# They're illegal aliens; stop making up other names for them. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 20, 2013, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theyre-illegal-aliens-stop-making-up-other-names-for-them/653468 "2013-03-20T17:16:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![SCAdian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scadian/32/3292_2.png) [@SCAdian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SCAdian)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2013, 3:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theyre-illegal-aliens-stop-making-up-other-names-for-them/653468/101 "2013-03-21T03:30:44Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > I am more than a frequent speeder, to use an earlier example. A person who comes here without legal authority is more than an “illegal alien.” The term, as used in the U.S., implies serious misconduct. Some people like “softer” terms because they don’t think being here “illegally” is such a big deal. You may be a “more than frequent” speeder, but you aren’t speeding 24 hours a day. An illegal alien is breaking the law every second he is in the country. ---
**Author:** ![SCAdian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scadian/32/3292_2.png) [@SCAdian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SCAdian)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2013, 3:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theyre-illegal-aliens-stop-making-up-other-names-for-them/653468/102 "2013-03-21T03:38:14Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > I called him a bigot because it’s accurate, so, by his own logic, we should call him such. He wants people treated differently not because the content of their character but based on something they can’t control: where they were born. Not because of where they were born - because of where they currently live, and the legality of their status there. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Second\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@The\_Second\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Second_Stone)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2013, 4:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theyre-illegal-aliens-stop-making-up-other-names-for-them/653468/103 "2013-03-21T04:24:48Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > You are monstrously stupid. I’d rather be called monstrously stupid than be the crypto racists you fascists are. You smile and smile while calling whole swaths of people “illegal” pretending you don’t mean non-English speaking or non-white people. Everyone now knows how highly you regard candor. Everybody has stopped and looked and is silent, waiting for you to try to find a few more crypto racist friends to agree with you to cover your embarrassment at being called on it. The fact of the matter is that every people is just as good as you. No matter your skin color or status of documentation. You are just another human. You and I are no better than an undocumented worker that has had no tribunal declare them “illegal”. Acts in this country are illegal, only when a court pronounces someone guilty of those acts. A person is never “illegal”. That is the American way. And you are racists. I love how you all run and get your friends to come say how stupid I am to try to cover your racist crap. I love how you are flush from embarrassment at being called out. You are racists giving cover to racists and racism. You are calling human beings “illegal” and think that makes you smart. And you think I find it insulting or a defense to be called stupid. I don’t. There is nothing shameful in being stupid. But there is something shameful in perpetuating racism. While I may in fact be stupid, failing to accept that the emperor has no clothes and calling out this “illegal” crap as racism isn’t stupid or evidence of my stupidity, which really isn’t in issue. I long ago abandoned any pretense on this board to being anything other than an idiot. The issue is whether insisting people with less than perfect documentation are “illegal” and outside the protection of the law and human dignity is racist and repugnant. It is and so are you. In this matter, the only moral difference between you folks and a white supremacist is that the white supremacist isn’t low enough to lie to himself and others about his white supremacist garbage. How does it feel to be lower than a white supremacist? That’s called a regression analysis. How does it feel to have your ass handed to you by a stupid liberal? ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2013, 4:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theyre-illegal-aliens-stop-making-up-other-names-for-them/653468/104 "2013-03-21T04:48:51Z")
> [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > I’d rather be called monstrously stupid than be the crypto racists you fascists are. You smile and smile while calling whole swaths of people “illegal” pretending you don’t mean non-English speaking or non-white people. Project much? What makes you assume that anyone is talking about any people other than those who are here illegally? Hell, I’ll step up to the plate - here, an illegal _is_ almost always non-English speaking and their skin tends to be brown. You know why? Because the illegals here come from Mexico and they speak Spanish only. That is a reality, not racism. Racism would be if I assumed that every Mexican I see was illegal, which I don’t. > [@](#): > > The fact of the matter is that every people is just as good as you. Nope. There are lots of people who are not as good as me or **Miller** , even you. There are also lots of people who are better than any of us. People are not all exactly the same, and not all people are good. > [@](#): > > You are calling human beings “illegal” and think that makes you smart. No, we call those human beings “illegal” because it is the shorthand we use for “people in the country illegally”. It has nothing