# "There's a Wire Above Manhattan That You've Probably Never Noticed" - Fascinating **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [March 8, 2017, 2:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-wire-above-manhattan-that-youve-probably-never-noticed-fascinating/781667 "2017-03-08T02:26:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Sailboat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sailboat/32/461_2.png) [@Sailboat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sailboat)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2017, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-wire-above-manhattan-that-youve-probably-never-noticed-fascinating/781667/61 "2017-03-08T17:33:33Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Feakin’ hell! > > Armadillos! Not aardvarks! Sheesh. I am not going to earn any laurels as a zoologist. I was picturing armadillos, calling them capybaras, and correcting myself to aardvarks. I better sit down before I’m attacked by a pangolin. Henceforth to be known in SDMB lore as Bricker’s Armadillo Peccadillo. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2017, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-wire-above-manhattan-that-youve-probably-never-noticed-fascinating/781667/62 "2017-03-08T17:53:42Z")
> [@Sailboat](#): > > Henceforth to be known in SDMB lore as Bricker’s Armadillo Peccadillo. aka The Aardvark Lark. Or Bricker’s Capybaras Capitulation. ---
**Author:** ![Dendarii\_Dame](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/bbce88/32.png) [@Dendarii\_Dame](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dendarii_Dame)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2017, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-wire-above-manhattan-that-youve-probably-never-noticed-fascinating/781667/63 "2017-03-08T19:29:44Z")
That point about goat cheese and meat from a cow is referenced in one of Harry Kemelman’s Rabbi Small mysteries, I think Tuesday the Rabbi Saw Red. He says a cousin of his is called the “apikoros” (a person who doesn’t follow rabbinic tradition) because he makes that very point. In the Middle Ages, a barnacle goose was considered to be a fish because nobody knew where it nested. (Turns out it nested so far to the north nobody had seen it.) I’m sure nobody thought it was really a fish, but if you were wealthy enough, you could eat it during Lent. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2017, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-wire-above-manhattan-that-youve-probably-never-noticed-fascinating/781667/64 "2017-03-08T19:50:01Z")
> [@txjim](#): > > If technology is a valid work-around, could a solid-state switch be used to work around the problem? \*\*Can Alexa be summoned as a gentile to work around these issues? \*\* > > (not trying to be a wise-ass, genuinely interested in the “legal” aspects of religion) Unless Alexa can handle something like “Turn on the stove tomorrow at 3pm” I don’t think that will work. My probably wrong understanding is that asking a Gentile to do something on Sabbath is the same thing as you doing it on Sabbath. The arrangements have to be made beforehand. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2017, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-wire-above-manhattan-that-youve-probably-never-noticed-fascinating/781667/65 "2017-03-08T20:00:09Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > People didn’t stop to go ask a rabbi if they could carry their daughter to a hospital, these questions were posed to rabbis hypothetically, and you end up with this kind of reasoning. Some rabbi would always mention that in order to preserve the life and health of a person that the laws could be ignored, but they’d spend much longer deconstructing every aspect of the issue and offering all possible alternatives. There, you’re not entirely wrong. And sometimes the results are counter-intuitive. For example, suppose in an emergency someone must break Shabbat to save a life, but there are two people present. If one is known as a truly pious and learned Jew and the other is a Jew less observant less and less caring about the Shabbos halakha, and each are equally qualified to address the emergency, who should do so? ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2017, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-wire-above-manhattan-that-youve-probably-never-noticed-fascinating/781667/66 "2017-03-08T20:02:42Z")
> [@Sailboat](#): > > Henceforth to be known in SDMB lore as Bricker’s Armadillo Peccadillo. We’ll long remember that time Bricker capybarassed himself. ---
**Author:** ![Mona\_Lisa\_Simpson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ce7236/32.png) [@Mona\_Lisa\_Simpson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mona_Lisa_Simpson)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2017, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-wire-above-manhattan-that-youve-probably-never-noticed-fascinating/781667/67 "2017-03-08T20:39:45Z")
Quote: Originally Posted by Princhester Clearly it would be easier if you just found a co-operative Gentile with a fence around his land, and announced that his fence defined the eruv, with his land being the outside. > [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > And that gentile’s name is Wonko the Sane. 😃 That was my reaction to the post too! But seriously, I first heard of the eixistence of eruvs here on the Dope. One thread is this: [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/archive/index.php/t-31812.html](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/archive/index.php/t-31812.html) But I can’t find the one that specifically discusses Manhattan. It exists, I found out about it here. Here is a link to the [eruv of Vancouver](https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewer?mid=1lvDpkRo5LvxYoHtnPy4197dw8UU&ll=49.237481658171454%2C-123.13711789999996&z=13), BC which I found on the website of the Orthodox synagogue which is at the end of my block. I have a question though. Why is it impossible to find parking on my street on Yom Kippur, and Rosh Hashanna? I see so many orthodox Jewish people walking to temple on Saturdays, playing with their kids in the park two blocks away. Wouldn’t people be _more_ observant on the high holidays? ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2017, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-wire-above-manhattan-that-youve-probably-never-noticed-fascinating/781667/68 "2017-03-08T20:41:32Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > There, you’re not entirely wrong. > > And sometimes the results are counter-intuitive. > > For example, suppose in an emergency someone must break Shabbat to save a life, but there are two people present. If one is known as a truly pious and learned Jew and the other is a Jew less observant less and less caring about the Shabbos halakha, and each are equally qualified to address the emergency, who should do so? Since a life-threatening emergency removes the requirement to keep the Sabbath, I’d say whoever starts working on the victim first. And there still may be a need for the second person to assist. ---
**Author:** ![Mona\_Lisa\_Simpson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ce7236/32.png) [@Mona\_Lisa\_Simpson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mona_Lisa_Simpson)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2017, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-wire-above-manhattan-that-youve-probably-never-noticed-fascinating/781667/69 "2017-03-08T20:56:58Z")
> [@Mona\_Lisa\_Simpson](#): > > But seriously, I first heard of the eixistence of eruvs here on the Dope. > One thread is this: > > [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/archive/index.php/t-31812.html](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/archive/index.php/t-31812.html) > > But I can’t find the one that specifically discusses Manhattan. It exists, I found out about it here. Had I fully read the thread before jumping in, I would have realized that what I read was **cmkeller** ’s **Staff Report**. I have been on this message board for a very long time! ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2017, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-wire-above-manhattan-that-youve-probably-never-noticed-fascinating/781667/70 "2017-03-08T20:58:41Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > There, you’re not entirely wrong. > > And sometimes the results are counter-intuitive. > > For example, suppose in an emergency someone must break Shabbat to save a life, but there are two people present. If one is known as a truly pious and learned Jew and the other is a Jew less observant less and less caring about the Shabbos halakha, and each are equally qualified to address the emergency, who should do so? The relative piousity of the participants doesn’t matter. I’m sure some rabbis could come up with a rule to determine what must be done under the circumstances of two people available to preserve life and health when only one may be necessary. And there will be a prayer to say in that situation where any doubt exists. Possibly they address this subject in the AP Talmud class at your local yeshiva. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2017, 9:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-wire-above-manhattan-that-youve-probably-never-noticed-fascinating/781667/71 "2017-03-08T21:23:35Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > Since a life-threatening emergency removes the requirement to keep the Sabbath, I’d say whoever starts working on the victim first. And there still may be a need for the second person to assist. You’re fighting the hypothetical. We have two people who are each able to assist in equal measure, and both ready to. If a subsequent need arises for another, there’s no question the second can join in. But right now, only one person is needed – perhaps it’s as simple as making a phone call. Who should do it? ---
**Author:** ![gnoitall](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bb73d2/32.png) [@gnoitall](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gnoitall)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2017, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-wire-above-manhattan-that-youve-probably-never-noticed-fascinating/781667/72 "2017-03-08T22:25:35Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > You’re fighting the hypothetical. We have two people who are each able to assist in equal measure, and both ready to. If a subsequent need arises for another, there’s no question the second can join in. But right now, only one person is needed – perhaps it’s as simple as making a phone call. > > Who should do it? The [Samaritan](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parable_of_the_Good_Samaritan)? ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2017, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-wire-above-manhattan-that-youve-probably-never-noticed-fascinating/781667/73 "2017-03-08T22:33:53Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > You’re fighting the hypothetical. We have two people who are each able to assist in equal measure, and both ready to. If a subsequent need arises for another, there’s no question the second can join in. But right now, only one person is needed – perhaps it’s as simple as making a phone call. > > Who should do it? Whichever is less of a fool. ---
**Author:** ![Uzi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/91b2a8/32.png) [@Uzi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uzi)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2017, 1:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-wire-above-manhattan-that-youve-probably-never-noticed-fascinating/781667/74 "2017-03-09T01:04:25Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > He’s nuts, this kind of stuff is nuts, but at least as far as religious nutcases go I have respect for people who stick to their loony principles unlike those who find an excuse to ignore them whenever it is convenient. Unfortunately, this level of nuttery is a short distance from going whole hog like stoning people. I tend to have more respect for those that realize it is bs and act accordingly. ---
**Author:** ![F.U.Shakespeare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/aca169/32.png) [@F.U.Shakespeare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/F.U.Shakespeare)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2017, 2:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-wire-above-manhattan-that-youve-probably-never-noticed-fascinating/781667/75 "2017-03-09T02:00:33Z")
As an atheist, my first reaction is to roll my eyes at the things believers construct. But then, I wonder if an atheist’s kind of believer is one who lets God know he can’t take mortals for granted. In _Religulous_, Bill Maher interviewed an orthodox Jew who devised a telephone dialing device which had all ten digits constantly dialing separately, but all ten were blocked by an inserted insulator. A user removed in succession the appropriate insulators to dial a telephone number. The idea being, the user wasn’t actually _dialing_ a number. They were removing the barriers to a number being dialed. I pictured God snapping his fingers and muttering, "Curses - foiled again! _Why did I ever choose those people?!"_ And then realizing, because they’d become really smart, and figure out ways to improve the world, via science, ethics, etc. I’m still an atheist, but keeping an eye on things. ---
**Author:** ![doreen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/858c86/32.png) [@doreen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doreen)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2017, 2:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-wire-above-manhattan-that-youve-probably-never-noticed-fascinating/781667/76 "2017-03-09T02:03:36Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > You’re fighting the hypothetical. We have two people who are each able to assist in equal measure, and both ready to. If a subsequent need arises for another, there’s no question the second can join in. But right now, only one person is needed – perhaps it’s as simple as making a phone call. > > Who should do it? The more pious one- less risk of him going down the slippery slope to become completely non-observant, ---
**Author:** ![Spoons](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spoons/32/3141_2.png) [@Spoons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoons)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2017, 9:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-wire-above-manhattan-that-youve-probably-never-noticed-fascinating/781667/77 "2017-03-09T09:14:19Z")
I recall an extremely observant Orthodox Jew who was in charge of our group at a place I worked at maybe 25 years ago. As we got to December, he would leave early on Fridays, so as to get home before sunset. Nobody minded; we knew him and his religious requirements, and his work was always done well and on time. He was a fair and nice boss. He always left us with clear instructions as to what needed to be done after he left on Fridays, even if his departure was earlier than normal, due to sunset times. But at one Christmas–which is pretty much the darkest time of the year here in Canada–he came around to each of us non-Jews after lunch on Christmas Eve, shook our hands, and wished each of us a Merry Christmas. As I recall, he even had little candy treats for each of us. Then he hurried home, so as to be home before sunset. (Christmas Eve was Friday that year.) He was an observant Orthodox Jew, but he recognized that not everybody was. He managed to accommodate his religion with the demands of business, and made us all feel easy about it. He was a great guy, and I hope he is doing well today. There was an item in the Canadian press recently about the wires that indicate where Orthodox Jews can carry things. It showed the regions (not sure if that is the correct term) in various Canadian cities. I hope my old boss can work within these boundaries to make everybody he encounters to feel at ease with him and Judaism, just as he did with us at work. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2017, 9:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-wire-above-manhattan-that-youve-probably-never-noticed-fascinating/781667/78 "2017-03-09T09:57:59Z")
> [@Dendarii\_Dame](#): > > In the Middle Ages, a barnacle goose was considered to be a fish because nobody knew where it nested. (Turns out it nested so far to the north nobody had seen it.) I’m sure nobody thought it was really a fish, but if you were wealthy enough, you could eat it during Lent. You could eat beaver, too (hey, no sniggering!). Maybe that’s what **Bricker** was remembering, beaver tails are scaly. ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2017, 12:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-wire-above-manhattan-that-youve-probably-never-noticed-fascinating/781667/79 "2017-03-09T12:33:14Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > I’m a capyist. They all look alike to me. I just want say that I think young capys are cute. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2017, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-wire-above-manhattan-that-youve-probably-never-noticed-fascinating/781667/80 "2017-03-09T14:35:27Z")
> [@doreen](#): > > The more pious one- less risk of him going down the slippery slope to become completely non-observant, The rationale I have heard is from the comments of the Taz (Orach Chaim 328:5) that such an emergency is a teaching opportunity for observers to learn the value placed on _pikuach nefesh_, and it’s thus appropriate to demonstrate this by the most learned and respected of the qualified responders available. Another argument is Rav Shlomo Zalman Auerbach’s comment that the motive of the learned person is to act in accord with the law; the less learned person may well be acting for other reasons (a physician getting paid, for instance) and that the preference is for the former. (I am indebted to Rabbi Flug of Yeshiva University for his kind correspondence and edification on these points; if I have failed to convey a correct nuance here, the fault remains mine, naturally). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-wire-above-manhattan-that-youve-probably-never-noticed-fascinating/781667.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theres-a-wire-above-manhattan-that-youve-probably-never-noticed-fascinating/781667.md?page=5)