# This stupid fucking bag ban in California **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 27, 2016, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-stupid-fucking-bag-ban-in-california/773112 "2016-11-27T00:02:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![PatriotX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c4cdca/32.png) [@PatriotX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatriotX)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2016, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-stupid-fucking-bag-ban-in-california/773112/121 "2016-11-27T15:52:17Z")
> [@aldiboronti](#): > > How many of the sneering posters here have been in a position where 10c _matters_ and its lack can mean the difference between buying something you need or going without it? On behalf of those who fit the shoe You don’t know me. If your argument depends on your assumptions about people you’ve never met, there’s a significant probability that your argument is poorly founded. A better argument would be to demonstrate exactly how much of a monetary impact this fee has on someone. From what I can tell it’s largest impact is on someone who has poor planning skills and who is poor enough to receive public assistance but who is not receiving public assistance. But even there, I’m not sure of how much of an impact this largest impact is. But we should try to compensate for everyone who has problems planning everyday activities. If your post was sarcasm, then…uh…nvm ---
**Author:** ![joyfool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/df788c/32.png) [@joyfool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/joyfool)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2016, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-stupid-fucking-bag-ban-in-california/773112/122 "2016-11-27T16:45:20Z")
Nah, his post wasn’t sarcasm. And I’m on both ends. I now sack groceries for a living and I’m so poor I can’t afford to pay attention. And you know what? I’d welcome this in my state because I believe it’s better in the long run on multiple fronts. I think is poor folks would benefit from having more reusable bags around (which you can get for free here at the resale I volunteer at), the environment would be better off, my store’s bottom line would improve (helping the economy) and, although they are indeed a bitch to load (takes longer and are more bulky / problematic ), plastic sacks ain’t no walk in the park either. And now that I constantly encounter people on WIC, SNAP and other forms of robbing Peter to pay Paul, I can assure you that a .10¢ bag fee won’t be the issue. Not by a long shot. ---
**Author:** ![Patx2](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/73ab20/32.png) [@Patx2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Patx2)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2016, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-stupid-fucking-bag-ban-in-california/773112/123 "2016-11-27T16:48:07Z")
> [@araminty](#): > > Really? Then consider the 10c/bag a stupidity tax. Ouch! Now you suggest stupid people like me be taxed more? What’s next a tax break for geniuses? Where does it end? What about those of average intelligence? 🕶 ---
**Author:** ![That\_Don\_Guy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/that_don_guy/32/538_2.png) [@That\_Don\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/That_Don_Guy)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2016, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-stupid-fucking-bag-ban-in-california/773112/124 "2016-11-27T16:57:22Z")
If a store really wants to get around the ban, it can. The law says that some plastic bags can still be supplied for free - for example, to keep meat in so it doesn’t leak onto anything else, and to keep produce in (you’re not expected to buy, say, green beans or Brussels sprouts and carry them loose). What stops them from using the old-style carryout plastic bags for this purpose? ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2016, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-stupid-fucking-bag-ban-in-california/773112/125 "2016-11-27T17:06:19Z")
I’ve always wondered why bags were free in the first place. When I lived in Budapest, you had to either buy them or bring your own and bag your own groceries. It wasn’t a matter of being poor or rich, and I doubt it was done for environmental reasons-- it simply a matter of them not being free. Fucking packets of ketchup and mayo at McDonald’s weren’t even free. It didn’t take long to figure out how to reuse a bag. And the bags there cost more than ten cents (I remember the equivalent of about 50 cents) in a city where the average monthly salary was $400-500 a month. People figured out to bring their own bags. ---
**Author:** ![joyfool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/df788c/32.png) [@joyfool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/joyfool)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2016, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-stupid-fucking-bag-ban-in-california/773112/126 "2016-11-27T17:18:13Z")
Right? But you know Americans. We like to bitch (and bitch and bitch) about anything, especially if it’s something we feel entitled to. It’s just our way. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2016, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-stupid-fucking-bag-ban-in-california/773112/127 "2016-11-27T18:17:19Z")
