# Times they show you the 4th wall **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** tv-shows-scripted\ **Created:** [March 27, 2024, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/times-they-show-you-the-4th-wall/999462 "2024-03-27T15:57:15Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2024, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/times-they-show-you-the-4th-wall/999462/41 "2024-03-28T18:27:57Z")
_Eerie, Indiana_ had a shot where Marshall realized he was in a sitcom when he turned and saw the camera crew where the fourth wall would be. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FXPqXqKjLVY&t=223s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FXPqXqKjLVY&t=223s) ---
**Author:** ![Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slow_moving_vehicle/32/291_2.png) [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slow_Moving_Vehicle)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2024, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/times-they-show-you-the-4th-wall/999462/42 "2024-03-28T21:31:35Z")
It’s not exactly what the OP was asking for, but the Adam Sorkin dramedy _Sports Night_ played with something like this. Since the series was about a _Sports Center_-like show on an ESPN expy network, it didn’t break the immersion to occasionally show the camera operators and soundstage, from the actors’ point of view. The writers did this very cleverly in one Christmas episode. A plot involved a wardrobe assistant called out Casey, one of the anchors of the fictional show, for not knowing the costume director’s name; then later his partner Dan called him out for not knowing the camera operators. So the very last scene had Casey and Dan (Peter Krauss and Josh Charles), thanking various members of the fictional _Sports Night_ crew, grips and script supervisors and editors, and yes, the head of the wardrobe department. Immediately when the scene ended, the credits for the actual show began to roll, revealing that Krauss and Charles had in fact been using the names of the real life crew. A very sweet scene, and clever bit of writing. [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/sKxivEu9yuY/hqdefault.jpg "Christmas on Sports Night") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sKxivEu9yuY) ---
**Author:** ![Reeses\_Monkey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/reeses_monkey/32/2885_2.png) [@Reeses\_Monkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reeses_Monkey)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2024, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/times-they-show-you-the-4th-wall/999462/43 "2024-03-28T22:12:41Z")
Also from Fresh Prince. “I we so rich, [how we can’t afford no ceiling](https://youtu.be/01K4RZpcufs?si=ux99H2wCCk4exnWg)?” ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2024, 11:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/times-they-show-you-the-4th-wall/999462/44 "2024-03-28T23:10:03Z")
I’m sure I’ll screw up the link, but Monty Python showed multiple “walls” in the getting lost in the jungle skit. It starts at 6:50 in the clip if I get the link wrong. [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/9Z6ZuPHWQYw/maxresdefault.jpg "Monty Python's Flying Circus - Jungle Restaurant & The Lost World of Roiurama -1972") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Z6ZuPHWQYw&t=410/) ---
**Author:** ![Two\_Many\_Cats2](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/779978/32.png) [@Two\_Many\_Cats2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Two_Many_Cats2)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2024, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/times-they-show-you-the-4th-wall/999462/45 "2024-03-30T17:20:59Z")
The First Doctor’s Christmas toast in the middle of “The Daleks’ Masterplan”. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2024, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/times-they-show-you-the-4th-wall/999462/46 "2024-03-30T19:35:31Z")
Can you explain a bit more? ---
**Author:** ![Maserschmidt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/maserschmidt/32/18829_2.png) [@Maserschmidt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maserschmidt)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2024, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/times-they-show-you-the-4th-wall/999462/47 "2024-03-30T19:42:04Z")
He turns to the camera and wishes the viewers a Happy Christmas. Not what the OP was looking for. ---
**Author:** ![Two\_Many\_Cats2](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/779978/32.png) [@Two\_Many\_Cats2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Two_Many_Cats2)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2024, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/times-they-show-you-the-4th-wall/999462/48 "2024-03-30T21:35:10Z")
I see I misunderstood. How about when Johnny Carson walked off the set of the Tonight Show to go yell at Don Rickles on the set of “CPO Sharkey” about Johnny’s broken cigarette case? ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2024, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/times-they-show-you-the-4th-wall/999462/49 "2024-03-30T22:07:50Z")
I think you still misunderstand. If we’re not seeing a literal wall, it’s not what the OP is talking about. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2024, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/times-they-show-you-the-4th-wall/999462/50 "2024-03-30T22:11:47Z")
I didn’t get it at first, either. It’s more “Times a show or movie surprised by NOT showing the set and revealing there actually is the rest of the set where the cameras would normally be…” ---
**Author:** ![Two\_Many\_Cats2](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/779978/32.png) [@Two\_Many\_Cats2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Two_Many_Cats2)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2024, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/times-they-show-you-the-4th-wall/999462/51 "2024-03-30T22:12:35Z")
Well there were plenty of set walls seen in Johnny’s walk to the Sharkey set. What, the OP is looking for scenes where the characters point to a wall and say, “Here’s the fourth wall.” ? ---
**Author:** ![Stratocaster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stratocaster/32/16393_2.png) [@Stratocaster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stratocaster)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2024, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/times-they-show-you-the-4th-wall/999462/52 "2024-03-30T22:16:59Z")
There are some examples early in the thread. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2024, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/times-they-show-you-the-4th-wall/999462/53 "2024-03-30T22:29:10Z")
Well, here’s what the OP asked: > [@DCnDC](#): > > What are occasions in TV shows where they actually show you the normally “invisible” 4th wall? The “fourth wall” is (to quote from [Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fourth_wall)) “a performance [convention](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dramatic_convention) in which an invisible, imaginary wall separates actors from the audience. While the audience can see through this ‘wall’, the convention assumes the actors act as if they cannot.” Nowadays, we mainly encounter the term “fourth wall” in the context of “_breaking_ the fourth wall,” but that’s almost the opposite of what the OP is looking for here. When you’re in the audience, watching a play on stage or a TV show being filmed, you can see three walls of the room that the characters are in. But you can’t see the fourth wall, because it’s not really there—if it were, it would be in the way, blocking your view of the set and the actors. The OP, if I am interpreting their intent correctly, is looking for times when we, the TV viewers, _are_ shown that fourth wall, which presumably exists _to the characters, within the reality of the show_, but is not normally there _to the actors, within the reality of those involved in the show’s performance._ ---
**Author:** ![Maserschmidt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/maserschmidt/32/18829_2.png) [@Maserschmidt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maserschmidt)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2024, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/times-they-show-you-the-4th-wall/999462/54 "2024-03-30T23:28:19Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > The OP, if I am interpreting their intent correctly, is looking for times when we, the TV viewers, _are_ shown that fourth wall, which presumably exists _to the characters, within the reality of the show_, but is not normally there _to the actors, within the reality of those involved in the show’s performance._ This. ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2024, 11:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/times-they-show-you-the-4th-wall/999462/55 "2024-04-01T11:34:10Z")
> [@Two\_Many\_Cats2](#): > > What, the OP is looking for scenes where the characters point to a wall and say, “Here’s the fourth wall.” ? Two videos are embedded in posts 2 and 3 of this thread, both queued up to when the literal 4th walls are shown. In the Friends clip, the 4th wall is purple. In the Married With Children clip, the 4th wall is wood panel with two windows. Both of those 4th walls are pretty much never shown in the respective series’ runs. The embedded videos might possibly be the only times those walls are _ever_ shown. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/times-they-show-you-the-4th-wall/999462.md?page=2)