# The voter ID Thread **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [May 24, 2017, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-voter-id-thread/787346 "2017-05-24T15:57:21Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 12:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-voter-id-thread/787346/201 "2017-09-14T12:45:38Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > What specific state’s laws trouble you, then? > > In general, states offer some way of waiving or working around that requirement. If you give me an example of a state that does not, I’ll be happy to look into it, and if there is no such path, I will likely oppose it. Alabama’s requirements trouble me – IIRC, they offered free IDs, but closed tons of the ID issuing offices in majority non-white areas. The North Carolina law that was struck down by the courts due to targeting African Americans greatly troubled me. IIRC, you supported those requirements, even though they were later struck down, and SCOTUS allowed the decision to stand. Those are a few off the top of my head. ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 1:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-voter-id-thread/787346/202 "2017-09-14T13:11:44Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > _sigh_ > > In debate, an assertion made without rebuttal (even if the rhetor declares it’s “not worthy” of rebuttal) is known as a _gratuitous assertion_, and the rule is that it may be equally gratuitously denied. Therefore: nuh uh. I don’t think I can respond to this in a manner that is both worthy and reasonable outside the pit. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 1:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-voter-id-thread/787346/203 "2017-09-14T13:14:55Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Alabama’s requirements trouble me – IIRC, they offered free IDs, but closed tons of the ID issuing offices in majority non-white areas. > > The North Carolina law that was struck down by the courts due to targeting African Americans greatly troubled me. IIRC, you supported those requirements, even though they were later struck down, and SCOTUS allowed the decision to stand. > > Those are a few off the top of my head. My overarching approach to these laws is that I respect the process that enacts them. This process includes judicial review, as well as voter reaction to the laws. (And, indeed, I have long argued that any change to voting laws should be effective only after at least one intervening election, to allow the existing rules about voter qualification to effectively endorse any changes.) With this in mind, I’m fine with North Carolina’s outcome. I supported the law, but I also supported the judicial review, and the decision by Roy Cooper (newly elected Democratic governor) to withdraw the appeal. The voters spoke; they elected Cooper, and one consequence of that was that the state decided to no longer appeal the Fourth Circuit’s decision. Now, Alabama. There’s at least one permanent location in each county to obtain the free ID: County Address Phone Autauga 218 N. Court Street Prattville, Alabama 36067-3041 (334) 358-6740 Baldwin 119 West 2nd St Bay Minette, Alabama 36507 (251) 937-0229 Barbour 113 Court Street Clayton, Alabama 36016 (334) 775-8579 (334) 687-1585 Barbour 303 E Broad Street, Room 108 Eufaula, Alabama 36027 (334) 687-1585 Bibb 8 Court Square W Centreville, Alabama 35042 (205) 926-3102 Blount 220 Second Ave E Rm B-5 Oneonta, Alabama 35121 (205) 625-4182 Bullock 217 Prairie St N, Room 101 Union Springs, Alabama 36089-1659 (334) 738-5372 Butler 700 Court Sq Rm 8 Greenville, Alabama 36037-2308 (334) 382-5685 Calhoun 1702 Noble St, Ste 113 Anniston, Alabama 36201-3889 (256) 241-2930 (256) 237-3681 Chambers 18 Alabama Ave E Rm 101 LaFayette, Alabama 36862 (334) 864-4313 Chambers 610 S Gilmer Ave Lanett, Alabama 36863 (334) 644-7781 Cherokee 260 Cedar Bluff Rd, Suite 106 Centre, Alabama 35960-1403 (256) 927-5336 Chilton 500 2nd Ave N Rm 119 Clanton, Alabama 35045 (205) 755-3820 Choctaw 117 S Mulberry Ave, Suite 1 Butler, Alabama 36904-2557 (205) 459-2531 Clarke 114 Court St Grove Hill, Alabama 36451 (251) 275-3062 Clay 1 Courthouse Square, 1st Floor Ashland, Alabama 36251 (256) 354-7815 Cleburne 120 Vickery Street, Room 103 Heflin, Alabama 36264-1166 (256) 463-5299 Coffee 6 County Complex New Brockton, Alabama 36351-9791 (334) 894-5347 Colbert 201 N Main Street Tuscumbia, Alabama 35674-2095 (256) 386-8535 Conecuh 200 Court Street, Room 224 Evergreen, Alabama 36401 (251) 578-7024 Coosa 9709 US Hwy 231 Rockford, Alabama 35136 (256) 377-2418 Covington 228 Hillcrest Drive Andalusia, Alabama 36420-2570 (334) 428-2685 Crenshaw 29 S Glenwood Ave Luverne, Alabama 36049 (334) 335-6568 Ext. 252 Cullman 500 2nd Ave SW, Suite 112 Cullman, Alabama 35055-4135 (256) 739-3530 Ext. 9 Dale 100 Court Square Ozark, Alabama 36360 (334) 774-9038 Dallas 105 