# The Walking Dead; 5.05 "Self Help" (open spoilers) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [November 10, 2014, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-5-05-self-help-open-spoilers/704199 "2014-11-10T00:55:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![sisu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/df705f/32.png) [@sisu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sisu)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2014, 5:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-5-05-self-help-open-spoilers/704199/121 "2014-11-11T05:04:18Z")
shheez love this show but really it is so full of plot holes etc that I welcome the additional information provided to me via the comic book “spoilers” given out. It’s not like its GOT with a real plot… dons flame suit. ---
**Author:** ![Critical1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3e96dc/32.png) [@Critical1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Critical1)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2014, 9:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-5-05-self-help-open-spoilers/704199/122 "2014-11-11T09:03:58Z")
I personally have no idea how you can even worry about spoilers in a show with only the occasional bout of decent writing, hell I can spoil the rest of the series for you, People will do stupid shit in the face of obviously better plans/ideas/actions and the writers will dig DEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEP into the well of crappy hollywood cliches in pretty much every show in the series. I still don’t know why I keep coming back but damnit its a show about the friggin ZA ffs! ---
**Author:** ![Quimby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/22d042/32.png) [@Quimby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quimby)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2014, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-5-05-self-help-open-spoilers/704199/123 "2014-11-11T15:18:02Z")
> [@wedgehed](#): > > You were answering my question & I appreciate it. I don’t get the outrage at referring to the comics to criticize or clarify events that have already occurred on the TV show. I thought what I wrote was fair but I just want everyone to get along 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2014, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-5-05-self-help-open-spoilers/704199/124 "2014-11-11T20:38:04Z")
> [@wedgehed](#): > > You were answering my question & I appreciate it. I don’t get the outrage at referring to the comics to criticize or clarify events that have already occurred on the TV show. It’s a slippery slope, there is nothing wrong with what you asked or what the answer you got was but allowing any comic book talk means we have to deal with every single posters idea of what is ok to share or not. It is just a lot simpler to not have any comic book talk whatsoever than to rely on the common sense of vastly different sets of posters. ---
**Author:** ![Push\_You\_Down](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/push_you_down/32/9095_2.png) [@Push\_You\_Down](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Push_You_Down)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2014, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-5-05-self-help-open-spoilers/704199/125 "2014-11-11T20:44:16Z")
> [@EllisDee](#): > > As far as I’m aware, there has never been a “comics don’t exist” rule in TWD threads. Maybe, _maybe_, in the threads for the very first season, but certainly not for the last several seasons. I definitely do NOT remember “hashing this out every season.” There are plenty of comics references in the various episode threads, but for the most part people have done a great job of spoiler-boxing spoilers and discussing irrelevant minutia openly. > > So I’d like cites of examples where it’s stated the “comics don’t exist” is a rule in these threads. > > I’d also like cites of examples where it’s being “hashed out every year.” > > I think the “comics don’t exist” rule can’t possibly work for TWD specifically because of The Talking Dead. Case in point: They did NOT say the reason why Abe killed those dudes in the grocery store on the Talking Dead. The actor who played Abe was very specific: “That scene was a callback to the comics. In the comics, those guys were his neighbors and friends when the apocalypse hit, and were part of his group. Abe had gone off on a supply run and those guys raped his family, so he killed them. That’s what happens in the comics, anyway; the writers could very well revisit that scene and make it some other reason.” > > I highly doubt the writers would change the reason, but the explanation given was specifically “this is what happened in the comics.” NOT “this is what happened in the show.” > > I find this hand-wringing over “the comics DON"T EXISTS!!!1!!” shameful and embarrassing, a showcase of the worst aspects of SDMB culture. > > Link to me the last time this was an issue. Also, link me the last TWD thread that didn’t mention the comics. Jesus christ, now who is sucking all the fun out the thread? I don’t have the time or inclination to do dig through YEARS of threads, but I do see multiple new single threads that were created for people specifically wanting to discuss differences between show and comic. That implies to me that at least previous posters weren’t completely tone-deaf about the issue. ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2014, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-5-05-self-help-open-spoilers/704199/126 "2014-11-11T20:54:00Z")
