# They drew stick figures! Take them away in chains! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 10, 2005, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-drew-stick-figures-take-them-away-in-chains/289476 "2005-02-10T23:00:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Jaade](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/dfb087/32.png) [@Jaade](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jaade)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-drew-stick-figures-take-them-away-in-chains/289476/41 "2005-02-11T16:36:07Z")
> [@Terrifel](#): > > Ordinarily you can’t, but it turns out that the kid being threatened was _really thin_. > > Actually, it seems that the artists thoughtfully labeled their subject in the pictures, along with misspelled profanities–clearly a sad commentary on the Florida public education system. Granted that the kids in question are only in elementary school, and are apparently attending special education classes, but most of the more common swear words only have four letters at most. One can only hope that this unpleasantness doesn’t permanently deter the kids from continuing to produce art that combine infantile themes of violence and profanity, there being such demand for this material in the novelty T-shirt and puffy hat industry. This is the South we’re talking about, after all. > > The handcuffs might seem a bit over the top, but bear in mind that 9-year olds are alarmingly fast and wiry. Floridians take this threat seriously; over the years, a large number of 9-year olds have escaped into the wild, and are starting to occupy the ecological niche previously held by coyotes and panthers. Fortunately, the large native alligator population keeps the environmental impact of feral 9-year olds minimized, at least for now. Why do we always have to go through this? What does being in the South have to do with it? :rolleyes: (And then again…can you consider Florida to be part of the “backwards” South?) I get so tired of hearing these dumb generalizations about the South being so backwards and redneck. With regards to the OP: I think the response was definitely over the top. I do think that if these boys would have drawn these pictures and then made good on their “threat” we’d have another pit thread about why their teachers/parents/counselors were letting them draw such pictures and not getting them any help. 9 or 10 is a young age, and one may not fully understand one’s actions at that age, but 9 and 10 year olds are perfectly capable of harming themselves and other kids. I think there should have been some concern on the part of the school, considering the past ten years with things like Columbine and the litigious society that we live in, but arresting the kids is too extreme. ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Ashtar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ea924/32.png) [@Lord\_Ashtar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Ashtar)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-drew-stick-figures-take-them-away-in-chains/289476/42 "2005-02-11T17:54:37Z")
Yet another reason for me to send my children to private school, should I ever have any. ---
**Author:** ![FordPrefect](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e99b99/32.png) [@FordPrefect](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FordPrefect)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-drew-stick-figures-take-them-away-in-chains/289476/43 "2005-02-11T18:26:32Z")
> [@danceswithcats](#): > > Had these regulations been in place when I was a lad, you’d never have seen me post on SDMB-I’d have been locked away. Cripe-one of my best friends in grade school would spend time with me drawing-we constructed tracked flame throwing nuclear vehicles capable of mayhem, bullet spraying machines, and one of my teachers (I think it was 4th grade) noted on a report card that “He shows great interest in mechanical design and drawing”. > > Then again, we all (most of the guys, at least) carried pocket knives, those of us in the model car club had X-Acto knives (and we got to enjoy toluene fumes) and nobody got killed. > > I’m so tired of this stupidity. When I was in grade four, me and several of my buddies would bring wooden swords and shields to school, on the bus, no less, and have epic battles on the school ground. A few short years later, with a change in principal-ship, we could no longer play tackle-football, throw snowballs, whatever. But at the time, the teachers knew us boys to be good kids, not prone to random acts of violence. I am sure that had some of the more bully-ish kids brought wooden swords they would have been confiscated right aways. In this same school, now about 20 years later, my kids can’t walk through a shallow puddle wearing rubber boots, it is against the rules! The world is insane. Absolutely bat-shit crazy insane. ---
**Author:** ![Bruce\_Daddy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/85f322/32.png) [@Bruce\_Daddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bruce_Daddy)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-drew-stick-figures-take-them-away-in-chains/289476/44 "2005-02-11T18:36:18Z")
> [@Terrifel](#): > > One can only hope that this unpleasantness doesn’t permanently deter the kids from continuing to produce art that combine infantile themes of violence and profanity, there being such demand for this material in the novelty T-shirt and puffy hat industry. This is the South we’re talking about, after all. What? ---
**Author:** ![kidchameleon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/898d66/32.png) [@kidchameleon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kidchameleon)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-drew-stick-figures-take-them-away-in-chains/289476/45 "2005-02-11T18:56:23Z")
> [@iamthewalrus(:3=](#): > > How the hell can you who is portrayed by a stick figure? Hey, Callista Flockheart still has rights! ---
