# This has to stop: extreme actions at political gathering **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 24, 2019, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-has-to-stop-extreme-actions-at-political-gathering/843927 "2019-11-24T19:15:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 23
**Author:** ![margin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/65b543/32.png) [@margin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/margin)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2019, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-has-to-stop-extreme-actions-at-political-gathering/843927/441 "2019-12-01T17:14:59Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > a car touching someone. In this case someone who was breaking the law blocking traffic. Someone who could avoid instigating the confrontation in the first place. I’m \sure\ it’s just a coincidence that all these big brave Trumpies put themselves in the shoes of a dude who’s driving a 4,000-lb murder weapon and who wants his false accusations against pedestrians be sufficient excuse to run them over. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2019, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-has-to-stop-extreme-actions-at-political-gathering/843927/442 "2019-12-01T17:19:59Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > a car touching someone. In this case someone who was breaking the law blocking traffic. Someone who could avoid instigating the confrontation in the first place. A driver has the unqualified duty to avoid contact with pedestrians. It doesn’t matter if the pedestrian was breaking any law or engaging in confrontations. None of this “he started it” kindergarten nonsense has any weight whatsoever. None of this disguises the fact that you simply want the right to kill someone with your car for pissing you off. That’s the long and short of it. ---
**Author:** ![Bullitt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bullitt/32/5725_2.png) [@Bullitt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bullitt)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2019, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-has-to-stop-extreme-actions-at-political-gathering/843927/443 "2019-12-01T17:20:58Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > And — _ **serious question** _ — what IS with the [Redstate.Com](http://Redstate.Com)? Is this where you get your facts? Accidental click from Facebook? How can we take you seriously if you can’t answer this question? I have answered the question. Upthread. Easy to find since I’ve only got a couple of posts here, certainly less than 7. Seriously. ---
**Author:** ![raventhief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/raventhief/32/4_2.png) [@raventhief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raventhief)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2019, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-has-to-stop-extreme-actions-at-political-gathering/843927/444 "2019-12-01T17:25:59Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > I took a CCW class too and the discussion of when to use was more extensive than I expected. Yes, clearly you can’t shoot someone who is pissing you off. That would be like running someone over. If a car merely touches someone they are not injured by it. In this instance the driver stopped when stick man refused to allow passage. while that’s not a full cavalry retreat he stopped before the car was used as a weapon. He didn’t get out of the car a 2nd time to confront him. Stick man then goes on to strike the car and a fight ensues. > > People may not like the optics of the car touching stick man but the driver is exhibiting restraint while trying to leave. You also can’t threaten to shoot someone who is pissing you off. You can’t take your gun out and touch them with it. If you aren’t planning to fire your weapon, you leave it holstered. Obviously you can’t holster your car, but driving into them, however “gently,” is still threatening them with harm, and per my link above, vehicular assault. Driving into them, much less getting out and assaulting them, is not retreating. Disclaimer: I don’t know much about Justia as a source. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2019, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-has-to-stop-extreme-actions-at-political-gathering/843927/445 "2019-12-01T17:29:49Z")
> [@Kobal2](#): > > No, you asked for a cite for a direct rebuttal of your own (bs) statement. When a statement is challenged, it’s up to the one who made the original statement to prove its validity. _That_’s how the [burden of proof](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burden_of_proof_(philosophy)) works, genius. You’ve been here years and have no doubt talked colossal bollocks for even longer, surely people must have explained it to you by now, possibly striving to use small words when they did. You got it. The person making the claim has to prove it. NO ONE has to disprove it. NO ONE. ---
**Author:** ![Chisquirrel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6bbea6/32.png) [@Chisquirrel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chisquirrel)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2019, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-has-to-stop-extreme-actions-at-political-gathering/843927/446 "2019-12-01T22:13:48Z")
> [@margin](#): > > I’m \sure\ it’s just a coincidence that all these big brave Trumpies put themselves in the shoes of a dude who’s driving a 4,000-lb murder weapon and who wants his false accusations against pedestrians be sufficient excuse to run them over. For some reason, it’s always the big bad Trumpist driving into liberals, while our board cowards cry about how dangerous ANTIFA is. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2019, 12:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-has-to-stop-extreme-actions-at-political-gathering/843927/447 "2019-12-02T00:24:33Z")
