# There's a reason they chose her to spread this message... **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [October 10, 2006, 12:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-reason-they-chose-her-to-spread-this-message/375916 "2006-10-10T12:45:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Sailboat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sailboat/32/461_2.png) [@Sailboat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sailboat)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2006, 12:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-reason-they-chose-her-to-spread-this-message/375916/1 "2006-10-10T12:45:41Z")
Meaning no disrespect to a serious cause, am I a bad person for indulging in an ironic chuckle over the name of the person chosen as spokesperson? As you can see in the story [here,](http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15181642/) Native Americans are asking that the word “squaw” be removed from various place names. They say it’s a very dirty word, and I have no reason to doubt them; but the reason they want it removed is not that it’s dirty, but that it demeans and disparages people. I’m okay with that. I have no problem with their campaign and wish them well. I don’t intend to start a debate about the word. I can’t help but laugh a little, however, out of the fact that they’ve chosen, as their spokesperson to spearhead the campaign against a demeaning term, **Norma Peon**. Sailboat ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2006, 12:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-reason-they-chose-her-to-spread-this-message/375916/2 "2006-10-10T12:57:56Z")
I’ve always understood squaw to mean woman, but I acknowledge that native americans find it offensive. However, a native american friend of mine gave me a recipe for Squaw Corn. Kinda hard to determine how offensive it is. I don’t get where the “offense” comes in if it means “woman.” I guess I’ll tell my little niece to start calling it Native American Corn. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2006, 1:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-reason-they-chose-her-to-spread-this-message/375916/3 "2006-10-10T13:06:00Z")
That article is on MSNBC? Was it written by a ten-year-old? > [@](#): > > It was an honor, Harwood said. Its how you use the word, not what the word means. Its funny how words change. Gay used to mean happy. > > What do you think > > Should Idaho seek to change geographic names that use the term squaw? That’s just embarrassing. Daniel ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2006, 1:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-reason-they-chose-her-to-spread-this-message/375916/4 "2006-10-10T13:09:11Z")
Seeing as it means “woman” (and not “filthy whore”, according to my dictionary), what word do they want us to use in place of it? ---
**Author:** ![Sailboat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sailboat/32/461_2.png) [@Sailboat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sailboat)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2006, 1:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-reason-they-chose-her-to-spread-this-message/375916/5 "2006-10-10T13:15:49Z")
**Kalhoun** , I’m asking that we not debate the issue in this thread. To address your specific complaint, I would venture a guess that dictionaries in general may be [bowdlerized](http://www.m-w.com/dictionary/bowdlerize). Think about it. **LHOD** , to be honest, I read the article in a local (physical) paper and ust quickly Googled for an online source to quote. I didn’t mean to get “Ten-year-olds present: today’s news!” 😉 That does look like a book report, doesn’t it? Sailboat ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2006, 1:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-reason-they-chose-her-to-spread-this-message/375916/6 "2006-10-10T13:21:18Z")
You see, the spokeswoman’s name is a perfect example of a case where one word that’s offensive (at least to the OP) in one language is not in another. The lowest grade for any trade or industrial job is a peón, in Spanish. Second lowest is a peón especializado. In chess, it’s the name for the pawns. Nothing wrong with the term at all. So long as I’m speaking English, a “plaza” is a building (usually a singular one, but not always, I’ve seen English-language “plazas” that were completely surrounded by other buildings); when I speak Spanish it’s an open space between buildings where several streets meet (what’s called a “square” in English). Squaw may be insulting in its original language - in English, it’s not. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2006, 1:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-reason-they-chose-her-to-spread-this-message/375916/7 "2006-10-10T13:37:25Z")
[Cecil on the word “squaw”.](http://www.straightdope.com/columns/000317.html) ---
**Author:** ![corkboard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9bcb4/32.png) [@corkboard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/corkboard)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2006, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-reason-they-chose-her-to-spread-this-message/375916/8 "2006-10-10T13:39:27Z")
> [@](#): > > Also on the councils docket: a proposal to change Saint Marys Nipple near Idaho Falls to Saint Marys Knoll. This just made me giggle. And I think they accidentally ran the unedited draft of the story- it is missing quotation marks and apostrophes throughout. ---
**Author:** ![yBeayf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/e274bd/32.png) [@yBeayf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yBeayf)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2006, 1:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-reason-they-chose-her-to-spread-this-message/375916/9 "2006-10-10T13:41:14Z")
> [@](#): > > So long as I’m speaking English, a “plaza” is a building (usually a singular one, but not always, I’ve seen English-language “plazas” that were completely surrounded by other buildings); when I speak Spanish it’s an open space between buildings where several streets meet (what’s called a “square” in English). What you give as the meaning of “plaza” in Spanish is its meaning in English, too. I’ve never heard it used to refer to a building. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2006, 2:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-reason-they-chose-her-to-spread-this-message/375916/10 "2006-10-10T14:01:00Z")
