# The world is perfect? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [June 22, 2018, 2:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-world-is-perfect/816554 "2018-06-22T02:50:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Machinaforce](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/aeb1de/32.png) [@Machinaforce](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machinaforce)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2019, 3:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-world-is-perfect/816554/102 "2019-10-07T03:03:44Z")
> [@Machinaforce](#): > > Addendum: I don’t think the world is perfect. It merely is. Saying it is perfect would imply some criteria for perfection and therefor would be a value judgment. It would also imply some standard for imperfection which would violate his alleged claims of nonduality. I never typed this up. Edit: never mind I just realized what happened. ---
**Author:** ![Machinaforce](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/aeb1de/32.png) [@Machinaforce](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machinaforce)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2019, 3:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-world-is-perfect/816554/103 "2019-10-07T03:08:00Z")
> [@roys](#): > > A question as brief and apparently ‘simple’ as this one, is a perfect illustration of why there is so much misunderstanding between human beings. Because before anyone can even begin to think about ‘how’ to answer it … they must first clarify what the questioner means by the word ‘perfect.’ > > For instance, I can quite honestly say that “I think the world is perfect”, because by using that word, I mean that “The world ‘could not be other than it is right now’, at this very moment.” Therefore, it is ‘perfect.’ Similarly, there has never been any possibility of ‘anything’ being other than exactly how it is, right now. And this I believe is true for every moment that has ever been. > > But of course, this then opens up a whole Pandora’s Box of related questions about time, free will, pre-destination, choices, etc. > > However, most people aren’t interested in engaging in such a seemingly impossible and uninteresting enquiry and are far happier remaining within the limits of what feels right to us. I imagine the most popular approach towards answering a question which uses the word ‘perfect’ the way you have here, would be to assume the question meant something like “If every single thing in the world happened the way ‘I liked’ - then the world would be perfect.” > > Nevertheless, I strongly suspect that if the world operated exactly the way you or I found ‘perfect’, it would NOT be seen as such by any other person we could find. > > The moral ? “Define your terms first. Answer second.” It seems to be a variation on that theme because he thinks that reality as it is would be absent all our judgments and values, except then we wouldn’t be human. It’s worth noting that such a view is a human thing to strive for in an ironic sense and that in an objective sense it’s not better than what we have now. Even writing that whole thing and continuing to make videos seems like he doesn’t believe it or there is some major cognitive dissonance. ---
**Author:** ![Machinaforce](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/aeb1de/32.png) [@Machinaforce](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machinaforce)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2019, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-world-is-perfect/816554/104 "2019-10-07T03:09:43Z")
Or to what someone on the other thread said: Everything is identical to itself, so then by force the colors mean nothing, as they are truly all the same colors. And if the colors mean nothing, the lower stages are the higher stages. So then ignorance and enlightenment are but two sides of the same coin. So, once you understand that you are ignorant and enlightened both, it is folly to continue seeking. It is the seeking which mars perfection. ---
**Author:** ![PlaceboTarget](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/placebotarget/32/1073_2.png) [@PlaceboTarget](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PlaceboTarget)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2019, 6:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-world-is-perfect/816554/105 "2019-10-08T06:31:23Z")
> [@Machinaforce](#): > > Everything is identical to itself, so then by force the colors mean nothing, as they are truly all the same colors. Statements like this one make me feel Socrates should be sanctified. But for his contribution to epistemology, I guess people would still be building pyramids. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2019, 7:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-world-is-perfect/816554/106 "2019-10-08T07:05:59Z")
So [Actualized.org](http://Actualized.org)’s position appears to be summed up as: Nothing matters, you can’t change anything; you shouldn’t judge anything. If nothing matters, why have they made hundreds of videos about it? If you can’t change anything, who are they trying to persuade? Also, why monetize the videos? It’s not like you can change anything (such as your financial situation) ‘you shouldn’t judge anything’ IS a judgment There’s a whole lot of purposely deep-sounding wibble on the site and channel, but at it’s heart, it is utterly insincere. ---