> [@Bullitt](#): > > I have answered the question. Upthread. Easy to find since I’ve only got a couple of posts here, certainly less than 7. > > Seriously. You never did tell us which of the two incidents was worse: hitting the car with a fist or stick(or whatever it was), or the driver purposefully driving towards the pedestrian and pushing him/hitting him. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2019, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-has-to-stop-extreme-actions-at-political-gathering/843927/448 "2019-12-02T01:20:20Z")
> [@Chisquirrel](#): > > … about how dangerous ANTIFA is. And yet, amidst all this hue and cry, the Antifas ringleaders, the Central Committee or whatever, no one is on trial. You can google the leaders and prominent members of the Proud Boys, Storm Front, various other groups of Slime Nazis. They are on rolodexes, media can call them for a comment, cops can fall by for a chat. How is it that so much trouble is brewed by a bunch of people that, for all we know, may not actually exist? ---
**Author:** ![Bullitt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bullitt/32/5725_2.png) [@Bullitt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bullitt)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2019, 11:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-has-to-stop-extreme-actions-at-political-gathering/843927/449 "2019-12-02T11:10:34Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > You never did tell us which of the two incidents was worse: hitting the car with a fist or stick(or whatever it was), or the driver purposefully driving towards the pedestrian and pushing him/hitting him. I have not followed the discussion, and particularly on this point, but to me, the worse incident was the driver pummeling the pedestrian. Once the pedestrian was down and hit he was clearly outmatched and any more hits was too much, IMO. I counted 6 punches. He should have stopped at one or two. Does that answer your question, **Czarcasm**? ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2019, 11:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-has-to-stop-extreme-actions-at-political-gathering/843927/450 "2019-12-02T11:57:33Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > If a car merely touches someone they are not injured by it. So, more like a pistol whipping, then? ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2019, 1:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-has-to-stop-extreme-actions-at-political-gathering/843927/451 "2019-12-02T13:14:08Z")
Magiver, you’re a fucking moron. Possibly a dangerous moron. ---
**Author:** ![margin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/65b543/32.png) [@margin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/margin)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2019, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-has-to-stop-extreme-actions-at-political-gathering/843927/452 "2019-12-02T14:18:13Z")
> [@Bullitt](#): > > I have not followed the discussion, and particularly on this point, but to me, the worse incident was the driver pummeling the pedestrian. Once the pedestrian was down and hit he was clearly outmatched and any more hits was too much, IMO. I counted 6 punches. He should have stopped at one or two. > > Does that answer your question, **Czarcasm**? So not until the driver _gets out of the car?_ ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2019, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-has-to-stop-extreme-actions-at-political-gathering/843927/453 "2019-12-02T14:56:39Z")
> [@Bullitt](#): > > I have not followed the discussion, and particularly on this point, but to me, the worse incident was the driver pummeling the pedestrian. Once the pedestrian was down and hit he was clearly outmatched and any more hits was too much, IMO. I counted 6 punches. He should have stopped at one or two. > > Does that answer your question, **Czarcasm**? It answers whatever question you _wished_ I had asked, which was to be expected. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2019, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-has-to-stop-extreme-actions-at-political-gathering/843927/454 "2019-12-02T15:25:12Z")
> [@Bullitt](#): > > I have not followed the discussion, and particularly on this point, but to me, the worse incident was the driver pummeling the pedestrian. Once the pedestrian was down and hit he was clearly outmatched and any more hits was too much, IMO. I counted 6 punches. He should have stopped at one or two. > > Does that answer your question, **Czarcasm**? What’s the pity is that reactions to “answers” like yours(What is worse: A or B? C, of course!), and that thread from a supposed “moderate” that tries to promote Michael Savage will be used to show how we are intolerant towards conservatives. ---
