# The Wheel of Time: TV series discussion (open spoilers; comparison to the books allowed) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** tv-shows-scripted, amazon-prime\ **Created:** [November 19, 2021, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-wheel-of-time-tv-series-discussion-open-spoilers-comparison-to-the-books-allowed/954636 "2021-11-19T18:24:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2021, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-wheel-of-time-tv-series-discussion-open-spoilers-comparison-to-the-books-allowed/954636/161 "2021-12-17T19:26:57Z")
I think they mean what was the hint during those two scenes as they occured, and I don’t think there were any. I mean, if “that’s a strong door, you can’t break it” followed by character breaking it is a hint towards channeling, then that’s pretty lame. Also, they always show the threads, no? Except when it would give something plot significant away I guess. ---
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2021, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-wheel-of-time-tv-series-discussion-open-spoilers-comparison-to-the-books-allowed/954636/162 "2021-12-17T19:31:17Z")
@Mahaloth said he has to go back and find the clip, so I don’t think that’s the case. And didn’t notice during the episode how Rand being the Dragon Reborn was revealed other than the bartender who sees visions told him things. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2021, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-wheel-of-time-tv-series-discussion-open-spoilers-comparison-to-the-books-allowed/954636/163 "2021-12-17T19:41:51Z")
> [@Snarky\_Kong](#): > > I mean, if “that’s a strong door, you can’t break it” followed by character breaking it is a hint towards channeling, then that’s pretty lame. Also, they always show the threads, no? Except when it would give something plot significant away I guess. Well the thing about the threads is that women can only see women channeling and men can see men, so nobody would be able to see Rand’s channeling but several people in the party can see Moiraine, Egwenne and Nynaeve. ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2021, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-wheel-of-time-tv-series-discussion-open-spoilers-comparison-to-the-books-allowed/954636/164 "2021-12-17T19:44:48Z")
I’m not talking about other characters seeing it, I’m talking about the audience seeing it. We’ve seen women channel (Moiraine, Egwene, Nynaeve, etc) and men (Logain) channel. We saw Rand channel to throw the Trolloc off in the Ways (although Egwene took credit… did they both do so?) but not when breaking open the door. ---
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2021, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-wheel-of-time-tv-series-discussion-open-spoilers-comparison-to-the-books-allowed/954636/165 "2021-12-17T19:56:51Z")
Yes, it happened in the clip in this last episode when Rand ties 2 and 2 together, not during the previous scene. ---
**Author:** ![mordecaiB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mordecaib/32/7725_2.png) [@mordecaiB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mordecaiB)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2021, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-wheel-of-time-tv-series-discussion-open-spoilers-comparison-to-the-books-allowed/954636/166 "2021-12-17T20:51:24Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > > [@Alessan](#): > > > > Their heads are masks, but they have backwards-bending animal legs, which I presume are CGI. > > [Here’s how you can do it with practical effects.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KKyeAQNFLVk) I knew I recognized the running gait when I posted above, I just couldn’t place it. I’ll bet you are right on this one. ---
**Author:** ![mordecaiB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mordecaib/32/7725_2.png) [@mordecaiB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mordecaiB)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2021, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-wheel-of-time-tv-series-discussion-open-spoilers-comparison-to-the-books-allowed/954636/167 "2021-12-18T19:48:15Z")
Finally caught up, with just one episode to go. I’m going to ask a few questions if you don’t mind. Is Thom not dead and will be revealed as some important person in the future? That group of knights that run around with Child looking for witches. Who are they and what gives them their powerbase - are they government or just freelancers? Does Child have powers to discern witches or does he just guess and torture people? I’m guessing he is also not dead dead. When will people learn you never stab/shoot someone only once? Do it many times to be sure. Had we heard of the blight earlier than episode 7? It appears that trees are absorbing people, is that right? Rand was such an obvious guess for Dragon, that I assume him thinking he is will be a fake out. But if he isn’t the Dragon, he’ll die when he gets to the eye, no? Were we to assume the person that followed the group thru the stargate/wormhole thing is Mat? I’m sticking with my theory that Thom is not dead and it was him. I’m on the side of the flashback and clue dropping not being very well done. “I’ve seen this place before” is not really a clue. And why would there be an unbreakable door in a rundown tavern? > [@DigitalC](#): > > Well the thing about the threads is that women can only see women channeling and men can see men, so nobody would be able to see