# This whole anti-French thing just went WAY too far **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 14, 2003, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-whole-anti-french-thing-just-went-way-too-far/161215 "2003-03-14T00:57:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Coldfire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a587f6/32.png) [@Coldfire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Coldfire)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2003, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-whole-anti-french-thing-just-went-way-too-far/161215/41 "2003-03-15T02:11:23Z")
Yeah, really, **rogzilla**. Amazingly, you found an anecdote of some rude French people. Big fucking deal. I could provide you with similar examples of dozens of Dutchmen, Germans, British, Finnish, Siera Leonians… I think you get the idea. If you think one example of extreme French rudeness (however impolite) is enough to start digging up 74,000 war heroes, then I humbly suggest you ARE a “typical pig” - who happens to be American. **Sofa King** , we’re not barking up the wrong tree at all - you just gave us _another_ tree to bark up to. Sheeee-yit. You’d be hard pressed to _find_ idiocy of this magnitude if you started looking: for some reason, a lot of them have convinced enough others to vote them into Congress. This is some scary stuff, man. _“Better the pride that resides in a citizen of the world Than the pride that divides when a colourful rag is unfurled”_ – Neil Peart ( **Rush** - _Territories_) ---
**Author:** ![Beagle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/85f322/32.png) [@Beagle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beagle)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2003, 2:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-whole-anti-french-thing-just-went-way-too-far/161215/42 "2003-03-15T02:24:26Z")
I’m pretty sure that the Angles and the Saxtons never got along with the French anyway. 😛 :o ---
**Author:** ![Beagle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/85f322/32.png) [@Beagle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beagle)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2003, 2:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-whole-anti-french-thing-just-went-way-too-far/161215/43 "2003-03-15T02:27:43Z")
I know, it’s Saxons. Double pun. Still stupid? Sorry. ---
**Author:** ![CLedet](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b487fb/32.png) [@CLedet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CLedet)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2003, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-whole-anti-french-thing-just-went-way-too-far/161215/44 "2003-03-15T03:09:43Z")
Bashing the French is nothing new: “France has neither winter nor summer nor morals. Apart from these drawbacks it is a fine country. France has usually been governed by prostitutes.” —Mark Twain ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Lance\_Murdoch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/47e85d/32.png) [@Captain\_Lance\_Murdoch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Lance_Murdoch)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2003, 4:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-whole-anti-french-thing-just-went-way-too-far/161215/45 "2003-03-15T04:55:51Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originaly posted by jjimm_So, a 10-year-old and her family act like asshats towards a friend of yours… and thus, an entire nation is condemned. I never condemned France and I never will. I said people should be nice to each other no matter where they are from. I was trying to say this kind of nationalism is idiotic and the France bashing going on today is pointless. I do think, however, that anti-Americanism has become ingrained in France (and in Europe in general) to a depressing degree. I would not wish to see the same kind of anti-French, German or whateverism take hold here. > [@](#): > > _Origianly posted by Coldfire_If you think one example of extreme French rudeness (however impolite) is enough to start digging up 74,000 war heroes, then I humbly suggest you ARE a “typical pig” - who happens to be American. There is nothing humble about your post. Did you even read my post? Where did I endorse this crazy idea? I could site dozens of examples too but it would be (a) boring and (b) pointless. You can’t use the word “typical” and then qualify it by saying “who happens to be.” ---
**Author:** ![Coldfire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a587f6/32.png) [@Coldfire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Coldfire)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2003, 6:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-whole-anti-french-thing-just-went-way-too-far/161215/46 "2003-03-15T06:02:09Z")
Nice going, **rogzilla**. As long as we’re playing semantics games, how does saying: > [@](#): > > \*\*Many years ago, a friend of mine (a very, very pretty girl) went to France as an au pair. She was majoring in French, so the language was not a problem. She wanted to make a good impression on her host family. She brought them small gifts (not an easy thing for a student). Needless to say, the they rolled thier eyes at the American things she brought them. Their ten-year old girl told my friend she was a “typical American pig.” Now where could she have gotten an idea like that? > > With all the France-bashing going on now, I think we still have a long way to go before we catch up in this idiotic race. The French are masters at this.\*\* … inlfuence the following hollow phrase: > [@](#): > > \*\*How about just being nice to people no matter where they are from? \*\* Well, duh. Of course being nice to peope regardless of their nationality is a good thing. So what purpose does your example serve? You obviously believe it applies to all French people, as you state: “With all the France-bashing going on now, I think we still have a long way to go before we catch up in this idiotic race. The French are masters at this”. Forgive me for being a tad unconvinced if you then follow up with a standard “why can’t we all just get along”. It has no merit if you just bashed an entire people based on one example. > [@](#): > > **I do think, however, that anti-Americanism has become ingrained in France (and in Europe in general) to a depressing degree. I would not wish to see the same kind of anti-French, German or whateverism take hold here.** Neither do I. And I can assure you that whatever your media tell you, there is no “anti-Americanism engrained in Europe”. Sure, there’s plenty of criticism right now. If that’s anti-Americanism to you, then there’s nothing I can do to change that. If you want this “anti-Americanism” to go away, I suggest you don’t vote for Bush in 2004. ---
