# Tipping in America: the insult tip **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 20, 2017, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tipping-in-america-the-insult-tip/794226 "2017-08-20T23:14:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![Evan\_Drake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b487fb/32.png) [@Evan\_Drake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evan_Drake)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2017, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tipping-in-america-the-insult-tip/794226/181 "2017-08-23T13:54:00Z")
Maybe that _was_ the purpose of his trip. The heart is a dark forest. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2017, 2:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tipping-in-america-the-insult-tip/794226/182 "2017-08-23T14:03:53Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > It’s sort of weird that **Quartz** started several threads planning this major trip to see the eclipse, was clearly very excited by it, and has only managed to start a thread about being really rude to a waitress. > > **Quartz** , are you going to give us any kind of run-down of the real purpose of your trip? Hollandaise sans lemon ruined the whole damn trip, I’m guessing. ---
**Author:** ![burpo\_the\_wonder\_mutt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/burpo_the_wonder_mutt/32/365_2.png) [@burpo\_the\_wonder\_mutt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/burpo_the_wonder_mutt)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2017, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tipping-in-america-the-insult-tip/794226/183 "2017-08-23T14:52:46Z")
> [@kayaker](#): > > Hollandaise sans lemon ruined the whole damn trip, I’m guessing. Who eats that junk, anyway? [Take your eggs like a man!](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=snqs566G_Zg) 😉 ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2017, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tipping-in-america-the-insult-tip/794226/184 "2017-08-23T15:08:41Z")
> [@burpo\_the\_wonder\_mutt](#): > > Who eats that junk, anyway? [Take your eggs like a man!](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=snqs566G_Zg) 😉 Hah! Raw eggs in smoothies are excellent, giving the finished drink more body. But, yeah, just straight up from a glass is yech. ---
**Author:** ![spjork](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e95f7d/32.png) [@spjork](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/spjork)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2017, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tipping-in-america-the-insult-tip/794226/185 "2017-08-25T22:59:01Z")
Bleurgh [advocaat](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advocaat) ☹ ---
**Author:** ![Nawth\_Chucka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c57346/32.png) [@Nawth\_Chucka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nawth_Chucka)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2017, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tipping-in-america-the-insult-tip/794226/186 "2017-08-25T23:53:15Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > It’s sort of weird that **Quartz** started several threads planning this major trip to see the eclipse, was clearly very excited by it, and has only managed to start a thread about being really rude to a waitress. > > **Quartz** , are you going to give us any kind of run-down of the real purpose of your trip? Mayhap it was a Lonely Hearts trip and it didn’t pan out for him. Lot of dosh to throw at a Lonely Hearts trip, but humans are an odd lot. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tipping-in-america-the-insult-tip/794226/187 "2017-08-26T00:57:08Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > It’s sort of weird that **Quartz** started several threads planning this major trip to see the eclipse, was clearly very excited by it, and has only managed to start a thread about being really rude to a waitress. > > **Quartz** , are you going to give us any kind of run-down of the real purpose of your trip? Why should I start threads about the eclipse - which was awesome - when others have already done so? BTW I’m now at the Grand Canyon. ---
**Author:** ![Corry\_El](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ecae2f/32.png) [@Corry\_El](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Corry_El)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tipping-in-america-the-insult-tip/794226/188 "2017-08-26T01:28:27Z")
> [@Orwell](#): > > How do you know what others are tipping, and who are “jerks”? If tipping is for service, are you being a jerk if you leave a low tip for genuinely lousy service (not food quality)? How have you decided that 20% or “more than 20%” is fair or reasonable? Is the same percentage appropriate at all types of restaurants (diners, cafes, casual, bar, family, hotel, resort, upscale, etc.)? Is the same percentage appropriate if you drank water or if you spent $15 per person in drinks? > > Why has the customary amount risen from 10 to 15 to 20 percent over time? Do we know, and should we care, that tips are usually split with bartenders and busboys, but not always? Should we care that servers sometimes make a lot of money on a shift, but other times not very much? > > While I think the OP was misguided in leaving only a nickel, and tips should be left except in very rare occasions, I’m of the opinion that a tip or gratuity is completely discretionary on the part of the customer. I also think things tend to average out in the end. If they didn’t, why would servers still work where they do? Some good points there I think. Waiters in high price restaurants, and the most expensive also tend to be in areas like ours (NY) where lots of people have money to burn _and_ view it as their social justice duty to tip more than 20%, certainly aren’t itching for ‘tip culture’ to go away. At the extreme those jobs are gold mines relative to the qualifications required, guys (it usually is at the top of the table server pyramid) sometimes pass those jobs along to their sons in some famous places. OTOH it’s fair to point out that median nationwide it’s not a lucrative job, though as you point out tricky to make an exact comparison with reported income since tax cheating is particularly widespread in food service. But very broadly speaking the pay in relatively low skilled jobs is comparable: much as some people reflexively resist the idea, in the long run it’s a labor _market_. People don’t tend to work permanently in jobs that pay less than easier ones they also have the skills for and which pay more. IOW the posts recognizing that the issue is basically one of the distribution of pay in the labor market, not pay for waiters particularly, are at least partly on target. But then it comes back to how questionable it is to try raise pay for all low paying jobs far above the market clearing level via government mandates to employers. Raise it a bit and the negative side effects might get lost or offset by secondary and tertiary effects that aren’t fully reflected in introductory econ textbooks. But raise it a lot and it emerges into the zone where it really is ‘Econ 101’ that it’s going to have serious negative side effects. To raise people’s income a lot over what their skills are actually worth in the market, and avoid lots of negative side effects, you have to either subsidize them directly (take money from other people, cut govt checks to the lower paid people) or come up with policies that raise lower paid people’s skills (ie more people would have the skills to command higher market wages doing something else, which would feedback to higher wages in food service, retail counter etc , for the remaining people, though somewhere in their might also factor in not allowing the low skilled labor force to expand without limit from countries with lower prevailing wages). ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tipping-in-america-the-insult-tip/794226/189 "2017-08-26T02:11:34Z")
