# This Just In....War in Vietnam over. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 21, 2004, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-just-in-war-in-vietnam-over/260811 "2004-08-21T02:42:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![buttonjockey308](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bcef8e/32.png) [@buttonjockey308](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/buttonjockey308)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2004, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-just-in-war-in-vietnam-over/260811/1 "2004-08-21T02:42:07Z")
So let me get this straight… The East Side Swift Boaters club says Kerry was a hero, the West Side Swift Boaters Club says Kerry was a mope. Kerry says Bush put the West Side Swift Boaters up to it. Bush flies to texas to blow the guy who paid the West Side Swift Boaters, or to practice his acceptance speech, no one’s sure which. Kerry says bush milked it through the war. Bush can’t say shit, because Kerry’s got 3 purple hearts, and all W can claim is that he flew airplanes, and, on several occasions, was too drunk to go to his guard weekends. For the love of all that’s holy, IT WAS 30 FUCKING YEARS AGO. WHO THE FUCK CARES? Like people can’t change their minds in 30 years. Kerry said he was against the war then. Kerry said he’s against the war now, only his voting record don’t necessarily bear that out. SO WHAT? Neither of these two nitwits, nor their endless supply of hangers-on, can let this foolishness go. Vietnam is ancient history. Howsabout you two twits come up with something that matters to the people who are living NOW, instead of rehashing shit that will have NO EFFECT ON ANYTHING. EVER. Note to Newsmonkeys: What a candidate did or didn’t do 30 years ago in a war we probably never should have been in in the first fucking place is IMMATERIAL. Kerry did this, Bush didn’t do that, it just doesn’t matter! There are plenty of things a touch more recently done or not done that you can pick on. Just leave the whole Vietnam thing alone already. ---
**Author:** ![Gorsnak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gorsnak/32/7587_2.png) [@Gorsnak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gorsnak)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2004, 2:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-just-in-war-in-vietnam-over/260811/2 "2004-08-21T02:45:48Z")
The Civil War was over 130 years ago, and it will have an impact on the election too. Deal with it, bub. ---
**Author:** ![Sevastopol](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cdc98d/32.png) [@Sevastopol](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sevastopol)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2004, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-just-in-war-in-vietnam-over/260811/3 "2004-08-21T02:52:29Z")
That’s easy for you to say **buttonJ** , but you try finding some way of discrediting Kerry. And the comparison will be with a serial underachiever like GWB. Huh huh, not easy is it? What do you expect the GOP to do? Roll over and die? Their boy’s a dud, so what? I’m sure any better suggestions would be welcome. ---
**Author:** ![Tentacle\_Monster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ba9def/32.png) [@Tentacle\_Monster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tentacle_Monster)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2004, 3:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-just-in-war-in-vietnam-over/260811/4 "2004-08-21T03:58:19Z")
> [@sevastopol](#): > > That’s easy for you to say buttonJ, but you try finding some way of discrediting Kerry. _He’s been neglecting his duties as a Senator while campaigning!_ Sure, and Bush never left Texas while he was campaigning for President in 2004. _He missed a vote to reduce health care costs!_ Not quite. Tort reform doesn’t necessarily mean cheaper healthcare. However, it does mean that if a doctor accidentally amputates the wrong leg; or fails to stitch a ureter back up (causing your insides to fill up with hot piss); there’s a cap on how much you can sue for. IIRC, the proposed cap was $250,000. _He voted against the Laci Peterson Law!_ Isn’t it already illegal to kill a pregnant woman? And I doubt that anyone convicted of killing a pregnant woman would get anything less than the maximum punishment allowed by state law. It’s just not the kind of act that a jury would smile upon. Same goes for assault. I’m not even going to get into the implications of treating a fetus as a legal entity. _He’s the foremost liberal in the Senate!_ I’ll leave that one to Jon Stewart. ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2004, 4:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-just-in-war-in-vietnam-over/260811/5 "2004-08-21T04:12:14Z")
We never should have gotten out of it, Never should have abandoned the democracy that was South Vietnam. We should never have listened to those evil anti-war types like Kerry. Bush should promise America that _if elected_ he will return America to the Jungles of Vietnam, and do it _right_ this time. The Swift Boat Veterans for Truth deserve no less. To be truly _fair_ to them, we should allow them to go back with our new troops, and participate in the liberation of Saigon. Let freedom Reign! ---