**Author:** ![margin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/65b543/32.png) [@margin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/margin)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2019, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-has-to-stop-extreme-actions-at-political-gathering/843927/455 "2019-12-02T16:12:02Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > What’s the pity is that reactions to “answers” like yours(What is worse: A or B? C, of course!), and that thread from a supposed “moderate” that tries to promote Michael Savage will be used to show how we are intolerant towards conservatives. I like how the question is, “Driver or pedestrian?” and he changed the driver into a pedestrian by omitting the whole part where the guy has already committed assault with a deadly weapon. A 4,000 deadly weapon is a hard to ignore scale-tipper, but conservatives like to remove stuff like that, then whine that the driver was the victim. The fact that every conservative here has tried to handwave away or just disappear the vehicle entirely is proof they know _exactly_ what they are doing and that they are aware that honesty is not their friend. So: Guy drives vehicle into pedestrian. Conservatives protest guy is antifa and that blocking traffic is worse than murdering little babies. (As long as they’re not brown ones.) Driver gets out of vehicle, there’s a scuffle, driver throws guy to the ground and punches him several times. The Rightwing in general always attempt to argue that the “guy who got hurt” is antifa and that antifa are evil and dangerous, despite there being no evidence of that. What are Nazis famous for, again? Gardening? And don’t whine at “Nazis”. The standard Reichwing whine is that the Left calls everyone they disagree with “Nazis” (when the right is not arguing were Nazis were _really_socialists) but that ignores all the white nationalists in the White House, at Trump rallies, or marching while wearing swastikas at these rightwing rallies like “Unite the Right.” Meanwhile, rightwingers are still trying to blame Heather Heyer rather than James Alex Fields for her murder, just like this thread has been one long stream of _he asked for it and he got it hurr hurr hurr_. In both cases, the argument’s been made that both victims got themselves killed, because doncha know that white men ought to get to run down and murder people who disagree with them. Yeah, and don’t @me about the baseball shooter, either, because as much as I despise Bernie Sanders, the guy has not made hatred the central plank of his platform. Trump has. That’s why the odd shooting and/or bike lock here and there is meaningless against three years of Trump bellowing and whining by turns, “LOCK HER UP!” “WITCH HUNT! WITCH HUNT!” (So ironic, that one.) And, “SEND THEM BACK! SEND THEM BACK!” Not to mention his repeated suggestions that “you second amendment people” might find “a solution” if Hillary “stole the election.” Every time a rightwinger refuses to answer the question----or, even worse, claim they did so (without acknowledging they omitted the most damning part) it’s an admission of guilt. And this is the background to every discussion here. Conservatives refuse to answer questions, or answer the question they _wish_ you’d asked, or they demand cites they never read, or just repeat the same behavior and make the same debunked claims in a few months. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2019, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-has-to-stop-extreme-actions-at-political-gathering/843927/456 "2019-12-02T18:45:56Z")
> [@margin](#): > > Every time a rightwinger refuses to answer the question----or, even worse, claim they did so (without acknowledging they omitted the most damning part) it’s an admission of guilt. And this is the background to every discussion here. Conservatives refuse to answer questions, or answer the question they _wish_ you’d asked, or they demand cites they never read, or just repeat the same behavior and make the same debunked claims in a few months. Every time this happens, a demon in hell gets his horns. ---
**Author:** ![margin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/65b543/32.png) [@margin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/margin)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2019, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-has-to-stop-extreme-actions-at-political-gathering/843927/457 "2019-12-02T21:47:47Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > Every time this happens, a demon in hell gets his horns. There’s nothing quite like that first time you’re sitting across the table from somebody and you ask him one question but he provides an answer to an entirely \* different\* one. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2019, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-has-to-stop-extreme-actions-at-political-gathering/843927/458 "2019-12-02T21:50:24Z")
There’s a strawman genocide in this thread. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2019, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-has-to-stop-extreme-actions-at-political-gathering/843927/459 "2019-12-02T21:58:46Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > There’s a strawman genocide in this thread. Is that a fact? > [@octopus](#): > > I think the average actual Nazi is more dangerous than the actual antifa. Take that for what you will. I think neither have a right to initiate violence based upon another individual’s exercise of fundamental liberties. > [@QuickSilver](#): > > Not at all what I’m asking. But you _know_ that. > > I’ll assume you don’t want to answer the questions as posed, for reasons you also don’t wish to disclose. Duly noted. Want to try answering the questions I asked you back on the[3rd page](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=21993205&postcount=145) of this thread? Third time’s the charm, they say. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2019, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-has-to-stop-extreme-actions-at-political-gathering/843927/460 "2019-12-05T19:12:59Z")
> [@Chisquirrel](#): > > For some reason, it’s always the big bad Trumpist driving into liberals, while our board cowards cry about how dangerous ANTIFA is. " … it’s always the big bad NAZI driving into liberals…" Based on past history (Charlottesville). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-has-to-stop-extreme-actions-at-political-gathering/843927.md?page=22) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-has-to-stop-extreme-actions-at-political-gathering/843927.md?page=24)