nicely here: > > [Ice cream names cause debate - are the names racist or Nazi codewords?](http://beeqube.com/article/icec) > > - as I remember it, in fact the “88” was used because it is the international amateur radio signal for something like “love & kisses” or some such thing. Gotta love the Swedes. I want to move to Malmø and marry a Swedish feminist. Heh, I actually thought that website was serious when you first posted it. 🙂 Makes me realise I haven’t had a 99 in years. ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2008, 10:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-u-k-is-done-the-u-k-is-also-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine/478097/82 "2008-12-24T10:05:43Z")
I see nothing wrong with that last link in **Huerta88** ’s post. Isn’t a classroom supposed to be an all-inclusive environment? Any teacher that thought up this activity could be deemed to be a little insensitive, to say the least. If there is anything wrong, it is that teachers should need to be told about this. As for the **88** hullaballoo, are there that many **Huerta** ’s on here that they have to distinguish themselves by numbers? It seems to me that unless you have been living in a cultural vacuum, you would have to know that this number had Far Right connections, and that including it in your username would raise eyebrows. ---
**Author:** ![Huerta88](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/82dd89/32.png) [@Huerta88](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Huerta88)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2008, 12:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-u-k-is-done-the-u-k-is-also-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine/478097/83 "2008-12-24T12:25:17Z")
> [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > Isn’t a classroom supposed to be an all-inclusive environment? I don’t know where that idea comes from. I thought it was supposed to be “an environment” (or maybe just a room, with a teacher and pupils) where children were educated, but, failing that, it seems to me to be a biological truism that every child has a father, so allowing mother’s day cards to be on the agenda, but not father’s day cards, seems, well, stupid. > [@](#): > > As for the **88** hullaballoo Hullabaloo is right. At this juncture, I wouldn’t change it for money as it serves the very useful diagnostic function of being, it appears, sucker bait for morons with no actual arguments to make fools of themselves by sophomorically Godwinizing threads to which they have no substantive reply. ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2008, 12:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-u-k-is-done-the-u-k-is-also-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine/478097/84 "2008-12-24T12:57:18Z")
> [@Huerta88](#): > > I don’t know where that idea comes from. I thought it was supposed to be “an environment” (or maybe just a room, with a teacher and pupils) where children were educated, but, failing that, it seems to me to be a biological truism that every child has a father, so allowing mother’s day cards to be on the agenda, but not father’s day cards, seems, well, stupid. > > Hullabaloo is right. At this juncture, I wouldn’t change it for money as it serves the very useful diagnostic function of being, it appears, sucker bait for morons with no actual arguments to make fools of themselves by sophomorically Godwinizing threads to which they have no substantive reply. Look, I agree; having 88 in your username doesn’t make you a nazi. But having it in your username when you know its associations, does make you a twat. ---
**Author:** ![Huerta88](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/82dd89/32.png) [@Huerta88](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Huerta88)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2008, 1:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-u-k-is-done-the-u-k-is-also-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine/478097/85 "2008-12-24T13:44:50Z")
> [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > But having it in your username when you know its associations, does make you a twat. And I dissent, precisely because I believe that sniffing out hypothetical offense where none is intended, effected, or taken, is the definition (oh hey look at my OP) of twatdom. So: it turns out (1) I am not a Aryan supremacist (not even, in fact, Aryan); (2) I never post anything that would support such an ideology; and (3) there is no one on this board (Holocaust survivors? Pakis that I’ve bashed with my non-existent jackboots?) who has or would have reason to be offended, intimidated, threatened by some association other clowns make with a part of my username. How, then, is introducing discussion of that, in a thread having nothing to do with fascism, anything other than RO by self-satisfied goofballs? What’s this remind me of? Oh hey – > **[Latest news & breaking headlines](https://www.thetimes.com/)** > > The latest breaking UK, US, world, business and sport news from The Times and The Sunday Times. Go beyond today's headlines with in-depth analysis and comment. > **[tollbit-host.com](https://tollbit-host.com/news/2229719/Apology-over-'offensive'-puppy-police-advert-after-Muslim-complaints.html)** > **[BBC NEWS | UK | England | London | Jail toilets face away from Mecca](http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/london/4926114.stm)** > > New toilets at a prison are being designed so Muslim inmates do not have to face Mecca while on the toilet. Now, I forget if the Times, Telegraph, or Beeb are acceptable or unacceptable sources as judged by the self-appointed media guardians herein, but you get the point: that just happened, as they said in Talladega Nights. Oh hey, what else does the “fascism” brouhaha remind me of about Blighty? Thom Yorke (number four with a bullet on my list of Brits Who Desperately Need A Punch In The Face) met up with his bandmates while he was “active in the anti-fascist movements” at university. Because fascism was the leading threat to British and Western liberty and freedom in the late 1980s, most especially at Oxford where dear Thom ended up. Or rather, “anti-fascism” (what, were they fearing another Blitz? Was the BNP on the verge of taking over the Government?) was a fashionable cause for privileged twits or twats at Oxbridge to show off how enlightened they were. Naturally none of them took the time to oppose or protest the gravest actual threat to British and Western liberty post-1945, which was their very own Cambridge peers who when they could spare time from buggering each other were desperately keen on selling the nation out to the Soviets. ---
