# The Walking Dead; 2.13 "Beside the Dying Fire" SEASON FINALE (open spoilers) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [March 18, 2012, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-13-beside-the-dying-fire-season-finale-open-spoilers/616171 "2012-03-18T23:16:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![obfusciatrist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/4af34b/32.png) [@obfusciatrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/obfusciatrist)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2012, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-13-beside-the-dying-fire-season-finale-open-spoilers/616171/121 "2012-03-19T22:31:53Z")
The one defense of the group reaction to Rick’s admission I can think of is that for several of them they have to decide how much they believe him. Remember, Shane is the one who lead them, pretty comfortably, before Rick. And they mostly agreed with Shane’s position on things. And they weren’t seeing all the baby drama or what happened when they tried to release Randall or what Dale saw when Shane considered shooting Rick the first time. From a relatively uninformed point of view it wouldn’t be hard to see it as Rick kind of going off his rocker and taking out someone who kept questioning him on everything. ---
**Author:** ![joyfool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/df788c/32.png) [@joyfool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/joyfool)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2012, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-13-beside-the-dying-fire-season-finale-open-spoilers/616171/122 "2012-03-19T22:48:37Z")
Disregarding the motivations they supplied for Lori on The Talking Deaf and the fact that I can’t stand her, if I’d been in her shoes after Rick disclosed the Big Secret, I’d’ve been pissed for one simple reason… I’d been allowed to carry a baby who had no future as anything other than a zombie, no matter what. Yup, I’d pretty much punch him in the balls for that. ---
**Author:** ![coolbyrne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/bc79bd/32.png) [@coolbyrne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/coolbyrne)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2012, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-13-beside-the-dying-fire-season-finale-open-spoilers/616171/123 "2012-03-19T23:01:24Z")
> [@SykoSkotty](#): > > Just down the road?? Go watch it again - when the truck starts to sputter out of gas, Rick says “we’ve been running on red for an hour.” > > They were driving for several hours. How many miles do you think that equates to? So Andrea was running for as long as the rest were driving? Several hours? Don’t trust the change from night to day to tell you anything; this show plays fast and loose with passing time. Who’s to say the tanks were full anyway? Not one person from the farm even casually remembers this massive penitentiary? They’re standing outside, having nowhere to go, needing weapons and supplies, and not one person from Georgia, settling down for the night, wracking their brains trying to figure what the fuck to do, doesn’t think of the penitentiary? They don’t need to know the co-ordinates for the thing, but no one thinks, “Rick, you’re blathering on about how we need to find a place where we can be normal ad nauseum? I know there’s a prison around here.” Hell, considering the crowd Darryl likely hung around with, I’m surprised he didn’t know. Of course, maybe the loud “HUMANS HERE!” roar of his motorcycle engine numbed his brain. I know, I know, it’s a show about zombies. Doesn’t mean they can’t get little details (based in reality) done, though. ---
**Author:** ![AlsoNamedBort](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alsonamedbort/32/3213_2.png) [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2012, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-13-beside-the-dying-fire-season-finale-open-spoilers/616171/124 "2012-03-19T23:05:00Z")
> [@faithfool](#): > > Disregarding the motivations they supplied for Lori on The Talking Deaf and the fact that I can’t stand her, if I’d been in her shoes after Rick disclosed the Big Secret, I’d’ve been pissed for one simple reason… I’d been allowed to carry a baby who had no future as anything other than a zombie, no matter what. Yup, I’d pretty much punch him in the balls for that. That kind of silly. That’s like saying I have no future as anything other than a dead person. ---
**Author:** ![whole\_bean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/96bed5/32.png) [@whole\_bean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whole_bean)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2012, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-13-beside-the-dying-fire-season-finale-open-spoilers/616171/125 "2012-03-19T23:07:18Z")
> [@faithfool](#): > > Disregarding the motivations they supplied for Lori on The Talking Deaf and the fact that I can’t stand her, if I’d been in her shoes after Rick disclosed the Big Secret, I’d’ve been pissed for one simple reason… I’d been allowed to carry a baby who had no future as anything other than a zombie, no matter what. Yup, I’d pretty much punch him in the balls for that. Still don’t get this line of thinking. Currently every baby born has no future as anything other than a corpse, no matter what. Yet ladies keep on spitting 'em out. EDIT: scooped! ---
