# Title IX (Equality of Men's and Women's Sports Opportunities in Education) **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [April 1, 2014, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/title-ix-equality-of-mens-and-womens-sports-opportunities-in-education/685093 "2014-04-01T16:05:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2014, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/title-ix-equality-of-mens-and-womens-sports-opportunities-in-education/685093/1 "2014-04-01T16:05:01Z")
There is a current thread touching on Title IX titled “Baseball bleachers torn down after ruling that girls softball team’s seats must be equal” > **[Baseball bleachers torn down after ruling that girls softball team's seats...](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=719776)** > > http://www.myfoxdetroit.com/story/25095169/the-battle-over-bleachers-do-high-school-sports-facilities-have-to-match A new set of seating is being torn down outside the Plymouth Wildcats varsity boys’ baseball field, not long before the season... To refresh your memory: Title IX is a portion of the Education Amendments of 1972, which states (in part) that: ``` "No person in the United States shall, on the basis of sex, be excluded from participation in, be denied the benefits of, or be subjected to discrimination under any education program or activity receiving federal financial assistance. ``` [Title IX - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Title_IX)" I though we might have a thread about how well it is working and if it was a good idea. Overall I think it has been well worth doing. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2014, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/title-ix-equality-of-mens-and-womens-sports-opportunities-in-education/685093/2 "2014-04-01T16:42:18Z")
Arguably, organized sports (not phys ed, but organized sports) is not an “education program or activity”. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2014, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/title-ix-equality-of-mens-and-womens-sports-opportunities-in-education/685093/3 "2014-04-01T17:08:30Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > Arguably, organized sports (not phys ed, but organized sports) is not an “education program or activity”. It’s sponsored by the school, the costs are borne by the school(sometimes with fundraising added) and the teams represent the school. The district (or school) provides transport for the teams, liability insurance covers the teams, the coaches are employees of the district (or school). ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2014, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/title-ix-equality-of-mens-and-womens-sports-opportunities-in-education/685093/4 "2014-04-01T17:13:53Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > It’s sponsored by the school, the costs are borne by the school(sometimes with fundraising added) and the teams represent the school. The district (or school) provides transport for the teams, liability insurance covers the teams, the coaches are employees of the district (or school). And with all that, it is still not an “education program or activity”. Arguably. To be an “education program or activity” it has to, you know, educate. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2014, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/title-ix-equality-of-mens-and-womens-sports-opportunities-in-education/685093/5 "2014-04-01T17:22:34Z")
If you truly believe that, then you should be advocating for the elimination of all sports, not arguing that it’s OK for the boys to have better facilities than the girls. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2014, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/title-ix-equality-of-mens-and-womens-sports-opportunities-in-education/685093/6 "2014-04-01T17:26:24Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > If you truly believe that, then you should be advocating for the elimination of all sports, not arguing that it’s OK for the boys to have better facilities than the girls. No, I don’t think education funds should be spent on organized sports. When parents raise funds for the sports, I have no problem with that. ---
**Author:** ![OneCentStamp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/13edae/32.png) [@OneCentStamp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OneCentStamp)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2014, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/title-ix-equality-of-mens-and-womens-sports-opportunities-in-education/685093/7 "2014-04-01T17:34:43Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > If you truly believe that, then you should be advocating for the elimination of all sports, not arguing that it’s OK for the boys to have better facilities than the girls. > [@Terr](#): > > No, I don’t think education funds should be spent on organized sports. When parents raise funds for the sports, I have no problem with that. What about, as in the cases of major college football and men’s basketball, the sports are actually huge moneymakers for the schools? ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2014, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/title-ix-equality-of-mens-and-womens-sports-opportunities-in-education/685093/8 "2014-04-01T17:36:25Z")
> [@OneCentStamp](#): > > What about, as in the cases of major college football and men’s basketball, the sports are actually huge moneymakers for the schools? No problem for me. But if the sports program starts costing money instead of bringing it in, it should be discontinued. ---
**Author:** ![Ulf\_the\_Unwashed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/b4bc9f/32.png) [@Ulf\_the\_Unwashed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ulf_the_Unwashed)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2014, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/title-ix-equality-of-mens-and-womens-sports-opportunities-in-education/685093/9 "2014-04-01T17:55:57Z")
> [@OneCentStamp](#): > > What about, as in the cases of major college football and men’s basketball, the sports are actually huge moneymakers for the schools? It’s rarely that simple. Depending on how you wish to interpret the numbers–and how you choose which numbers to interpret to begin with–you can make a very good case that even among the top FB and BB programs, the programs very often cost the schools more money than they bring in. According to [22 college football programs made money in 2009-10, NCAA report says - al.com](http://www.al.com/sports/index.ssf/2011/06/22_college_football_programs_m.html), for instance, just 22 college football programs made money in 2009-2010–and just 14 did the previous year. Football, in particular, costs an enormous amount of money. ---
**Author:** ![Ulf\_the\_Unwashed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/b4bc9f/32.png) [@Ulf\_the\_Unwashed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ulf_the_Unwashed)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2014, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/title-ix-equality-of-mens-and-womens-sports-opportunities-in-education/685093/10 "2014-04-01T18:03:24Z")
Should add that some people think even 22 is too high a figure. Creative bookkeeping and all. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2014, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/title-ix-equality-of-mens-and-womens-sports-opportunities-in-education/685093/11 "2014-04-01T19:38:13Z")
And even if football might make money at some schools, sports as a whole never do. Why are we paying this fee, again? To support athletics. And why do we have athletics? Because they bring in so much money for the school. So why are we paying this fee? ---
**Author:** ![AHunter3](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ahunter3/32/368_2.png) [@AHunter3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AHunter3)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2014, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/title-ix-equality-of-mens-and-womens-sports-opportunities-in-education/685093/12 "2014-04-02T16:52:26Z")
I would be fine if all sports were absolutely and completely removed from schools forever. But let’s mark that as irrelevant… Existing colleges give athletic scholarships. Scholarships let people go to school who would otherwise not be able to afford it, or at least gives them a financial advantage over those who have to make other arrangements. Hence, Title IX is a good thing. No sexually disproportionate investment in sports. ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2014, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/title-ix-equality-of-mens-and-womens-sports-opportunities-in-education/685093/13 "2014-04-02T17:14:27Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > And even if football might make money at some schools, sports as a whole never do. Think of sports like landscaping. No, it doesn’t make money, but a good sports program makes the “college experience” better and makes your school more desirable than other schools without sports. Schools don’t simply exist to stuff facts into kids’ heads, they give children an opportunity to grow as people, become well rounded useful members of society. Sports is important for that. Yes, you can take it away from schools and let all sports be private. Perfect choice for keeping the riff raff out. Sports is good for both girls and boys, but given physiological differences, boys tend to be better at most sports, and will draw more interest (money) from people who like sport. School sports (esp. High School and below) do not exist for the benefit of spectators, it is for the benefit of the children, and all of the children should be equally served.