# \[Thread for speculating on the state of Yasir Arafat's health\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [November 4, 2004, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thread-for-speculating-on-the-state-of-yasir-arafats-health/272993 "2004-11-04T16:40:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2004, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thread-for-speculating-on-the-state-of-yasir-arafats-health/272993/21 "2004-11-04T17:56:14Z")
Well… actually, _one_ doctor announced he was brain dead, and 15 minutes ago, Arafat’s personnal doctor stated that actually he wasn’t. ---
**Author:** ![Loopydude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e56c9b/32.png) [@Loopydude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loopydude)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2004, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thread-for-speculating-on-the-state-of-yasir-arafats-health/272993/22 "2004-11-04T17:57:46Z")
> [@clairobscur](#): > > Apparently, the medical team just announced he was brain dead. Wow. End of an era, no matter what you think of him. I’m sure someone will regard his loss, so close to the American election, as some sort of sign. Let’s hope it’s a peacful sign. ---
**Author:** ![duffer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duffer/32/1026_2.png) [@duffer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/duffer)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2004, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thread-for-speculating-on-the-state-of-yasir-arafats-health/272993/23 "2004-11-04T18:04:24Z")
> [@clairobscur](#): > > Apparently, the medical team just announced he was brain dead. It took them 50 years to figure that out? Damn French socialized health care. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Brutus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/91b2a8/32.png) [@Brutus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brutus)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2004, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thread-for-speculating-on-the-state-of-yasir-arafats-health/272993/24 "2004-11-04T18:04:51Z")
What’s this? He isn’t quite dead, isn’t quite alive? :eek: Time to start searching for all those ‘What to do when zombies attack’ threads! ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2004, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thread-for-speculating-on-the-state-of-yasir-arafats-health/272993/25 "2004-11-04T18:08:25Z")
[Insert obligatory Holy Grail and/or Princess Bride references here] This will probably mean civil war among the Palestinians. Probably means more attacks on Israelis in the short term, and eventually some warlord will seize power. Whether that warlord can be negotiated with is an open question. Arafat proved that he couldn’t/wouldn’t deliver a peace deal, so his death at least allows another spin of the roulette wheel. Spin it enough times and eventually you’ll land on 00. ---
**Author:** ![Rufus\_Xavier](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/eada6e/32.png) [@Rufus\_Xavier](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rufus_Xavier)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2004, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thread-for-speculating-on-the-state-of-yasir-arafats-health/272993/26 "2004-11-04T18:13:53Z")
Apparently he is only **mostly** dead. When he is all dead, then we can go through his clothes and look for loose change… 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2004, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thread-for-speculating-on-the-state-of-yasir-arafats-health/272993/27 "2004-11-04T18:19:02Z")
> [@Diogenes the Cynic](#): > > The man won a Nobel Peace Prize. Well, now we know the cause of death; irony poisoning. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2004, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thread-for-speculating-on-the-state-of-yasir-arafats-health/272993/28 "2004-11-04T18:21:37Z")
> [@Brutus](#): > > What’s this? He isn’t quite dead, isn’t quite alive? :eek: > > Time to start searching for all those ‘What to do when zombies attack’ threads! **LLLLLLAAAAAAANNNNNNNDDDDD!!!** ---
**Author:** ![Brutus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/91b2a8/32.png) [@Brutus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brutus)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2004, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thread-for-speculating-on-the-state-of-yasir-arafats-health/272993/29 "2004-11-04T18:23:35Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > **LLLLLLAAAAAAANNNNNNNDDDDD!!!** LOL! 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Aro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b3f665/32.png) [@Aro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aro)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2004, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thread-for-speculating-on-the-state-of-yasir-arafats-health/272993/30 "2004-11-04T18:24:22Z")
> [@Brutus](#): > > What’s this? He isn’t quite dead, isn’t quite alive? :eek: Was there a cat involved, at all? 🙂 Anyone have any idea of a credible or [probable successor?](http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/1362216.stm) I here talk that [Marwan Barghouti](http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/in_depth/middle_east/2001/israel_and_the_palestinians/profiles/1473585.stm) is favoured, but is kinda, at present, stuck in jail in Israel. I doubt they are going to let him out to take over the reins, so to speak. ---