to do with smarts. > [@](#): > > While I may in fact be stupid, failing to accept that the emperor has no clothes and calling out this “illegal” crap as racism isn’t stupid or evidence of my stupidity, which really isn’t in issue. You may not be stupid but you sure do jump to all kinds of incorrect conclusions, and you seem to be hypersensitive to people being lumped into categories. It happens, it will always happen. > [@](#): > > The issue is whether insisting people with less than perfect documentation are “illegal” and outside the protection of the law and human dignity is racist and repugnant. Honey, we are talking about people with _no_ documents, not “less than perfect” ones. People who came here illegally from the start, who know they are breaking the law but do it anyway. Not sure what any of that has to do with human dignity, but none of it’s racist and the only repugnant thing is people expect to come here and be supported by others. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2013, 5:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theyre-illegal-aliens-stop-making-up-other-names-for-them/653468/105 "2013-03-21T05:18:51Z")
> [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > How does it feel to have your ass handed to you by a stupid liberal? I can say, without any hint of hyperbole at all, that it was one of the greatest experiences of my time on this board. ---
**Author:** ![Dag\_Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/439d5e/32.png) [@Dag\_Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dag_Otto)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2013, 5:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theyre-illegal-aliens-stop-making-up-other-names-for-them/653468/106 "2013-03-21T05:43:49Z")
> [@DMC](#): > > I’ll try and save you the headache you’re about to get. I’m pretty sure the answer will be “anywhere that they are, as they leech off of the rest of us.” I’ve always found this stance odd, as the poster in question is actually a recipient in one of those “socialist handout” programs. > > Anyway, it’s really not worth it. 🙂 I was going to bet that the real problem was finding a place to hold a Tea Party meeting. Every ballroom in town is reserved for quinceañeras. Every fucking weekend. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2013, 5:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theyre-illegal-aliens-stop-making-up-other-names-for-them/653468/107 "2013-03-21T05:45:45Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > Honey, I am the victim. I’m the one paying out my retirement to support hundreds of thousands of people in this state alone who are here illegally and sucking up benefits. Nonsense. Illegal aliens pay [billions of dollars](http://www.nytimes.com/2005/04/05/business/05immigration.html?_r=1&) of taxes in return for nothing. > [@curlcoat](#): > > We do? How is it that these folks you say are being exploited and abused _choose_ to be here, pay big money to do so and come back if deported? I suppose there are some businesses that are paying low wages with no benefits, but the illegals are still choosing to come here to work those jobs because the wages are far better than in their home country and the benefits are provided by the government. It’s called “desperation”. They risk their lives to come here to do jobs Americans refuse to do, under conditions they refuse to work under, for wages Americans consider beneath them. And they get few “benefits”. > [@curlcoat](#): > > Honey, we are talking about people with _no_ documents, not “less than perfect” ones. People who came here illegally from the start, who know they are breaking the law but do it anyway. Not sure what any of that has to do with human dignity, but none of it’s racist and the only repugnant thing is people expect to come here and be supported by others. :rolleyes: We are the ones exploiting them, not the other way around. No matter how popular it is to play White Man’s Burden. ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2013, 5:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theyre-illegal-aliens-stop-making-up-other-names-for-them/653468/108 "2013-03-21T05:49:17Z")
You’ll note, however that the people who are kicking up a fuss in the thread are doing it over aspects and locales associated with Central/South American illegal immigration and especially Mexico. I personally would have a hard time believing that the OP read an article or something about Olga the undocumented nail technician or Sven the student with an expired visa and that’s what got under his skin. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2013, 6:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theyre-illegal-aliens-stop-making-up-other-names-for-them/653468/109 "2013-03-21T06:01:41Z")
> [@Inner\_Stickler](#): > > You’ll note, however that the people who are kicking up a fuss in the thread are doing it over aspects and locales associated with Central/South American illegal immigration and especially Mexico. I personally would have a hard time believing that the OP read an article or something about Olga the undocumented nail technician or Sven the student with an expired visa and that’s what got under his skin. Of course; Olga and Sven are white. Race is a huge component of all this, as I’ve said. So-called anti-illegal-immigrant movements and laws tend to heavily punish anyone brown regardless of their citizenship for just that reason. ---