A chicken in every pot, and a bag to bring it home in!! ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2016, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-stupid-fucking-bag-ban-in-california/773112/128 "2016-11-27T18:24:44Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > You do realize you just confirmed my point, right? That’s how Trump responds when someone calls him out. BigTard is certain posters’ version of Lying Ted or Crooked Hillary. And, in your edit, you admit it made you feel good to hurt someone else. > > If you have a valid counterargument, you can make it. If you don’t, you’ll fall back on stupid shit like this. Either way is not my concern, as you confirmed I can now ignore everything you say from now on. > > Life’s too short for you lost causes. The BigTard lecture series continues. Fuck off, you mouthbreathing, basement dwelling sanctimonious piece of shit. Go back in the cellar and yell at mommy for bringing home the wrong kind of cheese. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2016, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-stupid-fucking-bag-ban-in-california/773112/129 "2016-11-27T18:30:09Z")
> [@Rigamarole](#): > > If you’re not aware already, this election CA voters chose to ban all single-use bags from retailers. I remember being similarly disappointed when Scotland similarly banned bags. I got over it; you will too. ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2016, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-stupid-fucking-bag-ban-in-california/773112/130 "2016-11-27T18:41:27Z")
> [@Ruken](#): > > I don’t have strong feelings on this topic, but what’s the evidence that single-use plastic bags are causing enough of a problem in this country that it needs fixing. Vs giving myself a good long green wank without accomplishing much. Read **wolfpup’s** and **smapti’s** posts. They both bring up some compelling points. > [@wolfpup](#): > > The important reason for phasing out plastic bags is that they are an environmental scourge. Besides the raw materials for their manufacture, as I said in a different thread earlier this year the plastics we consume are ending up in our environment on land and especially in the ocean – see [Great Pacific Garbage Patch](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Pacific_garbage_patch) for one vivid illustration. The plastics turn into microplastic particulates that are ingested by all kinds of marine life and threaten ocean life and bidiversity in several important ways. They can become bound to toxic metals and PCBs through adsorption and other processes and make their way up the food chain. At the current rate of plastic pollution, by around 2050 the total mass of plastic in the world’s oceans will outweigh the fish. > [@Smapti](#): > > Honestly, I thought the bag bans were pointless meddling myself at first. What changed my mind was a visit to Pacific Science Center a few years back, where one of the exhibits was of a big pile of junk that had been extracted from the stomach of a beached whale. A massive part of the pile was plastic grocery bags, and a pretty big portion of them were bags from my company. It really made me feel guilty to see the evidence that the company my livelihood depends upon was partly responsible for that. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2016, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-stupid-fucking-bag-ban-in-california/773112/131 "2016-11-27T18:52:43Z")
My city banned them a year ago or so. I’ve been bringing my own bags in for over ten years. I just hate waste. It’s one of my quirks. Originally I would get their bags and then reuse them until they tore and then get new ones. I eventually got sturdy ones that I have now been using for years. They stay in the trunk of my car. ---
**Author:** ![Ruken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f475e1/32.png) [@Ruken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ruken)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2016, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-stupid-fucking-bag-ban-in-california/773112/132 "2016-11-27T19:34:47Z")
> [@cochrane](#): > > Read **wolfpup’s** and **smapti’s** posts. They both bring up some compelling points. Gyres and whale stomachs make for good clickbait. But the U.S. is responsible for less than 1% of global mismanaged plastic waste. (DOI: 10.1126/science.1260352) That doesn’t mean don’t do anything, otherwise we’re like the anti-AGW folks who point at china (also the main culprit here) and their coal plants. But I don’t think the positive impact is what people expect. Which makes negative impacts, if any, stick out more. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2016, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-stupid-fucking-bag-ban-in-california/773112/133 "2016-11-27T19:36:52Z")