At the risk of Jr. modding, we were told to drop the subject and move it to another thread. ---
**Author:** ![FXMastermind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fxmastermind/32/7289_2.png) [@FXMastermind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FXMastermind)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2014, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-5-05-self-help-open-spoilers/704199/127 "2014-11-11T21:14:38Z")
This just shows how bad the recent episode actually is. The discussion over the thread is better than the TV show ---
**Author:** ![twickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2014, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-5-05-self-help-open-spoilers/704199/128 "2014-11-11T21:31:23Z")
> [@EllisDee](#): > > As far as I’m aware, there has never been a “comics don’t exist” rule in TWD threads. Maybe, _maybe_, in the threads for the very first season, but certainly not for the last several seasons. I definitely do NOT remember “hashing this out every season.” There are plenty of comics references in the various episode threads, but for the most part people have done a great job of spoiler-boxing spoilers and discussing irrelevant minutia openly. > > So I’d like cites of examples where it’s stated the “comics don’t exist” is a rule in these threads. > > I’d also like cites of examples where it’s being “hashed out every year.” > > I think the “comics don’t exist” rule can’t possibly work for TWD specifically because of The Talking Dead. Case in point: They did NOT say the reason why Abe killed those dudes in the grocery store on the Talking Dead. The actor who played Abe was very specific: “That scene was a callback to the comics. In the comics, those guys were his neighbors and friends when the apocalypse hit, and were part of his group. Abe had gone off on a supply run and those guys raped his family, so he killed them. That’s what happens in the comics, anyway; the writers could very well revisit that scene and make it some other reason.” > > I highly doubt the writers would change the reason, but the explanation given was specifically “this is what happened in the comics.” NOT “this is what happened in the show.” > > I find this hand-wringing over “the comics DON"T EXISTS!!!1!!” shameful and embarrassing, a showcase of the worst aspects of SDMB culture. > > Link to me the last time this was an issue. Also, link me the last TWD thread that didn’t mention the comics. This post is in direct contradiction of the instructions I posted above: > [@twickster](#): > > It’s up to the fans of any TV show to determine how they want to discuss the show – one thread per season vs. one thread per episode, etc. > > For shows based on a book or other non-TV source, you also have to decide how you want to handle that. The most acrimonious discussions take place around _Game of Thrones_, but y’all are giving them a run for their money here. > > The staff doesn’t care what you want to do – putting things from the graphic novels that haven’t been addressed on the show yet into spoiler boxes will probably suffice – but we will be happy to enforce the rule once you’ve decided what it is. Okay, no, we won’t be happy to enforce it because y’all tend to act like toddlers who haven’t had their naps – there’s always a group that’s pissed off about the decision and acts up about it – but we will enforce it. > > Discussion of how you want the policy to work should take place in a separate thread, though, rather than continuing to derail the discussion of this episode with it. For now, I’m declaring the meta discussion of how to handle spoilers to be _off topic_ in this thread. > > **twickster** , Cafe Society moderator I have thus issued a warning for ignoring moderator instructions. ---
**Author:** ![twickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2014, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-5-05-self-help-open-spoilers/704199/129 "2014-11-11T21:39:23Z")
All of the following posts continue the discussion about spoilers – what they are, how to handle, pro and con – after I instructed you to move that discussion out of this thread. None of these posts, however, flout my instructions as egregiously as **Ellis Dee** ’s post did, however, so I’m not going to issue warnings for them. If any of you continue this discussion in this thread, however, I will start handing out more warnings. > [@D\_Odds](#): > > Thanks for killing another fucking discussion thread. I wish I knew spoilers just so I could crap them out while leaving the thread. Fucking inanity. > [@carnivorousplant](#): > > I don’t believe we are going to decide that. Do Moderators (yes, I capitalized it, I can suck up with the best) go with the guy who started the thread, a majority vote, or posters that