**Author:** ![Machinaforce](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/aeb1de/32.png) [@Machinaforce](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machinaforce)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2019, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-world-is-perfect/816554/107 "2019-10-08T21:35:41Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > So [Actualized.org](http://Actualized.org)’s position appears to be summed up as: > > Nothing matters, you can’t change anything; you shouldn’t judge anything. > > If nothing matters, why have they made hundreds of videos about it? > > If you can’t change anything, who are they trying to persuade? Also, why monetize the videos? It’s not like you can change anything (such as your financial situation) > > ‘you shouldn’t judge anything’ IS a judgment > > There’s a whole lot of purposely deep-sounding wibble on the site and channel, but at it’s heart, it is utterly insincere. It reminds me of what the broward meditation mentioned about seeing the world in realistic way and not through our own clouded and dirty perceptions with all the “pictures” our mind takes. The way to see the world and everything in a realistic way is to drop all our judgments and opinions and values. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2019, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-world-is-perfect/816554/108 "2019-10-08T21:53:19Z")
No, because if you drop all your judgments and opinions and values, **you can no longer decide** that’s the way to see the world and everything in a realistic way. You can’t make the judgment that this is the right thing to do, if you decide to stop using judgment. ---
**Author:** ![DrFidelius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drfidelius/32/3447_2.png) [@DrFidelius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrFidelius)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2019, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-world-is-perfect/816554/109 "2019-10-08T22:53:10Z")
As Bizarro once said, if the world were perfect it wouldn’t be. And as I had said before, you need to read more fiction. It helps develop the empathic pathways of your mind and calibrate your bullshit filter. ---
**Author:** ![Machinaforce](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/aeb1de/32.png) [@Machinaforce](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machinaforce)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2019, 6:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-world-is-perfect/816554/110 "2019-10-10T06:03:04Z")
> [@DrFidelius](#): > > As Bizarro once said, if the world were perfect it wouldn’t be. > > And as I had said before, you need to read more fiction. It helps develop the empathic pathways of your mind and calibrate your bullshit filter. But in a sense I can see how he is “right” because all we are doing is describing it through our lens. Flaws are flaws because we judge them to be so and the same thing with strengths, so in a sense no one has flaws or strengths…people just ARE. It’s our judgment that makes these so but from an objective point they just ARE. I wouldn’t say the world is perfect, just that it IS. But in a sense it seems he’s right in that you can’t improve it because that itself is a form of judging one state to be better than another. Even if you died it would be “fine”. But you couldn’t really live through such a viewpoint and it wouldn’t make sense to tell me about it either. ---
**Author:** ![Beckdawrek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/beckdawrek/32/3647_2.png) [@Beckdawrek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beckdawrek)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2019, 7:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-world-is-perfect/816554/111 "2019-10-10T07:39:45Z")
> [@Machinaforce](#): > > Or to what someone on the other thread said: > > Everything is identical to itself, so then by force the colors mean nothing, as they are truly all the same colors. And if the colors mean nothing, the lower stages are the higher stages. So then ignorance and enlightenment are but two sides of the same coin. So, once you understand that you are ignorant and enlightened both, it is folly to continue seeking. It is the seeking which mars perfection. No, no, no. You forgot completely about black and white. Both ‘non’ colors as my ol’ Art prof used to say. (He was a bit batty, but NM) And what of new colors? Fashion, car manufacturing, housewares designers mix and manipulate color every few months. Then there are patterns that read as a solid color. Which truly screws with your brain. And, absolutely no one acknowledged my brilliant threadshit up there. ‘Arky blush’ will be the go to, you wait and see. Cars, iPhones, fashion. It will be everywhere. Seriously, dude get out of this color crap. It’s sounding a little crazed. (It ain’t perfect but it’s Pink, dang it)🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Machinaforce](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/aeb1de/32.png) [@Machinaforce](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machinaforce)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2019, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-world-is-perfect/816554/112 "2019-10-11T19:32:08Z")
> [@Beckdawrek](#): > > No, no, no. You forgot completely about black and white. Both ‘non’ colors as my ol’ Art prof used to say. (He was a bit batty, but NM) > And what of new colors? Fashion, car manufacturing, housewares designers mix and manipulate color every few months. Then there are patterns that read as a solid color. Which truly screws with your brain. > And, absolutely no one acknowledged my brilliant threadshit up there. ‘Arky blush’ will be the go to, you wait and see. Cars, iPhones, fashion. It will be everywhere. > Seriously, dude get out of this color crap. It’s sounding a little crazed. > > (It ain’t perfect but it’s Pink, dang it)🙂 You’re missing the part where I reluctantly explain how the world is perfect, even though I don’t want to admit it. Because if it is perfect then there is no reason to do anything. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2019, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-world-is-perfect/816554/113 "2019-10-11T21:19:59Z")
