# The Zimmerman/Martin case. Why so cleanly divided between the parties? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [March 28, 2012, 1:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-zimmerman-martin-case-why-so-cleanly-divided-between-the-parties/617036 "2012-03-28T13:11:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2012, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-zimmerman-martin-case-why-so-cleanly-divided-between-the-parties/617036/121 "2012-04-02T22:11:11Z")
**ENOUGH** Discussions of which posters may or may not be racist are not germane to the actual discussion. Everyone knock it off. [/Moderating] ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Colossus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.colossus/32/9423_2.png) [@Dr.Colossus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Colossus)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2012, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-zimmerman-martin-case-why-so-cleanly-divided-between-the-parties/617036/122 "2012-04-02T22:26:19Z")
> [@tomndebb](#): > > **ENOUGH** > > Discussions of which posters may or may not be racist are not germane to the actual discussion. > > Everyone knock it off. > > [/Moderating] to clarify, i’ve never called \*anyone \*racist. not even zimmerman. not once. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2012, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-zimmerman-martin-case-why-so-cleanly-divided-between-the-parties/617036/123 "2012-04-02T22:54:11Z")
> [@Capt\_Kirk](#): > > I cannot demand that he be convicted, because I am not the prosecutor in this case and in a legal system they are the only ones who can. But I as a Human Being can demand Justice and the Truth, hopefully we will find out exactly what happened that night and if Zimmerman Murdered Martin, then let Justice be done. There is a front page article on this today in the NYT and according to the paper there is quite a bit of confusion about what actually happened and now witnesses are afraid to speak about what they saw(publicly) because of the lynch mob mentality, which is good if you want Revenge not if you want Justice. > > Now some caveats, does Injustice exist here? Yes absolutely. Is the system gamed against African-Americans? Yes. If the skin colors of the two were reversed, would there have been an arrest that night? Probably yes. If all the outcry over this incident had not happened, would Zimmerman ever face a day in court? Probably not. Will we see Justice done? I hope so, but probably not. Does this view make me racist? No. I agree with everything you just said. However, you’ve been accusing everyone _else_ of wanting revenge and not justice, which is not a fair characterization. ---
**Author:** ![Capt\_Kirk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/779978/32.png) [@Capt\_Kirk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Capt_Kirk)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2012, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-zimmerman-martin-case-why-so-cleanly-divided-between-the-parties/617036/124 "2012-04-02T23:53:40Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > No. I agree with everything you just said. However, you’ve been accusing everyone _else_ of wanting revenge and not justice, which is not a fair characterization. And you are right I have been wrong about this and I apologize to everyone, I was feeling a little backed into a corner. Where do we go from here? ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Colossus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.colossus/32/9423_2.png) [@Dr.Colossus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Colossus)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2012, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-zimmerman-martin-case-why-so-cleanly-divided-between-the-parties/617036/125 "2012-04-03T01:56:02Z")
> [@Capt\_Kirk](#): > > And you are right I have been wrong about this and I apologize to everyone, I was feeling a little backed into a corner. Where do we go from here? i think it’s kind of awesome you just said that. takes a certain kind of character to be that big. kudos. i think everyone is very emotionally charged and everyone has a very strong personal opinion on this topic. i, for one, am kind of sick of discussing it. because all anyone can do now is speculate. and bicker. it actually makes me sick lately. makes my belly hurt. i’m not sure where were we ALL go from here, but i know for ME, i need to just wait and see what happens in 8 days when things get going on this real case. and maybe not discuss it much more between now and then. because…ugh… let’s all go watch some basketball now… ---
**Author:** ![rogerbox](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/76d3ee/32.png) [@rogerbox](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rogerbox)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2012, 3:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-zimmerman-martin-case-why-so-cleanly-divided-between-the-parties/617036/126 "2012-04-03T03:26:09Z")
> [@Dr.Colossus](#): > > i think it’s kind of awesome you just said that. takes a certain kind of character to be that big. kudos. My thoughts exactly. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2012, 3:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-zimmerman-martin-case-why-so-cleanly-divided-between-the-parties/617036/127 "2012-04-03T03:34:48Z")