**Author:** ![jackelope](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/a6a055/32.png) [@jackelope](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jackelope)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-drew-stick-figures-take-them-away-in-chains/289476/46 "2005-02-11T19:43:38Z")
Just hypothetically, what if the drawings had been extremely detailed and lifelike, showing in graphic and disturbing detail the hanging and stabbing of their classmate? I’m talking recognizable facial features on the classmate, realistic blood dripping down the classmate’s arms and pooling up on the ground beneath his dangling body, and maybe one of the artists draws a little self-portrait of himself doing a grinning victory dance next to the body. Would this be a different story? Just curious; a lot of the anger here seems to be spurred by the fact that it was “only stick figures,” as though the fact that the drawings were crudely done indicates that the defendants weren’t serious. What if they spent hours on these drawings (that’s “drawings,” _plural_), but they just don’t have any artistic skills and that’s why they’re “stick figures”? What if they waited for the kid on his way home from school, showing him the pictures and saying, “This is what we’re gonna do to you”? What if they were drawing cartoons of YOUR child being stabbed and hung, labeled with your child’s name? Just curious. Oh, and **duffer** , if you _have_ to see the world in your moronic black-and-white terms, could you please keep it in threads started for the purpose? You really just sound like an obsessive asshole. And this is coming from a guy who voted against Clinton both times. ---
**Author:** ![F.U.Shakespeare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/aca169/32.png) [@F.U.Shakespeare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/F.U.Shakespeare)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-drew-stick-figures-take-them-away-in-chains/289476/47 "2005-02-11T19:45:32Z")
Although it referred to drugs, not violence, the earliest use I remember of the term ‘zero tolerance’ was in description of extremely draconian drug laws in which a minuscule amount of a controlled substance resulted in forfeiture of vehicles, boats, etc. Even worse, these laws didn’t make exceptions for cases where, say, a mechanic who worked on a customer’s car left a stubbed out joint in the ashtray. These federal laws were enacted during the administration of George H. W. Bush. > [@duffer](#): > > Funny how dear **Reeder** gets upset about this yet fails to mention this zero tolerence bullshit started during the Clinton administration. Wonder how the OP would look if it was Bush? :dubious: > Anyway, my take on this shit is it’s one more way to deny boys from acting like boys in any way possible, under any banner possible, to pussify the American male. Both my BIL’s used to take their hunting rifles to school so they could hit the fields before sundown. The only req was that the guns were unloaded. And you could have as many boxes of ammo as you could carry in the locker with the gun. > > Now you can’t even buy a decent plastic gun to play cops and robbers. Fucking liberals. ---
**Author:** ![MaxTheVool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@MaxTheVool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaxTheVool)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-drew-stick-figures-take-them-away-in-chains/289476/48 "2005-02-11T19:51:15Z")
> [@duffer](#): > > Now you can’t even buy a decent plastic gun to play cops and robbers. Fucking liberals. Given that just about every single poster has agreed that the actions in the OP were idiotic, and given that (as we know) the SDMB is heavily liberal, wouldn’t you agree that liberals don’t, in general, seem to agree with policies like this? C’mon, you can still claim that we’re all idiotic mindless bush-bashing terrorist-lovers, if you want, but try yielding just an inch on this issue. It might be therapeutic. ---
**Author:** ![SPOOFE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c5a1d2/32.png) [@SPOOFE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SPOOFE)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-drew-stick-figures-take-them-away-in-chains/289476/49 "2005-02-11T19:58:46Z")
> [@](#): > > He can’t help if all he knows how to do is shoot off at the lip. > > That’s what Bushies do. So you’re admitting to being a Bushie, Reeder? Eh. Drawing violent stick figures is at LEAST as bad as sticking one’s tongue out at reporters. We all know how frenzied you got about that one, eh, mate? ---
**Author:** ![betenoir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/258eb7/32.png) [@betenoir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/betenoir)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-drew-stick-figures-take-them-away-in-chains/289476/50 "2005-02-11T21:20:03Z")
Ummm…to the folks who quoted and reponded to me post can I please direct you to my first paragraph: > [@betenoir](#): > > Now…I agree this is an example of exteme stupidity. Arresting them??? Taking them away in handcuffs? Treating them like they were violent felonys when they are children and haven’t done anything violent? Idiocy. I don’t agree with them being arrested either. I was responding the sugestion that this was, not just not a crime (which it isn’t) but perfectly ok. And that _any_ action taken against children intimidating each other was somehow infringing on there rights as a male. As for my reaction “pussifying” :rolleyes: I would call it less rightious indignation than sarcastic irritation ---
