# Thoughts on "The Bourne Identity" **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [June 22, 2002, 2:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thoughts-on-the-bourne-identity/115437 "2002-06-22T14:27:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![dantheman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dantheman/32/9421_2.png) [@dantheman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dantheman)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2002, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thoughts-on-the-bourne-identity/115437/21 "2002-06-28T13:45:51Z")
The character may be early 30s in the movie, but Matt Damon looks like he’s in his early 20s (although he’s not, of course). I didn’t think there was a lot of chemistry between Franka Potente and Damon. And I thought some of the pacing was absolutely dreadful - there were some quick bursts of action, then (to me) endless ennui. I thought the movie would be better directed, but it turned into just another typical action movie. The chase scenes were good, but something just didn’t click for me with Matt Damon. He looked confused - yes, I know the character was supposed to be confused. But to me, he actually looked confused in the role. ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2002, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thoughts-on-the-bourne-identity/115437/22 "2002-06-28T14:42:09Z")
> [@](#): > > _SkipMagic wrote:_ > > Eh? Actually, I’m not sure that’s what I read in the book. I could be wrong, of course, but I just don’t recall there being a second personality being programmed. Before the amnesia–according to what I had understood as I read the book–an identity of the character was Jason Bourne, but he was consiously aware of Bourne the entire time. In short, it was simply a role he was playing to draw out the assassin. In the second book, he kind of went mentally AWOL and thought he was Jason Bourne for real, but that’s as close as I could reconcile your version with the book(s). Please correct me if I’m wrong. You took the words out of my mouth regarding the first book. It wasn’t a matter of some weird brain-washing, but rather simply an identity he adopted for the purpose of the mission. Even in the second book (The Bourne Supremacy, for those who haven’t read it), i don’t think it was a case of going “mentally AWOL” but was instead an attempt to get himself back into the frame of mind required for hunting and killing, when he had been leading a peaceful life. That’s what he means when he constantly tells himself that he has no time be David Webb, and that he must think like Bourne. The closest analogy i can think of for those of us who aren’t spies is the sort of transformation we undergo when we play a sport seriously, in which we push aside all the extraneous matter of everyday living and rely almost solely on the particular skills required to perform well. ---
**Author:** ![samclem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a9a28c/32.png) [@samclem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/samclem)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2002, 2:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thoughts-on-the-bourne-identity/115437/23 "2002-06-29T02:00:42Z")
So, am I the only one who wonders about the **bjorn** identity?😃 ---
**Author:** ![OpalCat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/8edcca/32.png) [@OpalCat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OpalCat)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2002, 2:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thoughts-on-the-bourne-identity/115437/24 "2002-06-29T02:19:28Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Number Six \* > \*\* > > I don’t see how the year of the book’s publication is relevant to whether Matt Damon is the right age to play a movie character. The movie character is not the book character. Bourne is established as being in his early 30’s (via the passport)in the movie, and I maintain that Matt Damon is appropriate to play that age. \*\* Err, it’s relevant because it means that the movie totally made it up and it isn’t based on anything from the book. The movie character is not the book character? What, so the story isn’t the same either? WHy the hell did they call it “The Bourne Identity” if it’s something totally different and unrelated? Also, please tell me how someone in their early 30s has SOOOO much experience and so on in his field?? ---
**Author:** ![OpalCat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/8edcca/32.png) [@OpalCat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OpalCat)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2002, 2:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thoughts-on-the-bourne-identity/115437/25 "2002-06-29T02:22:28Z")
Actually, after reading this thread I’ve more or less decided not to see it. If they’ve changed that much from the story and made the character such a n00b that it seems plausible that he can do his job at age 30, then it just isn’t the same as the book in any way, shape, or form and probably would suck ass IMO. ---