> [@Nawth\_Chucka](#): > > Mayhap it was a Lonely Hearts trip and it didn’t pan out for him. Lot of dosh to throw at a Lonely Hearts trip, but humans are an odd lot. > [@Ravenman](#): > > It’s sort of weird that **Quartz** started several threads planning this major trip to see the eclipse, was clearly very excited by it, and has only managed to start a thread about being really rude to a waitress. > > **Quartz** , are you going to give us any kind of run-down of the real purpose of your trip? Thank you both of you for demonstrating what nasty little idiots you both are. Clearly neither of you have done a search of my posts. Btw I’m now at the Grand Canyon and enjoyed dinner with moose grazing only perhaps 20 feet away. ---
**Author:** ![Nawth\_Chucka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c57346/32.png) [@Nawth\_Chucka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nawth_Chucka)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 2:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tipping-in-america-the-insult-tip/794226/190 "2017-08-26T02:54:22Z")
> [@Quartz](#): > > Thank you both of you for demonstrating what nasty little idiots you both are. Clearly neither of you have done a search of my posts. > > Btw I’m now at the Grand Canyon and enjoyed dinner with moose grazing only perhaps 20 feet away. I take umbrage at your insult; I happen to be average height and weight for a woman my age in the US. And I’m quite familiar w/ your posts, Quartz; IIRC you spent nearly $5000 USD on this trip. :eek: ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 3:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tipping-in-america-the-insult-tip/794226/191 "2017-08-26T03:31:46Z")
> [@Quartz](#): > > Thank you both of you for demonstrating what nasty little idiots you both are. Clearly neither of you have done a search of my posts. > > Btw I’m now at the Grand Canyon and enjoyed dinner with moose grazing only perhaps 20 feet away. This is a warning for personal insults. If you have a problem with a poster or two take it to the Pit. ---
**Author:** ![araminty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b5e925/32.png) [@araminty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/araminty)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 4:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tipping-in-america-the-insult-tip/794226/192 "2017-08-26T04:56:15Z")
> [@Quartz](#): > > Btw I’m now at the Grand Canyon and enjoyed dinner with moose grazing only perhaps 20 feet away. Uh, that’s an elk. Moose live in temperate boreal forests. [Moose - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moose) ---
**Author:** ![Nawth\_Chucka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c57346/32.png) [@Nawth\_Chucka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nawth_Chucka)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 5:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tipping-in-america-the-insult-tip/794226/193 "2017-08-26T05:24:13Z")
> [@araminty](#): > > Uh, that’s an elk. Moose live in temperate boreal forests. [Moose - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moose) True. But w/ the sun nearly set it can be hard to tell them apart if you haven’t seen the distinctive moose face before. ETA - or he’s at Yellowstone thinking he’s at the Grand Canyon. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 5:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tipping-in-america-the-insult-tip/794226/194 "2017-08-26T05:55:15Z")
As for the Hollandaise sauce/lemon thing. Hollandaise doesn’t have to have lemon as its acid. That’s the most common, but a vinegar can also be used as the acidifying agent. ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 7:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tipping-in-america-the-insult-tip/794226/195 "2017-08-26T07:39:31Z")
> [@Quartz](#): > > Thank you both of you for demonstrating what nasty little idiots you both are. Clearly neither of you have done a search of my posts. > > Btw I’m now at the Grand Canyon and enjoyed dinner with moose grazing only perhaps 20 feet away. Huh. The only moose I’ve ever seen in Arizona was on my television and he was accompanied by a squirrel wearing goggles. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 1:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tipping-in-america-the-insult-tip/794226/196 "2017-08-26T13:09:06Z")
> [@Quartz](#): > > Clearly neither of you have done a search of my posts. > > Btw I’m now at the Grand Canyon and enjoyed dinner with moose grazing only perhaps 20 feet away. I did do a search on your recent posts before asking the question. I didn’t see anything, but I was curious as to how you were enjoying things. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tipping-in-america-the-insult-tip/794226/197 "2017-08-26T14:26:21Z")
> [@Nawth\_Chucka](#): > > True. But w/ the sun nearly set it can be hard to tell them apart if you haven’t seen the distinctive moose face before. > > ETA - or he’s at Yellowstone thinking he’s at the Grand Canyon. or he could be at the [Grand Canyon of the Yellowstone](https://www.nps.gov/yell/learn/nature/grand-canyon.htm) ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tipping-in-america-the-insult-tip/794226/198 "2017-08-26T14:30:12Z")
> [@Evan\_Drake](#): > > The heart is a dark forest. A boreal one, with desert moose. ---
**Author:** ![Nawth\_Chucka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c57346/32.png) [@Nawth\_Chucka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nawth_Chucka)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tipping-in-america-the-insult-tip/794226/199 "2017-08-26T15:49:27Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > or he could be at the [Grand Canyon of the Yellowstone](https://www.nps.gov/yell/learn/nature/grand-canyon.htm) What a dreadful naming choice. Do they also have an equally confusing Carlsbad Cavern of the Yellowstone? ---
**Author:** ![DummyGladHands](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/49beb7/32.png) [@DummyGladHands](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DummyGladHands)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tipping-in-america-the-insult-tip/794226/200 "2017-08-26T17:34:57Z")
Jerkish thing to do. Is anyone else curious as to what the “generous” tip left the previous nite was? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tipping-in-america-the-insult-tip/794226.md?page=9) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tipping-in-america-the-insult-tip/794226.md?page=11)