[QUOTE=yBeayf] What you give as the meaning of “plaza” in Spanish is its meaning in English, too. I’ve never heard it used to refer to a building. [/QUOTE] Well, at least in Florida, “Plaza” usually refers to a building or collection of buildings similar to a shopping mall, but with no enclosed space between the shops (i.e. you walk in the open air between them.) Occasionally you will see the word referring to a semi-enclosed place such as Nava and yourself refer to. And occasionally you will see buildings developers _want_ to be associated with that, more “upscale” meaning, referred to as plazas even when they aren’t. ---
**Author:** ![Smeghead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f1d935/32.png) [@Smeghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smeghead)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2006, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-reason-they-chose-her-to-spread-this-message/375916/11 "2006-10-10T16:38:52Z")
[QUOTE=Kalhoun] However, a native american friend of mine gave me a recipe for Squaw Corn. Kinda hard to determine how offensive it is. I don’t get where the “offense” comes in if it means “woman.” I guess I’ll tell my little niece to start calling it Native American Corn. [/QUOTE] Maize. They call it Native American Maize. ---
**Author:** ![Diceman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Diceman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diceman)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2006, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-reason-they-chose-her-to-spread-this-message/375916/12 "2006-10-10T16:43:51Z")
[QUOTE=Smeghead] Maize. They call it Native American Maize. [/QUOTE] I thought that it was mostly Europeans who use the term “maize.” And University of Michigan fans 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Bambi\_Hassenpfeffer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Bambi\_Hassenpfeffer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bambi_Hassenpfeffer)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2006, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-reason-they-chose-her-to-spread-this-message/375916/13 "2006-10-10T16:53:35Z")
[QUOTE=yBeayf] What you give as the meaning of “plaza” in Spanish is its meaning in English, too. I’ve never heard it used to refer to a building. [/QUOTE] [Irving Plaza](http://www.irvingplaza.com/), a concert venue [, a mall [url=http://www.ichotelsgroup.com/crowneplaza](http://www.shopinternationalplaza.com/%5B/url), a hotel chain [url=[http://www.plazahotelcasino.com/](http://www.plazahotelcasino.com/), a single hotel That’s just four out of many on Google ---
**Author:** ![Bambi\_Hassenpfeffer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Bambi\_Hassenpfeffer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bambi_Hassenpfeffer)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2006, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-reason-they-chose-her-to-spread-this-message/375916/14 "2006-10-10T16:55:22Z")
[QUOTE=yBeayf] What you give as the meaning of “plaza” in Spanish is its meaning in English, too. I’ve never heard it used to refer to a building. [/QUOTE] [Irving Plaza](http://www.irvingplaza.com/), a concert venue [International Plaza](http://www.shopinternationalplaza.com/), a mall [Crowne Plaza](http://www.ichotelsgroup.com/crowneplaza), a hotel chain [Plaza Hotel & Casino](http://www.plazahotelcasino.com/), a single hotel [South Coast Plaza](http://www.southcoastplaza.com/), a mall That’s just five out of many from a Google search for “plaza”. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2006, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-reason-they-chose-her-to-spread-this-message/375916/15 "2006-10-10T17:06:48Z")
I confess some ignorance as to the OP: how is Norma Peon a funny name? I have a feeling I’m about to use the forehead-smacking smile. Daniel ---
**Author:** ![Kizarvexius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/da6949/32.png) [@Kizarvexius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kizarvexius)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2006, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-reason-they-chose-her-to-spread-this-message/375916/16 "2006-10-10T17:11:49Z")
At the hospital where Kizarvexilla was born, the lactation counselor’s last name was Udder. Isn’t that just karma at work? ---
**Author:** ![WhyNot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c77e96/32.png) [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2006, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-reason-they-chose-her-to-spread-this-message/375916/17 "2006-10-10T17:15:40Z")
[QUOTE=Left Hand of Dorkness] I confess some ignorance as to the OP: how is Norma Peon a funny name? I have a feeling I’m about to use the forehead-smacking smile. Daniel [/QUOTE] Peon = 1. a. An unskilled laborer or farm worker of Latin America or the southwest United States. b. Such a worker bound in servitude to a landlord creditor. 2. A menial worker; a drudge. 3. also (pyn) In India and other parts of South and Southeast Asia, a person of menial position, especially a messenger, servant, or foot soldier. It’s got a fairly negative connotation, somewhat akin to “minion” or “servant”, which could also be said, in some nations, of “squaw”. ---
**Author:** ![WhyNot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c77e96/32.png) [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2006, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-reason-they-chose-her-to-spread-this-message/375916/18 "2006-10-10T17:16:45Z")
Sorry, the above definition comes from [www.freedictionary.com](http://www.freedictionary.com) ---
**Author:** ![Contrapuntal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e274bd/32.png) [@Contrapuntal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contrapuntal)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2006, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-reason-they-chose-her-to-spread-this-message/375916/19 "2006-10-10T17:16:56Z")
[QUOTE=Left Hand of Dorkness] I confess some ignorance as to the OP: how is Norma Peon a funny name? I have a feeling I’m about to use the forehead-smacking smile. Daniel [/QUOTE] It’s just that “peon” is seen by some to be a derogatory word. So for her to be the spokesperson against the use of “squaw” is ironic. ---
**Author:** ![WhyNot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c77e96/32.png) [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2006, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-reason-they-chose-her-to-spread-this-message/375916/20 "2006-10-10T17:19:28Z")
[QUOTE=Contrapuntal] It’s just that “peon” is seen by some to be a derogatory word. So for her to be the spokesperson against the use of “squaw” is ironic. [/QUOTE] But more specifically that, again in \*some \*Nations, “squaw” pretty much means “female peon” or “female person of little or no social worth or value who does only menial labor.” [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-reason-they-chose-her-to-spread-this-message/375916.md?page=2)