# The United States Declares Economic War on Canada **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Tags:** trump\ **Created:** [February 1, 2025, 9:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-united-states-declares-economic-war-on-canada/1013734 "2025-02-01T21:16:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 47
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2025, 1:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-united-states-declares-economic-war-on-canada/1013734/921 "2025-03-17T13:12:07Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > WTF makes you think there would be any such exchange? This isn’t the reunification of Germany, it’s an invasion. It’s far more likely all Canadian money would be declared worthless than a one-to-one exchange. Current Canadian M2 is about two and a half trillion dollars; for the US to simply create that much money in one shot - which is what Uzi is proposing - would be an absolute clusterfuck. Everything Trump is doing or could do is an economic loss. Trade war? Bad for both economies. Real war? Catastrophic for both economies. The Americans are TRYING to make people poor. It is just not possible to explain any of this otherwise; Trump is dumb enough to think this tariff chaos will help his country but the people around him cannot all be this stupid. > [@Spoons](#): > > Indeed. Trucks only make money when they’re running. Somebody had to be paying them to stop running for weeks on end. No one has ever actually demonstrated the protest had substantial foreign funding. I mean, it was illegal and obnoxious and had to be stopped, but the conspiracy theories have all fizzled out, ya know. Remember how for days afterwards, people were freaking out that “The trucks will come back” and panicking when they saw trucks at truck stops? It was ridiculous. Let’s get over it. Sometimes, people protest. Sometimes there will be protests that go too far that you don’t agree with. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2025, 1:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-united-states-declares-economic-war-on-canada/1013734/922 "2025-03-17T13:14:40Z")
Incidentally, I have from my source that has never been wrong about this before that there is a very high probability a federal election will be called this week. ---
**Author:** ![Uzi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/91b2a8/32.png) [@Uzi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uzi)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2025, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-united-states-declares-economic-war-on-canada/1013734/923 "2025-03-17T13:42:07Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > Current Canadian M2 is about two and a half trillion dollars; for the US to simply create that much money in one shot - which is what Uzi is proposing - would be an absolute clusterfuck. I’m not proposing anything. I’m repeating what Trump said, for what it’s worth. The value of money isn’t in the piece of paper, it is what backs it. I can go to a bank and change the ‘look’ of my dollar to another look (US to Canada for example). Is the money all of a sudden worthless? Changing a whole bunch of money doesn’t make it any less valuable. It is backed by what would be a potentially huge economy, assuming a bunch of lost causers aren’t blowing shit up all over the place. The combined would likely be worth more than the separate parts, imho. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2025, 1:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-united-states-declares-economic-war-on-canada/1013734/924 "2025-03-17T13:47:35Z")
> [@Uzi](#): > > Changing a whole bunch of money doesn’t make it any less valuable. You have to create the US money to do this, and what’s backing it isn’t gonna be as valuable as it used to be. Canadian money would cease to have value if the government stopped existing, because that’s what guarantees its value. In effect you are proposing the American government create money to replace it, while taking over a country that will now have a shattered economy. How much was Iraqi money worth in 2004? You don’t really think life would just carry on, do you? That people wouldn’t be sending their kids away? Fleeing? That there wouldn’t be a collapse in the markets? And lost cause? We’d win, eventually. I guarantee it. The US would end up having the run away, just like they have in Vietnam and Afghanistan. ---
