# THEY are the fascists, the traitors and the anti-ameircan liars **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 7, 2009, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-the-fascists-the-traitors-and-the-anti-ameircan-liars/505665 "2009-08-07T17:41:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 14
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2009, 1:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-the-fascists-the-traitors-and-the-anti-ameircan-liars/505665/261 "2009-08-11T13:41:23Z")
> [@Carol\_Stream](#): > > Where is the competition under single-payer? > > [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zZ-6ebku3\_E](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zZ-6ebku3_E) I finally read the whole quote from Obama in 2007, as posted in GD. > [@](#): > > As I indicated before, I think that we’re going to have to have some system where people can buy into a larger pool. Right now their pool typically is the employer, but there are other ways of doing it. I would like to – I would hope that we could set up a system that allows those who can go through their employer to access a federal system or a state pool of some sort. But I don’t think we’re going to be able to eliminate employer coverage immediately. There’s going to be potentially some transition process. **I can envision a decade out or 15 years out or 20 years out where we’ve got a much more portable system. Employers still have the option of providing coverage, but many people may find that they get better coverage, or at least coverage that gives them more for health care dollars than they spend outside of their employer.** And I think we’ve got to facilitate that and let individuals make that choice to transition out of employer coverage. Carol Stream, you are a dishonest piece of filth whose very presence on this board causes convulsions and boils. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2009, 2:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-the-fascists-the-traitors-and-the-anti-ameircan-liars/505665/262 "2009-08-11T14:10:43Z")
> [@Mr.Svinlesha](#): > > In reference to a couple of posts by **athelas** on page 2 (#68, to be exact): > > Some additional information has [since since](http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/stories.nsf/stlouiscitycounty/story/7C2B91CFCB7B4D398625760D0008E6EA?OpenDocument) surfaced: > > Republicans: too fucking stupid for words. [I’ve run across a better one](http://www.ibdeditorials.com/IBDArticles.aspx?id=333933006516877): > [@](#): > > People such as scientist Stephen Hawking wouldn’t have a chance in the U.K., where the National Health Service would say the life of this brilliant man, because of his physical handicaps, is essentially worthless. Yes, [this Stephen Hawking](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_Hawking): > [@](#): > > Stephen William Hawking, CH, CBE, FRS, FRSA (born 8 January 1942) is a British theoretical physicist. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2009, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-the-fascists-the-traitors-and-the-anti-ameircan-liars/505665/263 "2009-08-11T14:43:00Z")
> [@jsgoddess](#): > > [I’ve run across a better one](http://www.ibdeditorials.com/IBDArticles.aspx?id=333933006516877): Yes. Yes you have. You should probably cross-post that in the “Stupid Republican of the day” thing, although it’s kind of annoying that the article doesn’t actually have anyone’s name appended to it. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2009, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-the-fascists-the-traitors-and-the-anti-ameircan-liars/505665/264 "2009-08-11T15:42:57Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Yes. Yes you have. > > You should probably cross-post that in the “Stupid Republican of the day” thing, although it’s kind of annoying that the article doesn’t actually have anyone’s name appended to it. I wouldn’t let them put MY name on it, either. I was tempted to start a new thread, defying anyone to top it. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Svinlesha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/22d042/32.png) [@Mr.Svinlesha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Svinlesha)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2009, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-the-fascists-the-traitors-and-the-anti-ameircan-liars/505665/265 "2009-08-11T15:47:45Z")
Sorry, **js** , but you’re still behind the curve: check my last few posts in the neighboring thread, **Limbaugh: Hitler, Lenin, Stalin were all men of the left**. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2009, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-the-fascists-the-traitors-and-the-anti-ameircan-liars/505665/266 "2009-08-11T15:50:50Z")
If we define socialism as simply government control of production, then any authoritarian government is “socialist”. The key factor is the people’s control of the government. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2009, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-the-fascists-the-traitors-and-the-anti-ameircan-liars/505665/267 "2009-08-11T15:54:17Z")
> [@Mr.Svinlesha](#): > > Sorry, **js** , but you’re still behind the curve: check my last few posts in the neighboring thread, **Limbaugh: Hitler, Lenin, Stalin were all men of the left**. > 🙂 NOOOOOOOOO! Damn… yoooooou… Oh well. The more people pointing out stuff like this, the better. _sob sob_ ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Svinlesha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/22d042/32.png) [@Mr.Svinlesha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Svinlesha)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2009, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-the-fascists-the-traitors-and-the-anti-ameircan-liars/505665/268 "2009-08-11T16:00:39Z")