> [@Capt\_Kirk](#): > > And you are right I have been wrong about this and I apologize to everyone, I was feeling a little backed into a corner. Where do we go from here? Hug? ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2012, 3:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-zimmerman-martin-case-why-so-cleanly-divided-between-the-parties/617036/128 "2012-04-03T03:46:55Z")
> [@rat\_avatar](#): > > Well we know it is different because Zimmerman never called 911 to report anyone without cause who was not black. “never”? Are you sure? What if I show you a few such reports? Like this one: 10. June 24, 2007 – 12:48 a.m. Type: TEL Subject: Suspicious activity Report: “By the pool”, two Hispanic males and one white male with “slim jim” ---
**Author:** ![Capt\_Kirk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/779978/32.png) [@Capt\_Kirk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Capt_Kirk)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2012, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-zimmerman-martin-case-why-so-cleanly-divided-between-the-parties/617036/129 "2012-04-03T14:25:22Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Hug? deal, did I miss something? what happens in 8 days? It is funny(not in the ha ha sense) how divisive something like this is, I mean no one is advocating shooting kids, ok, no one who is remotely sane. I might suggest that laws that value property over life should be re-examined. Cheers all ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2012, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-zimmerman-martin-case-why-so-cleanly-divided-between-the-parties/617036/130 "2012-04-03T14:30:35Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > “never”? Are you sure? What if I show you a few such reports? Like this one: > 10. June 24, 2007 – 12:48 a.m. > Type: TEL > Subject: Suspicious activity > Report: “By the pool”, two Hispanic males and one white male with “slim jim” He was just concerned about their reckless intake of saturated fat. ---
**Author:** ![rat\_avatar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rat_avatar/32/255_2.png) [@rat\_avatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rat_avatar)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2012, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-zimmerman-martin-case-why-so-cleanly-divided-between-the-parties/617036/131 "2012-04-03T14:39:08Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > “never”? Are you sure? What if I show you a few such reports? Like this one: > 10. June 24, 2007 – 12:48 a.m. > Type: TEL > Subject: Suspicious activity > Report: “By the pool”, two Hispanic males and one white male with “slim jim” Terr, Yes seeing two males at night with a slim jim is “with cause” Go back and try again. Where did he call “without cause” as I stated 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2012, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-zimmerman-martin-case-why-so-cleanly-divided-between-the-parties/617036/132 "2012-04-03T14:41:44Z")
I assume you are asking for some examples of Zimmerman calling 911 to report some true Scotsmen. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![rat\_avatar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rat_avatar/32/255_2.png) [@rat\_avatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rat_avatar)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2012, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-zimmerman-martin-case-why-so-cleanly-divided-between-the-parties/617036/133 "2012-04-03T14:51:35Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > I assume you are asking for some examples of Zimmerman calling 911 to report some true Scotsmen. > > Regards, > Shodan No, earlier I said that the fact that he only called in black males without cause indicated there may be a racism involved. Calling in two Hispanics with a burglary tool is not “without cause” The police were not called just because they were in existence near his home. ---
**Author:** ![rat\_avatar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rat_avatar/32/255_2.png) [@rat\_avatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rat_avatar)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2012, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-zimmerman-martin-case-why-so-cleanly-divided-between-the-parties/617036/134 "2012-04-03T15:50:29Z")
> [@rat\_avatar](#): > > No, earlier I said that the fact that he only called in black males without cause indicated there may be a racism involved. > > Calling in two Hispanics with a burglary tool is not “without cause” > > The police were not called just because they were in existence near his home. I just realized that many people probably thought a “slim jim” was the snack food in this instance. It is also the name for a tool that is meant to bypass the locks on a car, it is a thin long metal tool that reaches down inside the car door to move the rods that operate the lock and door directly. ---