**Author:** ![whole\_bean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/96bed5/32.png) [@whole\_bean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whole_bean)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2012, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-13-beside-the-dying-fire-season-finale-open-spoilers/616171/126 "2012-03-19T23:09:54Z")
> [@coolbyrne](#): > > So Andrea was running for as long as the rest were driving? Several hours? Don’t trust the change from night to day to tell you anything; this show plays fast and loose with passing time. Who’s to say the tanks were full anyway? > > Not one person from the farm even casually remembers this massive penitentiary? They’re standing outside, having nowhere to go, needing weapons and supplies, and not one person from Georgia, settling down for the night, wracking their brains trying to figure what the fuck to do, doesn’t think of the penitentiary? They don’t need to know the co-ordinates for the thing, but no one thinks, “Rick, you’re blathering on about how we need to find a place where we can be normal ad nauseum? I know there’s a prison around here.” Hell, considering the crowd Darryl likely hung around with, I’m surprised he didn’t know. Of course, maybe the loud “HUMANS HERE!” roar of his motorcycle engine numbed his brain. > > I know, I know, it’s a show about zombies. Doesn’t mean they can’t get little details (based in reality) done, though. I have no problem levying criticism against this show, but this ain’t one. The prison is likley to either be overrun or full of pissed-off, hungry inmates. That’s not inviting. ---
**Author:** ![Scupper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b9bd4f/32.png) [@Scupper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scupper)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2012, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-13-beside-the-dying-fire-season-finale-open-spoilers/616171/127 "2012-03-19T23:19:15Z")
I’d have to say the prison doesn’t look particularly inviting either. ---
**Author:** ![coolbyrne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/bc79bd/32.png) [@coolbyrne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/coolbyrne)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2012, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-13-beside-the-dying-fire-season-finale-open-spoilers/616171/128 "2012-03-19T23:23:45Z")
> [@whole\_bean](#): > > I have no problem levying criticism against this show, but this ain’t one. The prison is likley to either be overrun or full of pissed-off, hungry inmates. That’s not inviting. Not necessarily. While we can’t account for how many zombies might be mulling about, considering one of the first things inmates do when all hell breaks loose is escape from prison, who knows how many people are left? And while it might not be a good idea in the long run, that’s never stopped these people from making questionable, snap decisions in the past. ---
**Author:** ![Christopher\_Robin\_Davies](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8dc957/32.png) [@Christopher\_Robin\_Davies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Christopher_Robin_Davies)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2012, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-13-beside-the-dying-fire-season-finale-open-spoilers/616171/129 "2012-03-19T23:28:23Z")
I watched the show for the first time yesterday and liked it. But that is not why I am posting today. I am posting because I have noticed while reading through this thread that many people here do not like the idea of a supernatural explanation for the existence of the walkers but instead prefer to think that it is an infection of some kind that started things off. Can I ask why this is? Thank you. ---
**Author:** ![Superdude](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/superdude/32/13450_2.png) [@Superdude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Superdude)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2012, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-13-beside-the-dying-fire-season-finale-open-spoilers/616171/130 "2012-03-19T23:31:56Z")
> [@Ellen\_Cherry](#): > > I know where the two big state prisons are in this state, and one federal prison, but I’m not sure if I’d been driving on back roads, I’d know where one of them was. The other two are plainly visible, one from a main road, and the other, [“The Castle on the Cumberland,”](http://www.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~kylyon/eddyvilleprisonviews.html) built in 1889, is now located on the bank of a lake. > > Gah. I just went back and watched video clips from the show and got a better look at the armless zombies. They’re even more horrific at a leisurely viewing. And I’d be willing to bet a substantial amount of money that my brother works at one of the prisons you’re referring to. He’s a correctional officer at Kentucky State Reformatory, in La Grange. Question I had last night, while watching the show: If the fetus dies before delivery, will it try to attack Laurie in utero, or will they actually have to deliver the baby first? When the show first started, I told **Girl Wonder** that someplace like a prison would be a good place to call home. After finding out that everyone will become a zombie after death, perhaps not. However, they would have food, guns and ammo. And many of the walkers would be caged up. It seems like it would be possible for a systematic sweep of the prison, easily picking off the walkers in their cells. ---
**Author:** ![Fubaya](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c2a13f/32.png) [@Fubaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fubaya)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2012, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-13-beside-the-dying-fire-season-finale-open-spoilers/616171/131 "2012-03-19T23:34:56Z")
> [@Ellen\_Cherry](#): > > At any rate, while I’m not exactly doubting **Fubaya** good work in creating the timeline, I think there are some leaps of time that aren’t strictly covered by what’s seen on the screen. It’s not _24_, after all. Did that series implant some expectation of this sort? The problem is that all the time is accounted for. When something happens at night at the end of an episode, the next episode starts out at breakfast and they’re asking “so what about that thing that happened last night?” The only instance of time that isn’t 100% solid is the “week” between finding Randall and trying to let him loose near the buses. I normally don’t care about time in shows but got interested when people asked about it to figure out whose baby Lori was carrying. I’ve only kept it up because no one else is doing it and questions arise from time to time. I assumed the show would have some ambiguous time that would make it futile, but they keep nailing down the timeline in the show. If they start out series 3 with them having been in the prison for weeks, the timeline is out the window. But I bet they start out with them waking up from their camping spot and finding the prison, then in the next episode waking up after their first night there, etc. ---