**Author:** ![casdave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c6cbf5/32.png) [@casdave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/casdave)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2008, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-u-k-is-done-the-u-k-is-also-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine/478097/86 "2008-12-24T17:16:41Z")
There isno such thing as a completely truthful accurate and unbiased source, doesn’t matter what the title says. All that is left is for readers to be conscious of this, and be critical, read what is printed and what has not been printed, and to ask questions. This whole thread started out with an uncritical summary from very poor report. It is not jut about the source, its the unblinking acceptance of ‘information’ that is the issue. Its also true that some parts of the media are worse than others, but none are perfect. Merely because you find some faults in some of the more reputable parts is not a reason to discard everything they say, and equally, even a notoriously innaccurate source can get it right once in a while, its up to the reader to evaluate, seems some of us are rather better at this than others. ---
**Author:** ![Dead\_Badger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/848f3c/32.png) [@Dead\_Badger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dead_Badger)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2008, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-u-k-is-done-the-u-k-is-also-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine/478097/87 "2008-12-24T17:57:10Z")
> [@Huerta88](#): > > …sucker bait for morons with no actual arguments to make fools of themselves by sophomorically Godwinizing threads to which they have no substantive reply. While I disagree with, and have personally argued against, the accusations of Nazism, I do have to say that it would have helped avoid Godwinizing if you hadn’t Moronized your OP right from the start. This whole thread is a profoundly retarded exercise in which you post articles you’ve barely bothered to read, and clearly have made no attempt to think about, in support of a “thesis” that you apparently shat. At no point have you even attempted to address any actual criticism of your “thesis”, preferring instead to whinge about patricians who like their news from actual newspapers, or dodge from one stupid and minor “news” article to the next. Take your latest outrage, the Muslim dog issue. The only quote you’ve actually got from an “offended” Muslim is a local councillor, who says: > [@](#): > > My concern was that it is not welcomed by all communities, with the dog on the cards. It was probably a waste of resources going to these communities. Sounds like he’s more concerned about the waste, n’est-ce pas? But let’s not that get in the way of a good “THE MUZZERS ARE OFFENDED” story, eh? It’s no surprise people have turned on your name, frankly - if your actual argument was more than third grade in standard, we might have something to get our teeth into. Still, I see now you’re off on some dribbly rant about musicians you dislike, so I suspect there’s no chance of eliciting any actual sense from you. Hell, with this level of attention span, I doubt you even have the concentration to be a proper Nazi. That requires a bit more commitment than just searching for the phrase “muslims”+“political correctness gone mad” on google news, doesn’t it? ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tao\_s\_Revenge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/73ab20/32.png) [@The\_Tao\_s\_Revenge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tao_s_Revenge)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2008, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-u-k-is-done-the-u-k-is-also-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine/478097/88 "2008-12-24T18:06:18Z")
> [@jjimm](#): > > I don’t. They’re scary. They like to hide in people’s closets you know, and they come out when you turn off the light. ---
**Author:** ![furt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/439d5e/32.png) [@furt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/furt)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2008, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-u-k-is-done-the-u-k-is-also-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine/478097/89 "2008-12-24T19:39:41Z")
> [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > It seems to me that unless you have been living in a cultural vacuum, you would have to know that this number had Far Right connections, and that including it in your username would raise eyebrows. I have never, ever heard of this, except on the SDMB in (numerous) attacks on this username. The first time I saw this meme, I asked several people if they’d heard of it. Nobody had. ---
