My first reaction on seeing his posts to this thread was, “Dude, you need help.” For the most part, though, I tend to roll my eyes when I see him going off on religion; very much a “there he goes again” reaction. And I’m an atheist/agnostic myself.
Readjust the Sarcast-a-tron.
Here’s a thoughtful editorial in the Irish Times.
No, all I wonder is how it took you until page 2 of this thread to flounce in and get your pony to do its one trick.
Hey, his pony also does that trick where it’s horribly misinformed about basic facts and reality and is angry about nonsense conspiracy theories.
That’s two tricks, bucko!
Or if they were gay. Or trans.
Bishop: "Does that sonogram look a bit *fabulous *to you?
From the editorial:
No, but we can say categorically that no amount of medical intervention would have saved the life of the foetus. This was not a choice between the life of the mother and the life of the child. The child was doomed, even if its heart was still beating. This was, categorically, risking the life of a woman for sentimental bullshit about a hopeless baby.
And we can say, categorically, that it was barbaric that the woman was not allowed to make the choice for herself.
They’re trying to fix it and move forward. When my brother’s wife got pregnant, they didn’t know the gender of the baby - reputable doctors will not tell the gender of a baby anymore because of this. I believe it’s actually against the law in some states.
I’m not saying that India doesn’t have some shit to answer for. But they are trying to change things, not just sitting there and proclaiming it’s a “Catholic” country. I don’t think it’s a fair comparison, and I absolutely think they have a right to speak up.
I think that says more about you to be honest. If it was an Irish woman the exact same thing would have happened. It seems to me that the heartbeat of a foetus that couldn’t survive trumped the heartbeat of a living breathing woman. The worst thing is I can’t see anything changing. The government will try to weather this storm and then go back to business as usual. Its twenty years since the X case and still no legislation. Its outrageous.
It’s not clear why they wouldn’t do an emergency c-section to try to save both mother and baby – even knowing the baby wouldn’t make it??
Earlier this year I started a thread about a similar case in the Dominican Rep. Similar outcome.
A 16 year pregnant girl (first trimester) was diagnosed with leukemia. Since a pregnancy was stressing her body more than it would if she were not pregnant the proper way to go about was perform an abortion and give her immediate treatment. Instead, doctors feared that the almost certain abortion that would occur when she was given treatment would break the law, they delayed treatment until they heard from practically every authority, including the RCC, that it was OK to administer treatment (no abortion). By then she was weakened by the disease and the pregnancy. She died.
While it’s impossible to say if she had survived had all medical standards been followed, the fact is that her chances were greatly diminished by her doctors twiddling their thumbs in the meantime. At the time I commented that it was her fault for being born poor. She would have been sent out of the country stat had her family had the resources for it. Instead she languished and died to prove a point about some ancient, archaic bullcrap.
Way to go RCC!
That’s true. However, I also wondered about racism and it’s because of that line “this is a Catholic country”. Now I can’t hear the tone of voice and nor do I know the exact context, but what my imagination does is add “you amoral heathen” at the end. Needless to say my imagination is not proof of anything, but I lived in Ireland (Co.Clare) for 8 years and I wouldn’t rule it out either. Regardless, it is already bad enough even without the racism.
Not racist but I feel the bigotry. Do you think they would have said “This is a Catholic Country” to a Catholic?
One common quote of the “pro-life” movement is “Abortion is never medically necessary to save a mother’s life.” Really?
When I first heard the “This is a Catholic Country” I automatically assumed the same as PookahMacPhellimey:
Someone pointed out that it might have been said in more of an apologetic ‘my hands are tied’ way. But who knows? I do think it would have also been said to a white Irish athiest too though.
This is one of those instances that would seem to support your claim in a way that is hard to ignore.
Some days I wonder if Der and Cloth aren’t the same person having us on with polar opposite political stances but is genuine about his hate of religion and love of nerdy books and games.
No one should have to die like that, no matter what excuse is used.
In this case I have to side with Clothahump. It was avoidable, it was unnecessary, it was cruel and it was STUPID. The fact is, someone died horribly because of religious theocratic bullshit.
Yeah, true enough. The idea that India has some kind of moral leg to stand on on this issue was really bothering me; I’m not a huge fan of abortion (although still pro-choice), but female infanticide makes me quite angry. I guess the way it looks to me is India saying, “Allowing a woman to die because of your religion is wrong. But pay no attention to us killing female fetuses because we don’t think women are as good as men!”