**Author:** ![Scupper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b9bd4f/32.png) [@Scupper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scupper)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2012, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-13-beside-the-dying-fire-season-finale-open-spoilers/616171/132 "2012-03-19T23:43:45Z")
Fubaya, is there no time gap available for the kid to recover from his massive gunshot wound? That, and Randall’s ridiculously fast recovery, have been bothering me a lot. ---
**Author:** ![Scupper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b9bd4f/32.png) [@Scupper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scupper)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2012, 11:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-13-beside-the-dying-fire-season-finale-open-spoilers/616171/133 "2012-03-19T23:49:14Z")
> [@Christopher\_Robin\_Davies](#): > > I watched the show for the first time yesterday and liked it. But that is not why I am posting today. I am posting because I have noticed while reading through this thread that many people here do not like the idea of a supernatural explanation for the existence of the walkers but instead prefer to think that it is an infection of some kind that started things off. Can I ask why this is? Thank you. The show’s premise is that it is caused by a virus. This has been explicitly shown. The question of how a virus could do anything like what it does without a supernatural component is best not dwelt upon. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2012, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-13-beside-the-dying-fire-season-finale-open-spoilers/616171/134 "2012-03-20T00:11:53Z")
> [@DianaG](#): > > I don’t disagree, although Rick and Shane are more likely than most to know. My point is that even if they knew it was there, they have no reason to believe that it’s anything other than a deathtrap. After all, prisons are generally overcrowded and designed to keep IN much cleverer things than walkers. > [@Superdude](#): > > \ > When the show first started, I told **Girl Wonder** that someplace like a prison would be a good place to call home. After finding out that everyone will become a zombie after death, perhaps not. However, they would have food, guns and ammo. And many of the walkers would be caged up. It seems like it would be possible for a systematic sweep of the prison, easily picking off the walkers in their cells. Good points from both of you; I can see the prison starting as being full of zombies, but it could be fairly easy to clean out if the remaining zombies are locked in cells. It could be a good place to stay, too, since (theoretically) they could disable the regular locks and just lock themselves into their individual cells each night, so anyone dying in their sleep would not be able to get out. > [@Christopher\_Robin\_Davies](#): > > I watched the show for the first time yesterday and liked it. But that is not why I am posting today. I am posting because I have noticed while reading through this thread that many people here do not like the idea of a supernatural explanation for the existence of the walkers but instead prefer to think that it is an infection of some kind that started things off. Can I ask why this is? Thank you. I can only speak for myself; I wouldn’t have a problem with a supernatural show, but that isn’t what we’ve gotten so far - we’ve gotten a show where something has gone horribly wrong, but it is a man-made disaster as far as we know, and I think it would feel like too big a change in gears to go from a man-made disaster to a supernatural one. ---
**Author:** ![Ellen\_Cherry](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellen_cherry/32/3600_2.png) [@Ellen\_Cherry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ellen_Cherry)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2012, 12:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-13-beside-the-dying-fire-season-finale-open-spoilers/616171/135 "2012-03-20T00:14:42Z")
Hey Superdude! Yep. I just drove by there a couple weeks ago. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2012, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-13-beside-the-dying-fire-season-finale-open-spoilers/616171/136 "2012-03-20T00:15:49Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > That’s basically the premise of every zombie story ever… [Fido](http://akas.imdb.com/title/tt0457572/) was a pretty funny example of a functional society risen from the aftermath of a Romero-style zombie apocalypse. I’m not away of any dramatic attemps to show this in film, but I’ve read plenty of fan fiction that does a pretty good job. WWZ does as well. Some group on this show is organized enough to operate aircraft on a regular basis. It’d might just be a larger survivor group; there might actually be some kind of government left functioning. It’d be a really interesting development if the group were to say get their hands on a shortwave radio, and realize that Australia still has it’s act together or that the federal government has relocated to Hawaii & abandoned everything east of the Rockies. > [@shijinn](#): > > 2 weeks on the farm?! it felt like months - they had even talked about settling down and raising a baby! The vauge timeline is one of the biggest problems with this show. Sometimes it takes multiple episodes to cover a single day, other times weeks appear to pass, but everyone acts like it’s only been a few days. The characterization is all over the map. Most of the zombies look like they’re in advanced states of decomposition, but they aren’t as rotted as normal corpses would be so whatever’s reanimating them must also slow the decomp process though not as much as in the Living Dead films. > [@Squooshed](#): > > …When we watched the show, we thought the revelation there was that Lori had turned to Team Shane. After urging Rick to finish him off, and seeing Rick still fail to act, Lori had decided her life and her children’s lives were better protected by Shane. So, she went to Shane and told him in effect that they could be together again like the big happy family they were before Rick showed up. Then, when Rick wins the big fight, she recoils from him because **the wrong guy won the duel** … I think it makes alot more sense for Lori to have been on Shane’s side and upset that Rick won that vice versa. ---
