# To all Obama apologists on the economy. You need to go fuck yourself today. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 10, 2012, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-all-obama-apologists-on-the-economy-you-need-to-go-fuck-yourself-today/618390 "2012-04-10T18:01:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![sqweels](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f19dbf/32.png) [@sqweels](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sqweels)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2012, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-all-obama-apologists-on-the-economy-you-need-to-go-fuck-yourself-today/618390/101 "2012-04-10T23:37:46Z")
> [@Koxinga](#): > > As election day approaches, the economy continues to flounder along and one out of every six Americans remains unemployed or underemployed, I encourage you to redouble your efforts in getting this message out and educate voters about how they ought to feel about their crappy situations. If all Obama supporters take it to heart, I have some hope we will finally start to see things improve after November. Ah, but you see the flip side of “Obama apologists on the economy” are the Republicans who have been relentlessly campaigning on the idea the Obama is to blame for the bad economy. But: 1. Obama is _not_ to blame for the bad economy. 2. The economy is not as bad as it might have been. So while the Repubs have been able to convince people that Obama is to blame for a bad economy, they’ll be damned if he’ll get any credit for any improvements. > [@](#): > > 1. Whatever’s still wrong with the economy is the fault of the previous president. I submit that it’s a lot easier for a president to screw up an economy than it is to fix one. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2012, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-all-obama-apologists-on-the-economy-you-need-to-go-fuck-yourself-today/618390/102 "2012-04-10T23:52:27Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > Now, technically, a kid who apologizes to another kid for hitting him is also an apologist. Because you say so? No he isn’t. > [@](#): > > But when it comes to people being “apologists” for causes, etc., it takes on the flavor of what I said. I’m pretty sure you know that. And know what I meant. Words have meanings. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2012, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-all-obama-apologists-on-the-economy-you-need-to-go-fuck-yourself-today/618390/103 "2012-04-11T00:01:01Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > Because you say so? No he isn’t. You are correct. I originally used the word in a way that is commonly used, but I then added the thing about the kid, who is an “apologi_zer_”. I should have left the kid thing out of it. I was wrong about that. My apologies. 😉 > [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > Words have meanings. Ah, so all my work has not been for naught after all…;)😉 ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2012, 12:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-all-obama-apologists-on-the-economy-you-need-to-go-fuck-yourself-today/618390/104 "2012-04-11T00:26:31Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > You are correct. I originally used the word in a way that is commonly used Err…no. Words do have meanings, inasmuch as people use them in a particular way, but sometimes people use them according to the dictionary. You were chastising people who were using the dictionary denotation of the word because they weren’t using the connotation you attach to the word. That’s absurd. It’s fine to suggest that a word has certain connotations for you. But it’s silly to suggest that it has those same connotations for everyone, when the ultimate descriptivist device, the dictionary, disagrees. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2012, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-all-obama-apologists-on-the-economy-you-need-to-go-fuck-yourself-today/618390/105 "2012-04-11T00:49:08Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Err…no. Words do have meanings, inasmuch as people use them in a particular way, but sometimes people use them according to the dictionary. You were chastising people who were using the dictionary denotation of the word because they weren’t using the connotation you attach to the word. That’s absurd. No I don’t think I was. I was explaining how it was used in the OP. The word is often used imbued with the blind partisanship I described. Do you not agree with that? Do you not agree that the way I described it was the way it was being used in the OP. I mean, it seems to be a pretty common take on the word. ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Fun\_Ball](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_fun_ball/32/17664_2.png) [@Happy\_Fun\_Ball](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Fun_Ball)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2012, 1:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-all-obama-apologists-on-the-economy-you-need-to-go-fuck-yourself-today/618390/106 "2012-04-11T01:05:56Z")
I was laid off at the end of 2008 after close to a decade of wage stagnation. Since the 2008 election, I have had my salary grow more than in the previous 8 years and I have had my stock portfolio double. Thanks Obama. Of course, neither he nor Bush were responsible for any of the above, but that obviously does not stop any conservatives from being morons as demonstrated in this thread. ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2012, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-all-obama-apologists-on-the-economy-you-need-to-go-fuck-yourself-today/618390/107 "2012-04-11T01:06:48Z")
