# There might just be a reason that Lissener gets repeated pittings. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 10, 2009, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/there-might-just-be-a-reason-that-lissener-gets-repeated-pittings/499278 "2009-06-10T00:42:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2009, 3:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/there-might-just-be-a-reason-that-lissener-gets-repeated-pittings/499278/81 "2009-06-13T03:48:27Z")
> [@Frank](#): > > **lissener** is actually one of the very few to have been banned, and allowed back. This bewilders me. He is just like **collounsbury** in my mind; someone with vast and deep knowledge in his areas of expertise, yet someone who just cannot help being a vast and deep asshole about it. Yet Collounsbury contributed honest to God intelligent substance to Great Debates, and lissener contributes … … … … … I got nuthin’ ---
**Author:** ![Yookeroo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yookeroo/32/323_2.png) [@Yookeroo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yookeroo)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2009, 8:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/there-might-just-be-a-reason-that-lissener-gets-repeated-pittings/499278/82 "2009-06-13T08:12:16Z")
> [@Hamlet](#): > > Yet Collounsbury contributed honest to God intelligent substance to Great Debates, and lissener contributes … > > … > > … > … > … > > I got nuthin’ And **Collounsbury** gave us a point of view that we don’t see a whole lot of around here. Not so much the case with **lissener**. ---
**Author:** ![Argent\_Towers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e8c25b/32.png) [@Argent\_Towers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Argent_Towers)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2009, 11:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/there-might-just-be-a-reason-that-lissener-gets-repeated-pittings/499278/83 "2009-06-13T11:03:36Z")
> [@acsenray](#): > > Perhaps consider that “not keeping my slave name” just might be a sincere motivation for some number of people and not just crapola. Muhammad Ali actually endured a significant blow to his popularity when he changed his name. Pretty stupid, since Muhammad was an advocate of slavery, and the Muslims have been practicing human slavery (some say to this very day, in certain countries) in the name of Islam loooong before Whitey ever came along. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2009, 1:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/there-might-just-be-a-reason-that-lissener-gets-repeated-pittings/499278/84 "2009-06-13T13:46:05Z")
How is that relevant? We’re talking about the sincerity of Muhammad Ali’s action, not whether you would choose it for yourself. (And, I might point out, it seems to me that the the “slave name” thing has to to with one’s ancestors being slaves, not whether they were slave-owners.) ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2009, 2:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/there-might-just-be-a-reason-that-lissener-gets-repeated-pittings/499278/85 "2009-06-13T14:05:58Z")
> [@Cat\_Fight](#): > > Do people who anglicize their names (as her father did) regularly pass their ‘ethnic’ ones down to their offspring? I’ve heard several variations of her ‘real’ name, so methinks this has a hint of urban legend. Not that there aren’t plenty of real cases (_cough_ Natalie Herschlag). Unreal, too - Laurel Jane Juspeczyk. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2009, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/there-might-just-be-a-reason-that-lissener-gets-repeated-pittings/499278/86 "2009-06-13T14:20:48Z")
> [@Cat\_Fight](#): > > IDo people who anglicize their names (as her father did) regularly pass their ‘ethnic’ ones down to their offspring? There are some number of entertainers who use stage names, but don’t change their legal names (I think Alexander Siddig is one example), so I would assume that they pass their original names to their children. The children of Martin Sheen (Ramón Estévez) have apparently kept their ethnic family name, although one of them (Charlie Sheen) uses the anglicized name as his own stage name. This is probably not relevant to Aniston’s case, though, since so far as I know her father wasn’t an entertainer. ---
**Author:** ![Purd\_Werfect](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e47c2d/32.png) [@Purd\_Werfect](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Purd_Werfect)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2009, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/there-might-just-be-a-reason-that-lissener-gets-repeated-pittings/499278/87 "2009-06-13T18:21:45Z")
> [@Isamu](#): > > Since we’re in the pit - Momus is an insufferable bore. 😛 Maybe now, but his early on works **Circus Maximus** and the **Murderers, Hope of Women** ep were stunning. **Tender Pervert** has some real weak points, but it also contains a few incredible songs. Later on, when he seemingly became obsessed with singing about sex, he did indeed become pretty boring, though he still tosses off (ha!) the occasional great song. ---
**Author:** ![Beware\_of\_Doug](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/278dde/32.png) [@Beware\_of\_Doug](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beware_of_Doug)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2009, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/there-might-just-be-a-reason-that-lissener-gets-repeated-pittings/499278/88 "2009-06-13T18:41:09Z")
> [@acsenray](#): > > There are some number of entertainers who use stage names, but don’t change their legal names (I think Alexander Siddig is one example), so I would assume that they pass their original names to their children. > > The children of Martin Sheen (Ramón Estévez) have apparently kept their ethnic family name, although one of them (Charlie Sheen) uses the anglicized name as his own stage name. Right. Charlie is legally Carlos Irwin Estévez. BTW, Martin adopted “Sheen” in honor of [Bishop Fulton Sheen](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fulton_J._Sheen), whom he admired. It’s not anglicized _from_ anything, but does reflect his half-Irish origins. As for Fred Astaire, he gave up Austerlitz amidst all the German-bashing of the WW1 era. His ancestry was Alsatian (Franco-German) - Astaire was a Frenchification some of his ancestors had used. ---
**Author:** ![flonks](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3ab097/32.png) [@flonks](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flonks)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2009, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/there-might-just-be-a-reason-that-lissener-gets-repeated-pittings/499278/89 "2009-06-13T19:04:24Z")
Can we settle this by just calling it “mook rock”? 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Rubystreak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Rubystreak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rubystreak)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2009, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/there-might-just-be-a-reason-that-lissener-gets-repeated-pittings/499278/90 "2009-06-13T19:18:49Z")