Do not despair, young **goddess**. _/bad 70s TV show reference/_ When you can snatch the pebble from my hand, you will be ready to leave the message board. _/end bad 70s TV show reference/_ ---
**Author:** ![Rhythmdvl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/85f322/32.png) [@Rhythmdvl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rhythmdvl)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2009, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-the-fascists-the-traitors-and-the-anti-ameircan-liars/505665/269 "2009-08-11T16:06:46Z")
> [@jsgoddess](#): > > [I’ve run across a better one](http://www.ibdeditorials.com/IBDArticles.aspx?id=333933006516877): > > Yes, [this Stephen Hawking](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_Hawking): :eek: Is he ok?!?! I sure hope he has health insurance. ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2009, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-the-fascists-the-traitors-and-the-anti-ameircan-liars/505665/270 "2009-08-11T16:20:11Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Yes. Yes you have. > > You should probably cross-post that in the “Stupid Republican of the day” thing, although it’s kind of annoying that the article doesn’t actually have anyone’s name appended to it. To be fair - they were probably confused by his colonially-tinged accent. Picked up from endless re-runs of I Love Lucy. ---
**Author:** ![Sinaijon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dc4da7/32.png) [@Sinaijon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sinaijon)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2009, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-the-fascists-the-traitors-and-the-anti-ameircan-liars/505665/271 "2009-08-11T16:23:53Z")
> [@jsgoddess](#): > > [I’ve run across a better one](http://www.ibdeditorials.com/IBDArticles.aspx?id=333933006516877): > > Yes, [this Stephen Hawking](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_Hawking): Sure, it’s fun to just blow off the example, but according to Hawking, he gets his 24 hour nursing from some private foundations, and his wheelchair/electronics were also given to him. [http://www.hawking.org.uk/index.php/disability/disabilityadvice](http://www.hawking.org.uk/index.php/disability/disabilityadvice) I’m sure he still gets some basic care from NHC, but it’s his status as an elite citizen that allowed him to become more than just some crazy old guy laying in a bed in a group home scribbling arcane symbols on a note book. He’s much more a poster boy for private health care than for government health care. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2009, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-the-fascists-the-traitors-and-the-anti-ameircan-liars/505665/272 "2009-08-11T16:26:27Z")
> [@tagos](#): > > To be fair - they were probably confused by his colonially-tinged accent. Picked up from endless re-runs of I Love Lucy. His voice synthesizer does have an American accent, amusingly enough. ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2009, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-the-fascists-the-traitors-and-the-anti-ameircan-liars/505665/273 "2009-08-11T16:39:03Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > Yet, you want us to pronate ourselves before him. You said he was not God, yet you want us to treat him with Godlike deference. LHoD very effectively rebutted the second portion of your post, so I’ll deal with this first bit. I just want you to give his policies a chance to be implemented and tried out. After that, if they don’t work, THEN bitch and moan. Why is that such a terrible position to take? ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Svinlesha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/22d042/32.png) [@Mr.Svinlesha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Svinlesha)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2009, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-the-fascists-the-traitors-and-the-anti-ameircan-liars/505665/274 "2009-08-11T16:39:11Z")
> [@](#): > > \*I’m sure he still gets some basic care from NHC, but it’s his status as an elite citizen that allowed him to become more than just some crazy old guy laying in a bed in a group home scribbling arcane symbols on a note book. He’s much more a poster boy for private health care than for government health care. \* Uh…her claim, specifically, is the following: \*People such as scientist Stephen Hawking wouldn’t have a chance in the U.K., where the National Health Service would say the life of this brilliant man, because of his physical handicaps, is essentially worthless. \* Hawking has lived his entire life in the UK, the NHS has never said that his (or any other life) is “essentially worthless,” and her claims are fully idiotic on the face of them. That Hawking currently employs private health care (or, more accurately, a combination of public and private health care) in order to receive a higher quality of care than what the NHS would otherwise offer is, in fact, totally irrelevant, and honestly, it’s kinda stupid to try to posit otherwise. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2009, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-the-fascists-the-traitors-and-the-anti-ameircan-liars/505665/275 "2009-08-11T16:56:23Z")