**Author:** ![Racer1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ee59a6/32.png) [@Racer1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Racer1)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2008, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-u-k-is-done-the-u-k-is-also-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine/478097/90 "2008-12-24T19:48:30Z")
> [@Huerta88](#): > > And I dissent, precisely because I believe that sniffing out hypothetical offense where none is intended, effected, or taken, is the definition (oh hey look at my OP) of twatdom. > > So: it turns out (1) I am not a Aryan supremacist (not even, in fact, Aryan); (2) I never post anything that would support such an ideology; and (3) there is no one on this board (Holocaust survivors? Pakis that I’ve bashed with my non-existent jackboots?) who has or would have reason to be offended, intimidated, threatened by some association other clowns make with a part of my username. How, then, is introducing discussion of that, in a thread having nothing to do with fascism, anything other than RO by self-satisfied goofballs? > > What’s this remind me of? Oh hey – > > [http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article4276489.ece](http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article4276489.ece) > [tollbit-host.com](http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2229719/Apology-over-'offensive'-puppy-police-advert-after-Muslim-complaints.html) > [BBC NEWS | UK | England | London | Jail toilets face away from Mecca](http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/london/4926114.stm) > > Now, I forget if the Times, Telegraph, or Beeb are acceptable or unacceptable sources as judged by the self-appointed media guardians herein, but you get the point: that just happened, as they said in Talladega Nights. > > Oh hey, what else does the “fascism” brouhaha remind me of about Blighty? Thom Yorke (number four with a bullet on my list of Brits Who Desperately Need A Punch In The Face) met up with his bandmates while he was “active in the anti-fascist movements” at university. Because fascism was the leading threat to British and Western liberty and freedom in the late 1980s, most especially at Oxford where dear Thom ended up. Or rather, “anti-fascism” (what, were they fearing another Blitz? Was the BNP on the verge of taking over the Government?) was a fashionable cause for privileged twits or twats at Oxbridge to show off how enlightened they were. Naturally none of them took the time to oppose or protest the gravest actual threat to British and Western liberty post-1945, which was their very own Cambridge peers who when they could spare time from buggering each other were desperately keen on selling the nation out to the Soviets. Weird ranting aside, I don’t really get why you are singling us out? You sound like my dad, which in turn suggests that this isn’t a UK specific issue. ---
**Author:** ![Baron\_Greenback](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baron_greenback/32/48_2.png) [@Baron\_Greenback](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baron_Greenback)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2008, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-u-k-is-done-the-u-k-is-also-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine/478097/91 "2008-12-24T20:34:58Z")
> [@Racer1](#): > > Weird ranting aside, I don’t really get why you are singling us out? Our friend may as well just post “I have an inferiority complex about Britain” over and over and over again for all the sense he is making. Let the little lad be, he’s not worth it. ---
**Author:** ![Rune](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e68b1a/32.png) [@Rune](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rune)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2008, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-u-k-is-done-the-u-k-is-also-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine/478097/92 "2008-12-25T01:39:54Z")
> [@Racer1](#): > > Heh, I actually thought that website was serious when you first posted it. 🙂 > > Makes me realise I haven’t had a 99 in years. You mean the website about the ice creams called “Nogger” and “88”? Yes that is serious enough. I mean those people protesting against the name were serious. It all petered out when the company spokesman (with the ubercool name: Petronella Warg) showed quite unexpectedly to have balls. Asked if the company had any intention of changing the name, she responded: “Doubt it. We can ‘t let ourselves be intimidated by everything. There are also those whom claim our Igloo Coke foster cocaine abuse amongst Eskimos.” ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2008, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-u-k-is-done-the-u-k-is-also-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine/478097/93 "2008-12-25T01:52:51Z")
> [@furt](#): > > I have never, ever heard of this, except on the SDMB in (numerous) attacks on this username. The first time I saw this meme, I asked several people if they’d heard of it. Nobody had. Well, I have elsewhere. And the people who used it WERE neo-Nazis, from that Stormfront site as I recall. ---
**Author:** ![Baron\_Greenback](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baron_greenback/32/48_2.png) [@Baron\_Greenback](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baron_Greenback)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2008, 1:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-u-k-is-done-the-u-k-is-also-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine/478097/94 "2008-12-25T01:54:16Z")
> [@Rune](#): > > You mean the website about the ice creams called “Nogger” and “88”? Yes that is serious enough. I mean those people protesting against the name were serious. It all petered out when the company spokesman (with the ubercool name: Petronella Warg) showed quite unexpectedly to have balls. Asked if the company had any intention of changing the name, she responded: “Doubt it. We can ‘t let ourselves be intimidated by everything. There are also those whom claim our Igloo Coke foster cocaine abuse amongst Eskimos.” _shrug_ In the UK an ice-cream cone with a Flake chocolate stuck in the top is called a 99. What the blithering fuck are _you_ talking about, you dozy cunt? :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Rune](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e68b1a/32.png) [@Rune](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rune)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2008, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-u-k-is-done-the-u-k-is-also-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine/478097/95 "2008-12-25T02:12:59Z")
