# They are not Replacement Refs...They are SCABS! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 25, 2012, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-not-replacement-refs-they-are-scabs/635798 "2012-09-25T17:29:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![johnpost](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f17d59/32.png) [@johnpost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/johnpost)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2012, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-not-replacement-refs-they-are-scabs/635798/81 "2012-09-26T22:37:08Z")
looks like thanks to bad calls the talks are back rolling. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2012, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-not-replacement-refs-they-are-scabs/635798/82 "2012-09-26T22:57:59Z")
> [@johnpost](#): > > looks like thanks to bad calls the talks are back rolling. And this is where my allegiance starts to shift to the regular refs. I don’t mind workers playing a strong hand, because they can be right. I like them putting their money where their opinions are. I bristle at the notion that the replacement refs are doing anything wrong (aside from the calls). The notion that they owe some allegiance to the regular refs, or “workers” writ large is nonsense. When someone refuses to show up and do a job for a particular wage, they are claiming that company couldn’t find others to do as good a job for that same wage. It appears that the refs might be proven correct. But they shouldn’t overplay their hand, cause reffing aint’t brain surgery. Give the current refs a few more weeks and the best of them will be as good as most of the regular refs. With more experience they will just get better and better. Reagan’s air traffic controllers should be front and center in their heads. Also, the notion that they deserve more just because the teams can afford it is weak. I mean, I’m sure the teams can afford to pay $1,000 per football and $500 for a jock strap. That doesn’t mean they _should_ pay it. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2012, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-not-replacement-refs-they-are-scabs/635798/83 "2012-09-26T23:50:08Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > … When someone refuses to show up and do a job … Oh, is that what happened? They chose not to work? ---
**Author:** ![al27052](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/41988e/32.png) [@al27052](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/al27052)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2012, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-not-replacement-refs-they-are-scabs/635798/84 "2012-09-27T00:32:18Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > One would expect that people who actually want to work will do a better job than lazy, greedy cunts. Fuck anyone who strikes over pay. > > (If anyone cares, I’ve just voted against striking, and will leave the union if the vote is passed). Union of what? Kneejerk conservative trolls? Even TROLLS have unions? ---
**Author:** ![Ruken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f475e1/32.png) [@Ruken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ruken)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2012, 12:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-not-replacement-refs-they-are-scabs/635798/85 "2012-09-27T00:34:30Z")
I wonder how many people upset about the NFL’s behavior have stopped watching games, buying tickets/gear/etc. Probably not that many. ---
**Author:** ![kidchameleon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/898d66/32.png) [@kidchameleon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kidchameleon)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2012, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-not-replacement-refs-they-are-scabs/635798/86 "2012-09-27T00:52:34Z")
> [@For You](#): > > Oh, is that what happened? They chose not to work? Well, they did chose not to accept the terms the NFL offered them. I presume they were smart enough to imagine the consequences. I can’t get worked up about the replacement refs and the GB-Sea game cost me $100. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2012, 4:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-not-replacement-refs-they-are-scabs/635798/87 "2012-09-27T04:48:47Z")
> [@kidchameleon](#): > > Well, they did chose not to accept the terms the NFL offered them. I presume they were smart enough to imagine the consequences. I am not saying the offer was good or bad in this case but suggesting that someone refused an offer tells you nothing. Maybe the offer was shit. There is nothing inherent about refusing an offer that make the people refusing in the wrong. I could offer to buy your house for $100. Does not make you a bad person if you refuse. ---
**Author:** ![TokyoBayer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tokyobayer/32/13989_2.png) [@TokyoBayer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TokyoBayer)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2012, 11:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-not-replacement-refs-they-are-scabs/635798/88 "2012-09-27T11:59:45Z")
It’s over, folks. Let the real games begin. ---
