# This is how you blow a very winnable election **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [August 26, 2020, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-is-how-you-blow-a-very-winnable-election/919094 "2020-08-26T21:25:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![agzem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a8b319/32.png) [@agzem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/agzem)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2020, 3:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-is-how-you-blow-a-very-winnable-election/919094/161 "2020-08-28T03:34:56Z")
**First shooting** **While Mr. Rittenhouse is being pursued by the group** , an unknown gunman fires into the air, though it’s unclear why. The weapon’s muzzle flash appears in footage filmed at the scene. Mr. Rittenhouse turns toward the sound of gunfire as **another pursuer lunges toward him from the same direction**. Mr. Rittenhouse then fires four times, and appears to shoot the man in the head. **Second shooting** Mr. Rittenhouse seems to make a phone call and then flees the scene. Several people chase him, some shouting, “That’s the shooter!” As **Mr. Rittenhouse is running, he trips and falls to the ground. He fires four shots as three people rush toward him.** One person appears to be hit in the chest and falls to the ground. Another, who is carrying a handgun, is hit in the arm and runs away. Mr. Rittenhouse’s gunfire is mixed in with the sound of at least 16 other gunshots that ring out during this time. > **[Tracking the Suspect in the Fatal Kenosha Shootings (Published 2020)](https://www.nytimes.com/2020/08/27/us/kyle-rittenhouse-kenosha-shooting-video.html)** > > Footage appears to show a teenager shooting three people during protests in Wisconsin. We tracked his movements that night. ---
**Author:** ![agzem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a8b319/32.png) [@agzem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/agzem)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2020, 3:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-is-how-you-blow-a-very-winnable-election/919094/162 "2020-08-28T03:38:02Z")
Sorry…replied to the wrong person. ---
**Author:** ![BlankSlate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blankslate/32/80_2.png) [@BlankSlate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlankSlate)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2020, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-is-how-you-blow-a-very-winnable-election/919094/163 "2020-08-28T03:42:08Z")
If they’re white, it’s stand your ground. If they’re black, it’s shoot 'em down. ---
**Author:** ![BlankSlate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blankslate/32/80_2.png) [@BlankSlate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlankSlate)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2020, 3:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-is-how-you-blow-a-very-winnable-election/919094/164 "2020-08-28T03:54:14Z")
@agzem. Thanks for the links. It looks as if this malfunctioning piece of shit traveled all over midwest looking for black people to murder. ---
**Author:** ![agzem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a8b319/32.png) [@agzem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/agzem)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2020, 4:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-is-how-you-blow-a-very-winnable-election/919094/165 "2020-08-28T04:04:25Z")
> [@BlankSlate](#): > > looking for black people to murder. All three were white. One was a pedophile, another was a domestic abuser, and another criminal who was trying to shoot Rittenhouse point blank but Rittenhouse shot him first. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2020, 4:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-is-how-you-blow-a-very-winnable-election/919094/166 "2020-08-28T04:12:28Z")
> [@ThisIsTheEnd](#): > > Racism won’t be solved ever. Police shootings won’t be solved in the next two months. Covid won’t be solved in the next two months. Trumpism won’t be solved in the next two months. Trump can be solved in the next two months. > > White SJW misfits high on self-righteousness do not help solve the solvable. This is what common sense looks like! Well said. > [@k9bfriender](#): > > You want Biden to call out the violence? Done. You want him to call out even aggressive encounters like the one with the diners in DC? Sure, he should. > > We should even ask the protesters to do some level of self policing. Call out and turn in violent actors in their midst. Call out and dissuade the “rude” protesters. Glad we agree. Yes, spot on. > [@k9bfriender](#): > > You want Biden to tell them to go back to their homes and just wait until we get around to finding the time to address their concerns? No, we’ve asked that over and over and over again, always asking them to put their priorities behind that of the fear of making white people uncomfortable. No. Not what I’m asking for. A John Lewis style march/rally is always welcome. The burning and looting is most decidedly not, and neither is intimidating people into pledging fealty to your cause. There is a world of difference between those things. > [@GIGObuster](#): > > That 43% was due to it being a 3 way race Yes, a 3-way race in which his two opponents were conservative old white guys from Texas. > [@QuickSilver](#): > > Here’s the thing… what we hear from the rank and file all too often is, “Yeah, but look at the majority of protesters who are aren’t burning and looting and intimidating bystanders!” Which sounds an awful lot like, “Look at all the cops who aren’t shooting black people!”