**Author:** ![Ibn\_Warraq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e19b73/32.png) [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2013, 6:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theyre-illegal-aliens-stop-making-up-other-names-for-them/653468/110 "2013-03-21T06:45:14Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Of course; Olga and Sven are white. Race is a huge component of all this, as I’ve said. So-called anti-illegal-immigrant movements and laws tend to heavily punish anyone brown regardless of their citizenship for just that reason. Define “brown”. Similarly, define “white”. I ask, because IIRC you insisted that Cuban-Americans weren’t “brown” but were white. Please explain why you consider some Latin Americans to be “brown” and some to be “white”? Thank you in advance for your answer which I’m sure will be well thought-out and will show great knowledge about the topic and will make the people who think you’re an ignoramus who merely likes to throw out flames without having the balls or the brains to back them up feel really stupid. ---
**Author:** ![Ibn\_Warraq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e19b73/32.png) [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2013, 6:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theyre-illegal-aliens-stop-making-up-other-names-for-them/653468/111 "2013-03-21T06:48:07Z")
> [@bump](#): > > I think there are a couple of other things that need to be pointed out- an overwhelming majority are Mexicans who come here to work, but don’t necessarily have any desire to become Americans, get American citizenship, or integrate into American society. They want to come, live illegally, earn money, and send it back to Mexico. > > This isn’t the same kind of immigration as your 19th century poor Italians, Poles and Hungarians coming through Ellis Island to make a new life in America and wanting to become Americans Racist bullshit. Moreover, it shows extreme ignorance since about half to of the Southern and Eastern European immigrants of the late 19th and early 20th Century stayed in the US for awhile and then went back home. Truth be told, today’s Mexican immigrants show vastly more desire to be Americans than the Jews, Italians, and Greeks of the late 19th and 20th Century. ---
**Author:** ![Ibn\_Warraq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e19b73/32.png) [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2013, 6:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theyre-illegal-aliens-stop-making-up-other-names-for-them/653468/112 "2013-03-21T06:58:54Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > It’s a little embarrassing to read this kind of thing. It’s like a parody of what idiots think liberals think. Like I said already, the OP said nothing about race. I guess you assumed he’s talking about Latinos because you’re an oversensitive idiot who doesn’t have two brain cells to rub together, but not all illegal immigrants are Latino and the OP did not throw out any racial slurs or make any dumbass comments like that, so there’s no racial component. While his comments were obnoxious, to claim that someone not squealing about “illegal immigrants” isn’t talking about Hispanics is like insisting that someone squealing about “Zionists” “controlling the State Department” “controlling the media” or “controlling Hollywood” isn’t talking about Jews. Obviously not all Zionists are Jews, but when people make comments like that, we know they’re not talking about Jesse Helms or Jerry Falwell. Similarly, yes, there are lots of illegal immigrants who aren’t Latinos, but when people whine about illegals they aren’t talking Irish immigrants on their Uncle’s green cards or Russian immigrants who overstayed a tourist visa. In fact, you’ll find numerous politicians as diverse as Hillary Clinton and John McCain appearing in front of groups openly calling not for “dream act” for illegal Irish immigrants or even “amnesty” but openly calling for “legalizing” them. Here’s one example. [http://3.bp.blogspot.com/\_00Gyx1Zx7Gk/RfCvjJcw5tI/AAAAAAAAAKg/qIin3aQxxyY/s400/Senator+Clinton+and+Irish+Lobby+for+Immigration+Reform.jpg](http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_00Gyx1Zx7Gk/RfCvjJcw5tI/AAAAAAAAAKg/qIin3aQxxyY/s400/Senator+Clinton+and+Irish+Lobby+for+Immigration+Reform.jpg) I’ll make an educated guess and say no one on this thread has even seen that picture before. Can anyone seriously imagine the ramifications if a major American Presidential candidate appeared before calling for legalizing all Mexican immigrants holding aloft a sign proclaiming “Legalize the Mexicans”? ---
**Author:** ![Machine\_Elf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@Machine\_Elf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machine_Elf)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2013, 12:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theyre-illegal-aliens-stop-making-up-other-names-for-them/653468/113 "2013-03-21T12:21:34Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > I called him a bigot because it’s accurate, so, by his own logic, we should call him such. He wants people treated differently not because the content of their character but based on something they can’t control: where they were born. This is stupidly simplistic, as it means virtually everyone is a bigot. I doubt you’ll find many Americans who believe, for example, that citizens of other countries should be able to vote or hold public office in the US. I want people treated differently if they jump the fence. Come in through the gate? Welcome to America; live long and prosper. Sneak in against our wishes? We’ll hunt you down and put you on a bus headed south. > [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > The quota for Mexican immigrants is _zero_; and let’s face it, +90% of the time “illegal immigrant” is a code phrase for “Mexican”. Absolutely, because 99% of the time an illegal immigrant _is_ Mexican. You do get people from other countries overstaying their visas and such, but the vast majority of people who are here illegally are Mexicans who have snuck across our southern border. To pretend otherwise is to deny reality. > [@](#): > > Racism is a central feature of the anger against “illegals”, however often people like to pretend otherwise. It’s possible to favor _legal_ immigration while being strongly against illegal immigration and all the ills it brings. There may be plenty of racists who rail against illegal immigration because of their racism - but a person who opposes illegal