**Author:** ![Rune](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e68b1a/32.png) [@Rune](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rune)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2004, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thread-for-speculating-on-the-state-of-yasir-arafats-health/272993/31 "2004-11-04T18:32:36Z")
Earlier on the radio they said several of his important internal organs had stopped working, but he wasn’t quite dead. They didn’t specify which organs, I recon the brain is pretty important. How about Abu Madsen the man who walked in protest, he seemed like a sensible man. ---
**Author:** ![Humanist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/71c47a/32.png) [@Humanist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Humanist)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2004, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thread-for-speculating-on-the-state-of-yasir-arafats-health/272993/32 "2004-11-04T18:33:03Z")
> [@SentientMeat](#): > > A question, especially for Dani (or **Alessan** ): > > _Who_ could realistically tell Hamas/Islamic Jihad/Al Asqa Martyrs to ceasefire? > > This to me seems a Catch 22. If they are ‘trustworthy’, these groups will not listen. If they have strong enough links that their word is sufficiently powerful, will they not be blown up by an Israeli rocket for being a terrorist? > > As the peace process in Northern Ireland found, surely one must eventually negotiate **with the terrorists themselves**? **SentientMeat** , I really do think you’re right. I wish there were a way around it, but the only people that can make Hamas stick to a cease-fire are the members of Hamas. And anyone that they trust enough to say, “Yeah, we’ll stop bombing and let you negotiate with the Israelis,” is going to be seen as a terrorist. This is in addition to the fact that anyone that Hamas would trust this much is pretty likely to be a Hamas member. ---
**Author:** ![MEBuckner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mebuckner/32/2896_2.png) [@MEBuckner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MEBuckner)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2004, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thread-for-speculating-on-the-state-of-yasir-arafats-health/272993/33 "2004-11-04T18:38:00Z")
**Moderator’s Note:** Since the news reports still haven’t settled down as to whether or not Arafat is really dead, in a coma, or “resting”, I’ve edited the thread title so as not to get anyone excessively worked up . ---
**Author:** ![MacTech](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c0e974/32.png) [@MacTech](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MacTech)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2004, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thread-for-speculating-on-the-state-of-yasir-arafats-health/272993/34 "2004-11-04T18:38:49Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > According to Yahoo news, he wasn’t so much dead as “No longer alive”. > …He’s getting better! 😃 'e’s probably pining for the Fijords… ---
**Author:** ![ladyfish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/779978/32.png) [@ladyfish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ladyfish)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2004, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thread-for-speculating-on-the-state-of-yasir-arafats-health/272993/35 "2004-11-04T18:48:53Z")
> [@Noone Special](#): > > Well, Yasser Arafat [has apparently died](http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=578&e=2&u=/nm/20041104/ts_nm/mideast_arafat_dc). > > I wonder what people here think of the consequences for the Peace Process in the Middle East. > > I have yet to formulate my own take on this (plus I’m at work and can’t take too much time to post right now). I’ll join the fray later, when I get home… > > Dani This can be turned into a positive. Example: Israel and the U.S. have been adamant about a change in the Palestinian leadership in order to keep the “peace process” on track. Well, it don’t get much more changed than this!! Are there any opportunistic moderates in either the U.S. or Israel that could now drive a peace agenda forward? Note: In the initial power struggle there will be an increase in extremist action. Although it is probably a moot point, now would be a good time to commit to some restraint on the Israeli side while trying to engage a new Palestinian leadership. Any heavy-handed Israeli (US approved) action or response will alienate any moderate leadership that attempts to wrestle control from the extreme elements in the new Palestinian leadership. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2004, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thread-for-speculating-on-the-state-of-yasir-arafats-health/272993/36 "2004-11-04T18:52:02Z")