> [@Struan](#): > > _shrug_ > > In the UK an ice-cream cone with a Flake chocolate stuck in the top is called a 99. What the blithering fuck are _you_ talking about, you dozy cunt? :dubious: do’h. Why don’t you read the article idiot? A Swedish ice cream company was accused of racism for naming an ice cream “nogger” and subsequently also accused of, I guess Nazism, for naming one of their ice creams “88”. Turns out the “nogger” (from ’79) is a play on the word “nougat” and “88” (from ’64) means “Love & Kisses” in radio amateur code – which of course is also why Huerta chose those numbers. Petronella told the whining bastards to go fuck a goat. Which they promptly did. ---
**Author:** ![BlankSlate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blankslate/32/80_2.png) [@BlankSlate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlankSlate)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2008, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-u-k-is-done-the-u-k-is-also-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine/478097/96 "2008-12-25T02:29:31Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Well, I have elsewhere. And the people who used it WERE neo-Nazis, from that Stormfront site as I recall. I just assumed when I saw the OP that the poster was a stormfront butthead. I know it’s wrong to assume, but I’ve never seen 88 used in an internet user-handle that wasn’t some neo-nazi crackpot. ---
**Author:** ![Baron\_Greenback](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baron_greenback/32/48_2.png) [@Baron\_Greenback](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baron_Greenback)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2008, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-u-k-is-done-the-u-k-is-also-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine/478097/97 "2008-12-25T02:35:18Z")
> [@Rune](#): > > do’h. Why don’t you read the article idiot? A Swedish ice cream company was accused of racism for naming an ice cream “nogger” and subsequently also accused of, I guess Nazism, for naming one of their ice creams “88”. Turns out the “nogger” (from ’79) is a play on the word “nougat” and “88” (from ’64) means “Love & Kisses” in radio amateur code – which of course is also why Huerta chose those numbers. Petronella told the whining bastards to go fuck a goat. Which they promptly did. What the fuck does this have to do with the UK? Is it something that HuertaNazi said? Are you just having a wee clenched-fist rant/salute to yourself, my dear? ---
**Author:** ![Rune](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e68b1a/32.png) [@Rune](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rune)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2008, 11:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-u-k-is-done-the-u-k-is-also-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine/478097/98 "2008-12-25T11:11:58Z")
> [@Struan](#): > > What the fuck does this have to do with the UK? Is it something that HuertaNazi said? It was obviously a comment on the “88 hullaballoo”. Huerta88, ice cream “88”. Both accused of Nazism. Spot the similarities? btw. did you know that “Struan” was Mussolinis nickname in Danish. Well of course you do. ---
**Author:** ![Sevastopol](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cdc98d/32.png) [@Sevastopol](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sevastopol)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2008, 12:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-u-k-is-done-the-u-k-is-also-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine/478097/99 "2008-12-25T12:22:20Z")
88’s a very lucky number in Chinese: [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International\_Finance\_Centre](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Finance_Centre). So you never know what people are thinking. ---
**Author:** ![Huerta88](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/82dd89/32.png) [@Huerta88](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Huerta88)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2008, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-u-k-is-done-the-u-k-is-also-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine/478097/100 "2008-12-25T14:49:47Z")
> [@Struan](#): > > Our friend may as well just post “I have an inferiority complex about Britain” Would this not require that there be some field of endavor in which the U.K. were superior? Binge drinking? Wives and girlfriends reportage? David Cameron’s windmill? One could readily feel a lot of things toward the British of today. Sympathy, even, for their diminished state. But no one in the Anglophone First World could sanely be supposed to be envying or feeling inferior to them. You are going nicely down a checklist of every eighth grader’s rhetoriical arsenal, though. Godwin, check. Amateur psychology from Freud For Dummies, 1951 edition? Check. Genetic Fallacy? Done? Man, I’m worried. If you pull out your copy of Catcher In The Rye and inform me I’m a big phony, or declare “Huerta’s a total fag,” I don’t know what I’ll do. Game set match at that point. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-u-k-is-done-the-u-k-is-also-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine/478097.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-u-k-is-done-the-u-k-is-also-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine/478097.md?page=6)