**Author:** ![Hometownboy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/5e9695/32.png) [@Hometownboy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hometownboy)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2002, 3:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thoughts-on-the-bourne-identity/115437/26 "2002-06-29T03:53:22Z")
Another POV for **OpalCat**. It seems to me that it is entirely possible for someone in their early 30s to have a great deal of experience. Consider professional athletes, many of whom are past their prime and washed up by their early 30s. Some of them train and compete on intense schedules which provide them with enough experience, in some cases, to compete on a world class basis. I would guess that someone in whom the govt. has invested $30 million sheckels would probably train at least as hard as a world class gymnast… Or, forget all the rationalizations and go see it just for the pure joy of the wonderful car chase, deliciously so because it’s in a Mini-Cooper instead of some exotic Italian rocket or huge American muscle car. Back in the mists of time I had a college roommate who co-owned a gorgeous little Mini with his twin brother. They rallyed it (both navigation and time/distance) and were superb drivers. I would occasionally get to ride with them for fun. The spectacularly underpowered Minis would perform with aplomb on any course with corners. Truly fun, and truly fun to watch the beautifully shot chase. And now that they’ve reintroduced the Mini, well… Sorry about the digression. I enjoyed the film greatly, having read the book when it came out. They don’t have to match, IMHO; the movie just has to create its own believeable universe. Worked for me; YMMV. ---
**Author:** ![OpalCat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/8edcca/32.png) [@OpalCat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OpalCat)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2002, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thoughts-on-the-bourne-identity/115437/27 "2002-06-29T04:09:54Z")
There is quite a difference between athletic experience and high level intelligence work. And car chases are boring. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2002, 4:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thoughts-on-the-bourne-identity/115437/28 "2002-06-29T04:40:19Z")
Book spoilers! I seem to recall that there was originally a man, David Webb, who became involved in a top secret military operation in Vietnam called Medusa. Medusa was, iirc, a suicide mission not supposed to be supported, but David’s innate skills at surviving got him back home. He got out of the army, became a schoolteacher of sorts (college professor) in New England. Until the US government, in their quest to capture Carlos (the leading assassin of the day), pulled him out of retirement into Operation Treadstone. The purpose of Treadstone was to create a counter-assassin, named Cain, with a background so perfect and so refined that they had to remake David into another man - Jason Bourne, who became Cain. Hence the confusion - he really isn’t Jason Bourne at all. The Bourne identity is a sham, a ruse to protect the real man, David Webb for when his mission was over. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2002, 4:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thoughts-on-the-bourne-identity/115437/29 "2002-06-29T04:42:57Z")
Shoot, I sometimes wish we could edit. If we could, I’d get rid of the wasted bandwidth that is the above post for I recapped that which had already been recapped. My apologies for stating the obvious… and not reading the entire thread. ---
**Author:** ![Drastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Drastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drastic)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2002, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thoughts-on-the-bourne-identity/115437/30 "2002-06-29T15:17:05Z")
This flick had fallen completely off my interest list based purely on the first line of the trailer. “He has the skills…of a dangerous man.” Trailers have made me snicker before with lame openings, but WOW. I was imagining a resume, with a bullet point under “Skills.” - Certified dangerous man. But based on this thread, I think it’s moved up into a rental. ---
**Author:** ![dantheman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dantheman/32/9421_2.png) [@dantheman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dantheman)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2002, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thoughts-on-the-bourne-identity/115437/31 "2002-06-29T16:36:45Z")
Has anyone here seen the 1988 made-for-TV adaptation with Richard Chamberlain? I didn’t even realize it existed (foolish me)… Apparently, Jaclyn Smith is the female lead. ---
**Author:** ![KneadToKnow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kneadtoknow/32/3999_2.png) [@KneadToKnow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KneadToKnow)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2002, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thoughts-on-the-bourne-identity/115437/32 "2002-07-13T15:34:37Z")
Anyone who hasn’t seen the TV version will soon have another chance. [Digital Bits](http://www.thedigitalbits.com) is reporting that it will soon be released on DVD. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2002, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thoughts-on-the-bourne-identity/115437/33 "2002-07-13T16:11:49Z")
I thought the movie worked pretty well. Never read the book, so I can’t comment on it’s faithfulness, but as a movie I found the pacing, action, and story all worked. They never did fully explain the Operation Threadstone backstory, but I think it was needed to make Jason Bourne a more likeable character. “See, it wasn’t Jason Bourne who was a killer, they played games with his mind.” Any idea where the final scene was set? I’m guessing the Greek Islands, perhaps Corfu, like the shirt she was wearing earlier in the flick. ---
**Author:** ![KneadToKnow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kneadtoknow/32/3999_2.png) [@KneadToKnow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KneadToKnow)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2002, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thoughts-on-the-bourne-identity/115437/34 "2002-07-13T18:26:41Z")
Location of the final scene was addressed in a thread just today: [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=125307](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=125307) ---