I’ve got an idea for a successor, a celebrity even. He’s rested, he’s ready… He’s [YUSEF ISLAM!](http://www.yusufislam.org.uk/index.shtml) Out on the edge of darkness there rides a Peace Train. 🆒 ---
**Author:** ![Noone\_Special](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/noone_special/32/2863_2.png) [@Noone\_Special](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Noone_Special)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2004, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thread-for-speculating-on-the-state-of-yasir-arafats-health/272993/37 "2004-11-04T19:04:41Z")
> [@SentientMeat](#): > > _Who_ could realistically tell Hamas/Islamic Jihad/Al Asqa Martyrs to ceasefire? Anyone who inherits the guns that they **do** have. When the PA really wanted to, they could keep things (at least relatively) quiet for weeks at a stretch. As to what you probably mean by the question - someone who can realistically get the extremists to cease fire **without** literally twisting their arms - even Arafat was not able to accomplish that when he did want it. > [@](#): > > This to me seems a Catch 22. If they are ‘trustworthy’, these groups will not listen. If they have strong enough links that their word is sufficiently powerful, will they not be blown up by an Israeli rocket for being a terrorist? There are plenty of Palestinian figures who have not been “taken out” by Israel - Dahlan, Def, Rajub and Barghouti (as well as the established figures of Abu-Ala [Qurie] and Abu-Mazen) come to mind, even if some of there are in Israeli prison. Unlike assassination, incarceration is reversible (if it is deemed advantageous to do so). > [@](#): > > As the peace process in Northern Ireland found, surely one must eventually negotiate **with the terrorists themselves**? Agreed; however there would have to be some politicking and brokering behind smoke and mirrors to ensure that when this **does** happen, said terrorists will shortly thereafter “coincidentally” come up with the idea that maybe a temporary cease-fire is a Good Idea just now… Going back to 1977, this is how Sadat’s visit to Jerusalem was brought about: He made a great concession in return for guaranteed concessions from Israel in return. My thoughts on the matter: Until now, all progress was effectively stalled because Arafat has **not** really been in any shape to do anything for some time now, yet nobody else was willing to take the initiative while he lived. This resulted in Israel coming up with the Unilateral Withdrawal from Gaza initiative - which is, IMO, still a good idea. However, with Arafat no longer relevant in any case, there will be pressure from all sides (US, Europe and Israeli hard-line right wingers) to stop and regroup. Which is a shame, I think, since the withdrawal and dismantling of settlements, even if unilateral, could have been an important first step. Even when stepping off the political stage (whether completely dead or not), Arafat seems to be doing his best to stall any chance for peace… ☹ * * * To **MEBuckner** : Thanks for the title change - although I suspect it is only a question of time, and not of essence, I agree that I (as well as several others in the world…) _did_ jump the gun a wee bit. Dani ---
**Author:** ![MEBuckner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mebuckner/32/2896_2.png) [@MEBuckner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MEBuckner)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2004, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thread-for-speculating-on-the-state-of-yasir-arafats-health/272993/38 "2004-11-04T19:13:53Z")
> [@Noone Special](#): > > although I suspect it is only a question of time, and not of essence Of course, that’s true of us all, not just Yasir Arafat. ---
**Author:** ![BrotherCadfael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@BrotherCadfael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrotherCadfael)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2004, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thread-for-speculating-on-the-state-of-yasir-arafats-health/272993/39 "2004-11-04T19:23:43Z")
I saw this somewhere on the 'net this morning: “If there’s any justice in this world, when Arafat dies he’ll get 72 virgins who look just like him.” ---
**Author:** ![Sevastopol](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cdc98d/32.png) [@Sevastopol](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sevastopol)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2004, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thread-for-speculating-on-the-state-of-yasir-arafats-health/272993/40 "2004-11-04T20:10:46Z")
It sure is true that if you want to find hate speech the 'net is your friend. But why limit yourself to elderly Palestinians. Enjoy life’s infinite variety. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thread-for-speculating-on-the-state-of-yasir-arafats-health/272993.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/thread-for-speculating-on-the-state-of-yasir-arafats-health/272993.md?page=3)