> [@acsenray](#): > > This is probably not relevant to Aniston’s case, though, since so far as I know her father wasn’t an entertainer. Her father is the soap opera actor [John Aniston](http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0030100/) aka Yannis Anastassakis. Jennifer took his anglicized last name. Another difference between Erykah Badu and Mohammad Ali and Kareem Abdul Jabar is that they changed their names for religious reasons, while Badu changed hers from Erica Johnson because she didn’t like it. I’m not saying I have a problem with it, since a lot of musicians, esp. hip hop artists, use stage names. Also, saying you dislike Tori Amos is a vastly different statement from saying she’s a sell out. You’re perfectly entitled not to like her, but it would seem that you don’t know her history and what she’s gone through with her record labels. She’s far from a sell out. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2009, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/there-might-just-be-a-reason-that-lissener-gets-repeated-pittings/499278/91 "2009-06-14T00:01:33Z")
> [@Rubystreak](#): > > Her father is the soap opera actor [John Aniston](http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0030100/) aka Yannis Anastassakis. Jennifer took his anglicized last name. No, she didn’t take it, it was given to her. Again, **it’s her real name.** ---
**Author:** ![Rubystreak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Rubystreak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rubystreak)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2009, 12:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/there-might-just-be-a-reason-that-lissener-gets-repeated-pittings/499278/92 "2009-06-14T00:36:11Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > No, she didn’t take it, it was given to her. Again, **it’s her real name.** You get what I’m saying. It’s her real name, because she took it from her father, who anglicized it. Please don’t nitpick me. ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2009, 3:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/there-might-just-be-a-reason-that-lissener-gets-repeated-pittings/499278/93 "2009-06-14T03:43:54Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > There’s also the fact that Jennifer Aniston is, in fact, the woman’s real name. Her father had changed his surname before she was born. Somehow, I have acquired quite a few friends of Greek origins over the years and nearly all of the ones I have met that have traditional Greek first names go by a more anglicized name when dealing with the general public. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2009, 9:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/there-might-just-be-a-reason-that-lissener-gets-repeated-pittings/499278/94 "2009-06-14T09:54:00Z")
> [@Purd\_Werfect](#): > > **Tender Pervert** has some real weak points, but it also contains a few incredible songs. This is the only Momus I know, and I really like it. So are you saying the earlier stuff is even better? ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2009, 2:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/there-might-just-be-a-reason-that-lissener-gets-repeated-pittings/499278/95 "2009-06-14T14:05:57Z")
> [@flonks](#): > > Can we settle this by just calling it “mook rock”? 🙂 How about Fraggle Rock? Does lissener have a PhD level discussion on the merits of Fraggle rock and how it was influenced by 14th century monks? ---
**Author:** ![Purd\_Werfect](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e47c2d/32.png) [@Purd\_Werfect](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Purd_Werfect)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2009, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/there-might-just-be-a-reason-that-lissener-gets-repeated-pittings/499278/96 "2009-06-14T15:07:54Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > This is the only Momus I know, and I really like it. So are you saying the earlier stuff is even better? Yes, yes, yes. The other [two](http://www.amazon.com/Poison-Boyfriend-Momus/dp/B000007078/ref=ntt_mus_ep_dpi_lnk) [releases](http://www.amazon.com/Circus-Maximus-Momus/dp/B0000080M0/ref=ntt_mus_ep_dpi_lnk) I mentioned are awesome. (The first link includes the EP I previously mentioned, and is a great album besides.) Circus Maximus is expensive in CD form, but cheap in Amazon MP3s. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2009, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/there-might-just-be-a-reason-that-lissener-gets-repeated-pittings/499278/97 "2009-06-14T18:13:35Z")
Cool, I’ll check them out. As for \*\*lissener \*\*- dumb drama queen [can’t just apologise](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=11239369&postcount=59) and leave it at that, can he? Love the mod response. ---
**Author:** ![CaveMike](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cavemike/32/16379_2.png) [@CaveMike](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CaveMike)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2009, 5:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/there-might-just-be-a-reason-that-lissener-gets-repeated-pittings/499278/98 "2009-06-15T05:08:36Z")
> [@woodstockbirdybird](#): > > I can count on 2 fingers the number of my close friends who think my all-time favorite band is awesome, but I don’t condemn the rest as ignorant fools for not feeling the same way I do. Let me guess, your friends are Daryl Hall and John Oates? ---
**Author:** ![Isamu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/7c8e57/32.png) [@Isamu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Isamu)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2009, 5:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/there-might-just-be-a-reason-that-lissener-gets-repeated-pittings/499278/99 "2009-06-15T05:52:00Z")
> [@Purd\_Werfect](#): > > Maybe now, but his early on works **Circus Maximus** and the **Murderers, Hope of Women** ep were stunning. **Tender Pervert** has some real weak points, but it also contains a few incredible songs. > > Later on, when he seemingly became obsessed with singing about sex, he did indeed become pretty boring, though he still tosses off (ha!) the occasional great song. Oh I wasn’t talking so much about his music (which I think is pretty good in terms of witty lyricism) but his philosophical musings over at his click opera site. I still read it all anyway - I just have to bang my head against the wall whenever he feels compelled to talk about Japan (which is far too often). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/there-might-just-be-a-reason-that-lissener-gets-repeated-pittings/499278.md?page=4)