**Author:** ![dtilque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d6d6ee/32.png) [@dtilque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dtilque)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2025, 1:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-united-states-declares-economic-war-on-canada/1013734/925 "2025-03-17T13:55:17Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > Incidentally, I have from my source that has never been wrong about this before that there is a very high probability a federal election will be called this week. I’ve been thinking that they should add an advisory question to that election. Something like “Should Canada become part of the US?”. Not that I think it’s at all likely to get a Yes vote, but rather to have ammunition to show Trump that 89% of Canadians don’t want to become Americans. Of course, Trump will immediately claim those results are fraudulent, so you’d also have to have American election observers to verify the result. Even that probably won’t do much good, so adding the question is likely to be an exercise in futility. Trump has made up his mind and nothing will change it. ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2025, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-united-states-declares-economic-war-on-canada/1013734/926 "2025-03-17T13:56:02Z")
> [@Uzi](#): > > Americans and Canadians are pretty much indistinguishable for the most part. Apparently you know nothing about Canada at all. Not the first thing. Canada is a social democracy. The US is a capitalist oligarchy. And that’s just the basic starting point. ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2025, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-united-states-declares-economic-war-on-canada/1013734/927 "2025-03-17T14:14:39Z")
> [@wolfpup](#): > > Apparently you know nothing about Canada at all. Not the first thing. Canada is a social democracy. The US is a capitalist oligarchy. And that’s just the basic starting point. Exactly. The US is hostile to Canada, in part, because it represents an alternative to America’s repressive regime. It’s also one of the motivating factors for Russia’s hostility to Ukraine. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2025, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-united-states-declares-economic-war-on-canada/1013734/928 "2025-03-17T14:15:45Z")
> [@wolfpup](#): > > Apparently you know nothing about Canada at all. Not the first thing. Canada is a social democracy. The US is a capitalist oligarchy. And that’s just the basic starting point. I mean, if Canadians were indistinguishable, **they wouldn’t be so viciously opposed to annexation.** ---
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2025, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-united-states-declares-economic-war-on-canada/1013734/929 "2025-03-17T15:52:33Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > The Americans are TRYING to make people poor. It is just not possible to explain any of this otherwise; Trump is dumb enough to think this tariff chaos will help his country but the people around him cannot all be this stupid They’re trying to make people desperate enough to work for them under whatever conditions they feel like providing. An economy in which people who don’t like their working conditions can say ‘I’ve had it with this shit, I quit’ and reasonably expect to find another job where they’ll be treated better is not the economy they think they want. The fact that in the long run the mess they’re designing will eat them too hasn’t entered their heads. They don’t believe that it will. > [@Uzi](#): > > I’m not proposing anything. I’m repeating what Trump said, for what it’s worth. Good God. Can you possibly be believing that everything Trump says is going to happen? ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2025, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-united-states-declares-economic-war-on-canada/1013734/930 "2025-03-17T16:23:31Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > if Canadians were indistinguishable, **they wouldn’t be so viciously opposed to annexation.** If Canadians were indistinguishable, we’d have been assimilated decades ago. World War One, Prohibition, the Great Depression, World War Two, the Cold War, the Collapse of the Soviet Union, 9/11, the War on Terror? If none of that motivated us to join the US, what will motivate us now? ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2025, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-united-states-declares-economic-war-on-canada/1013734/931 "2025-03-17T19:32:05Z")
> [@Uzi](#): > > But Trump making the argument that if Canada doesn’t like tariffs, they can join the US is a perfectly reasonable position No, it’s not. It is not right for one nation to tell another another to surrender its sovereignty. Nevermind that the trade agreement he has torn up as used as toilet paper was _the one he himself negotiated and praised as the greatest agreement ever._ > [@Uzi](#): > > If he wants to tear up every trade agreement, treaty, or contract with us, he is only limited by the laws of his country in doing so. Trump is a convicted felon by the laws of his own country and right now there are numerous lawsuits in our court system arguing that what he is doing is NOT legal in the country he was elected to lead. So that argument is down the toilet. > [@Uzi](#): > > So, would Trump invade Canada. No. Yes, yes he would. > [@Uzi](#): > > Would he try to crush us economically? I wouldn’t put it past him. That does seem to be the plan. > [@Uzi](#): > > He’d then wait to pick up the pieces. Yep. He’d invade and destroy your country. I have no idea why you are so blasé about that. > [@wolfpup](#): > > The ability to declare war involves specifically circumscribed powers and a disciplined chain of command, not all of whom are imbeciles. Bush