**Author:** ![Freudian\_Slit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@Freudian\_Slit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freudian_Slit)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2003, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-whole-anti-french-thing-just-went-way-too-far/161215/47 "2003-03-15T17:40:22Z")
This is not only horrible…but well…gross. I mean, we’re SO anti-French that everything in their nation with the American stamp of shoddiness…er, approval, must be reposessed? Even our rotting skeletal corpses? God. The U.S. is turning into the proverbial little kid in the sandbox. “You won’t play with me, so I’m taking my corpses and going home!” Or, we could use the lover analogy. “I hate you! You ruined my life! You disgust me! I’m over you forever, now give me back every gift/piece of lingerie/veteran corpse I ever left at your apartment! And that’s the last time I’m going to ask…really!” Or…to go back to the children analogy. “Waah! But Johnny Five’s parents let HIM have corpses. I’m appealing it to the U.S. government!” Well, that last one was a stretch. But still. The U.S. The red, the white, the blue. Protecting once again our national treasure. Our national corpses. Rock on, Uncle Sam. ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2003, 12:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-whole-anti-french-thing-just-went-way-too-far/161215/48 "2003-03-16T00:27:58Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Zoggie \* > The U.S. is turning into the proverbial little kid in the sandbox. Please do not lump all of us Americans with the overzealous jingoistic schemes of a few Republican Congresscritters. ☹ (What _is_ it with Republican politicians, really? “Freedom fries,” “Freedom toast,” and now this? :eek: Don’t they have any real work to do, like inventing new reasons to go to war?) ---
**Author:** ![Jeff\_Lodoen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/b3f665/32.png) [@Jeff\_Lodoen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jeff_Lodoen)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2003, 10:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-whole-anti-french-thing-just-went-way-too-far/161215/49 "2003-03-16T10:42:39Z")
First Trent now this. We ain’t called the stupid party for nothin’! But, I just learned of this cow on the National Review weblog (the mention was… not positive.) I immediately thought “that thread I avoided must be about this” and I was right. ---
**Author:** ![Rysdad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/7cd45c/32.png) [@Rysdad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rysdad)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2003, 11:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-whole-anti-french-thing-just-went-way-too-far/161215/50 "2003-03-16T11:41:10Z")
I started disliking the French when our unit had to train with their “military” back in 1972. No wonder they have a Foreign Legion. I wouldn’t advocate disinterring 70-something-thousand fallen soldiers, though. I’ll just do my part by boycotting Perrier. 'Course, I never bought it before… ---
**Author:** ![Wearia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/13edae/32.png) [@Wearia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wearia)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2003, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-whole-anti-french-thing-just-went-way-too-far/161215/51 "2003-03-16T18:08:42Z")
Anyone see SNL last night? They had a bit on Weekend Update called “Yelling at Americans.” It gave me hope that a lot of Americans can see how stupid their government is being. ---
**Author:** ![moi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c2a13f/32.png) [@moi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/moi)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2003, 4:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-whole-anti-french-thing-just-went-way-too-far/161215/52 "2003-03-17T04:51:08Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Coldfire \* > 74,000 vets. If only the dead could speak. They’d step right up and bitch-slap the ever loving snot out of Ginny Brown-Waite. On the other hand, some of the living WW II vets are also snubbing the French. I’ve seen news stories on vets in [Ohio](http://www.wtrf.com/home/headlines/258131.html), [Florida](http://news.tbo.com/news/MGA3RU0D5DD.html) and [Massachussetts](http://www.turnto10.com/news/2041864/detail.html) returning medals of bravery the received from the French government. I feel like my countrymen and women are being juvenile (yes, you members of the [Freedom Quarter Union](http://www.heraldtribune.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?Date=20030315&Category=APN&ArtNo=303150903&Ref=AR), I’m talking to you), and I’m overwhelmed with embarrassment and disappointment. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![Coldfire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a587f6/32.png) [@Coldfire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Coldfire)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2003, 10:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-whole-anti-french-thing-just-went-way-too-far/161215/53 "2003-03-17T10:28:35Z")
Well, there’s no reason why WWII vets can’t be complete assholes either. They’ll always be my heroes, don’t get me wrong, but when they use their hard-earned medals as some sort of statement in this battle of international politics, then I can only say they seriously disappoint me. If anything, I expect _these_ guys to know better. I’ll just console myself with the thought that the number of WWII vets disgracing their medals of honour this way is a small, very small minority in a large community of men and women who know what war can be REALLY like, and what France was REALLY liberated for. ---
