# The Walking Dead; 2.12 "Better Angels" (open spoilers) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [March 12, 2012, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-12-better-angels-open-spoilers/615502 "2012-03-12T00:25:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 14
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2012, 2:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-12-better-angels-open-spoilers/615502/262 "2012-03-14T02:17:02Z")
> [@Folacin](#): > > Glenn’s proven his worth with his scouting/scavenging, but the episode in the alley (and driving the car with the alarm on all the way back from Atlanta in season 1) shows that he isn’t yet a hardened survivor. He’s Zombie Bait. Maggie said so. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Not\_From\_Here](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/2acd7d/32.png) [@Not\_From\_Here](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Not_From_Here)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2012, 2:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-12-better-angels-open-spoilers/615502/263 "2012-03-14T02:38:28Z")
i think that they should use this last episode to get rid of all annoying characters (specially Lori). The new season should start only with Rick, Glenn, Maggie, Andrea and Darryl. ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2012, 2:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-12-better-angels-open-spoilers/615502/264 "2012-03-14T02:40:32Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > Aside from Maggie and Glenn, and maybe Andrea and Daryl… I have to admit caring less and less if this group gets massacred - they’re too determinedly self-destructive. This is a creeping sentiment that all of us that are watching the show are feeling, I think. Everyone has their favorite characters…but at the end of the day I don’t think you can argue that “our group” had a hell of a more cohesive feel to it earlier in the show’s run up to now. Of course, that’s kinda the point/arc of the story, you’d say. But I think \*\*Ekers \*\*here is hitting on something. The fragmentation/deaths of the group members is seriously changing the dynamic of the story. I know, Captain Obvious and all that…but its just starting to feel a little weird watching this show, actually rooting for some characters to just die already, when in the 1st season I was rooting for the entire group to survive. Anyway, upon re-read, nevermind it. All obvious bullshit. ---
**Author:** ![Fubaya](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c2a13f/32.png) [@Fubaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fubaya)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2012, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-12-better-angels-open-spoilers/615502/265 "2012-03-14T02:41:34Z")
> [@simster](#): > > The person who just re-watched it will likely be along to correct us - but I recall Randal going one direction and Shane going straight - since his gun was drawn, I think his first inclination was to shoot the ‘runaway’. They both went the same direction. Shane stuck the pistol in his pants, turned and looked around (presumably to make sure no one was around), stepped behind the tree Randall had just stepped behind and we hear “Ah..” Snap. Slump. He then came back in front of the camera and looked around some more to make sure no one saw him, looked at the tree and face-butted it. ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2012, 3:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-12-better-angels-open-spoilers/615502/266 "2012-03-14T03:06:02Z")
> [@Fubaya](#): > > They both went the same direction. Shane stuck the pistol in his pants, turned and looked around (presumably to make sure no one was around), stepped behind the tree Randall had just stepped behind and we hear “Ah..” Snap. Slump. He then came back in front of the camera and looked around some more to make sure no one saw him, looked at the tree and face-butted it. Yep, that’s exactly correct. ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2012, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-12-better-angels-open-spoilers/615502/267 "2012-03-14T04:09:22Z")
> [@simster](#): > > I didn’t mean there was a doubt that Shane did the neck breaking - only that we were not shown it on screen - kid falls - no noises (as if that was the death itself) - Shane gets wood - I know the writers of the show wanted the neck break/shane’s reveal to be later in the episode - but there was no doubt what was going to happen. > > Just prior to Randall falling - Shane had his gun drawn - so, I don’t think breaking his neck was his initial plan. > > This was specifically talked about in season one in the Atlanta rest home. I would just like to say that if we are to accept the premise that something _in the brain_ reanimates the dead and allows them to be mobile, logically consistency requires that people who die of a severed or otherwise catastrophically damaged spinal cord would still awaken, but the zombie signals would not travel down the destroyed spinal cord and they would be quadraplegic zombies. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2012, 4:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-12-better-angels-open-spoilers/615502/268 "2012-03-14T04:20:51Z")
> [@Stoid](#): > > I would just like to say that if we are to accept the premise that something _in the brain_ reanimates the dead and allows them to be mobile, logically consistency requires that people who die of a severed or otherwise catastrophically damaged spinal cord would still awaken, but the zombie signals would not travel down the destroyed spinal cord and they would be quadraplegic zombies. Thank you.🙂 Does a broken neck automatically = a severed spinal cord though? 😕 Or could Shane have just strangled Randel? ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2012, 4:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-12-better-angels-open-spoilers/615502/269 "2012-03-14T04:39:17Z")