. Great point. And I constantly see liberal friends share videos from the BLM types who actually do defend, even celebrate, burning and looting. And it’s not just other Democrats like me who see this: it’s everyone in their family, or who they went to high school with, who knows they are on the left. So it is terrible branding for our side. (And it’s funny how, although the people in the videos are Black, the people sharing them always seem to be white, trying to virtue signal to the max.) It’s absolutely crazymaking. > [@Akaj](#): > > I wonder if this is the moment to leverage Harris’ background as a prosecutor. Make her the bad-ass. I would love this. On my local CBS TV station, the host of a Hannity-style show that comes on right after the CBS Evening News played a voicemail from a listener in which the woman said “Joe Biden gave a good speech, read it from the teleprompter. But Kamala Harris is going to be the one running the show, and she’s going to close all the prisons and let all the inmates go free.” The host didn’t correct her at all! I was so pissed. But if we’re already carrying the burden of the left not trusting her from her prosecutorial background, we may as well use it to our advantage to get her to reassure moderate white suburbanites. She needs some moderation of her brand with them anyway, after she was rated on DW-NOMINATE is the second-most-liberal Democrat in the Senate (after Warren but ahead of Bernie). ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2020, 4:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-is-how-you-blow-a-very-winnable-election/919094/167 "2020-08-28T04:33:42Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > If Biden came out, and actually condemned those calling for “Defund the police”, rather than just coming out and explaining what it is that he is planning on doing to address their concerns without actually using the phrase himself, then I would have a hard time voting for him, and I’m a white middle class suburbanite. Were I a black city resident, there’s no way that I would brave the obstacles and possible dangers necessary to vote in order to support someone that threw me under the bus that way. This is ridiculous. And I am positive you have this backward. Only someone with your privilege can afford to place this kind of purity policing over the real necessity of getting Trump out of office. This is exactly why Black Democratic primary voters so consistently go for moderate candidates, why they supported Joe Biden overwhelmingly: they are pragmatic and know that it’s much more important to get Republicans out of power than to elect the ideal progressive Democrat. > [@DeadTreasSecretaries](#): > > I could be wrong, but I don’t think anyone is referring to it as “defund” unless it’s about actually cutting overall funding to the police and possibly increasing it on social services at whatnot. This may increase funding of crime prevention overall, but it’s not just cut 5% to take away their urban assault vehicles and add 10% for training. > > If I’m wrong about that, the term really is actively dishonest and not just slippery. Cosigned. > [@QuickSilver](#): > > When they hear people say that “defund” doesn’t mean what it means of that “reallocate sometimes means increase”, they know they are being fucked with. Mean what you say and say what you mean. Transform the Police accomplishes that without trickery and changing the meaning of words they know. Yes, this. Or just “reform the police”. > [@k9bfriender](#): > > If you are against the movement, then you have no reason to criticize the messaging of it, you are simply against it, and there is absolutely no reason why anyone in it should listen to anything that you have to say. This is quite obviously untrue. I’m against the movement, and I’m also against Trump and the GOP. This is true for many people, and we can walk and chew gum at the same time. If we see the movement as jeopardizing our goal of defeating the GOP, then we do have a reason to criticize it, and anyone who also wants to defeat the GOP should definitely listen to what we have to say. > [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > "Joe Biden now says he’s going to ‘crack down’. Of course that’s Joe’s instinct - he is the person who helped author the 1994 crime bill that put so many young black men in jail. Donald Trump is the first president to sign significant justice reform - and the unfair laws that most needed reforming are the ones Joe Biden helped put into law. > > As for Kamala Harris, she put 1500 people in jail for minor marijuana offenses. She fought to keep exculpatory evidence out of court that would have exonerated many people. The police aren’t the problem - it was prosecutors like Kamala Harris, an ambitious politician willing to throw innocent black people into jail to achieve her own ambitions." > > I’m not going to debate whether that argument is fair or not. The question is, if it’ made, how do Democrats refute it? They shouldn’t! If Trump does this, he’s throwing us right into the briar patch, where Rust Belt suburbanites will feel much more comfortable with us in power. Meanwhile, the left will grumble but they will still go vote Democratic because Trump and the GOP are so awful. Win-win. People like **Boudicca** will jump up and down and stamp their feet and vow not to vote for Biden in this scenario, but (a) I don’t believe them, (b) the vast majority of them are not in swing states, and (c) flipping a swing voter makes twice as much difference as attracting or retaining a progressive voter. ---