**Author:** ![ParentalAdvisory](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/53a042/32.png) [@ParentalAdvisory](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ParentalAdvisory)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-drew-stick-figures-take-them-away-in-chains/289476/51 "2005-02-11T21:42:59Z")
> [@mstay](#): > > What’s with kids these days? Total lack of imagination. So boring and dull. No kidding. I would have at least made it a paperback flip animation. Fuck everyone involved in bringing these kids to jail. You suck at life. Will someone get the prosecutors some blowjobs? Sounds like they need some. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-drew-stick-figures-take-them-away-in-chains/289476/52 "2005-02-11T21:44:45Z")
> [@jackelope](#): > > Just hypothetically, what if … Would this … What if … What if … What if … Just curious. That’s a lot of what ifs there. Does a bunch of what ifs justify dragging someone out of grade school in handcuffs? What if a meteor hits the earth? What if pigs fly? What if roaches replace humans as the dominant species? What if King Arthur returns? It doesn’t matter if it was stick figures or a genuine work of art. The reaction was grossly out of line in any SANE person’s view. Even we liberals and conservatives, Dems and Repubs agree on this one. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-drew-stick-figures-take-them-away-in-chains/289476/53 "2005-02-11T21:48:33Z")
> [@betenoir](#): > > I don’t agree with them being arrested either. I was responding the sugestion that this was, not just not a crime (which it isn’t) but perfectly ok. And that _any_ action taken against children intimidating each other was somehow infringing on there rights as a male. As for my reaction “pussifying” :rolleyes: I would call it less rightious indignation than sarcastic irritation Understood. I reacted more to the huge disparity in your annoyance vs. the OP issue. Sometimes people do just that as a deliberate derailment. My apologies. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-drew-stick-figures-take-them-away-in-chains/289476/54 "2005-02-11T23:45:08Z")
When I was in… I think it was seventh, maybe sixth grade, I was playing soccer at P.E. when this big kid, Ramsey, came out of nowhere and clothelined me. No reason for it at all. Ramsey was generally a decent guy, although we weren’t exactly friends, and looking back at it, I think he was just over-excited about the game and wasn’t really thinking. At the time, however, I was super pissed at him. During the lunch break that day, me and my friend Rob filled a good twenty pages of binder paper with cartoons of Ramsey being slaughtered in various inventive ways. It was, for me, a really positive and cathartic way of working out my anger at the guy without getting into a confrontation with him. (Which would have gone very badly for me. I was a pudgy little kid. Ramsey was a fuckin’ beast. He’d have pounded me into putty if I’d tried to fight him.) I stuffed the drawings in my binder and forgot all about them until a couple weeks later, when I pulled all of the random doodles and drawings out of my binder and threw them out. Turns out, one of the drawings I made of Ramsey was on top of the stack, and he saw them. He fished the stack out, tracked me down at recess, and demanded to know what the deal was with them. I think he was looking for a fight. I told him I drew them after he’d clocked me in soccer last month for no reason. He looked surprised, then apologized for hitting me. I told him no hard feelings, and we were, if not friends, at least friendly until we started different high schools. Haven’t seen him since. The moral? Kids need to sort these things out on their own. Learning how to do that is the entire point of being a kid. It genuinely worries me what the current generation is going to do when they become adults and have still not learned these skills. I do not think it bodes well. ---
**Author:** ![GuanoLad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guanolad/32/42_2.png) [@GuanoLad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuanoLad)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2005, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-drew-stick-figures-take-them-away-in-chains/289476/55 "2005-02-12T00:18:34Z")
> [@SteveG1](#): > > What if King Arthur returns? Hey, that’d be cool! ---
**Author:** ![Ale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f19dbf/32.png) [@Ale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ale)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2005, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-drew-stick-figures-take-them-away-in-chains/289476/56 "2005-02-12T01:03:44Z")
**[Convention on the Rights of Children](http://www.unicef.org/crc/crc.htm)** > [@](#): > > Article 3 > > 1. In all actions concerning children, whether undertaken by public or private social welfare institutions, courts of law, administrative authorities or legislative bodies, the best interests of the child shall be a primary consideration. > > 2. States Parties undertake to ensure the child such protection and care as is necessary for his or her well-being, _taking into account the rights and duties of his or her parents_, legal guardians, or other individuals legally responsible for him or her, and, to this end, shall take all appropriate legislative and administrative measures. > [@](#): > > Article 5 > > States Parties shall respect the responsibilities, rights and duties of parents or, where applicable, the members of the extended family or community as provided for by local custom, legal guardians or other persons legally responsible for the child, to provide, in a manner consistent with the evolving capacities of the child, appropriate direction and guidance in the exercise by the child of the rights recognized in the present Convention. [QUOTE[Article 13 1. _The child