**Author:** ![Rand\_Rover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/db5fbb/32.png) [@Rand\_Rover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rand_Rover)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2012, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-zimmerman-martin-case-why-so-cleanly-divided-between-the-parties/617036/135 "2012-04-03T15:53:41Z")
> [@you\_with\_the\_face](#): > > One thing that stands out to me, at least on this board, is that there seems to be more ideological diversity on the pro-Martin side than on the pro-Zimmerman side. > > The posters who have defended Zimmerman (and the cops) usually present as conservative here. > > But the posters who have decried Zimmerman’s actions (and the cops) span the gamut from **monstro** to **Lonesomepolecat**. Both liberal types and conservatives. It’s quite interesting to see this, actually. For once, race doesn’t seem to be strongly tied to how you see this issue. > > What does this mean? I don’t know. But it could be an indicator as to who the far right is vs. everyone else. Who are the posters who have defended Zimmerman? ---
**Author:** ![gamerunknown](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/6bbea6/32.png) [@gamerunknown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gamerunknown)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2012, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-zimmerman-martin-case-why-so-cleanly-divided-between-the-parties/617036/136 "2012-04-03T16:14:15Z")
> [@](#): > > I just realized that many people probably thought a “slim jim” was the snack food in this instance. It would mesh with his previous patterns of behaviour. Black male, skinny build, 7 to 9? ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2012, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-zimmerman-martin-case-why-so-cleanly-divided-between-the-parties/617036/137 "2012-04-03T16:52:52Z")
> [@gamerunknown](#): > > It would mesh with his previous patterns of behaviour. Black male, skinny build, 7 to 9? That report was hardly without cause - Zimmerman reported a child who was apparently lost. But you are correct - it does mesh with the behavior of a neighborhood watch captain. Zimmerman reported all kinds of things, ranging from loud parties thru open garage doors to suspicious activity. And it doesn’t seem to correlate very much with race AFAICT. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![rat\_avatar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rat_avatar/32/255_2.png) [@rat\_avatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rat_avatar)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2012, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-zimmerman-martin-case-why-so-cleanly-divided-between-the-parties/617036/138 "2012-04-03T17:22:26Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > That report was hardly without cause - Zimmerman reported a child who was apparently lost. > > But you are correct - it does mesh with the behavior of a neighborhood watch captain. Zimmerman reported all kinds of things, ranging from loud parties thru open garage doors to suspicious activity. And it doesn’t seem to correlate very much with race AFAICT. > > Regards, > Shodan Go back and look, besides the lost child the only time he called in “suspicious” e.g. no valid reason to call the “suspect” was black. It does not prove he was racist but it does indicate it is quite possible. It may be that the only shifty eyed types that were around his apartment complex were black…unlikely but possible. ---
**Author:** ![rat\_avatar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rat_avatar/32/255_2.png) [@rat\_avatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rat_avatar)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2012, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-zimmerman-martin-case-why-so-cleanly-divided-between-the-parties/617036/139 "2012-04-03T17:43:44Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > That report was hardly without cause - Zimmerman reported a child who was apparently lost. > > But you are correct - it does mesh with the behavior of a neighborhood watch captain. Zimmerman reported all kinds of things, ranging from loud parties thru open garage doors to suspicious activity. And it doesn’t seem to correlate very much with race AFAICT. > > Regards, > Shodan Note he was a self-appointed neighborhood block watch captain, thus he was not a captain just the local busy body. ---
**Author:** ![Condescending\_Robot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a183cd/32.png) [@Condescending\_Robot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Condescending_Robot)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2012, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-zimmerman-martin-case-why-so-cleanly-divided-between-the-parties/617036/140 "2012-04-03T19:06:46Z")
> [@rat\_avatar](#): > > Note he was a self-appointed neighborhood block watch captain, thus he was not a captain just the local busy body. Yes, he was self-appointed to a position of command that he made up over a nonexistent neighborhood watch. This is relevant to his delusions of power that culminated in him deciding, Raskolnikov-like, that law and morality do not apply to him and he can commit murder on a whim. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-zimmerman-martin-case-why-so-cleanly-divided-between-the-parties/617036.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-zimmerman-martin-case-why-so-cleanly-divided-between-the-parties/617036.md?page=8)