Rand’s channeling but several people in the party can see Moiraine, Egwenne and Nynaeve. Is that correct? Why could all the Aes Sedai see the threads from the False Dragon? And the False Dragon could see the Aes Sedai. If the threads are for the audience, we should have seen them when Rand broke down the door. And why did none of the Aes Sedai see the threads when Moraine was being kicked out? Finally, what exactly is the power the Aes Sedai wield? They all draw from the same source but manifest differently: fireballs , lightning, wind or some kind of forcefield and the lady that made small patches of ground explode upwards to very little effect. I have to say I’m enjoying this quite a bit. As a not-big fan of Jordan’s writing, I will never read the books but I’m in for a few seasons of this if they can keep up the quality. Looking forward to the last episode. Is it really going to air on Christmas eve? That may put a damper on people watching right away. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2021, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-wheel-of-time-tv-series-discussion-open-spoilers-comparison-to-the-books-allowed/954636/168 "2021-12-18T19:57:36Z")
> [@mordecaiB](#): > > Is that correct? It’s how it’s supposed to be. They are…inconsistent on the show with when they are shown. The Aes Sedai could feel the false dragon channeling because he was channeling directly at their shields, I don’t think they could actually see the threads. ---
**Author:** ![Kimera757](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kimera757/32/3765_2.png) [@Kimera757](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimera757)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2021, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-wheel-of-time-tv-series-discussion-open-spoilers-comparison-to-the-books-allowed/954636/169 "2021-12-18T19:58:22Z")
I haven’t watched any of the series (and I’ve been dodging spoilers). Since I read books 1 and 2, I’m probably safe from spoilers so far. How does the show pacing compare to the book series? The books were very slow. Is it going to be one season per book, or something like that? ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2021, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-wheel-of-time-tv-series-discussion-open-spoilers-comparison-to-the-books-allowed/954636/170 "2021-12-18T20:02:08Z")
> [@Kimera757](#): > > How does the show pacing compare to the book series? The books were very slow. Is it going to be one season per book, or something like that? The show is very fast paced, literally racing from one plot point to another. Season 1 is only eight episodes long and apparently it goes a bit into book 2. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2021, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-wheel-of-time-tv-series-discussion-open-spoilers-comparison-to-the-books-allowed/954636/171 "2021-12-18T21:28:31Z")
> [@mordecaiB](#): > > Is Thom not dead and will be revealed as some important person in the future? I would assume so. He was an important figure in the books. That doesn’t mean that the show is following that line, but I would think that to be the case. > [@mordecaiB](#): > > That group of knights that run around with Child looking for witches. Who are they and what gives them their powerbase - are they government or just freelancers? They are actually looking for darkfriends and the like, but Aes Sedai are close enough. In the books, they basically run a city state. > [@mordecaiB](#): > > Does Child have powers to discern witches or does he just guess and torture people? I’d say the latter. OTOH, everyone has the power to tell an Aes Sedai. Just ask. If they say no, you know that they aren’t. (They could still be a channeler though.) > [@mordecaiB](#): > > I’m guessing he is also not dead dead. When will people learn you never stab/shoot someone only once? Do it many times to be sure. Probably not. In the books, his story continues. But yes, stab, stab, stab. > [@mordecaiB](#): > > Had we heard of the blight earlier than episode 7? \*Maybe in passing, but I don’t remember anyone having mentioned it. > [@mordecaiB](#): > > It appears that trees are absorbing people, is that right? I don’t know if they are actually absorbing living people, so much as those who have perished within. > [@mordecaiB](#): > > Rand was such an obvious guess for Dragon, that I assume him thinking he is will be a fake out. But if he isn’t the Dragon, he’ll die when he gets to the eye, no? Unless they made some serious changes, then he is the Dragon. If he’s not, then I guess he’s safe, as if the dragon is not there, then he cannot get between the Dragon and the Dark One. > [@mordecaiB](#): > > Were we to assume the person that followed the group thru the stargate/wormhole thing is Mat? Pretty sure that was Padin Fain. He becomes pretty important later in the books. > [@mordecaiB](#): > > I’m on the side of the flashback and clue dropping not being very well done. “I’ve seen this place before” is not really a clue That’s where he was born. > [@mordecaiB](#): > > And why would there be an unbreakable door in a rundown tavern? It was run by a darkfriend. I’m sure she had all sorts of uses for a room that can’t be broken out of, and no one can hear screams from within. > [@mordecaiB](#): > > Why could all the Aes Sedai see the threads from the False Dragon? And the False Dragon could see the Aes Sedai. I don’t think that they could. They could _sense_ the threads of the other gender’s power, but only in how it interacted