> [@Liberal](#): > > I just want you to give his policies a chance to be implemented and tried out. After that, if they don’t work, THEN bitch and moan. Why is that such a terrible position to take? So, with that attitude you were fine with Bush going into Iraq, right? You’d be fine with a president raising the income tax 50% for everyone? Or cutting it 50% for everyone? Outlawing abortion? Eliminating all welfare? Disbanding the military (as one idiot Board of Supervisor member here in SF wanted to do)? Making guns illegal? Just let him do it because he’s…drum roll…OBAMA! And surely you’re aware that some policies that might be put in place would take some time to see the ramifications of, and even longer to undo. But what the heck, right, let’s just try anything. Or are we just to let Obama try anything. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2009, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-the-fascists-the-traitors-and-the-anti-ameircan-liars/505665/276 "2009-08-11T17:08:24Z")
Once again, [John Stewart nails it!](http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/mon-august-10-2009/healther-skelter)😃 ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2009, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-the-fascists-the-traitors-and-the-anti-ameircan-liars/505665/277 "2009-08-11T17:22:18Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > Just let him do it because he’s…drum roll…OBAMA! Well, he [“does have many Christ-like qualities”](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=9878895&postcount=13), you know. ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2009, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-the-fascists-the-traitors-and-the-anti-ameircan-liars/505665/278 "2009-08-11T17:31:44Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > So, with that attitude you were fine with Bush going into Iraq, right? Wrong. That is simply an improper comparison. You are comparing the invasion of a country that has done you no harm with providing health coverage for all Americans. The two do not compare in any particular whatsoever. > [@](#): > > You’d be fine with a president raising the income tax 50% for everyone? Or cutting it 50% for everyone? Outlawing abortion? Eliminating all welfare? Disbanding the military (as one idiot Board of Supervisor member here in SF wanted to do)? Making guns illegal? Just let him do it because he’s…drum roll…OBAMA! Oh. More of this, then. You apparently are capable of thinking only in terms of one extreme versus another. So no, I am not saying let Obama get away with murder or with subverting the Constitution. Nothing he proposes compares in any way to taking away our guns or disbanding the military or raising income taxes for everyone. Frankly, the fact that your only argument in favor of opposing his actual policies is to make up policies that he is not proposing, and then talking about how bad those hypotheticals are, means your argument is worthless. > [@](#): > > And surely you’re aware that some policies that might be put in place would take some time to see the ramifications of, and even longer to undo. But what the heck, right, let’s just try anything. Or are we just to let Obama try anything. You make (or are trying to make) it sound like he just woke up one day, and on a whim summoned his minions and told them that he had a visit from God in his sleep, and that we should provide health care for all Americans, free ourselves from dependency on foreign oil, and better our relations with our former allies. But that is not the case. He met with the best and brightest from all areas of health care, including doctors, nurses, insurance providers, medical suppliers, hospital administrators, and others. He listened to their input and made a thoughtful decision only after careful evaluation. What you describe is a fantasy. ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2009, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-the-fascists-the-traitors-and-the-anti-ameircan-liars/505665/279 "2009-08-11T17:32:57Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > Well, he [“does have many Christ-like qualities”](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=9878895&postcount=13), you know. Well, yes he does. So what. So do a lot of other people. He is kindhearted, caring, empathetic, and even tempered. What’s wrong with that? ---
**Author:** ![cosmosdan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a6a055/32.png) [@cosmosdan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cosmosdan)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2009, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-the-fascists-the-traitors-and-the-anti-ameircan-liars/505665/280 "2009-08-11T17:50:48Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > Once again, [John Stewart nails it!](http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/mon-august-10-2009/healther-skelter)😃 I love Jon. Holy shit. How discouraging must be for a republican congressman to be booed for suggesting people turn off Glen Beck. He must be searching for some intelligent people to represent. He’s the kind of conservative I want in on the discussion and his own constituent’s {we assume} are rejecting intelligent discourse in favor of Glen fucking moron Beck [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-the-fascists-the-traitors-and-the-anti-ameircan-liars/505665.md?page=13) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-are-the-fascists-the-traitors-and-the-anti-ameircan-liars/505665.md?page=15)