# Time to officially Pit the Sanford Police Dept and their cover-up. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 29, 2012, 1:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/time-to-officially-pit-the-sanford-police-dept-and-their-cover-up/617108 "2012-03-29T01:38:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 46
**Author:** ![brazil84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8491ac/32.png) [@brazil84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brazil84)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2012, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/time-to-officially-pit-the-sanford-police-dept-and-their-cover-up/617108/901 "2012-05-26T19:34:30Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > If Martin feared this “creepy” guy, and found out when standing closer But how did he end up “standing closer”? > [@](#): > > As always when one matches wits with you, one slinks away battered, bruised, and regretful. Thank you 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![scratch\_llll](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9fc348/32.png) [@scratch\_llll](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scratch_llll)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2012, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/time-to-officially-pit-the-sanford-police-dept-and-their-cover-up/617108/902 "2012-05-26T20:10:19Z")
> [@JoelUpchurch](#): > > You don’t seem to grasp the distinction between kill and murder. I would have thought you would understand by my last sentence that it was tongue in cheek. However this incident and the stand your ground law it highlights does harken back to wild west law. It would not be unreasonable for anyone armed who sees him pull his gun to beat him to the draw as he has shown a propensity to shoot to kill someone he feels might injure him. That would not be murder. I’m curious to know how a skinny teen was able to get enough of a handle on Zimmermans bald head to beat it against the ground considering his stocky build. I’ve been on the ground straddled by someone who outweighed me by 50 pounds and because I had both hands free could keep that from happening (though I took some licks)and even get him off me. I guess his commitment to not only pull and point but shoot to kill precluded any other outcome. ---
**Author:** ![enomaj](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/59ef9b/32.png) [@enomaj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enomaj)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2012, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/time-to-officially-pit-the-sanford-police-dept-and-their-cover-up/617108/903 "2012-05-26T20:26:14Z")
> [@brazil84](#): > > So what? I know human nature pretty well. **Jamicat** asked a question and I answered it. > > Again, so what? > > That’s silly, he could have easily disappeared for 15 minutes or half an hour or longer. As opposed to a minute or two. > > Besides which, confronting someone doesn’t serve the purpose of concealing where you live since it just draws attention to you. Unless perhaps you kill them. Bill Frist ain’t got shit on you. ---
**Author:** ![brazil84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8491ac/32.png) [@brazil84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brazil84)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2012, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/time-to-officially-pit-the-sanford-police-dept-and-their-cover-up/617108/904 "2012-05-26T20:28:55Z")
> [@enomaj](#): > > Bill Frist ain’t got shit on you. Lol, a brilliant response. From someone brilliant enough to criticize me for speculating about the motives of someone I don’t know – and then in the next sentence speculate about the motives of someone he doesn’t know. ---
**Author:** ![enomaj](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/59ef9b/32.png) [@enomaj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enomaj)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2012, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/time-to-officially-pit-the-sanford-police-dept-and-their-cover-up/617108/905 "2012-05-26T20:42:32Z")
i never said don’t speculate but you are pulling shit out of your ass. Trayvon felt subconsciously humiliated?! Based on what?! You don’t think Trayvon could tell the difference between a creep and a gay man?! What actions of Zimmerman’s could be misconstrued as an attempt at a pick up. ---
**Author:** ![brazil84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8491ac/32.png) [@brazil84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brazil84)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2012, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/time-to-officially-pit-the-sanford-police-dept-and-their-cover-up/617108/906 "2012-05-26T20:47:34Z")
> [@enomaj](#): > > i never said don’t speculate but you are pulling shit out of your ass. Trayvon felt subconsciously humiliated?! Based on what?! Martin would have felt dominated/humiliated based on the fact that another man was staring at him and watching him and then he (Martin) ran away. Duh. > [@](#): > > You don’t think Trayvon could tell the difference between a creep and a gay man?! What actions of Zimmerman’s could be misconstrued as an attempt at a pick up. Staring and following. Duh. ---
**Author:** ![voltaire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voltaire/32/313_2.png) [@voltaire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/voltaire)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2012, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/time-to-officially-pit-the-sanford-police-dept-and-their-cover-up/617108/907 "2012-05-26T20:57:05Z")
Holy shit! You weren’t just being facetious with the whole gay-panic theory? Duh(m) indeed. ---
**Author:** ![enomaj](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/59ef9b/32.png) [@enomaj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enomaj)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2012, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/time-to-officially-pit-the-sanford-police-dept-and-their-cover-up/617108/908 "2012-05-26T20:58:55Z")
Staring and following are pickup techniques now? You don’t know human nature as well as you think. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2012, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/time-to-officially-pit-the-sanford-police-dept-and-their-cover-up/617108/909 "2012-05-26T21:00:41Z")
> [@JoelUpchurch](#): > > YouThe last time I checked pounding someone head against the sidewalk isn’t in the marquis of queensbury rules. There is no evidence GZ had his head pounded on the pavement. One single laceration does not a pounding make. He could have hit his head when he fell. ---