> [@Fubaya](#): > > They both went the same direction. Shane stuck the pistol in his pants, turned and looked around (presumably to make sure no one was around), stepped behind the tree Randall had just stepped behind and we hear “Ah..” Snap. Slump. He then came back in front of the camera and looked around some more to make sure no one saw him, looked at the tree and face-butted it. Damn good thing I’m not an eye witness for a court case - thanks for the clarifications. ---
**Author:** ![Fubaya](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c2a13f/32.png) [@Fubaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fubaya)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2012, 4:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-12-better-angels-open-spoilers/615502/270 "2012-03-14T04:58:39Z")
> [@simster](#): > > Damn good thing I’m not an eye witness for a court case - thanks for the clarifications. Me either, but I save episodes and put them on my server so I can watch them on tv or computer. As long as I’m reading the thread on the computer, I can look up the scene in a few seconds. ---
**Author:** ![Scupper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b9bd4f/32.png) [@Scupper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scupper)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2012, 7:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-12-better-angels-open-spoilers/615502/271 "2012-03-14T07:19:06Z")
> [@Stoid](#): > > I would just like to say that if we are to accept the premise that something _in the brain_ reanimates the dead and allows them to be mobile, logically consistency requires that people who die of a severed or otherwise catastrophically damaged spinal cord would still awaken, but the zombie signals would not travel down the destroyed spinal cord and they would be quadraplegic zombies. There is nothing that indicates spinal injuries are any more effective than anything else in disabling walkers. Apart from their incredibly fragile brains – a blow to the side of the head with the flat of a shovel will kill one, no problem – walkers seem to be more or less completely compartmentalized. The “virus” causes walkers to develop incredible powers of regeneration to counteract their own decomposition and somehow provides energy for their muscles to operate. We’ve seen walkers with exposed intestines and shredded internal organs that seem to be pretty much unaffected by their injuries. They eat, but they don’t seem to need to eat. They maintain senses of hearing, sight, and smell despite advanced decomposition. They can maintain balance and a bipedal gait, and enough strength to single-handedly overpower and tear open the gut of a full-grown cow. The “zombie signals” might not even travel along neural pathways at all. Upon death, it’s possible within the context of the show that the dormant virus explodes into life within the new corpse, instantly suffusing its tissues and directing the hijacked brain’s instructions via microscopic structures laid down by the virus itself. I doubt there’s any answer other than “it’s magic” that could stand up to any logical scrutiny. They are fantasy monsters, not something that science could explain. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2012, 2:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-12-better-angels-open-spoilers/615502/272 "2012-03-14T14:02:23Z")
> [@Fubaya](#): > > Me either, but I save episodes and put them on my server so I can watch them on tv or computer. What hardware and software do you use for that, Fubaya? ---
**Author:** ![IvoryTowerDenizen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ivorytowerdenizen/32/17937_2.png) [@IvoryTowerDenizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IvoryTowerDenizen)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2012, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-12-better-angels-open-spoilers/615502/273 "2012-03-14T15:33:57Z")
> [@Scupper](#): > > I doubt there’s any answer other than “it’s magic” that could stand up to any logical scrutiny. They are fantasy monsters, not something that science could explain. I know I don’t want to go down the “midichlorians” route and try to explain something that should be accepted for what it is- fantastical and outside the realm of normal possibility. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2012, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-12-better-angels-open-spoilers/615502/274 "2012-03-14T15:54:36Z")
I’ve been amused by Cracked’s articles on: [5 Scientific Reasons a Zombie Apocalypse Could Actually Happen](http://www.cracked.com/article_15643_5-scientific-reasons-zombie-apocalypse-could-actually-happen.html) and [7 Scientific Reasons a Zombie Outbreak Would Fail (Quickly)](http://www.cracked.com/article_18683_7-scientific-reasons-zombie-outbreak-would-fail-quickly.html) Among the reasons in the second article are that as slow, shambling humanoids with little agility and limited strength, they would be easily picked off by predators; they would quickly rot and fall apart in heat; they would quickly freeze and dehydrate in the cold; that infection spread only by direct contact does not spread very widely (this reason doesn’t seem to apply to this show); that their bodies don’t heal so any individual would be unlikely to be able to infect very many people before becoming immobile; they don’t have the intelligence or physical skill to overcome simple barriers to shambling movement; and that their prey have access to much better technology to destroy them as well as the physical ability to run circles around them. Of course none of these things apply to “fast zombies.” ---
**Author:** ![obfusciatrist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/4af34b/32.png) [@obfusciatrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/obfusciatrist)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2012, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-12-better-angels-open-spoilers/615502/275 "2012-03-14T16:16:34Z")
I’m bothered by the corpses in cars and don’t like the apparent official fanwank that all of those people beat themselves to death. Has this been mentioned as a possibility: [ul] [li]Georgia summer[/li][li]Traffic jam[/li][li]Zombie horde comes along forcing people to remain in their cars with the windows rolled up.[/li][li]Because zombies can see the people in the cards they never leave.[/li][li]Eventually people are no longer able to run their air conditioners.[/li][li]The greenhouse like heat in the car during a Georgia summer eventually fries the brains of everybody in the cars. [/li][li]This is sufficient brain damage to prevent re-animation.[/li][/ul] ---