**Author:** ![obfusciatrist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/4af34b/32.png) [@obfusciatrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/obfusciatrist)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2012, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-13-beside-the-dying-fire-season-finale-open-spoilers/616171/137 "2012-03-20T00:51:17Z")
I have no problem with them not knowing the prison is there, for most of the reasons stated above. I do have a problem that apparently nobody has picked up a Thomas guide for Georgia. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2012, 12:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-13-beside-the-dying-fire-season-finale-open-spoilers/616171/138 "2012-03-20T00:54:55Z")
> [@Christopher\_Robin\_Davies](#): > > I watched the show for the first time yesterday and liked it. But that is not why I am posting today. I am posting because I have noticed while reading through this thread that many people here do not like the idea of a supernatural explanation for the existence of the walkers but instead prefer to think that it is an infection of some kind that started things off. Can I ask why this is? Thank you. Personally, I would be disappointed by a supernatural explanation, for many of the same reasons that I was disappointed by the supernatural endings to _Battlestar Galactica_ and _Lost_: 1. In our modern world, a supernatural cause is less frightening than a scientific one, because it’s easier for us to imagine something like this actually happening. If it turns out to be supernatural, that robs the story of its power, because we know it’s merely fantasy. 2. A supernatural cause is less interesting than a scientific one. It offers fewer moral, ethical, and logistical dilemmas, problems, and puzzles. 3. A supernatural cause has become so clichéd that it’s really kind of lazy. It’s too easy to say “a wizard it it.” It ruins the storytelling process and the mystery. It cheapens all the tension and care that we give the plot and the characters. 4. A supernatural cause is a kind of deus ex machina. 5. The story as it has been set up has prepared us for there to be a scientific explanation rather than a supernatural one. Presented with problems and mysteries and questions that seem unsolvable makes us expect a really good rationalistic explanation. It makes us think that the writers are working hard to really come up with a good answer to the questions. ---
**Author:** ![TBG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c89c15/32.png) [@TBG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TBG)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2012, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-13-beside-the-dying-fire-season-finale-open-spoilers/616171/139 "2012-03-20T01:17:03Z")
> [@obfusciatrist](#): > > Though just had a thought (probably not original, but not seen by me) that with everybody infected this settles one of my issues with Sophia. Namely, how did she turn. It seems very unlikely that they’d get bitten but not pretty much eaten. If, instead, she just fell down a ravine and broke herself to death, then I’m ok with that. She clearly had a bite mark on her neck/shoulder region, though. > [@MeanJoe](#): > > Girlfriend: Who is in the helicopter? > MeanJoe: The survivors from The Monroeville Mall. 😃 I was thinking the same thing, Joe. > [@obfusciatrist](#): > > This is why it is interesting to learn that Andrea is apparently an endurance athlete, since she maintained her pace over back country from the time of the zombie attack to near sundown the next evening. 16 hours, conservatively, of running, with no ability to stop (though apparently when she does stop for a moment this just causes the zombies to slow down since it would ruin the show if they actually caught up to her).. The actress who plays Andrea was on Talking Dead and talked about the filming, and she was literally running an entire day as they were filming that part of the episode, from sun up to sun down. She said she could barely even move for three days after that. :eek: Speaking of Talking Dead, I find it interesting that originally Randall was supposed to escape (not be taken off by Shane) and kill Hershel (THEN the stuff with him and Shane was going to happen). But I’m really glad they haven’t killed Hershel it’s interesting to see what happens to him with his world turned upside down. Of course, for all I know they’ll just off him in the opening scene of season 3, but I hope not. I haven’t read enough of the comics to have any idea about hooded woman (I only read up to Carl shooting Shane, so not very far) but damn, that was some nightmare fuel right there. Looked like something out of Silent Hill. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2012, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-13-beside-the-dying-fire-season-finale-open-spoilers/616171/140 "2012-03-20T01:17:39Z")
Romero had the right idea; never even try to explain what’s causing the dead to rise, just have it happen and show your characters trying to deal with it. It would be way more disturbing if Jenner had told Rick “There is no virus, we have no clue what’s causing this or how it’s even possible”. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-13-beside-the-dying-fire-season-finale-open-spoilers/616171.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-2-13-beside-the-dying-fire-season-finale-open-spoilers/616171.md?page=8)