> [@Saint\_Cad](#): > > Now going into a third straight year of budget and staff cuts, the district staff at my school district have just been told about massive staff cuts (me included). Why don’t you pull some more numbers out of Obama’s ass (they’re in there next to your head) and explain again about how the economy is recovering and has been for some time. Explain how real unemployment has gone down. > > Look, the economy is in the shitter and everyone except you and your President know it. So out of respect for me being laid off for the second summer in a row (ya know, last hired = first fired), I order a 24 hour morotorium on any statement implying the economy has been getting better under your President. You’re complaining about getting fired from… a government job? And you’re blaming Obama? Elect one of these Republican yahoos who wants to defund education and see how THAT works out for you. Moron. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2012, 1:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-all-obama-apologists-on-the-economy-you-need-to-go-fuck-yourself-today/618390/108 "2012-04-11T01:19:07Z")
> [@Saint\_Cad](#): > > Look, the economy is in the shitter and everyone except you and your President know it. So out of respect for me being laid off for the second summer in a row (ya know, last hired = first fired), I order a 24 hour morotorium on any statement implying the economy has been getting better under your President. Oh, I wouldn’t dream of hinting. But I understand the economy has been getting wow-better under **your** president. ::d&r:: ---
**Author:** ![Truman\_Burbank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecc23a/32.png) [@Truman\_Burbank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Truman_Burbank)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2012, 1:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-all-obama-apologists-on-the-economy-you-need-to-go-fuck-yourself-today/618390/109 "2012-04-11T01:25:01Z")
to suggest that we recognize the complicated reality that the economy is getting better, but still isn’t where we want it? I don’t think anybody is saying “the economy is great!” as your strawman assertion suggests. In fact, the last time I heard anybody assert that it was Bush and McCain. Besides, I was given to understand that if an individual finds themselves unemployed it reflects either a defect of character or the bad choices they’ve made in their life… ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2012, 1:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-all-obama-apologists-on-the-economy-you-need-to-go-fuck-yourself-today/618390/110 "2012-04-11T01:34:29Z")
**Saint Cad** , what folks seem to be getting at is that you don’t seem to understand what the various parties stand for. You seem to be railing against the wrong person (Obama). As far as my limited knowledge goes, the Democrats generally like to see services provided for people, including those who cannot afford them. Education in particular is highly valued, and a publicly funded education system is seen as something that is good for the country. Democrats generally feel that tax rates should be set so that the public systems are well funded, and staffed appropriately by public employees (paid out of tax dollars). Republicans, on the other hand, have a different approach to both government employment and taxation. In general, they feel that taxes should be lower. Government should be smaller, and those who get a paycheck from a government source should be fewer in numbers. In general terms, Republicans would be cheering your downsizing (smaller government, less taxes), while Democrats would be not impressed with your downsizing (sacrificing public education for short-sighted gains of tax cuts). You seem to be confused about the part where Obama is a president with the Democrat party. His party is currently being fought tooth and nail by other branches of government controlled by the Republican Party. These branches are in agreement with what happened to you. Yet you rail against a Democrat president. You seem confused. ---
**Author:** ![PandaBear77](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/edb3f5/32.png) [@PandaBear77](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PandaBear77)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2012, 1:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-all-obama-apologists-on-the-economy-you-need-to-go-fuck-yourself-today/618390/111 "2012-04-11T01:38:26Z")
Saint Cad – I’m really sorry you’re going through this ☹ Seriously. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2012, 2:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-all-obama-apologists-on-the-economy-you-need-to-go-fuck-yourself-today/618390/112 "2012-04-11T02:07:44Z")
> [@Truman\_Burbank](#): > > to suggest that we recognize the complicated reality that the economy is getting better, but still isn’t where we want it? That is not too subtle or complicated to recognize, but it is too subtle and complicated to enjoy, therefore it is rejected and is a lie, shut up. ---
**Author:** ![Koxinga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/4af34b/32.png) [@Koxinga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Koxinga)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2012, 3:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-all-obama-apologists-on-the-economy-you-need-to-go-fuck-yourself-today/618390/113 "2012-04-11T03:12:23Z")
> [@Truman\_Burbank](#): > > to suggest that we recognize the complicated reality that the economy is getting better, but still isn’t where we want it? This is just the break the [del]Carter '80[/del] [del]Bush '92[/del] Obama '12 campaign has been waiting for! ---