the Younger had a hard enough time justifying the invasion of Iraq, which was at least vaguely a plausible threat. A long-time close ally is in no sane world a plausible threat. Plenty of presidents have gotten the US involved a war by calling it a “police action” - Korea and Viet Nam being the two that come to my mind first but they aren’t the only ones. Currently, the MAGAts are attempting to purge of the military of anyone who isn’t a yes-man for Trump. And finally, we are not in a sane world - or at least not a sane US government - at present. > [@thorny\_locust](#): > > Nor is it a “perfectly reasonable position” to claim that all of Canada would only count as one state. That’s mostly because Trump hasn’t a clue how big Canada actually is, or how many people it has. But, under the assumption that One Big Canadian State would be hella leftist by MAGAt standards it does make sense to limit it to just one so they only get two seats in the Senate, limiting the impact all those new citizens could have on Congress as a whole. > [@Uzi](#): > > > [@RickJay](#): > > > > Current Canadian M2 is about two and a half trillion dollars; for the US to simply create that much money in one shot - which is what Uzi is proposing - would be an absolute clusterfuck. > > I’m not proposing anything. I’m repeating what Trump said, for what it’s worth. The value of money isn’t in the piece of paper, it is what backs it. I can go to a bank and change the ‘look’ of my dollar to another look (US to Canada for example). Is the money all of a sudden worthless? Changing a whole bunch of money doesn’t make it any less valuable. It is backed by what would be a potentially huge economy, assuming a bunch of lost causers aren’t blowing shit up all over the place. The combined would likely be worth more than the separate parts, imho. “What Trump says” is worth the paper it isn’t printed on. “What Trump says” changes from day to day, sometimes hour to hour, and frequently does a 180. Sadly, the Canadian dollar is not worth as much as the American dollar. There is no way in hell the greedy jackasses in DC would ever do a 1:1 exchange in the event they take over Canada. Not a goddamn chance, because that would make _their_ money worth less. ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2025, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-united-states-declares-economic-war-on-canada/1013734/932 "2025-03-17T20:16:21Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > Yep. He’d invade and destroy your country. I have no idea why you are so blasé about that He’s living in a fantasy world where, after annexation, Trump showers us with wealth by trading our savings at par with the US dollar, all while not getting rid of any of the government programs that make life in Canada better than in the US, like our health care. And he’s doing that while we’re watching Trump try to dismantle every US program that helps anyone who isn’t rich as fuck. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2025, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-united-states-declares-economic-war-on-canada/1013734/933 "2025-03-17T20:33:22Z")
Yes. When you see what Trump is doing to his own fellow citizens the notions the Uzi is suggesting are just laughably unrealistic. ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2025, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-united-states-declares-economic-war-on-canada/1013734/934 "2025-03-17T20:36:13Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > > [@Uzi](#): > > > > But Trump making the argument that if Canada doesn’t like tariffs, they can join the US is a perfectly reasonable position > > No, it’s not. It is not right for one nation to tell another another to surrender its sovereignty. I seem to have missed that part of Uzi’s position. Wow. I find myself wondering just how extensible this position is? - If you won’t sell your car to me for what I decide is a reasonable price, may I simply take it from you? By force? - If a woman rejects my kind request of a dance, just how much of a conquest am I justified in launching? - When a couple is unable to have children of their own, but desperately wants them, should they kidnap somebody else’s child from a shopping cart at Walmart? Once again … your stance on this entire issue utterly baffles me. Somewhere, the ghost of Neville Chamberlain is screaming, “NOOOOOOOOOooooooooooooo!!!” ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2025, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-united-states-declares-economic-war-on-canada/1013734/935 "2025-03-17T20:37:16Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > Plenty of presidents have gotten the US involved a war by calling it a “police action” - Korea and Viet Nam being the two that come to my mind first but they aren’t the only ones. Currently, the MAGAts are attempting to purge of the military of anyone who isn’t a yes-man for Trump. And finally, we are not in a sane world - or at least not a sane US government - at present. One of the oddest claims I keep hearing is that the President can’t start a war. This is usually based on two arguments; one is that only Congress can start a war, and the other is that the army would refuse such an “illegal command.” In fact, it has to be pointed out that both these claims are utterly false. The President CAN start a war on his own; it’s quite clearly spelled out in the War Powers Resolution of 1973. The President can order military action without Congressional approval; he must merely declare it to be an “emergency” and then inform Congress within 48 hours. Congress’s permission is only required for action lasting longer than sixty days, and in theory they could pass a law prohibiting FURTHER action. (the 60-day-rule has been broken, too, with little political effect.) And of course, it’s been done. Grenada, for example, or Kosovo. And that being said, it wouldn’t BE an illegal order. It’s perfectly legal for the President to order the armed forces to attack anyone he likes, if Congress has not explicity forbidden such an act, per the War Powers Resolution 1973. ---
**Author:** ![Dr\_Paprika](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr_paprika/32/3042_2.png) [@Dr\_Paprika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr_Paprika)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2025, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-united-states-declares-economic-war-on-canada/1013734/936 "2025-03-17T21:34:34Z")
Very, very few Canadians would choose this. Even under implausible circumstances like loonies being converted to greenbacks. And I am far more pro-American than most of my friends. Under Trump, I doubt 10%. Canadians usually value politeness and kindness. People who generally talk loudly and only about themselves are not usually regarded highly, though I know a few scant exceptions to this. ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2025, 1:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-united-states-declares-economic-war-on-canada/1013734/937 "2025-03-18T01:07:24Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > under the assumption that One Big Canadian State would be hella leftist by MAGAt standards it does make sense to limit it to just one so they only get two seats in the Senate, limiting the impact all those new citizens could have on Congress as a whole. But the Canadian contingent could tip the House since the number of reps is population-based. No doubt that would be prevented from happening, though. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2025, 1:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-united-states-declares-economic-war-on-canada/1013734/938 "2025-03-18T01:57:16Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > Sadly, the Canadian dollar is not worth as much as the American dollar. There’s nothing sad or bad about it. Currency and money are different concepts. The Japanese yen is only worth one Canadian penny; that doesn’t mean Japan is one hundred times poorer. ---
**Author:** ![PhillyGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ed655f/32.png) [@PhillyGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PhillyGuy)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2025, 2:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-united-states-declares-economic-war-on-canada/1013734/939 "2025-03-18T02:01:42Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > The President CAN start a war on his own; it’s quite clearly spelled out in the War Powers Resolution of 1973. . . . > And of course, it’s been done. Grenada, for example, or Kosovo. I agree that, legally and practically, the U.S. President can start a war with Canada If Trump did it, it would be done purely because he wanted it done, without his being much pressured to do it by other countries or his party. This is abnormal. Wars rarely start just because one person wants one. So there was a NATO angle in Kosovo. And the Organization of Eastern Caribbean States pushed Reagan to invade Grenada. If Trump invaded Canada, there would be no other nation pushing him to do it. And there would be nothing like the chorus of liberal hawks who were pressuring Bush to invade Iraq. Instead, it would be the ultimate vindication of the great man theory of history, where a war was caused by one person. I almost totally disbelieve in the great man theory of war causation. I think wars are caused by economic, political, and ideological factors rather than one misguided man. That’s one reason I’m skeptical you will actually be invaded, but of course it is possible. P.S. The great man theory of history is extremely popular on the internet, so I do not except much agreement about that! ---
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2025, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-united-states-declares-economic-war-on-canada/1013734/940 "2025-03-18T03:09:12Z")
> [@PhillyGuy](#): > > If Trump did it, it would be done purely because he wanted it done, without his being much pressured to do it by other countries or his party. This is abnormal. Trump is abnormal. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-united-states-declares-economic-war-on-canada/1013734.md?page=46) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-united-states-declares-economic-war-on-canada/1013734.md?page=48)