**Author:** ![kidchameleon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/898d66/32.png) [@kidchameleon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kidchameleon)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2012, 12:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-not-replacement-refs-they-are-scabs/635798/89 "2012-09-27T12:08:18Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > I am not saying the offer was good or bad in this case but suggesting that someone refused an offer tells you nothing. Maybe the offer was shit. There is nothing inherent about refusing an offer that make the people refusing in the wrong. I could offer to buy your house for $100. Does not make you a bad person if you refuse. Are you a replacement ref? :dubious: Was this all some convoluted scheme to get my house? Short me $100 in the confidence pool then offer it to me for my house? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![gamerunknown](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/6bbea6/32.png) [@gamerunknown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gamerunknown)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2012, 1:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-not-replacement-refs-they-are-scabs/635798/90 "2012-09-27T13:47:08Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > As far as sweatshops and the like, you do realize that a slew of laws have been passed between then and now, right? From the Universal Declaration of Human Rights: > [@UDHR](#): > > (1) Everyone has the right to work, to free choice of employment, to just and favourable conditions of work and to protection against unemployment. > (2) Everyone, without any discrimination, has the right to equal pay for equal work. > (3) Everyone who works has the right to just and favourable remuneration ensuring for himself and his family an existence worthy of human dignity, and supplemented, if necessary, by other means of social protection. > (4) Everyone has the right to form and to join trade unions for the protection of his interests. ---
**Author:** ![Hbns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hbns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hbns)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2012, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-not-replacement-refs-they-are-scabs/635798/91 "2012-09-27T14:23:58Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > You do realize that referees do more than show up at game time and go home after the game right? I’m not saying they are the working poor. I’m saying that I shouldn’t have to put up with this shit because the team owners want to save a few bucks by beating down on the real referees. Context is everything. My comment was with regard to the absurdity of pointing to NHL referees salaries as evidence that NFL refs are underpaid. It is a fucking apples and kumquats comparison. Looks pretty much like they are getting a 16% raise now ramping up to nearly 40% by 2019 and the possibility for at least some to be “full time” employees. Makes my glib comment look downright reasonable. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Cartooniverse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cartooniverse/32/3084_2.png) [@Cartooniverse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cartooniverse)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2012, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-not-replacement-refs-they-are-scabs/635798/92 "2012-09-27T14:44:04Z")
We may be witness to a surreal sight tonight: Immense 322 lb linemen approaching a Ref, taking off their helmet, gently hugging the Ref, smiling through tears of gratitude, stepping away, replacing helmet. I can’t wait. Seriously, I suspect the Refs will get a standing ovation when announced. ---
**Author:** ![Drunky\_Smurf](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drunky_smurf/32/449_2.png) [@Drunky\_Smurf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drunky_Smurf)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2012, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-not-replacement-refs-they-are-scabs/635798/93 "2012-09-27T16:06:11Z")
> [@gamerunknown](#): > > From the Universal Declaration of Human Rights: > [@](#): > > Originally Posted by UDHR > (1) …and to protection against unemployment. Agreed. So therefore Obama is a universal criminal for allowing so many to be unemployed. He needs to be imprisoned for the rest of his life. > [@](#): > > (2) Everyone, without any discrimination, has the right to equal pay for equal work. Agreed. I work in computers. Bill Gates works in computers. Therefore society owes me a couple billion dollars. > [@](#): > > (3) Everyone who works has the right to just and favourable remuneration ensuring for himself and his family an existence worthy of human dignity, and supplemented, if necessary, by other means of social protection. Agreed. Society owes me a pension that will let me live the life of Bill Gates until the day I die otherwise I will not feel dignified. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2012, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-not-replacement-refs-they-are-scabs/635798/94 "2012-09-27T18:10:22Z")