Lauderdale St Rm 122 Selma, Alabama 36701 (334) 874-2534 DeKalb 111 Grand Ave SW, Suite 105 Fort Payne, Alabama 35967 (256) 845-8598 Elmore 100 E Commerce Street, Room 205 Wetumpka, Alabama 36092-2746 (334) 567-1150 (334) 567-1197 Escambia 301 Belleville Ave Rm 204 Brewton, Alabama 36426 (251) 867-0243 Etowah 800 Forrest Ave, Suite 206 Gadsden, Alabama 35901-3651 (256) 549-5384 Fayette 103 First Ave NW, Suite 4 Fayette, Alabama 35555-2627 (205) 932-5432 Franklin 410 Jackson Ave North Russellville, Alabama 35653 (256) 332-8849 Geneva 200 N. Commerce Street Geneva, Alabama 36340 (334) 684-5655 Greene 110 Main Street Eutaw, Alabama 35443 (205) 372-9669 Hale 905D Centerville Street Greensboro, Alabama 36744-1536 (334) 624-4672 Henry 101 Court Square Ste K Abbeville, Alabama 36310-2135 (334) 585-6080 Houston 462 N Oates Dothan, Alabama 36303 (334) 677-4776 Jackson 102 E Laurel St Scottsboro, Alabama 35768 (256) 574-9339 Jefferson 716 Richard Arrington Jr Blvd N, Ste A-410 Birmingham, Alabama 35203-0115 (205) 325-5550 Lamar 44690 Hwy 17 Vernon, Alabama 35592 (205) 695-6348 Lauderdale 200 South Court Street Florence, Alabama 35630 (256) 760-5840 Lawrence 14451 Market Street Ste 340 Moulton, Alabama 35650 (256) 974-2460 Lee 215 S 9th St Opelika, Alabama 36801 (334) 737-3635 Limestone 100 Clinton Street S., Suite E Athens, Alabama 35611-2665 (256) 233-6405 Lowndes 205 Tuskeena St E Rm 101 Hayneville, Alabama 36040 (334) 548-2389 (334) 548-2080 Macon 101 Rosa Parks Ave Ste 100 Tuskegee, Alabama 36083-1735 (334) 724-2617 Madison 819 Cook Avenue, NW, Suite 150 Huntsville, Alabama 35801-5983 (256) 532-3510 Marengo 101 E Coats Ave Linden, Alabama 36748 (334) 295-2249 Marion 132 Military Street South Hamilton, Alabama 35570 (205) 921-3625 Marshall 424 Blount Ave Ste 106A Guntersville, Alabama 35976-1122 (256) 571-7740 Mobile 151 Government St Ste 165 Mobile, Alabama 36602 (251) 574-8586 Monroe 65 N. Alabama Ave. Monroeville, Alabama 36460 (251) 743-4107 Ext. 141 Montgomery 100 S Lawrence St. Montgomery, Alabama 36104 (334) 832-1215 Morgan 302 Lee St NE Decatur, Alabama 35601 (256) 351-4660 Perry 300 Washington Street Ste 102 Marion, Alabama 36756 (334) 683-2218 Pickens 155 Reform Street, Suite 303 Carrollton, Alabama 35447 (205) 367-2071 Pike 120 W Church Street, Room B2 Troy, Alabama 36081-1913 (334) 566-1757 Randolph 2 First Street NE Wedowee, Alabama 36278 (256) 357-2138 Russell 1000 Broad St Phenix City, Alabama 36867 (334) 298-1443 Shelby 108 W College Street Ste 100 Columbiana, Alabama 35051 (205) 669-3913 St. Clair 1815 Cogswell Ave Ste B-25 Pell City, Alabama 35125 (205) 338-3954 Sumter 311 S Washington St Livingston, Alabama 35470 (205) 652-7902 Talladega 1 Courthouse Square Talladega, Alabama 35160 (256) 761-2132 (256) 761-2131 Talladega 400 N Norton Avenue Sylacauga, Alabama 35150-2010 (256) 249-1007 Tallapoosa 125 N Broadnax St Rm 20 Dadeville, Alabama 36853-1371 (256) 825-1081 Tuscaloosa 2501 7th St Ste 200 Tuscaloosa, Alabama 35401-1801 (205) 349-3870 Ext. 415 Walker 1803 3rd Ave Ste 109A Jasper, Alabama 35501 (205) 384-7279 Washington 45 Court St. Chatom, Alabama 36558 (251) 847-3255 Wilcox 219 Claiborne St Camden, Alabama 36726 (334) 682-9753 Winston 11 Blake Dr Rm 3 Double Springs, Alabama 35553 (205) 489-3966 In addition, Alabama has mobile units that visit other locations to provide the IDs. Alabama residents may provide the following forms of ID in order to get a Voter ID: [ul] [li]A student ID issued by a public or private high school[/li][li]A student or employee ID card issued by a private university or postgraduate technical or professional school located OUTSIDE the state of Alabama[/li][li]An employee ID card NOT issued by a branch, department, agency, or entity of the US government, the State of Alabama, or any county, municipality, board, authority, or entity of the State of Alabama[/li][li]Hospital/nursing home ID card[/li][li]Wholesale club or other membership card[/li][li]Birth Certificate [/li][li]Hospital or nursing home record[/li][li]Marriage Record [/li][li]State or Federal Census Record[/li][li]Military Record[/li][li]Medicare or Medicaid document[/li][li]Social Security Administration Document[/li][li]Certificate of Citizenship[/li][li]Official school record or transcript[/ul][/li] I’m sorry, but I absolutely don’t share your concern that this scheme is unduly burdensome. And more importantly, I don’t believe that the vast majority of observers in the country would, either. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 1:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-voter-id-thread/787346/204 "2017-09-14T13:30:32Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > I’m sorry, but I absolutely don’t share your concern that this scheme is unduly burdensome. And more importantly, I don’t believe that the vast majority of observers in the country would, either. Some of those counties are pretty damn large and spread out in terms of their population. When most of the closings were in blacker areas of the state, and considering Alabama’s really terrible history on voting rights, skepticism seems entirely warranted. I’m glad you’ve changed your mind on the NC laws. IIRC our discussions from about a year ago, you felt pretty differently than. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-voter-id-thread/787346/205 "2017-09-14T14:26:24Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Some of those counties are pretty damn large and spread out in terms of their population. When most of the closings were in blacker areas of the state, and considering Alabama’s really terrible history on voting rights, skepticism seems entirely warranted. > > I’m glad you’ve changed your mind on the NC laws. IIRC our discussions from about a year ago, you felt pretty differently than. Not really. What I was defending then was the process as much as the result. If the process in a given state results in the lack of any voter ID laws, I’m fine with that: it means that our representative democracy has spoken. I, myself, would favor a scheme slightly less tainted than North Carolina’s was, but I don’t regard my opinion - as brilliant as it always is - as a good substitute for representative democratic results. However, I don’t see the same respect accorded to outcomes that favor Voter ID coming from man of my esteemed interlocutors. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-voter-id-thread/787346/206 "2017-09-14T14:31:34Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > This is where the difference in opinion lies. In my understanding, most of the laws that have been criticized on this board do not “provide a free ID to those who need it and a way to waive the requirement in edge cases”. Do you still support laws that require a photo ID, but provide no assistance to those without them, or those older folks who might have serious difficulty in getting them (i.e. no birth certificate)? See post #155 as of yet still unanswered. Seems like the Dems would rather bitch about Voter ID laws rather than going out and helping people get IDs. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-voter-id-thread/787346/207 "2017-09-14T14:33:30Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > I, myself, would favor a scheme slightly less tainted than North Carolina’s was, but I don’t regard my opinion - as brilliant as it always is - as a good substitute for representative democratic results. When it comes to the same sorts of representative democratic processes that resulted in Jim Crow, segregation, and similar things (and based on the “targeting” of African American voters from this latest round, I think it qualifies as a lesser version of those oppressive policies), I would greatly prefer your opinion (or mine). Or even better, a DOJ that takes this stuff seriously and adheres to the spirit of the VRA, including the pre-clearance requirements, and a SCOTUS that doesn’t pretend racism is no longer significant in order to get rid of those requirements. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-voter-id-thread/787346/208 "2017-09-14T14:35:21Z")
> [@Saint\_Cad](#): > > See post #155 as of yet still unanswered. Seems like the Dems would rather bitch about Voter ID laws rather than going out and helping people get IDs. Whether or not some Democrats in office may be hypocritical doesn’t affect my position at all. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-voter-id-thread/787346/209 "2017-09-14T15:04:36Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > When it comes to the same sorts of representative democratic processes that resulted in Jim Crow, segregation, and similar things (and based on the “targeting” of African American voters from this latest round, I think it qualifies as a lesser version of those oppressive policies), I would greatly prefer your opinion (or mine). Or even better, a DOJ that takes this stuff seriously and adheres to the spirit of the VRA, including the pre-clearance requirements, and a SCOTUS that doesn’t pretend racism is no longer significant in order to get rid of those requirements. But this is my central point: while you may prefer it, your preferences can’t be the way we run the state, or the country, unless King II Andy IIII is to be crowned. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-voter-id-thread/787346/210 "2017-09-14T15:11:14Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Whether or not some Democrats in office may be hypocritical doesn’t affect my position at all. Maybe not but at least call them out for thier part in this (inaction in getting people IDs) like you call out the Pubs. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-voter-id-thread/787346/211 "2017-09-14T15:11:54Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > But this is my central point: while you may prefer it, your preferences can’t be the way we run the state, or the country, unless King II Andy IIII is to be crowned. The political processes that allowed Jim Crow and segregation should be equally as anathema, IMO. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 3:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-voter-id-thread/787346/212 "2017-09-14T15:12:56Z")