suck up well? > 🙂 > [@FXMastermind](#): > > So when the thread title says (open spoilers) it doesn’t really mean you can post spoilers? > [@DigitalC](#): > > It means open spoilers about the episode that just aired. Open spoilers doesn’t mean i can come in this thread and tell you Bruce Willis was dead the whole time. > [@sisu](#): > > shheez love this show but really it is so full of plot holes etc that I welcome the additional information provided to me via the comic book “spoilers” given out. It’s not like its GOT with a real plot… > > dons flame suit. > [@DigitalC](#): > > It’s a slippery slope, there is nothing wrong with what you asked or what the answer you got was but allowing any comic book talk means we have to deal with every single posters idea of what is ok to share or not. It is just a lot simpler to not have any comic book talk whatsoever than to rely on the common sense of vastly different sets of posters. > [@Push\_You\_Down](#): > > Jesus christ, now who is sucking all the fun out the thread? > > I don’t have the time or inclination to do dig through YEARS of threads, but I do see multiple new single threads that were created for people specifically wanting to discuss differences between show and comic. That implies to me that at least previous posters weren’t completely tone-deaf about the issue. ---
**Author:** ![FXMastermind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fxmastermind/32/7289_2.png) [@FXMastermind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FXMastermind)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2014, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-5-05-self-help-open-spoilers/704199/130 "2014-11-11T21:51:19Z")
> [@twickster](#): > > All of the following posts continue the discussion about spoilers – what they are, how to handle, pro and con – after I instructed you to move that discussion out of this thread. I’m sorry I missed that instruction. Where is the discussion moved to? I didn’t mean to add to the derailment. I really want to know the answer. ---
**Author:** ![twickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2014, 12:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-5-05-self-help-open-spoilers/704199/131 "2014-11-12T00:33:01Z")
Start a new thread. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2014, 1:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-5-05-self-help-open-spoilers/704199/132 "2014-11-12T01:35:29Z")
> [@twickster](#): > > Start a new thread. Yes, Ma’am. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![FXMastermind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fxmastermind/32/7289_2.png) [@FXMastermind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FXMastermind)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2014, 3:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-5-05-self-help-open-spoilers/704199/133 "2014-11-12T03:35:14Z")
Where? ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2014, 4:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-5-05-self-help-open-spoilers/704199/134 "2014-11-12T04:30:11Z")
> [@FXMastermind](#): > > I’m sorry I missed that instruction. Same. Maybe when issuing moderator instructions, you should lead with them. I scanned the first couple paragraphs of that very long mod mote and it just kept saying “it’s up to you guys, we don’t care” so I continued on reading the thread. After that mod note the discussion continued on about spoilers, so I participated. She buried the lead four paragraphs deep. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2014, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-5-05-self-help-open-spoilers/704199/135 "2014-11-12T14:51:49Z")
> [@EllisDee](#): > > Same. > > Maybe when issuing moderator instructions, you should lead with them. I scanned the first couple paragraphs of that very long mod mote and it just kept saying “it’s up to you guys, we don’t care” so I continued on reading the thread. After that mod note the discussion continued on about spoilers, so I participated. > > She buried the lead four paragraphs deep. nitpick - “Very long mod mote”? “Buried”? Seriously? There were only 4 paragraphs for a total of 7 sentences. :eek: ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2014, 9:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-5-05-self-help-open-spoilers/704199/136 "2014-11-13T09:55:15Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > nitpick - “Very long mod mote”? “Buried”? Seriously? There were only 4 paragraphs for a total of 7 sentences. :eek: Very long mod note, yes. Buried, yes. Seriously, yes. Her moderation was titled “Moderator Note”, not “instructions.” It started off with “we don’t care what policy you decide to adopt.” It continued on with “we don’t care what policy you decide to adopt.” I got the message that the mods don’t care what policy we adopt so I skipped the rest of the boring administrative stuff to get back to the more interesting topical discussion. My bad, but geez, that was a lot of moderator talk to get through before instructions that carry “obey or get a warning” weight. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-walking-dead-5-05-self-help-open-spoilers/704199.md?page=6)