with theirs, they couldn’t actually see them directly. > [@mordecaiB](#): > > If the threads are for the audience, we should have seen them when Rand broke down the door. That would have been too much of a reveal at that time, I think. Besides, if Rand hadn’t really noticed them at the time, then no one else was there to do so. > [@mordecaiB](#): > > And why did none of the Aes Sedai see the threads when Moraine was being kicked out? I don’t know why they wouldn’t have. I assume that they did, and that is how they know that Moraine’s oath is binding. It’s possible that someone could just put their hand on the rod and make false promises, it is only channeling into the rod while swearing that makes it binding. > [@mordecaiB](#): > > Finally, what exactly is the power the Aes Sedai wield? They all draw from the same source but manifest differently: fireballs , lightning, wind or some kind of forcefield and the lady that made small patches of ground explode upwards to very little effect. It’s the “One Source”. It can be channeled, with training, into any of those effects. Some have more power than others, and some have more affinity with certain elements than others. ---
**Author:** ![mordecaiB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mordecaib/32/7725_2.png) [@mordecaiB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mordecaiB)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2021, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-wheel-of-time-tv-series-discussion-open-spoilers-comparison-to-the-books-allowed/954636/172 "2021-12-18T21:58:57Z")
Thanks for taking the time to answer. > [@k9bfriender](#): > > Unless they made some serious changes, then he is the Dragon. Damn! Outguessed myself! > [@k9bfriender](#): > > Pretty sure that was Padin Fain. He totally fell off my radar. Now I have to wonder if he has the power to open the gateway or if someone sent him. > [@k9bfriender](#): > > That’s where he was born. I thought his mom died giving birth to him on the battlefield, and his father adopted him. > [@k9bfriender](#): > > I don’t know why they wouldn’t have. I assume that they did, and that is how they know that Moraine’s oath is binding. Maybe I looked at that scene wrong. I took it as something secret between the two. If it was just the manifestation of the oath I guess everyone would expect to see it. > [@DigitalC](#): > > They are…inconsistent on the show with when they are shown. Yes, I wish they would be consistent, it would help me out considerably. To me, the audience should see them whenever they are used. But I understand sometimes they need to obfuscate things to keep the plot from being readily apparent. > [@DigitalC](#): > > The show is very fast paced, literally racing from one plot point to another I agree with this, but it’s not all fighting-type action, it’s situational too. There’s a little bit of exposition, but generally it’s a good pace. I think I need to pay a little more attention and not be in such a hurry to have all my questions answered. Now that I’m caught up, next year I can just keep pace with everyone else. It would be nice to discuss one episode at a time. I am a little surprised that this thread isn’t much longer considering the popularity of the books on this board. Hopefully more will join in by binging the series once the last episode drops. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2021, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-wheel-of-time-tv-series-discussion-open-spoilers-comparison-to-the-books-allowed/954636/173 "2021-12-18T22:15:11Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > I would assume so. He was an important figure in the books. That doesn’t mean that the show is following that line, but I would think that to be the case. If we are going full open spoilers, I believe the character has been re-cast and will return. I asked upthread and am not sure if anyone answered. Do you all think they filmed Mat staying behind originallly? I thought perhaps as they approached Covid-shutdown(or as they returned), they re-filmed it with him staying way back and not entering the portal. I am not convinced they knew before their Covid sabbatical that they were going to let him go mid-season. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2021, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-wheel-of-time-tv-series-discussion-open-spoilers-comparison-to-the-books-allowed/954636/174 "2021-12-18T22:17:18Z")
A voice over of the rest of the cast shouting his name while the CGI portal closes would not have been a difficult addition to make. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2021, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-wheel-of-time-tv-series-discussion-open-spoilers-comparison-to-the-books-allowed/954636/175 "2021-12-18T22:19:20Z")