> [@Saint\_Cad](#): > > Maybe not but at least call them out for thier part in this (inaction in getting people IDs) like you call out the Pubs. Okay: any Democrats who are being hypocritical and not trying to help people get IDs are wrong, and should stop being hypocritical, and start working to help voters get IDs. ---
**Author:** ![gatorslap](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bb73d2/32.png) [@gatorslap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gatorslap)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-voter-id-thread/787346/213 "2017-09-14T16:11:36Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > The most recent news is that the Fifth Circuit kept Texas’ law in place for the upcoming elections. Only after it was amended. Do you disagree with the necessity of that amendment? Your support for voter ID laws has been in the general. You ask others to cite specific laws, but you don’t want to make distinctions yourself. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 5:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-voter-id-thread/787346/214 "2017-09-14T17:04:11Z")
Don’t you dare denigrate the Counselor’s grasp of specifics! Don’t you do it, nosir! Did you see that research he performed, that exhaustive list of county offices? Who else would go to that much trouble, track down each and every one like that? So, no one can say that counties in Alabama don’t have county offices, because they do! Each and every one! Boy, he sure nailed that one to the wall! And what effort, what persistance, what dedication! Somebody else might have just found a list somewhere and tormented the hamsters by cutting and pasting it, as if it proved something! But not our **Bricker** , nosiree Bob! No such slapdash half-measures for a point so important, so definitive, so _dispositive_! When it comes to proving such a crucial point, he gets it _done!_ ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-voter-id-thread/787346/215 "2017-09-14T17:18:50Z")
> [@Saint\_Cad](#): > > Maybe not but at least call them out for thier part in this (inaction in getting people IDs) like you call out the Pubs. Wouldn’t it be more efficient to try to get the law struck down instead of trying to help citizens jump through the hoop the law creates? Besides, let’s say Democrats go all-out and throw maximum effort at getting IDs to as many citizens as possible, and the Republicans add _another_ hoop-jump, i.e. “it turns out the IDs we specified were too easy to get and we heard a rumor about this guy somewhere who had a fake ID and might have affected an ultra-sooper-dooper-califragilooper-close election, so now we’re adding an extra requirement, in the name of voter confidence.” Of course, if the voters keep returning these guys to office, my sympathy for the voters begins to wane. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-voter-id-thread/787346/216 "2017-09-14T17:30:41Z")
Can we take a moment to gasp with wonder and admiration at the work undertaken by the Presidential Commission on voter integrity? A moment should be all we will need. > **[Kris Kobach Says New Hampshire Is Suffering From Mass Vote Fraud. This Judge...](https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2017/09/kris-kobach-says-new-hampshire-is-suffering-from-mass-vote-fraud-this-judge-says-no.html)** > > The court’s order constituted an oblique rebuke to the “election integrity” commission’s very purpose. > [@](#): > > Last week, Kansas Secretary of State Kris Kobach wrote a column for Breitbart in which he asserted that more than 5,000 people voted fraudulently in New Hampshire in the 2016 election, enough to sway the state’s tight Senate race and perhaps even its presidential election results. “It has long been reported, anecdotally, that out-of-staters take advantage of New Hampshire’s same-day registration and head to the Granite State to cast fraudulent votes,” Kobach wrote. “Now there’s proof.”… Alas, no. Oopsy-daisy! No, there isn’t. Because “Kansas City” Kurt Knoblick can’t read. The election laws of the Grunt State don’t say what he thinks it says. Darn! So _close!