**Author:** ![Tangent](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tangent/32/3098_2.png) [@Tangent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tangent)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2012, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-12-better-angels-open-spoilers/615502/276 "2012-03-14T17:13:44Z")
Are any of you listening to any _Walking Dead_ podcasts? Apparently this is one of the most “casted” television shows. None of my family or friends watch the show, and I like to hear other people’s opinions of each episode (which, of course, I also get from these Dope threads). I had been listening to one called _The Talking Dead_ (not affiliated with _Talking Dead_–the AMC aftershow hosted by Chris Hardwick), but the hosts started to annoy me with their speech mannerisms and their way of taking endless little verbal “loops” before finally getting to a point. They’re just too… _Canadian_. 🙂 Anyhow, there are several others available in iTunes and I’ve been checking a few of them out for the last couple of episodes. It’s interesting to see how much they differ. In some, they pretty much constantly praise the show while in others they are very critical. In some the hosts seem more polished and ‘professional’ and in others they seem a bit more rough around the edges. The more critical ones are still fans of the show, but they echo many of the sentiments we’ve expressed here about some of the sloppy writing and/or directing. So if any of you are listening to any _Walking Dead_ podcasts, I’d be interested in which ones and what your opinions of them are. ---
**Author:** ![Ellen\_Cherry](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellen_cherry/32/3600_2.png) [@Ellen\_Cherry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ellen_Cherry)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2012, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-12-better-angels-open-spoilers/615502/277 "2012-03-14T18:44:46Z")
I’ve been watching this series over the last several weeks (on Netflix and online) and just today caught up. I think I’ve been reading too much **Sampiro** or something, because every time I open one of these threads a soundtrack starts playing in my mind: \*Oh yes, oh yes, oh yes they both Oh yes, they both Oh yes, they both reached for The gun, the gun, the gun, the gun, Oh yes, they both reached for the gun for the gun. \* 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Shark\_Sandwich](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f04885/32.png) [@Shark\_Sandwich](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shark_Sandwich)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2012, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-12-better-angels-open-spoilers/615502/278 "2012-03-14T18:46:15Z")
Has anyone dissected the theory yet that Jenner whispered, “You’re still in a coma. This is all a dream,” to Rick? ---
**Author:** ![Ellen\_Cherry](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellen_cherry/32/3600_2.png) [@Ellen\_Cherry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ellen_Cherry)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2012, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-12-better-angels-open-spoilers/615502/279 "2012-03-14T18:59:09Z")
Ha. I think there’s no doubt that Jenner whispered to Rick that the zombug causes _any_ dead person to reanimate, because that’s one thing he is in a position to know: the behavior of the agent that causes zombification. He studied it, he knows its progression, and with this knowledge he decided to kill himself tomorrow. ---
**Author:** ![Scupper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b9bd4f/32.png) [@Scupper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scupper)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2012, 7:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-12-better-angels-open-spoilers/615502/280 "2012-03-14T19:00:54Z")
> [@Shark\_Sandwich](#): > > Has anyone dissected the theory yet that Jenner whispered, “You’re still in a coma. This is all a dream,” to Rick? Well, Rick’s reaction probably wouldn’t have been to keep such a thing a secret. More likely vocal denial, incredulity, etc. Not to mention the fact that the collected fanbase would march on the writers’ homes and string them up. ---
**Author:** ![Ellen\_Cherry](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellen_cherry/32/3600_2.png) [@Ellen\_Cherry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ellen_Cherry)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2012, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-12-better-angels-open-spoilers/615502/281 "2012-03-14T19:58:24Z")
Hey I just found out from my daughter, who has read nearly all the comics, that (spoiler for, literally, Page 1 only of the comic series) … [spoiler]… the comics begin in Cynthiana, Ky., and Rick travels to Atlanta based solely on the guy he meets in his town, who tells him that there was a survivor camp based there. Rick then proceeds southward, where he finds his wife and son, Shane and the rest. This seems more implausible to me than if the whole thing was set in Georgia, as the series seems to be. She also told me the comic creator is from Kentucky, where we live, so I’m super-duper thrilled to be at Zombie Central. 🙂 [/spoiler] This is screamingly minor and passes even my stringent no-spoiler rules. However, I box it for anyone who wishes to ignore the comics completely and considers their mere existence a spoiler. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-12-better-angels-open-spoilers/615502.md?page=13) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-12-better-angels-open-spoilers/615502.md?page=15)