**Author:** ![Boudicca90](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boudicca90/32/16818_2.png) [@Boudicca90](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boudicca90)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2020, 5:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-is-how-you-blow-a-very-winnable-election/919094/168 "2020-08-28T05:16:18Z")
I’m voting Howie Hawkins, but you are right that I live in California, so this state will go to Biden anyway. I haven’t voted Democrat since 2008, the party left me behind quite some time ago. The only way I could vote for Biden is if I still lived in a swing state like Nevada, and even then I would find it difficult. As the GOP slides further and further into fascism, the Dems seem to want to take their place on the center-right. I am still a Democrat, but only to make sure progressives still have some influence to save the party from itself. ---
**Author:** ![Kron](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kron/32/12444_2.png) [@Kron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kron)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2020, 5:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-is-how-you-blow-a-very-winnable-election/919094/169 "2020-08-28T05:57:42Z")
> [@agzem](#): > > One was a pedophile, another was a domestic abuser, and another criminal who was trying to shoot Rittenhouse point blank but Rittenhouse shot him first. Cite for these claims? ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2020, 5:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-is-how-you-blow-a-very-winnable-election/919094/170 "2020-08-28T05:59:20Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > Yes, a 3-way race in which his two opponents were conservative old white guys from Texas. And if my aunt had wheels she would be a bicycle. Don’t overthink your weak tea replies. As pointed in the past, you continue to ignore that the ones tempting fate now are others. Many of those appeared in the last day of the convention from the old grand party of the old Republicans. We got fanning the flames guys like conspiracy theorist Giuliani, the racist confederate Tim Cotton, and the divisive Trump on top. Sounds like healing in America. /s More like a super spreader of hate and corona virus. > **[President Trump Ends RNC 2020 With Divisive Rhetoric Emblematic Of His Tenure](https://www.huffpost.com/entry/trump-republican-national-convention-speech-2020_n_5f47545ac5b697186e310935)** > > In his speech closing out the GOP convention, Trump said a vote for Joe Biden would be "the destroyer of American greatness." When I saw the police in the article’s video, grouped around a fence and spraying a protester, I did remember this classic cartoon from Ron Cobb: [The president saying “Mah fellow Americans” surrounded by shady looking police, keeping his so called “fellow” Americans out of his view.](https://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=https%3A%2F%2Fsilbergalerie.weebly.com%2Fuploads%2F2%2F5%2F5%2F9%2F25593282%2Fcobb_1_orig.jpg&imgrefurl=https%3A%2F%2Fsilbergalerie.weebly.com%2Fthe-cartoons-of-ron-cobb.html&tbnid=1Ds_e0aqPCyQxM&vet=12ahUKEwiYutPVmL3rAhWTlJ4KHbCMCIkQMygDegUIARCnAQ..i&docid=0to60K7YDHlLqM&w=540&h=546&q=Ron%20cobb%20%22my%20fellow%20americans%22&client=firefox-b-1-d&ved=2ahUKEwiYutPVmL3rAhWTlJ4KHbCMCIkQMygDegUIARCnAQ#imgrc=xQ5M-LaV8BPOcM&imgdii=1Ds_e0aqPCyQxM) ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2020, 6:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-is-how-you-blow-a-very-winnable-election/919094/171 "2020-08-28T06:22:15Z")
Very glad to see they are in fact using Kamala Harris to inoculate the ticket: > **[Kamala Harris condemns looting, violence in wake of police shooting](https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-election-harris-idUSKBN25N344?fbclid=IwAR1Ml0C2arrDgxNy3qQ9uPaezhKGEHOt6YHTSxXx0rUxqLAgzp_2CgQMark)** > > U.S. presidential nominee Joe Biden's running mate Kamala Harris on Thursday denounced the looting and acts of violence that followed the police shooting of a Black man, as Republicans sought to paint the two Democrats as weak on crime. This is brilliant because although she has a very liberal voting record in the Senate, she does have a strong law enforcement background (too strong for some), and she’s a better messenger for it than Biden is as a white man. More of this please! ---
**Author:** ![not\_what\_you\_d\_expect](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/not_what_you_d_expect/32/3246_2.png) [@not\_what\_you\_d\_expect](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/not_what_you_d_expect)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2020, 11:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-is-how-you-blow-a-very-winnable-election/919094/172 "2020-08-28T11:23:38Z")
> [@Kron](#): > > > [@agzem](#): > > > > One was a pedophile, another was a domestic abuser, and another criminal who was trying to shoot Rittenhouse point blank but Rittenhouse shot him first. > > Cite for these claims? **I’ll second the request. And if one isn’t provided, I’d sure like to see the mod’s do something about that post.** ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2020, 11:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-is-how-you-blow-a-very-winnable-election/919094/173 "2020-08-28T11:30:19Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > Very glad to see they are in fact using Kamala Harris to inoculate the ticket: > > [https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-election-harris-idUSKBN25N344?fbclid=IwAR1Ml0C2arrDgxNy3qQ9uPaezhKGEHOt6YHTSxXx0rUxqLAgzp\_2CgQMark](https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-election-harris-idUSKBN25N344?fbclid=IwAR1Ml0C2arrDgxNy3qQ9uPaezhKGEHOt6YHTSxXx0rUxqLAgzp_2CgQMark) > > This is brilliant because although she has a very liberal voting record in the Senate, she does have a strong law enforcement background (too strong for some), and she’s a better messenger for it than Biden is as a white man. More of this please! And it’s exactly what I told you would happen. It’s why I don’t understand you making this thread. We knew that the reason Harris was picked was so she could push the law-and-order message. There is no other reason to pick the prosecutor who is widely hated by the left. Biden is running a center-right campaign. His goal is to pick up the moderate Republicans who are disaffected by Trump. He is counting on being able to keep enough of the left for it not to matter. His strategy thus is to be against the violence, but not against the movement. It is to agree the police need “defunding” while avoiding the slogan. He’s just doing it in a more politically correct manner. He has to get the left to attack him to appeal to the right wingers (moderate Republicans). But he also has to make sure they don’t get too upset, and to not become someone who is genuinely seen as evil (like Trump). The riots will only hurt him if he makes them worse with his actions. If he does it right, he can use them to win votes from moderate Republicans. And, no, I’m not happy this is the strategy. I was hoping Bernie’s strategy would work better, but he couldn’t get the votes. But it makes sense–in a place where Trump could win by appealing to people’s basest desires, you really can’t pull hard to the left. You have to ease them back away from the cliff. ---
**Author:** ![agzem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a8b319/32.png) [@agzem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/agzem)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2020, 11:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-is-how-you-blow-a-very-winnable-election/919094/174 "2020-08-28T11:31:08Z")
Here’s the video of the Gaige Grosskreutz as attempts to shoot Rittenhouse: [https://twitter.com/firstcitizensam/status/1299087825854316549](https://twitter.com/firstcitizensam/status/1299087825854316549) ---
**Author:** ![agzem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a8b319/32.png) [@agzem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/agzem)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2020, 11:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-is-how-you-blow-a-very-winnable-election/919094/175 "2020-08-28T11:32:39Z")
Rosenbaum was a registered sex offender for a sex crime involving a minor. > ---
**Author:** ![agzem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a8b319/32.png) [@agzem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/agzem)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2020, 11:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-is-how-you-blow-a-very-winnable-election/919094/176 "2020-08-28T11:33:37Z")
Huber has a criminal history that includes charges of battery & repeat domestic abuse > ---
**Author:** ![HammondsCollapse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ecb155/32.png) [@HammondsCollapse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HammondsCollapse)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2020, 11:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-is-how-you-blow-a-very-winnable-election/919094/177 "2020-08-28T11:41:30Z")
Man people want to attack Rand Paul, everywhere he goes lol [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/Ld_TpnRP1OI/hqdefault.jpg "Senator Rand Paul Cornered and Chased by BLM Protesters") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ld_TpnRP1OI) ---
**Author:** ![agzem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a8b319/32.png) [@agzem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/agzem)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2020, 11:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-is-how-you-blow-a-very-winnable-election/919094/178 "2020-08-28T11:49:59Z")
Grosskreutz has a criminal record that includes being intoxicated & armed w/a gun. His friend said that Grosskreutz’s **only regret ‘was not killing the kid’** and ’ **emptying the entire mag into him** ’ > ---
**Author:** ![not\_what\_you\_d\_expect](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/not_what_you_d_expect/32/3246_2.png) [@not\_what\_you\_d\_expect](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/not_what_you_d_expect)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2020, 12:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-is-how-you-blow-a-very-winnable-election/919094/179 "2020-08-28T12:03:25Z")
I can’t duplicate this search. [https://appsdoc.wi.gov/public/offenders](https://appsdoc.wi.gov/public/offenders) I wouldn’t trust a site by Andy. He’s a known liar. Name Search: Enter a last name and/or first name to search for sex offenders by name. Last Name:\* First Name: Middle Initial: Offender Search Results No offenders found. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2020, 12:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-is-how-you-blow-a-very-winnable-election/919094/180 "2020-08-28T12:33:51Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > We only disagree on whether or not we should try to tell protesters how to protest. We tell protesters how (not) to protest all the time. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-is-how-you-blow-a-very-winnable-election/919094.md?page=8) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-is-how-you-blow-a-very-winnable-election/919094.md?page=10)