_ > [@](#): > > …But the column likely pleased President Trump, who lost the state’s 4 electoral votes to Hillary Clinton and alleged “serious voter fraud” there in late November. He later privately complained to members of Congress that “thousands” of people took buses in from Massachusetts to vote illegally in the state… Well, then, where did those buses come from? There are only a few companies that rent out buses for long tours and such, how hard would it have been to contact them, even just the ones in Massachusetts? Check the records for buses rented on New Hampshire election day. You might wonder why they didn’t. You may. Or you can assume that they already knew it never happened, and just hoped to get away with it. Or that they are stupid. Or think we are. And while we’re about it, anybody believe this thunderstorm of bullshit? That three to five million illegal votes account for HRC’s popular vote win? Don’t be afraid, don’t hold back, step right up and declare “I believe it, and I would lose a game of tic-tac-toe to a chicken!” (Not actually asking **Bricker,** pretty sure the boy ain’t that dumb. Nobody could create such complex rationalizations as he without a keen mind honed by a Jesuit education!) And they are not done, not by a long shot! Who knows what revelations may be presented, as soon as they hire somebody who can read! We wait with bated breath, and “the calm confidence of a Methodist with four aces”. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-voter-id-thread/787346/217 "2017-09-14T17:45:19Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > Wouldn’t it be more efficient to try to get the law struck down instead of trying to help citizens jump through the hoop the law creates? Nope and I’ll tell you why. As I have said repeatedly in these threads, photo ID (especially given the Patriot Act) is practically a requirement these days. A responsible government (I’m thinking at the county level) should be helping all of its residents photo ID for everyday purposes. I also believe that we live in 2017 and that we should not be using antiquated methods for establishing identities. Why can’t my current county access records from other counties such as birth, marriage, property ownership, voting records, etc. Secondly, the law itself is not a bad law. There are others that are far worst. You don’t have to prove citizenship so theoretically every illegal immigrant 18 or older could pinky-promise tomorrow they are citizens and register to vote. In Washington State, a poll worker can mark a ballot indicating how they think the voter [del]should have[/del] voted. There is evidence that Democratic poll workers in King County gave the governorship to Christine Gregoire by defacing ballots yet I didn’t here Dems yelling about fundamental voting rights and stolen elections and election fraud then. So no, when counties get steamrolled by voting machine manufacturers and accept hackable machines with no paper trail, when I myself have experience going to my polling place and seeing someone who has already signed in as me and voted as me, when we have DoTs working on streets in urban areas on election day, when we have an absentee ballot system with no verification other than a signature (not even a PIN system) then I can’t really get worked up about 97 year-old Yvonne in the bayou who can’t make it to the Gumbo Parish county seat with her family Bible and two utility bills for her free ID. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-voter-id-thread/787346/218 "2017-09-14T17:49:05Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Alabama’s requirements trouble me – IIRC, they offered free IDs, but closed tons of the ID issuing offices in majority non-white areas. Colorado is worse. You have to go to your local county office to do anything involving cars or licenses or ID. Yesterday it took me 1 hour 50 minutes to get there from work to register my car and I made it with 6 minutes to spare. Anyone who has a 9-5 M-F hourly job (don’t work? you don’t get paid) who lives in a different county is completely fucked. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-voter-id-thread/787346/219 "2017-09-14T17:53:32Z")
> [@Saint\_Cad](#): > > ,There is evidence that Democratic poll workers in King County gave the governorship to Christine Gregoire by defacing ballots yet I didn’t here Dems yelling about fundamental voting rights and stolen elections and election fraud then… . Proof? That’s where the proof goes, right after the dots. Usually a link, something like that. You got, you bring. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-voter-id-thread/787346/220 "2017-09-14T17:54:17Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Perhaps a common reaction to your cunning plan would be for people to ask, “What laws, specifically?” > > It seems to me that at this point your plan hits what might be described in literary circles as a ‘snag.’ Whatever law you care to imagine. Since this business of illegal voting being an issue worth worrying about is a phantom, all that’s needed is for right-wing worrywarts to be _told_ everything’s fine now and they can vote in what you deem to be the appropriate emotional state. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-voter-id-thread/787346.md?page=10) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-voter-id-thread/787346.md?page=12)