**Author:** ![TVeblen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/4bbf92/32.png) [@TVeblen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TVeblen)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2004, 4:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-just-in-war-in-vietnam-over/260811/6 "2004-08-21T04:30:06Z")
> [@buttonjockey308](#): > > What a candidate did or didn’t do 30 years ago in a war we probably never should have been in in the first fucking place is IMMATERIAL. Kerry did this, Bush didn’t do that, it just doesn’t matter! There are plenty of things a touch more recently done or not done that you can pick on. Just leave the whole Vietnam thing alone already. Is Clinton still a draft dodger for earning a Rhodes scholarship? ---
**Author:** ![glee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b5a626/32.png) [@glee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glee)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2004, 5:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-just-in-war-in-vietnam-over/260811/7 "2004-08-21T05:03:24Z")
If the war is over, does that mean Bush is safe from the draft? :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![SPOOFE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c5a1d2/32.png) [@SPOOFE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SPOOFE)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2004, 5:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-just-in-war-in-vietnam-over/260811/8 "2004-08-21T05:07:33Z")
> [@](#): > > Kerry said he’s against the war now Actually, he says [the opposite](http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A52839-2004Aug9.html). (Anticipating: “But he QUALIFIED his statement!” “He would have voted for it, but that doesn’t mean he supports it!” “Rjung rjung rjung!” Yeah, yeah, I get it, I get it. The point is Kerry has been terrible at expressing just what he’s for.) ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2004, 6:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-just-in-war-in-vietnam-over/260811/9 "2004-08-21T06:13:15Z")
Not in the slightest. Its only that Sen Kerry has a capacity thate exceeds the binary. You see, its not just that important, international type stuff is seldom black, white and simplistic. Its that its _never_ black, white, and simple. John Kerry made a mistake. He trusted GeeDubya (Praise the Leader!) to be prudent, cautious, and flexible. Note well: the Pubbies can only claim that Kerry voted _for war_ if they can show that GeeDubya was entirely clear about his intentions to go to war. I certainly believed he intended to go to war regardless, but that’s because I regard GeeDubya as a stubborn, self-righteous and mendacious medocrity. So when GeeDubya told me that he was intent on preserving peace, when he told me that he would only lead us into war if there were _no_ other option, I didn’t believe him. Did you? ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2004, 7:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-just-in-war-in-vietnam-over/260811/10 "2004-08-21T07:24:49Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Not in the slightest. Its only that Sen Kerry has a capacity thate exceeds the binary. You see, its not just that important, international type stuff is seldom black, white and simplistic. Its that its _never_ black, white, and simple. > > John Kerry made a mistake. He trusted GeeDubya (Praise the Leader!) to be prudent, cautious, and flexible. > > Note well: the Pubbies can only claim that Kerry voted _for war_ if they can show that GeeDubya was entirely clear about his intentions to go to war. I certainly believed he intended to go to war regardless, but that’s because I regard GeeDubya as a stubborn, self-righteous and mendacious medocrity. > > So when GeeDubya told me that he was intent on preserving peace, when he told me that he would only lead us into war if there were _no_ other option, I didn’t believe him. > > Did you? Just so. I didn’t believe him either, and I’m hard-pressed to understand why Senator Kerry did. Still, I’m disappointed in the way he’s being taken to task for answering the question he was asked: “Had you known then the truth of the WMD situation as we know it today, would your vote for authorizing military action have been the same?” _[Note: preceding is paraphrased – **kd99**]_. Some friendly reporter needs to toss him the follow-up softballs: “Do you believe the President exploited that authorization in a manner consistent with your intentions at the time of your vote?”; and “Had you known how consistent or inconsistent with your intentions the President wuld have exploited the authorization, would you have voted to bestow the authorization on this president?” If he answers “Yes” to those two, then the hell with it; we’re doomed, and I’m writing in Kucinich. ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2004, 10:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-just-in-war-in-vietnam-over/260811/11 "2004-08-21T10:33:06Z")
> [@TVeblen](#): > > Is Clinton still a draft dodger for earning a Rhodes scholarship? No, he’s a draft dodger for dodging the draft. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2004, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-just-in-war-in-vietnam-over/260811/12 "2004-08-21T14:15:47Z")