**Author:** ![crypto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b3f665/32.png) [@crypto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crypto)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2012, 3:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-all-obama-apologists-on-the-economy-you-need-to-go-fuck-yourself-today/618390/114 "2012-04-11T03:52:24Z")
> [@DianaG](#): > > Couldn’ta happened to a nicer, more rational guy. Classy. I don’t know the OP or your history with him, but man… can’t you cut him a break for one day, instead of being a superior bitch? > [@Icarus](#): > > So let me get this straight - Obama issued you a layoff? Wow, that sucks. Does it ever end? The sarcasm! the wit! > [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > I support President Obama, the country is better off with him in the White House, and with any luck, the entire Republican Party will implode this November so we can finish what needs to be done to repair the damage caused by two terms of conservative misadventure. Tax cuts don’t create jobs. > > I hope that makes you feel better. OK, not really. The country is better with him in the white house? Cite? You can love yourself some Obama and you can love the fact that your guy got in (and a black man to boot! How liberal of you all!), but Obama has not done a bang up job on the economy. In fact, the economy sucks, and I think it may cost him the election later this year, regardless of what stiff suit the pubbies put up. > [@Koxinga](#): > > A smaller percentage of the workforce is classified as unemployed because the workforce is _shrinking_. If you include discouraged workers and those marginally attached to the labor force, the unemployment rate is still close to 10%. This is a very big part of it. But 10% figure is a joke. Just got my taxes done, and the woman who does them (and has been doing them for a decade now) said she has seen a surprising number of people come in with reduced incomes from last year, some of them being on unemployment the entire year. The fact is, when a person goes off the unemployment roles, he’s no longer visible by the system. So presto! Everyone can talk about how the economy is turning around, albeit slowly. The economy sucks. I don’t care what party you are affiliated with. You all need to pull your heads out of your asses and take a look around at your communities, friends and relations. If you are still lucky enough to be employed, I’m happy for you. This is beyond party politics at this point. > [@Cat\_Whisperer](#): > > When I hear things like the OP here, I am a little boggled - you think President Obama managed to dump the global economy in 2008, before he was even President? Wow, he really IS the most powerful man alive! What, he hasn’t completely fixed everything in three years, with the Republicans dragging their feet on every motion? I guess he’s completely useless then. > > ETA: And I really am sorry that you’re about to lose your job, **Saint Cad**. Regardless of the circumstances or the politics, that sucks. This sounds like any Republican rant when the Democrats run congress and the Repubs own the white house. It’s an exercise in futility. It’s just a finger pointing exercise that has grown old for me. I don’t blame Obama for the mess he inherited. I do blame him for the mess that is attributable to him, however. He certainly kept the Bush bailout/checkbook solution philosophy alive and well. When things get worse and worse, the masses tend to cling to their religion more. If Romney takes the Nomination, I’m guessing he’ll become much more overtly religious to the country than he is today. Santorum is already there. Obama will be spotted walking in and out of some house of religion on a more frequent basis. Sorry about your job loss. I don’t know who you are your your political affiliation (although based on the comments in the thread I can guess). I wish any and all of you best of luck in keeping your jobs, or finding one if you are on the bench. Personal note- I honestly don’t care who wins the WH this year. But whoever does, I’d like to see them stay out of another war, get us out of afghanistan, and let any investment bank that is heading for bankruptcy go down like Frasier vs. Ali. ---
**Author:** ![waterj2](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/858c86/32.png) [@waterj2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/waterj2)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2012, 3:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-all-obama-apologists-on-the-economy-you-need-to-go-fuck-yourself-today/618390/115 "2012-04-11T03:54:11Z")
Treating this as a political thread on public sector job losses, I figure it’s worth flagging [this article](http://www.thenation.com/article/167050/states-went-red-2010-massive-public-sector-job-losses-came-next) comparing states where Republicans took over in 2010 to the rest of the country: > [@](#): > > Nearly all of the job losses took place at the state and local level, and they were most severe in a handful of GOP-controlled states. In other words, erosion of public sector employment isn’t a problem affecting the entire country equally—it’s a problem in particular states, thanks to very particular legislators. [Here’s a pdf](http://www.rooseveltinstitute.org/sites/all/files/GOPProjectSlashingPublicWorkforce.pdf) of a research paper by the same authors with a little more data. I don’t know where **Saint Cad** lives, but perhaps he ought to look at a different level of government if he wants to bitch at government officials. Speaking as someone who defends Obama on the economy, at least as compared to the Republicans, we’ve been the ones saying that the government shouldn’t be firing public sector workers, so I don’t think we’re the top people to be telling to go fuck ourselves. ---