**Author:** ![brazil84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8491ac/32.png) [@brazil84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brazil84)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2012, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/time-to-officially-pit-the-sanford-police-dept-and-their-cover-up/617108/910 "2012-05-26T21:01:38Z")
> [@](#): > > You weren’t just being facetious with the whole gay-panic theory? No. > [@enomaj](#): > > Staring and following are pickup techniques now? You don’t know human nature as well as you tnk. Lol, if you are a reasonably attractive male, go hang out at a rest stop or some other place where gay men are known to cruise and see if anyone stares at or follows you. Otherwise, you will just have to take my word for it. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2012, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/time-to-officially-pit-the-sanford-police-dept-and-their-cover-up/617108/911 "2012-05-26T21:06:48Z")
Pics, or it didn’t happen. ---
**Author:** ![enomaj](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/59ef9b/32.png) [@enomaj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enomaj)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2012, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/time-to-officially-pit-the-sanford-police-dept-and-their-cover-up/617108/912 "2012-05-26T21:15:53Z")
Trayvon wasn’t in an airport restroom. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2012, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/time-to-officially-pit-the-sanford-police-dept-and-their-cover-up/617108/913 "2012-05-26T21:18:19Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > There is no evidence GZ had his head pounded on the pavement. One single laceration does not a pounding make. He could have hit his head when he fell. Why is Zimmerman’s statement not evidence? ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2012, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/time-to-officially-pit-the-sanford-police-dept-and-their-cover-up/617108/914 "2012-05-26T21:24:32Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Why is Zimmerman’s statement not evidence? Because it is contradicted by the EMT report. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2012, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/time-to-officially-pit-the-sanford-police-dept-and-their-cover-up/617108/915 "2012-05-26T21:29:50Z")
Which is also evidence. So are all those “eyewitnesses”. Evidence to be compared and weighed, is this a brick or a butterfly fart? Its not that we don’t have enough “evidence”, its that we have way too much. ---
**Author:** ![JoelUpchurch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f05b48/32.png) [@JoelUpchurch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JoelUpchurch)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2012, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/time-to-officially-pit-the-sanford-police-dept-and-their-cover-up/617108/916 "2012-05-26T21:37:55Z")
> [@Jamicat](#): > > Why didn’t Trayvon just keep running all the way home, if he thought he was being pursued by a creepy dude with a gun? > > Wasn’t he like a 100 yards away from where he was residing? > > Why stop, hide and lay in wait for creepy dude? > > 😕 Actually the most sensible suggestion I’ve read is that Martin stopped to answer the phone. He stepped onto the porch at 1221 to get out of the rain. I think he didn’t know that Zimmerman had got out of the truck at this point and assumed the encounter was over. Dede said Martin was whispering. I think this is because he didn’t want the people in 1221 to overhear him and call the police. Once he sees Zimmerman’s flashlight going down the sidewalk, then he realizes he made a mistake. ---
**Author:** ![brazil84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8491ac/32.png) [@brazil84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brazil84)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2012, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/time-to-officially-pit-the-sanford-police-dept-and-their-cover-up/617108/917 "2012-05-26T21:38:49Z")
> [@enomaj](#): > > Trayvon wasn’t in an airport restroom. So what? Your (apparent) claim was that staring and following are essentially never the actions of a gay man who is sexually interested in another man. That just isn’t so. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2012, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/time-to-officially-pit-the-sanford-police-dept-and-their-cover-up/617108/918 "2012-05-26T21:42:20Z")
> [@JoelUpchurch](#): > > …Once he sees Zimmerman’s flashlight going down the sidewalk, then he realizes he made a mistake. Flashlight? There was a flashlight? ---
**Author:** ![JoelUpchurch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f05b48/32.png) [@JoelUpchurch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JoelUpchurch)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2012, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/time-to-officially-pit-the-sanford-police-dept-and-their-cover-up/617108/919 "2012-05-26T21:59:22Z")
> [@scratch\_llll](#): > > I would have thought you would understand by my last sentence that it was tongue in cheek. However this incident and the stand your ground law it highlights does harken back to wild west law. It would not be unreasonable for anyone armed who sees him pull his gun to beat him to the draw as he has shown a propensity to shoot to kill someone he feels might injure him. That would not be murder. In the real world that doesn’t actually happen. Action always beat reaction. Your best bet is to hope the other guy misses. The last time I looked at the statistics, police miss about 80% of the time and felons at about 90%. Maybe someone has more recent statistics. I recall one study that indicate the average shooting happens at 6 feet. Of course, that includes a lot of shots at contact range. ---
**Author:** ![enomaj](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/59ef9b/32.png) [@enomaj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enomaj)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2012, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/time-to-officially-pit-the-sanford-police-dept-and-their-cover-up/617108/920 "2012-05-26T22:09:35Z")
At 7:00 p\_m. in a residential neighborhood, staring and following are more likely to be interpreted as stranger danger than gay come-ons. That is my claim. And the fact that Trayvon ran supports my contention a lot more than it does yours. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/time-to-officially-pit-the-sanford-police-dept-and-their-cover-up/617108.md?page=45) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/time-to-officially-pit-the-sanford-police-dept-and-their-cover-up/617108.md?page=47)