> [@](#): > > We never should have gotten out of it, > Never should have abandoned the democracy that was South Vietnam. > We should never have listened to those evil anti-war types like Kerry. > Bush should promise America that if elected he will return America to the Jungles of Vietnam, and do it right this time. > The Swift Boat Veterans for Truth deserve no less. > To be truly fair to them, we should allow them to go back with our new troops, and participate in the liberation of Saigon. > Let freedom Reign! I fear the blatant sarcasm in this post may be missed some some of our fair posters. ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2004, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-just-in-war-in-vietnam-over/260811/13 "2004-08-21T14:20:38Z")
I hope not. That was comedy gold. ---
**Author:** ![cornflakes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9d8465/32.png) [@cornflakes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cornflakes)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2004, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-just-in-war-in-vietnam-over/260811/14 "2004-08-21T14:30:26Z")
I agree. Two out of… uh… two Dopers agree, **Squink** is a comedic genius. ---
**Author:** ![Finagle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/b19c9b/32.png) [@Finagle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Finagle)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2004, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-just-in-war-in-vietnam-over/260811/15 "2004-08-21T14:56:43Z")
The way I understand it, Kerry is either a bonafide war hero, or he gamed the system to get a handful of medals and his ass shipped back to the U.S. intact. If it’s the first, then there’s no issue. And if it’s the second, then it shows a capability to manipulate the System that you want in a chief executive. True, the second option means that he’s probably a lying weasel, but he \* is \* a politician, so that shouldn’t surprise anyone. Yeah, I’m kind of depressed that he’s the mediocre best the Democrats had to offer, but if this is the worst smoking gun the opposition can dig up, then I guess he’ll do. ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2004, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-just-in-war-in-vietnam-over/260811/16 "2004-08-21T15:10:44Z")
That’s kind of how I see it. ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2004, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-just-in-war-in-vietnam-over/260811/17 "2004-08-21T15:24:52Z")
> [@Finagle](#): > > Yeah, I’m kind of depressed that he’s the mediocre best the Democrats had to offer, but if this is the worst smoking gun the opposition can dig up, then I guess he’ll do. Nothing mediocre about Kerry. I really believe that attack politics has lowered us to this. All the evidence says he’s a fine man and a good leader. He’s represented his people well, somehow managing to be “the most liberal Senator” while simultaneously being a poll-dependent flip-flopper. I’m not sure what you feel makes him mediocre, and I’m not sure we would know a good leader when we saw one anymore. ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2004, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-just-in-war-in-vietnam-over/260811/18 "2004-08-21T15:30:44Z")
I would. He would fight for my freedom without making me his slave. ---
**Author:** ![Finagle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/b19c9b/32.png) [@Finagle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Finagle)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2004, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-just-in-war-in-vietnam-over/260811/19 "2004-08-21T16:37:22Z")
> [@Hentor the Barbarian](#): > > Nothing mediocre about Kerry. I really believe that attack politics has lowered us to this. All the evidence says he’s a fine man and a good leader. He’s represented his people well, somehow managing to be “the most liberal Senator” while simultaneously being a poll-dependent flip-flopper. I’m not sure what you feel makes him mediocre, and I’m not sure we would know a good leader when we saw one anymore. From what I gather, the journalists in Massachusetts who know him best and have followed him longest don’t have a lot of good things to say about him. If he had a distinguished legislative record, then he’d be pointing to that instead of harping on his military record. But my primary evidence for “mediocre” is that the race is so close – Bush is politically vulnerable due to an unpopular war, high oil prices, and not much good economic news and a compelling candidate would clean his clock. Kerry is not that candidate. ---
**Author:** ![Sevastopol](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cdc98d/32.png) [@Sevastopol](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sevastopol)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2004, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-just-in-war-in-vietnam-over/260811/20 "2004-08-22T00:07:49Z")
Stuff and nonsense. We don’t hear about Kerry’s legislative record because it is boring. Having worn a uniform and been awarded medals works. That is why we hear about it. It is a marketing decision, no more. No what amazes me is the candidates’ pact to conceal their mutual plans to enslave the American population, whether or not they choose to simultaneously fight for their freedom. Now _that_ is media management. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-just-in-war-in-vietnam-over/260811.md?page=2)