I think the ban is a great thing and I am very glad I voted for it. Sure, I’ve had to go back to the car to get my bags a few times, but it is rapidly becoming reflex to grab a couple out of the stash in the trunk every time I go into a store. We must have a dozen or so bags there, ranging from small, plastic totes with Iron Man and Yoda on them to huge canvas bags supporting breast cancer research and Office Depot feeling good about themselves. The baggers and checkers get a kick out of the variety, and if I really need a disposable bag for some reason, I buy some produce. No hu-hu. The OP is being an idiot. ---
**Author:** ![Dr\_Paprika](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr_paprika/32/3042_2.png) [@Dr\_Paprika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr_Paprika)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2016, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-stupid-fucking-bag-ban-in-california/773112/134 "2016-11-27T19:49:48Z")
They did this in Ontario (Canada). People complained and got on with their lives. Supposedly it does help the environment, though probably not much. It is regressive on the very poor, and led to a moderate increase in sales of more durable plastic and fabric bags. But businesses themselves are often ambivalent about it and often give bags away for free, and probably would if you cared to whine loudly enough. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2016, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-stupid-fucking-bag-ban-in-california/773112/135 "2016-11-27T20:01:33Z")
> [@joyfool](#): > > Right? But you know Americans. We like to bitch (and bitch and bitch) about anything, especially if it’s something we feel entitled to. It’s just our way. I also wonder if some people here have just never shopped at Aldi. I don’t think they’ve ever given away free bags, bag bans or not. You either buy a sturdy bag, or bring your own. I’ve never much heard of people complaining about that (and it also tends to draw shoppers on tighter budgets than your average supermarket.) ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2016, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-stupid-fucking-bag-ban-in-california/773112/136 "2016-11-27T20:13:26Z")
> [@Monty](#): > > One might even be tempted to buy, perhaps, a box of (generic) plastic bags off the shelf. Someone up-thread (forgot to quote) said 2500 bags for $50, so that makes bags about 2 cents. Stand outside the store and sell your bags for 7 cents, undercutting the “tax/fee”, and PROFIT! 😛 (Until some punk comes along and only wants 5 cents for his! :mad: ) > [@Rigamarole](#): > > Another thing: I’m sure there will be more shoplifting as it becomes the norm to just walk out of stores with unbagged items now. You are a genius! I’ll never pay for anything in California again! If challenged at the door on the way out, I’ll claim that my receipt was emailed to me. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2016, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-stupid-fucking-bag-ban-in-california/773112/137 "2016-11-27T20:24:03Z")
> [@Gatopescado](#): > > You are a genius! I’ll never pay for anything in California again! If challenged at the door on the way out, I’ll claim that my receipt was emailed to me. 😉 That’s really a good plan. Seriously. I use Wal-Mart Pay and don’t get a paper receipt. It’s sent to my phone. I could see a shoplifter using that excuse. ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2016, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-stupid-fucking-bag-ban-in-california/773112/138 "2016-11-27T20:26:21Z")
I hate the bag ban, one supermarket I regularly go it has that system in effect, many times I didn’t shop there because I had no bag and don’t want to buy reusable bags as I have enough of them. There just gotta be a better way, perhaps each bag has a return stamp on it os I can get them next time. Perhaps I should be able to bring my reusable bags back in bulk for a refund or just store them there. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2016, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-stupid-fucking-bag-ban-in-california/773112/139 "2016-11-27T20:29:52Z")
> [@cochrane](#): > > That’s really a good plan. Seriously. I use Wal-Mart Pay and don’t get a paper receipt. It’s sent to my phone. I could see a shoplifter using that excuse. Then it would be easy enough to either have them show the proof on the phone or tell which checker served them. > [@kanicbird](#): > > I hate the bag ban, one supermarket I regularly go it has that system in effect, many times I didn’t shop there because I had no bag and don’t want to buy reusable bags as I have enough of them. > > There just gotta be a better way, perhaps each bag has a return stamp on it os I can get them next time. Perhaps I should be able to bring my reusable bags back in bulk for a refund or just store them there. The Trader Joe’s by me has a box where people can put their excess bags for others to use. ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2016, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-stupid-fucking-bag-ban-in-california/773112/140 "2016-11-27T21:06:04Z")
> [@hajario](#): > > Then it would be easy enough to either have them show the proof on the phone or tell which checker served them. I didn’t say they would get away with it. I could see someone trying that, though. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-stupid-fucking-bag-ban-in-california/773112.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-stupid-fucking-bag-ban-in-california/773112.md?page=8)