**Author:** ![Lux\_Fiat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/bc79bd/32.png) [@Lux\_Fiat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lux_Fiat)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2002, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thoughts-on-the-bourne-identity/115437/35 "2002-07-13T21:42:48Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by KneadToKnow \* > I also enjoyed the little homage to _Run Lola Run_ they played by having just a trace of bright red color in [Franka Potente](http://us.imdb.com/Name?Potente,+Franka)’s hair right at the beginning. I think my favorite little touch was when they showed Clive Owen [manfully driving a BMW](http://www.bmwfilms.com/site_layout/index.asp). ---
**Author:** ![Tim\_R.Mortiss](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tim_r.mortiss/32/142_2.png) [@Tim\_R.Mortiss](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tim_R.Mortiss)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2002, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thoughts-on-the-bourne-identity/115437/36 "2002-07-14T00:52:37Z")
I kinda liked the movie, except for a coupla nitpicks. For one, Matt Damon has no “charisma” to speak of, even for an amnesiac. He’s great at quiet, thoughtful roles (e.g., “Rounders”) but I thought he lacked the gravitas for a spy. Kind of the Kevin-Costner-Syndrome. Second, he seemed pretty bad at figuring out that he was an assassin! How many people do you have to kill (and how many passports with your photo do you have to find) before you figure out that you’re not a milkman or something? Other than that, it was a pretty good spy flick…Timmy ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2002, 1:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thoughts-on-the-bourne-identity/115437/37 "2002-07-14T01:53:05Z")
OMG, I knew there was something about Clive Owen driving but I couldn’t place it. That’s great! ---
**Author:** ![kittenblue](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ba8739/32.png) [@kittenblue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kittenblue)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2002, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thoughts-on-the-bourne-identity/115437/38 "2002-07-14T18:11:56Z")
I originally saw the TV mini-series, then read the book, so I was very dismayed to think of Matt Damon in the role, and not at all happy with the changes to the female character…before she was a woman with a substantial career and a lot to give up…not a footloose gypsy type. And I couldn’t understand how they could get rid of the whole Carlos/Cain thing. So I decided that the only way to enjoy the movie would be to forget about the book, and enjoy it on its own merits. And I liked it. The car chase was exciting and actually very, for lack of a better word, dignified. Not a ton of improbable ramps and fiery crashes…just great driving. If a real Mini handles that well, I want one. As for the headaches, I don’t think that indicated external mind control…just the result of an extremely stressful way to make a living. It was a rather touching moment between the two men, when the one knows he has been defeated and wants to have his life end with a bit of a human connection after living a life of constant vigilance and separation. And **JohnT** your post was not redundant…helped me remember a lot of book details. But I have to agree, Matt Damon is still too young and wholesome for the role. ---
**Author:** ![PunditLisa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/4af34b/32.png) [@PunditLisa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PunditLisa)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2003, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thoughts-on-the-bourne-identity/115437/39 "2003-02-08T15:54:01Z")
Thought I’d ressurect this thread because I finally watched the movie! > [@](#): > > One thing that cracked me up was that despite all of the deluxe techo stuff, they still used a map of France with pushpins to track him. He He. Also thought it was funny that the CIA came up with a full-color picture, etc. and all sorts of background information on Franka, just hours after discovering her car. We can’t find Osama bin laden but we know where some obscure gypsy spent the last 5 years of her life… with a click of a mouse. I suppose we’re to believe the CIA has a complete file on every person in the world and that information is accessible, in full color!, within hours. I can’t even imagine how many gigabytes the CIA’s computer would have to have to run all those graphics and pretty pictures. At least now I know where all my tax dollars are being spent. It was a pretty good, movie. Not as implausible as Armageddon but somewhat entertaining. ---
**Author:** ![KneadToKnow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kneadtoknow/32/3999_2.png) [@KneadToKnow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KneadToKnow)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2003, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thoughts-on-the-bourne-identity/115437/40 "2003-02-08T16:15:54Z")
> [@](#): > > I can’t even imagine how many gigabytes the CIA’s computer would have to have to run all those graphics and pretty pictures. At least now I know where all my tax dollars are being spent. [Judd Hirsch] You don’t think they spent $9000 on a _hammer_, do you? [/Judd Hirsch] 😃 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thoughts-on-the-bourne-identity/115437.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thoughts-on-the-bourne-identity/115437.md?page=3)