# Those Kids with their Awful Rock and Roll... **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 10, 2019, 11:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/those-kids-with-their-awful-rock-and-roll/832327 "2019-04-10T11:51:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Horatio\_Hellpop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Horatio\_Hellpop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatio_Hellpop)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2019, 11:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/those-kids-with-their-awful-rock-and-roll/832327/1 "2019-04-10T11:51:03Z")
Rock and Roll music was, in its original form, intended for kids. By the 1960s it was intended specifically for Baby Boom kids, and by the 70s most of the performers and songwriters had been born after 1945. But once in a while, a composition would come through by somebody of a distinctly older generation. I don’t mean Robert Johnson or Leadbelly or Gershwin; their songs were intended for their own generation, and they didn’t have a lot of say over who got to cover their stuff. Shel Silverstein wrote “Cover of the Rolling Stone” for a band full of guys young enough to be his children, and an audience young enough to be his grandchildren. And while he was hip to the then-current lingo, you just know he didn’t have any affection for the kids he was writing about. Are there any other Rock hits, written FOR rockers and a young audience by somebody born in 1930 or sooner (Retreads of Steven Foster and Kurt Weill don’t count), that have a patronizing “Old man shakes fist at cloud” quality to them? And is there a name for this? ---
**Author:** ![elbows](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b3f665/32.png) [@elbows](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elbows)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2019, 12:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/those-kids-with-their-awful-rock-and-roll/832327/2 "2019-04-10T12:08:28Z")
‘Money For Nothing’ immediately springs to mind. ---
**Author:** ![Fretful\_Porpentine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fretful_porpentine/32/2873_2.png) [@Fretful\_Porpentine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fretful_Porpentine)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2019, 1:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/those-kids-with-their-awful-rock-and-roll/832327/3 "2019-04-10T13:01:18Z")
> [@elbows](#): > > ‘Money For Nothing’ immediately springs to mind. Mark Knopfler was born in 1949. The OP was asking about songs written by people born BEFORE 1930, if I’m understanding correctly. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2019, 1:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/those-kids-with-their-awful-rock-and-roll/832327/4 "2019-04-10T13:09:19Z")
Also, if Money for Nothing was more sarcastic it would burn holes in the floor. It only has any kind of “dude shakes fist at cloud” feeling if the sarcasm goes above your head. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2019, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/those-kids-with-their-awful-rock-and-roll/832327/5 "2019-04-10T13:16:12Z")
Charles Strouse’s “One Last Kiss” from _Bye Bye Birdie_ seems to fit. There were probably quite a few early rock tunes that were written by older songwriters. A little research came up with “The Bristol Stomp” by the Dovells, written by Kal Mann and Dave Appell. Mann also co-wrote “Mashed Potato Time,” which was the 2nd best selling single of 1962. Mann and Appell also wrote “Let’s Twist Again” for Chubby Checker. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2019, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/those-kids-with-their-awful-rock-and-roll/832327/6 "2019-04-10T13:16:32Z")
Not a song, but Tom Lehrer’s intro to his own _Oedipus Rex_ springs to mind: > [@](#): > > It seems that most of the songs that you hear these days > on the radio played by the disk jockeys, apart from rock > and roll and other children’s records, tend to be motion > picture title songs. Apparently producers feel that we > will not attend their movies unless we have the titles > well drilled into our heads in advance. [http://www.metrolyrics.com/oedipus-rex-lyrics-tom-lehrer.html](http://www.metrolyrics.com/oedipus-rex-lyrics-tom-lehrer.html) Lehrer was born in 1928. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2019, 1:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/those-kids-with-their-awful-rock-and-roll/832327/7 "2019-04-10T13:27:37Z")
> [@Horatio\_Hellpop](#): > > Shel Silverstein wrote “Cover of the Rolling Stone” for a band full of guys young enough to be his children, and an audience young enough to be his grandchildren. And while he was hip to the then-current lingo, you just know he didn’t have any affection for the kids he was writing about. How’s that? It’s not mean-spirited in the least, or even sarcastic really. ISTM to have pretty much the same flavor as Joe Walsh’s “Life’s Been Good.” I’ve known both songs for most of my life, and I couldn’t have told you that one of them was written by someone from a pre-rock n’ roll generation, let alone which one. ---
**Author:** ![gregorio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/fbc32d/32.png) [@gregorio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gregorio)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2019, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/those-kids-with-their-awful-rock-and-roll/832327/8 "2019-04-10T15:08:33Z")
Hmmm, Santana just came on the radio here. Would “Oye Como Va” count? Tito Puente was born in 1923. Carlos Santana was born in 1947. Or, would you consider that not Rock and Roll, or **just** a cover? ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2019, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/those-kids-with-their-awful-rock-and-roll/832327/9 "2019-04-10T15:42:58Z")
Shel Silverstein was all of 42 when he wrote “Cover.” Not too many grandchildren were listening at the time. He was only three years older than Jerry Leiber and Mike Stoller and five years younger than Doc Pomus. Both Burt Bacharach and Hal David were older than him. ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2019, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/those-kids-with-their-awful-rock-and-roll/832327/10 "2019-04-10T17:28:04Z")
[Doc Pomus](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doc_Pomus), born 1925, who wrote or co-wrote songs ranging from _Suspicion_ to _Viva Las Vegas_. He’s in the Rock and Roll Hall of fame, and perhaps even more importantly, was instrumental in helping Lou Reed get started. ---
**Author:** ![ChockFullOfHeadyGoodness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chockfullofheadygoodness/32/511_2.png) [@ChockFullOfHeadyGoodness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ChockFullOfHeadyGoodness)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2019, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/those-kids-with-their-awful-rock-and-roll/832327/11 "2019-04-10T17:29:17Z")
Not born pre-1930, but pre-1940: Peter, Paul and Mary’s “I Dig Rock and Roll Music”. Paul would have been 30 when he wrote it. Based on the lyrics, they most certainly did not “dig it”, and felt it was inferior to folk. ---