**Author:** ![CLedet](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b487fb/32.png) [@CLedet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CLedet)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2003, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-whole-anti-french-thing-just-went-way-too-far/161215/54 "2003-03-17T14:45:10Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by moi \* > I feel like my countrymen and women are being juvenile (yes, you members of the [Freedom Quarter Union](http://www.heraldtribune.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?Date=20030315&Category=APN&ArtNo=303150903&Ref=AR), I’m talking to you), and I’m overwhelmed with embarrassment and disappointment. ☹ \*\* Don’t get upset. The French Quarter, cafe au lait, and beignets are safe. I agree that a lot of whats going on is juvenile, but why do you think it’s only one sided? The same freedom of expression that these so called peace protesters like to throw around extends to the other side also. > [@](#): > > - posted by Coldfire \* > Well, there’s no reason why WWII vets can’t be complete assholes either. They’ll always be my heroes, don’t get me wrong, but when they use their hard-earned medals as some sort of statement in this battle of international politics, then I can only say they seriously disappoint me. If anything, I expect these guys to know better. I’ll just console myself with the thought that the number of WWII vets disgracing their medals of honour this way is a small, very small minority in a large community of men and women who know what war can be REALLY like, and what France was REALLY liberated for. Why call them assholes? Why is this disgraceful? To me this is just a form of expression that like it or not, isn’t any more or less pointed than burning the American flag. While I don’t have any cite, I’ll bet dollars to beignets that Old Glory is taking more of a beating. ---
**Author:** ![Sivalensis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c4cdca/32.png) [@Sivalensis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sivalensis)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2003, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-whole-anti-french-thing-just-went-way-too-far/161215/55 "2003-03-17T14:59:01Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by rogzilla \* > \*\*Many years ago, a friend of mine (a very, very pretty girl) went to France as an au pair. She was majoring in French, so the language was not a problem. She wanted to make a good impression on her host family. She brought them small gifts (not an easy thing for a student). Needless to say, the they rolled thier eyes at the American things she brought them. Their ten-year old girl told my friend she was a “typical American pig.” Now where could she have gotten an idea like that? > > With all the France-bashing going on now, I think we still have a long way to go before we catch up in this idiotic race. The French are masters at this. > > How about just being nice to people no matter where they are from? \*\* Hmm…Well, I didn’t go as an au pair, but I went once in high school on an exchange, once in college for a couple weeks, once in my junior year for a semester, and then post graduation to teach english (that was the only time I didn’t stay in a family). I was a French major, so language wasn’t a problem. All the families I stayed with appreciated the gifts I brought them, and I made sure I brought gifts that were typically American. There are always bad apples, in any society. There are a lot of French who disagree with American policy and (based on some reality) American people (because tourists over there can be really horrible and arrogant, but that’s another thread). But as a whole, I didn’t run into any “racism” for being an American. ---
**Author:** ![Coldfire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a587f6/32.png) [@Coldfire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Coldfire)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2003, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-whole-anti-french-thing-just-went-way-too-far/161215/56 "2003-03-17T14:59:23Z")
I don’t know, it’s hard to put a finger on it. If anything, the liberation of Europe ought to have shown them the dangers of nationalism, which is what rabid patriotism can turn into. They gave France their freedom back, but when France excercises that freedom and it happens to not coincide with the wants and needs of the US government, they’re willing to give up the medals France gave them out of gratitude. That just reeks. Maybe assholes is too strong a word, but it’s not a form of expression I particularly care for. Burning a flag is meaningless, IMHO. This, however, is like giving back your wedding ring because your wife refuses to switch the TV to “Gunfight at the WMD Corral”. ---
**Author:** ![booka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e0b2c6/32.png) [@booka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/booka)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2003, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-whole-anti-french-thing-just-went-way-too-far/161215/57 "2003-03-17T15:32:01Z")
Dig up dead soldiers from France and transport them back to the U.S.? Jesus God - there are no words to describe the depths of this woman’s stupidity at even suggesting this. Forget how shamelessly she is pandering to the current rage of jingoist sentiments in the media. What a grandstanding shit-fer-brains. ---
**Author:** ![CLedet](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b487fb/32.png) [@CLedet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CLedet)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2003, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-whole-anti-french-thing-just-went-way-too-far/161215/58 "2003-03-17T16:03:50Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Coldfire \* > Burning a flag is meaningless, IMHO. Tell that to those same veterans who are giving back the medals. FWIW, I agree with most of your post, it’s getting out of hand on both sides. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/this-whole-anti-french-thing-just-went-way-too-far/161215.md?page=2)