immigration is not inherently racist, and reflexive accusations like that do nothing to advance the discussion. I am not a racist for wanting to maintain control over who enters my country so we can filter out murderers, drug addicts, drug couriers and other undesirables, and limit the influx of workers so as to serve the interests of America. We can talk about ways to help the impoverished citizens of other countries, but I don’t believe letting them stream across our borders in unchecked quantities is a smart way to do that. > [@](#): > > And let’s face it; we want them here, and we want them here illegally. That makes them easier to exploit and abuse; we don’t want them demanding fair wages and decent, humane treatment after all, we want to treat them as expendable near-slaves. There are some unscrupulous business owners who are happy to have access to an ultra-cheap pool of labor, but I’m not one of them. > [@The Second Stone](#): > > Acts in this country are illegal, only when a court pronounces someone guilty of those acts. A person is never “illegal”. > … > The issue is whether insisting people with less than perfect documentation are “illegal” and outside the protection of the law and human dignity is racist and repugnant. Quite right. Even people who are here illegally are entitled to the protection of the law. They have the right to remain silent, they have the right to an attorney, and all that. They have the right to be treated in a dignified manner by law enforcement officials, and they can’t be deported until/unless it’s officially determined that they are here illegally (usually by their own admission). > [@Der Trihs](#): > > They risk their lives to come here to do jobs Americans refuse to do, under conditions they refuse to work under, for wages Americans consider beneath them. Wages are depressed (and work conditions are crap) _because_ of illegal immigration. There are business owners who would like to hire citizens or legal immigrants and pay them minimum wage or more, but can’t because all of their competitors are hiring illegal immigrants and paying them less. If they don’t do the same, they will go out of business. Eliminate illegal immigration, and wages will rise until they attract citizens and legal immigrants. ---
**Author:** ![johnpost](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f17d59/32.png) [@johnpost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/johnpost)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2013, 1:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theyre-illegal-aliens-stop-making-up-other-names-for-them/653468/114 "2013-03-21T13:01:42Z")
> [@Death\_of\_Rats](#): > > Exactly! As an American Bison, I say kick them all out! 😃 > [@Drunky\_Smurf](#): > > Preach it Brother Bison. no wonder groups like the Moose, Elks, Eagles were so popular. now the Lions they were just waiting to get called out. ---
**Author:** ![kidchameleon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/898d66/32.png) [@kidchameleon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kidchameleon)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2013, 1:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theyre-illegal-aliens-stop-making-up-other-names-for-them/653468/115 "2013-03-21T13:05:50Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > Obviously, you don’t live in an area where illegal aliens are a major problem. They aren’t allowed in his basement. ---
**Author:** ![Rushgeekgirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rushgeekgirl/32/3715_2.png) [@Rushgeekgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rushgeekgirl)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2013, 1:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theyre-illegal-aliens-stop-making-up-other-names-for-them/653468/116 "2013-03-21T13:35:21Z")
> [@Saintly\_Loser](#): > > Well, here’s an example of where illegal aliens are a problem: > > In New York City, affluent mothers hire child care workers (“nannies”) who are, by and large, illegal, undocumented, whatever you want to call them, and don’t pay workers’ comp or FICA or offer health insurance or paid time off or any of the benefits legal , . This has depressed wages to the point where a person wishing to do this work cannot negotiate for any benefits at all, not even the ones they are legally entitled to (FICA, workers’ comp). I don’t know how amnesty would affect the situation, except that I’m betting that these employers don’t want amnesty, because it would cost them money. > > A great number of these employers would identify themselves as progressive people, always on the side of the poor and downtrodden. I guess buying fair-trade coffee balances things out enough so that you can screw your employees. This seems more like an affluent mother situation, not an illegal immigration situation. ---
**Author:** ![Saintly\_Loser](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saintly_loser/32/4045_2.png) [@Saintly\_Loser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saintly_Loser)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2013, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theyre-illegal-aliens-stop-making-up-other-names-for-them/653468/117 "2013-03-21T14:40:44Z")
> [@Rushgeekgirl](#): > > This seems more like an affluent mother situation, not an illegal immigration situation. Well, it’s both. The fact that there’s a large pool of women who lack legal status (yes, because they’ve come to or stayed in this country illegally) makes it possible for people to hire them and deny them the protections and benefits that citizens and legal residents take for granted. It also makes it impossible for those who do have legal status and want to work as nannies to demand, or even negotiate for, fair wages and benefits. As a side note, this pool of women is largely from the Caribbean and are almost all native English speakers. Not the most important thing in this discussion, but I saw a lot of posts above insisting that this debate is only about Mexicans. Which is untrue. Here in New York, although there are certainly many non-legal workers from Central and South America, there are also a lot of people from the Caribbean, and Eastern Europe, and Africa. This particular corner of the underground labor market always pisses me off, because it’s been my observation that those doing the hiring would almost always identify themselves as liberals or progressives. They’d never vote Republican. They buy fair-trade coffee. They are locavores. They are pro gay rights. Etc. But when it comes down to it, they’re perfectly willing to exploit a worker so that they can have servants at a good price. The hypocrisy is staggering. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2013, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theyre-illegal-aliens-stop-making-up-other-names-for-them/653468/118 "2013-03-21T14:47:45Z")