shall have the right to freedom of expression; this right shall include freedom to seek, receive and impart information and ideas of all kinds, regardless of frontiers, either orally, in writing or in print, in the form of art, or through any other media of the child’s choice._ 2. The exercise of this right may be subject to certain restrictions, but these shall only be such as are provided by law and are necessary: (a) For respect of the rights or reputations of others; or (b) For the protection of national security or of public order (ordre public), or of public health or morals. [/QUOTE] > [@](#): > > Article 14 > > 1. States Parties shall respect the right of the child to freedom of thought, conscience and religion. > [@](#): > > Article 37 > > States Parties shall ensure that: > > (a) No child shall be subjected to torture or other cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment. Neither capital punishment nor life imprisonment without possibility of release shall be imposed for offences committed by persons below eighteen years of age; > > (b) _No child shall be deprived of his or her liberty unlawfully or arbitrarily. The arrest, detention or imprisonment of a child shall be in conformity with the law_ and shall be used only as a measure of last resort and for the shortest appropriate period of time; > > © _Every child deprived of liberty shall be treated with humanity and respect for the inherent dignity of the human person and in a manner which takes into account the needs of persons of his or her age._ In particular, every child deprived of liberty shall be separated from adults unless it is considered in the child’s best interest not to do so and shall have the right to maintain contact with his or her family through correspondence and visits, save in exceptional circumstances; > > (d) Every child deprived of his or her liberty shall have the right to prompt access to legal and other appropriate assistance, as well as the right to challenge the legality of the deprivation of his or her liberty before a court or other competent, independent and impartial authority and to a prompt decision on any such action. Somalia and the United States are the only two countries in the world that haven´t ratified the Convention on the Rights of Children, Somalia can´t because it doesn´t have a recognized goverment. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2005, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-drew-stick-figures-take-them-away-in-chains/289476/57 "2005-02-12T01:24:49Z")
**betenoir** … “infringing their rights _as a male_”??? 😕 Fuck, girls have as much of a right to channel violent emotion. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2005, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-drew-stick-figures-take-them-away-in-chains/289476/58 "2005-02-12T03:13:40Z")
> [@Ale](#): > > Somalia and the United States are the only two countries in the world that haven´t ratified the Convention on the Rights of Children, Somalia can´t because it doesn´t have a recognized goverment. It sounds like they violated the hell out of this convention. When Somalia signs up, guess who will be the only nonsignatory. Oh, there was Article 13, para. 2(b). “national security” in there. That covers it all :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Wile\_E](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c37758/32.png) [@Wile\_E](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wile_E)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2005, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-drew-stick-figures-take-them-away-in-chains/289476/59 "2005-02-12T16:26:58Z")
[Chief Wiggum]Remember boys, these are little kids, so take out your tiny batons. … [/Chief Wiggum] I can’t believe this got to two pages without the obligatory Simpsons reference. Of did I miss it amoung all the political sniping? When I was in High School a friend and I used to write stories about people we didn’t like with all sorts of bad and strange things happening. Although, we never actually had them die in the stories, preferring to have them suffer. I had no idea we were such little felons. I agree “zero tolerance” has gone too far if it involves handcuffing 6 to 10 year olds and carting them off to jail to be charged with felonies. Even if the idea is to “scare them straight” that’s just too much, have the cops talk to them but cuffing and jail, no. Whatever happened to calling the parents? I am actually surprised that the police departments go along with this since it seems to be a lawsuit waiting to happen. ---
**Author:** ![danceswithcats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9e8a1a/32.png) [@danceswithcats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/danceswithcats)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2005, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-drew-stick-figures-take-them-away-in-chains/289476/60 "2005-02-12T21:01:42Z")
In [this story](http://www.kfvs12.com/Global/story.asp?S=2919630), a first-grader gives a bag of “rocks, clover and dirt” to her friend as a gift. The teacher looks at it, and decides it’s weed. :smack: Dunno what kinda shit the teacher smoked in college, and I’m no expert regarding smokable plants, but I’d know the difference between clover and marijuana. So, because the teacher was a dumbfuck, and the principal was a dumbfuck, the child gets a 2 day in school detention. Jumping Jesus in a Buick Roadmaster! If a kid takes a piss in a pop bottle does that mean he’s got Chardonnay? Dammit! Stupid asshats in charge of our kids. :mad: [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-drew-stick-figures-take-them-away-in-chains/289476.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/they-drew-stick-figures-take-them-away-in-chains/289476.md?page=4)