**Author:** ![waterj2](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/858c86/32.png) [@waterj2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/waterj2)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2012, 4:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-all-obama-apologists-on-the-economy-you-need-to-go-fuck-yourself-today/618390/116 "2012-04-11T04:07:23Z")
> [@Cheesesteak](#): > > Actually, if you look at the U6, which includes discouraged and marginally employed, it’s 14.5%, the lowest since Obama took office, down a half point since January, and down 2.5 points from its high of 17%. That rate is usually 7-8% when things are good, and jumped from 9 to 15% during Bush’s last year. > > Good? No, but it’s moving in the right direction. [Here’s a chart](http://www.democraticunderground.com/12518934) showing all measures of employment from U3 (the one generally referred to as “the unemployment rate”) to U6 declining slowly in tandem. ---
**Author:** ![Rachellelogram](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rachellelogram/32/8689_2.png) [@Rachellelogram](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rachellelogram)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2012, 4:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-all-obama-apologists-on-the-economy-you-need-to-go-fuck-yourself-today/618390/117 "2012-04-11T04:28:12Z")
You’d do better to blame your state legislature rather than the President–they’re the ones who determine education budgets, not the federal government. I’m sorry you lost your job, but I’m not seeing a correlation. Lots of people get laid off even in a booming economy. You’re a data point, not a statistic. ---
**Author:** ![rogerbox](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/76d3ee/32.png) [@rogerbox](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rogerbox)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2012, 5:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-all-obama-apologists-on-the-economy-you-need-to-go-fuck-yourself-today/618390/118 "2012-04-11T05:16:25Z")
Edit: I’m going to be nicer. Sorry you lost your job, but you need to re-think your OP because it does not do you any favors. ---
**Author:** ![splatterpunk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/3be4f8/32.png) [@splatterpunk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/splatterpunk)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2012, 5:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-all-obama-apologists-on-the-economy-you-need-to-go-fuck-yourself-today/618390/119 "2012-04-11T05:51:48Z")
> [@Stink Fish Pot](#): > > Classy. I don’t know the OP or your history with him, but man… can’t you cut him a break for one day, instead of being a superior bitch? Maybe if the OP wasn’t such a superior asshole. > [@](#): > > Does it ever end? The sarcasm! the wit! The brainless retort by **Stink Fish Pot**! > [@](#): > > The country is better with him in the white house? Cite? You can love yourself some Obama and you can love the fact that your guy got in (and a black man to boot! How liberal of you all!) And you hate the fact that a black man was elected president. How conservative of you! > [@](#): > > … , but Obama has not done a bang up job on the economy. In fact, the economy sucks, and I think it may cost him the election later this year, regardless of what stiff suit the pubbies put up. Wanna bet? > [@](#): > > This is a very big part of it. But 10% figure is a joke. Just got my taxes done, and the woman who does them… Jesus fucking Christ. What kind of stupid asshole are you if you can’t even do your own taxes? > [@](#): > > … (and has been doing them for a decade now) said she has seen a surprising number of people come in with reduced incomes from last year, some of them being on unemployment the entire year. Yeah, this is nothing new. So what? Ooohh, it must be the fault of that nigger in the White House. Is that your point? > [@](#): > > The fact is, when a person goes off the unemployment roles, he’s no longer visible by the system. So presto! Everyone can talk about how the economy is turning around, albeit slowly. The economy sucks. Wow. Someone has been listening to right wing talk radio and nothing else! > [@](#): > > I don’t care what party you are affiliated with. _snort_ Of course you don’t. > [@](#): > > This is beyond party politics at this point. Unless your name is **Stink Fish Pot** , in which case it’s _all_ about party politics. > [@](#): > > I don’t blame Obama for the mess he inherited. Yes, you do. > [@](#): > > When things get worse and worse, the masses tend to cling to their religion more. If Romney takes the Nomination, I’m guessing he’ll become much more overtly religious to the country than he is today. Santorum is already there. Obama will be spotted walking in and out of some house of religion on a more frequent basis. ??? So fucking what? > [@](#): > > Personal note- I honestly don’t care who wins the WH this year. Sure you don’t, pal. As long as he’s not some filthy Negro. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2012, 6:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-all-obama-apologists-on-the-economy-you-need-to-go-fuck-yourself-today/618390/120 "2012-04-11T06:33:46Z")
Did I miss the part where he said he had an objection to Obama’s complexion? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-all-obama-apologists-on-the-economy-you-need-to-go-fuck-yourself-today/618390.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-all-obama-apologists-on-the-economy-you-need-to-go-fuck-yourself-today/618390.md?page=7)