> [@Saintly\_Loser](#): > > This particular corner of the underground labor market always pisses me off, because it’s been my observation that those doing the hiring would almost always identify themselves as liberals or progressives. They’d never vote Republican. They buy fair-trade coffee. They are locavores. They are pro gay rights. Etc. But when it comes down to it, they’re perfectly willing to exploit a worker so that they can have servants at a good price. The hypocrisy is staggering. I don’t see any hypocrisy in the majority of items you list off, most resoundingly gay rights which is a social issue rather than economic. The closest to hypocrisy is support for fair-work food, but it is possible to simultaneously want to improve the living conditions of non-american food workers, while not wanting to do so for child care workers, providing of course that the latter have better conditions than the former. Of course, some of them could also be hypocrites. But not necessarily. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2013, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theyre-illegal-aliens-stop-making-up-other-names-for-them/653468/119 "2013-03-21T14:49:13Z")
> [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > I’d rather be called monstrously stupid You don’t have a choice at this point. > [@](#): > > than be the crypto racists you fascists are. This raises a second problem: when stupid people pass judgment on you using terms they overheard in college and clearly didn’t understand, it doesn’t hurt very much. There are people who talk about immigration issues in a racist way, but it’s not everybody. You’re too dumb to distinguish between them, which ought to surprise nobody. > [@](#): > > The fact of the matter is that every people is just as good as you. What did the English language ever do to you to deserve this kind of abuse? > [@](#): > > You and I are no better than an undocumented worker that has had no tribunal declare them “illegal”. What is your obsession with tribunals? This isn’t ancient Rome. We have _courts_, and it sounds like you have no idea how they work. > [@](#): > > Acts in this country are illegal, only when a court pronounces someone guilty of those acts. That’s not quite how that works, no. > [@](#): > > A person is never “illegal”. Several people have already said this. You do understand that I got into this thread because I disagreed with the OP that “illegal alien” is the best and only term for these people, right? (I’m kidding, I know you don’t understand.) I think the only person who actually used the word “illegals” seriously is **curlcoat** , and **curlcoat** is a moron. > [@](#): > > You are racists giving cover to racists and racism. Say racist a few more times and it’ll magically become true. > [@](#): > > You are calling human beings “illegal” Nope, we’re not. > [@](#): > > And you think I find it insulting or a defense to be called stupid. I don’t. There is nothing shameful in being stupid. I think you’ve got me there. You don’t mind being called stupid and don’t even think it’s bad. But it’s true anyway. You’re a whiny idiot. > [@](#): > > I long ago abandoned any pretense on this board to being anything other than an idiot. Here we can agree. > [@](#): > > The issue is whether insisting people with less than perfect documentation are “illegal” and outside the protection of the law and human dignity is racist and repugnant. Uh huh. Where did I say anything about that? Your problem is that you are too stupid to figure out who is arguing what. So you’re insulting the wrong people because you think you know what they are saying when it’s obvious you don’t have the least fucking clue. I guess you think you can cover this up by saying “racist!” a few dozen times and tossing in “crypto facist” here and there, but it doesn’t work. Not on people who can read, anyway. > [@](#): > > That’s called a regression analysis. No it isn’t. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2013, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theyre-illegal-aliens-stop-making-up-other-names-for-them/653468/120 "2013-03-21T15:02:14Z")
> [@Ibn\_Warraq](#): > > While his comments were obnoxious, to claim that someone not squealing about “illegal immigrants” isn’t talking about Hispanics is like insisting that someone squealing about “Zionists” “controlling the State Department” “controlling the media” or “controlling Hollywood” isn’t talking about Jews. For once in your life, you thread hijacking pedant, shut the hell up. I understand that people who whine about lazy immigrants who don’t speak English or talk about gardners are prejudiced against Latinos. It does not follow that every discussion of illegal immigration (or what to call people who immigrate illegally) is really about Latinos or is really racist. Something something tortured analogy Holocaust something something. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theyre-illegal-aliens-stop-making-up-other-names-for-them/653468.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/theyre-illegal-aliens-stop-making-up-other-names-for-them/653468.md?page=7)