> [@Machinaforce](#): > > Because if it is perfect then there is no reason to do anything. And yet you move. ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2019, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-world-is-perfect/816554/114 "2019-10-11T21:26:52Z")
> [@Machinaforce](#): > > You’re missing the part where I reluctantly explain how the world is perfect, even though I don’t want to admit it. Because if it is perfect then there is no reason to do anything. Just checking, when you say the world is perfect, you’re actually saying that if you voluntarily choose to refrain from making judgements about the world then you will suddenly stop making negative judgements about the world, which you then erroneously decide is the same as the world being perfect. Is that a correct summary? ---
**Author:** ![Machinaforce](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/aeb1de/32.png) [@Machinaforce](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machinaforce)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2019, 1:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-world-is-perfect/816554/115 "2019-10-12T01:34:31Z")
> [@begbert2](#): > > Just checking, when you say the world is perfect, you’re actually saying that if you voluntarily choose to refrain from making judgements about the world then you will suddenly stop making negative judgements about the world, which you then erroneously decide is the same as the world being perfect. Is that a correct summary? I was trying to follow that line of reasoning. But I think this gets at what I’m saying: [The World Is Perfect](https://www.drlwilson.com/articles/PERFECT.htm) ---
**Author:** ![Machinaforce](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/aeb1de/32.png) [@Machinaforce](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machinaforce)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2019, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-world-is-perfect/816554/116 "2019-10-12T02:58:45Z")
And one little bit I forgot: [https://drlwilson.com/Books/real\_self.htm](https://drlwilson.com/Books/real_self.htm) ---
**Author:** ![Machinaforce](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/aeb1de/32.png) [@Machinaforce](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machinaforce)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2019, 1:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-world-is-perfect/816554/117 "2019-10-14T01:04:47Z")
I mean the two start from a seemingly reasonable place but slowly go downhill after that. But I think the world just is. Perfect is a judgment, but things and events just “are” and good and bad are what we make of it. Though I’m thinking that because it’s subjective it isn’t real. ---
**Author:** ![Machinaforce](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/aeb1de/32.png) [@Machinaforce](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machinaforce)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2019, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-world-is-perfect/816554/118 "2019-10-26T18:59:04Z")
What I don’t get though is how people aren’t convinced by the paragraph? Isn’t the main argument being the world not being perfect just our own judgments and opinions about it? ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2019, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-world-is-perfect/816554/119 "2019-10-26T19:57:35Z")
> [@Machinaforce](#): > > Isn’t the main argument being the world not being perfect just our own judgments and opinions about it? In a perfect world, someone would sit you down and force you to diagram that sentence. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2019, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-world-is-perfect/816554/120 "2019-10-26T21:31:40Z")
> [@Machinaforce](#): > > What I don’t get though is how people aren’t convinced by the paragraph? Isn’t the main argument being the world not being perfect just our own judgments and opinions about it? Is that your opinion? Or is it, perhaps, your judgment? Is the argument that the world _is_ perfect rooted in judgment and opinion — like the argument that the world _isn’t?_ If you tell me something is “just” my own opinion, is there some reason that should matter to me — other than my _opinion_ of such a point? If you say a thing is “just” a question of judgment, can I do anything but — _judge_ that remark? ---
**Author:** ![Machinaforce](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/aeb1de/32.png) [@Machinaforce](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machinaforce)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2019, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-world-is-perfect/816554/121 "2019-10-28T01:30:43Z")
That’s what I thought that he literally contradicts himself in that paragraph by judging the world perfect and things as necessary, and then saying to drop all judgments and opinions. But part of me thinks there is some truth to it because in my experience on the forums on his website he seems sure of what he says talking about it being a “non conceptual” truth that you just have to understand and that you have to go beyond logic and that trying to use words is just the ego fighting for control. Another part of me thinks that objectively speaking nothing matters. You could die and it would mean nothing, there would be no flaws or strengths there would just be traits. That the subjective world we take to be reality is a dream. Part of me wants to try and debate this on his site. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-world-is-perfect/816554.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-world-is-perfect/816554.md?page=7)