> [@gamerunknown](#): > > From the Universal Declaration of Human Rights: If you think that anything coming from the UN carries any weight with thinking people you are incorrect. But just for the hell of it, (3) Everyone who works has the right to just and favourable remuneration ensuring for himself and his family an existence worthy of human dignity, and supplemented, if necessary, by other means of social protection. Can you define “just and favourable”? And “and existence worthy of human dignity”? And after you supply those definitions, please share what you think the odds are that everyone will agree with your definition. On a more positive note, I commend you on your ability to cut and paste and not put forth an actual argument. You did that exceedingly well. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2012, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-not-replacement-refs-they-are-scabs/635798/95 "2012-09-27T18:42:49Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > If you think that anything coming from the UN carries any weight with thinking people you are incorrect. Having legal effect =/= “carrying weight with thinking people”. If you actually think the UNDHR doesn’t carry any weight, you’re not just incorrect, you’re retarded. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2012, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-not-replacement-refs-they-are-scabs/635798/96 "2012-09-27T19:27:03Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Having legal effect =/= “carrying weight with thinking people”. If you actually think the UNDHR doesn’t carry any weight, you’re not just incorrect, you’re retarded. I was talking about the conservative philosophy, not legality. Surely you should have been able to glean that from the discussion. Evidently not. But since you seem so interested in this subject, why don’t you answer the questions I posed in the post you felt the need to respond to? I’ll wait. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2012, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-not-replacement-refs-they-are-scabs/635798/97 "2012-09-27T19:42:49Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > As far as sweatshops and the like, you do realize that a slew of laws have been passed between then and now, right? Please. In the US sure. So factories move to places where the government is less concerned with pesky human rights laws. You do realize sweatshops still exist, right? Please. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2012, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-not-replacement-refs-they-are-scabs/635798/98 "2012-09-27T19:51:56Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > In the US sure. > > So factories move to places where the government is less concerned with pesky human rights laws. > > You do realize sweatshops still exist, right? Please. Uh, we’re talking about the U.S. Feel free to reread the thread. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2012, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-not-replacement-refs-they-are-scabs/635798/99 "2012-09-27T20:26:57Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > Uh, we’re talking about the U.S. Feel free to reread the thread. Your notions lead us back to those grand old days. Companies have not become enlightened. They are entirely self interested and clearly will happily employ sweatshop workers. In your world where the market rules all then it inexorably leads to those results. We know this because it has happened in the US and is still happening elsewhere. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2012, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-not-replacement-refs-they-are-scabs/635798/100 "2012-09-27T21:18:39Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > I bristle at the notion that the replacement refs are doing anything wrong (aside from the calls). That’s my biggest problem with them. If they did just as good a job then I don’t think people would give a shit. I think everything about professional sports is overpaid. > [@](#): > > The notion that they owe some allegiance to the regular refs, or “workers” writ large is nonsense. If they are negotiating over pay and benefits, then no. If they are negotiating over working conditions or the right to organize, then yes. > [@](#): > > When someone refuses to show up and do a job for a particular wage, they are claiming that company couldn’t find others to do as good a job for that same wage. That’s not what happened. > [@](#): > > But they shouldn’t overplay their hand, cause reffing aint’t brain surgery. You mean they shouldn’t make the same mistake the team owners did? > [@](#): > > Give the current refs a few more weeks and the best of them will be as good as most of the regular refs. With more experience they will just get better and better. Reagan’s air traffic controllers should be front and center in their heads. The air traffic controllers weren’t locked out, they went on strike, an illegal strike. Why are you having so much trouble understanding that the referees were locked out not because of their own greed but because of the team owner’s greed? And no, the replacement referees won’t be as good with a little more practice. Its not like they were picked out of the stands and got better with experience. All the replacement referees have experience, they’re just not very good. > [@Cartooniverse](#): > > We may be witness to a surreal sight tonight: > > Immense 322 lb linemen approaching a Ref, taking off their helmet, gently hugging the Ref, smiling through tears of gratitude, stepping away, replacing helmet. > > I can’t wait. Seriously, I suspect the Refs will get a standing ovation when announced. There’s a game tonight? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-not-replacement-refs-they-are-scabs/635798.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-not-replacement-refs-they-are-scabs/635798.md?page=6)