> [@mordecaiB](#): > > Now I have to wonder if he has the power to open the gateway or if someone sent him. He’s a complicated one. He’s a Darkfriend, which is how the Trolloc army found them in the first place. In the books, he gets ahold of Mat’s dagger, which elevates him to a new level of power, as well as changing his ambitions somewhat. Still evil, but now in the service of Mordeth, of Shadar Logoth, rather than the Dark One. I think that he was able to open the ways with his new power. > [@mordecaiB](#): > > I thought his mom died giving birth to him on the battlefield, and his father adopted him. Yes, and that was on the Dragonmount, the mountain that they saw when he said it seemed familiar. > [@mordecaiB](#): > > I took it as something secret between the two. If it was just the manifestation of the oath I guess everyone would expect to see it. Yeah, I think it was a public oath for everyone to see. > [@mordecaiB](#): > > I am a little surprised that this thread isn’t much longer considering the popularity of the books on this board. Hopefully more will join in by binging the series once the last episode drops. To be honest, it’s been about 15 years since I read them, and never completed the series. Some of the changes in the show I find quite obvious, like Perrin’s wife. Some of them are more subtle, and I’m not sure if it’s a change or if I’m just not remembering the books quite right. If I find myself with a whole lot of freetime, I may go back through and read them, start to finish, but it’s likely that the series on Amazon will finish up before I get around to that. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2021, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-wheel-of-time-tv-series-discussion-open-spoilers-comparison-to-the-books-allowed/954636/176 "2021-12-18T22:26:10Z")
> [@Mahaloth](#): > > If we are going full open spoilers I _think_ we are, based on the title and OP. > [@Mahaloth](#): > > I believe the character has been re-cast and will return. I haven’t seen much behind the scenes about the show, so that he’s been recast is news to me. But I would be surprised if he doesn’t return, as that would be a pretty big change from the books. > [@Mahaloth](#): > > Do you all think they filmed Mat staying behind originallly? I thought perhaps as they approached Covid-shutdown(or as they returned), they re-filmed it with him staying way back and not entering the portal. I would say that’s likely. I don’t see a good reason to make that change from the books unless it had something to do with real world limitations. I know they got shut down during Covid, delaying things, and it’s possible that Mat’s scenes for the last two episodes hadn’t been filmed yet, and the actor didn’t come back for them. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2021, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-wheel-of-time-tv-series-discussion-open-spoilers-comparison-to-the-books-allowed/954636/177 "2021-12-18T22:29:15Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > I would say that’s likely. I don’t see a good reason to make that change from the books unless it had something to do with real world limitations. I know they got shut down during Covid, delaying things, and it’s possible that Mat’s scenes for the last two episodes hadn’t been filmed yet, and the actor didn’t come back for them. I’d love to find out later. I think they re-shot the portal/waygate entry scene when they came back and just “copy and pasted” the actor back there and had everyone yell his name. I know it is none of my business…but I want to know what the heck happened behind the scenes that made them want to dump a major actor. I’d guess vaccine mandates, but I just don’t think that’s it for some reason. ---
**Author:** ![Sunny\_Daze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunny_daze/32/438_2.png) [@Sunny\_Daze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunny_Daze)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2021, 12:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-wheel-of-time-tv-series-discussion-open-spoilers-comparison-to-the-books-allowed/954636/178 "2021-12-20T00:48:28Z")
> [@simster](#): > > I must have dozed off thru all of that ‘channeling hints’ - because I missed it. > > His mother was a badass tho. Me too (and yes, she was). **Question for the thread and the OP** how would you all feel about limiting spoilers from the book to the same point in the story, or before? We can split into 2 threads like GoT, and have book vs no book threads, but if everyone is amenable to my suggestion, I like discussing how the book diverges (or not) from the current story. Thoughts? ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2021, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-wheel-of-time-tv-series-discussion-open-spoilers-comparison-to-the-books-allowed/954636/179 "2021-12-20T01:01:30Z")
> [@Sunny\_Daze](#): > > **Question for the thread and the OP** how would you all feel about limiting spoilers from the book to the same point in the story, or before? We can split into 2 threads like GoT, and have book vs no book threads, but if everyone is amenable to my suggestion, I like discussing how the book diverges (or not) from the current story. Thoughts? That’s probably a good idea. Not sure this show is popular enough to warrant two threads yet, but some clearly delineated spoiler policy is needed regardless. ---
**Author:** ![Sunny\_Daze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunny_daze/32/438_2.png) [@Sunny\_Daze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunny_Daze)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2021, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-wheel-of-time-tv-series-discussion-open-spoilers-comparison-to-the-books-allowed/954636/180 "2021-12-20T01:11:30Z")
I should have been clearer that I would like to keep one thread with the spoiler policy that I suggested. You’re right about not really having enough contributors to have 2 threads. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-wheel-of-time-tv-series-discussion-open-spoilers-comparison-to-the-books-allowed/954636.md?page=8) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-wheel-of-time-tv-series-discussion-open-spoilers-comparison-to-the-books-allowed/954636.md?page=10)