**Author:** ![ftg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ftg/32/2801_2.png) [@ftg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ftg)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2019, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/those-kids-with-their-awful-rock-and-roll/832327/12 "2019-04-10T21:32:42Z")
Ellas Otha Bates aka Bo Diddley was born in 1928. In addition to his big hits in the 50s, he had two songs make the US charts in the 60s. R&R Hall of Famer in it’s 2nd year. ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2019, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/those-kids-with-their-awful-rock-and-roll/832327/13 "2019-04-10T21:38:57Z")
Oh, hell. We’ve all forgotten the most obvious example. [Chuck Berry, born October 18, 1926.](https://www.rockhall.com/inductees/chuck-berry) ---
**Author:** ![ftg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ftg/32/2801_2.png) [@ftg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ftg)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2019, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/those-kids-with-their-awful-rock-and-roll/832327/14 "2019-04-11T14:14:58Z")
Oops, didn’t fully get the OP, I believe. Not sure if Bo Diddley ever did a song that fits. ---
**Author:** ![Horatio\_Hellpop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Horatio\_Hellpop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatio_Hellpop)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2019, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/those-kids-with-their-awful-rock-and-roll/832327/15 "2019-04-11T16:30:19Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > How’s that? It’s not mean-spirited in the least, or even sarcastic really. ISTM to have pretty much the same flavor as Joe Walsh’s “Life’s Been Good.” I’ve known both songs for most of my life, and I couldn’t have told you that one of them was written by someone from a pre-rock n’ roll generation, let alone which one. The difference, I think, is that Joe Walsh was drawing on things that actually happened to him, whereas Silverstein wrote about things that he was kind of shocked that 1970-era rock stars were getting away with: “All kinds of pills,” “ten thousand blue-eyed teenaged groupies who’ll do anything we say,” “sing about truth and we sing about beauty/for $10,000 a show,” etc. He was either unimpressed with their integrity, or jealous that he was to old to get in on the action; either way, he did not seem thrilled with what he saw. > [@ftg](#): > > Oops, didn’t fully get the OP, I believe. Not sure if Bo Diddley ever did a song that fits. Yeah, not really what I’m looking for. It’s not just songs written by old guys, it’s songs that take a condescending attitude towards their intended audience, from the viewpoint of “I’m older than you, I know what I’m talking about.” I gave a 1930 birth cutoff date for the songwriters, but probably shouldn’t have. There are late-era songs by Ray Davies (“Prince of the Punks”) that kind of fit otherwise. ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2019, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/those-kids-with-their-awful-rock-and-roll/832327/16 "2019-04-11T16:39:44Z")
John Phillips was 32 when he wrote [Creeque Allen](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creeque_Alley) about the early San Francisco and New York City folk scenes that produced his group the Mamas and the Papasa, the Loving Spoonful, the Byrds and one hit wonder Barry McGuire. ---
**Author:** ![Horatio\_Hellpop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Horatio\_Hellpop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatio_Hellpop)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2019, 5:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/those-kids-with-their-awful-rock-and-roll/832327/17 "2019-04-12T05:33:53Z")
Whenever I read about Bill Haley’s career, I think of this [Jerry Lewis song](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m6fS9j8LrmU). ---
**Author:** ![Wheelz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wheelz/32/5718_2.png) [@Wheelz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wheelz)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2019, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/those-kids-with-their-awful-rock-and-roll/832327/18 "2019-04-12T19:40:35Z")
> [@Horatio\_Hellpop](#): > > Shel Silverstein wrote “Cover of the Rolling Stone” for a band full of guys young enough to be his children, and an audience young enough to be his grandchildren. And while he was hip to the then-current lingo, you just know he didn’t have any affection for the kids he was writing about. > [@Horatio\_Hellpop](#): > > The difference, I think, is that Joe Walsh was drawing on things that actually happened to him, whereas Silverstein wrote about things that he was kind of shocked that 1970-era rock stars were getting away with: “All kinds of pills,” “ten thousand blue-eyed teenaged groupies who’ll do anything we say,” “sing about truth and we sing about beauty/for $10,000 a show,” etc. He was either unimpressed with their integrity, or jealous that he was to old to get in on the action; either way, he did not seem thrilled with what he saw. I really think you’re reading more into the song than is there. It’s a tongue-in-cheek ditty about the excesses of the rock & roll lifestyle. I don’t get any of the bitterness or jealousy or disdain that you’re talking about. ---
**Author:** ![thelurkinghorror](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7c8e57/32.png) [@thelurkinghorror](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thelurkinghorror)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2019, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/those-kids-with-their-awful-rock-and-roll/832327/19 "2019-04-12T19:55:11Z")
[Metal Christopher Lee \m/](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XFbPiUEA62A) And [Pat Boone](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/In_a_Metal_Mood:_No_More_Mr._Nice_Guy), but that was umm… not as authentic. And he was born in 1934 I guess. Not rock at all, but Tony Bennett is still managing to do modern music authentically. ---
**Author:** ![whitetho](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whitetho/32/1059_2.png) [@whitetho](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whitetho)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2019, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/those-kids-with-their-awful-rock-and-roll/832327/20 "2019-04-12T22:44:46Z")
Allan Sherman, born November 30, 1924, wrote and recorded the comedy song [Pop Hates the Beatles](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2L0k4BdJL_M), although it was not itself a rock song. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/those-kids-with-their-awful-rock-and-roll/832327.md?page=2)