# To Boldly Go Where No Star Trek Franchise Has Gone Before **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [July 7, 2016, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-boldly-go-where-no-star-trek-franchise-has-gone-before/759315 "2016-07-07T15:43:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2016, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-boldly-go-where-no-star-trek-franchise-has-gone-before/759315/1 "2016-07-07T15:43:51Z")
[It will be revealed in _Star Trek Beyond_ that the character of Sulu is gay and that he and his partner are raising a child.](http://www.newsarama.com/30020-star-trek-beyond-reveals-franchise-s-first-openly-gay-established-character.html) First gay regular in any Star Trek franchise, I believe. ---
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2016, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-boldly-go-where-no-star-trek-franchise-has-gone-before/759315/2 "2016-07-07T15:51:41Z")
I’m glad it’s Sulu. That works as a nice homage to George Takei. ---
**Author:** ![ivylass](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/9de053/32.png) [@ivylass](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivylass)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2016, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-boldly-go-where-no-star-trek-franchise-has-gone-before/759315/3 "2016-07-07T15:52:58Z")
Very nice. IIRC Sulu has a daughter who shows up in one of the movies. This ties in nicely with precedent. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2016, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-boldly-go-where-no-star-trek-franchise-has-gone-before/759315/4 "2016-07-07T15:54:24Z")
Don’t know how Roddenberry actually felt about it, but if the times had been a little different a gay character would have made sense in his effort to have diverse characters on the show. I think if he had tried at the time the networks would have never allowed it. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2016, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-boldly-go-where-no-star-trek-franchise-has-gone-before/759315/5 "2016-07-07T16:04:29Z")
Considering the time frame, there was no way it would have been allowed except in the most vague terms. It wasn’t until the 1972 that gay characters were portrayed on TV, and not until 1975 that they were regulars in a series. I’d also be surprised if Roddenberry had thought of it, since gays were far outside the mainstream. ---
**Author:** ![Intergalactic\_Gladiator](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/intergalactic_gladiator/32/112_2.png) [@Intergalactic\_Gladiator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Intergalactic_Gladiator)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2016, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-boldly-go-where-no-star-trek-franchise-has-gone-before/759315/6 "2016-07-07T16:07:56Z")
I remember reading that Lt. Hawk in _First Contact_ was intended to be gay but a lot of his extra character development didn’t make it to the final movie. > **[Sexuality in Star Trek | Other examples](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexuality_in_Star_Trek#Other_examples)** > > 1.In the book A Stitch in Time and in an Amazon.com interview, the actor Andrew Robinson stated that he played Garak as being bisexual, while at other times he stated that he felt that Garak was pansexual, meaning that he loved people regardless of their gender. | > 2.In Star Trek Enterprise, Dr Phlox is in a polyamourous relationship with three wives. > **[Hawk (Lieutenant)](https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Hawk_(Lieutenant))** > > Hawk was a Human male who served as a Starfleet officer during the late-24th century. In 2373, he held the rank of lieutenant and was assigned to the USS Enterprise-E as the ship's conn officer. In that capacity, he served on the bridge of the ship... Star Trek has made efforts to include LGBT characters over the years but I think for the most part it’s been minor characters. Evil Major Kira was bi, but that was an alternate universe. ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2016, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-boldly-go-where-no-star-trek-franchise-has-gone-before/759315/7 "2016-07-07T16:46:49Z")
Just heard this today. Yay! From what I read, George Takei pitched the idea to Roddenberry and he was more or less hip to it, as he liked tackling social justice issues but it’s tricky business on television. Kirk’s white/black kiss with Uhura got censored in the south and ratings dropped. You have to be careful not to go too far or you won’t have a show to say anything. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2016, 5:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-boldly-go-where-no-star-trek-franchise-has-gone-before/759315/8 "2016-07-07T17:09:18Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > Don’t know how Roddenberry actually felt about it, but if the times had been a little different a gay character would have made sense in his effort to have diverse characters on the show. I think if he had tried at the time the networks would have never allowed it. They tried many times in Star Trek, and it never really got anywhere until DS9. And then it had to be women and connected with some alien stuff where they were different sexes in the past. And they were bisexual, not gay. There’s this guy watching Star Trek for the first time who wrote a [review](http://markwatches.net/reviews/2016/06/mark-watches-deep-space-nine-s04e06-rejoined/) on it, and how refreshing it is for him, as a gay man, to finally see Star Trek actually tackle it, and not shy away. Jadzia Dax is canon bisexual. And not from some evil universe or something. ---
**Author:** ![panache45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/panache45/32/64_2.png) [@panache45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panache45)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2016, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-boldly-go-where-no-star-trek-franchise-has-gone-before/759315/9 "2016-07-07T17:32:08Z")
All I can say is, it’s about time! And for it to be Sulu is a wonderful tribute to Takei. ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2016, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-boldly-go-where-no-star-trek-franchise-has-gone-before/759315/10 "2016-07-07T17:40:45Z")
It is a nice touch, and I like the tribute aspect. Now hopefully they can make a Trek movie that doesn’t suck to include this reveal in … 😃 ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2016, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-boldly-go-where-no-star-trek-franchise-has-gone-before/759315/11 "2016-07-07T17:43:08Z")
> [@Malthus](#): > > Now hopefully they can make a Trek movie \*\*\*that doesn’t suck \*\*\*to include this reveal in … 😃 We may see Warp Drive before that happens. ---
**Author:** ![Merneith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/57b2e6/32.png) [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2016, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-boldly-go-where-no-star-trek-franchise-has-gone-before/759315/12 "2016-07-07T17:54:23Z")
I assume that Sulu, like Dumbledore, was always gay. And also because it still cracks me up - [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/7ZWaWrvJ7nA/maxresdefault.jpg "Star Trek: Tik Tok") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ZWaWrvJ7nA) ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2016, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-boldly-go-where-no-star-trek-franchise-has-gone-before/759315/13 "2016-07-07T18:43:50Z")
> [@Merneith](#): > > I assume that Sulu, like Dumbledore, was always gay. Well, the current movies are _Star Trek_ Alternate Universe, though, after the time-travel reboot. Let’s see, if Young Sulu entered the storyline before the reboot then he was presumably the same character as the Original Series Sulu, which means that if he’s gay now then he was presumably always gay starting with Original Series, but perhaps in the Original Series storyline he didn’t have a partner or child? Annnnd, now I’ve confused myself. I got nothin’. ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2016, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-boldly-go-where-no-star-trek-franchise-has-gone-before/759315/14 "2016-07-07T19:04:04Z")
Though if they really want to honor George Takei I think they should give John Cho a hot sex scene with his partner, played by Channing Tatum, but in green Orion makeup. Further, I think it’s what Gene would have wanted. ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2016, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-boldly-go-where-no-star-trek-franchise-has-gone-before/759315/15 "2016-07-07T19:18:01Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > Let’s see, if Young Sulu entered the storyline before the reboot then he was presumably the same character as the Original Series Sulu… That’s… not how this reboot works. These are all different characters than the Original Series versions, in a different universe. ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2016, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-boldly-go-where-no-star-trek-franchise-has-gone-before/759315/16 "2016-07-07T19:21:08Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > Well, the current movies are _Star Trek_ Alternate Universe, though, after the time-travel reboot. > > Let’s see, if Young Sulu entered the storyline before the reboot then he was presumably the same character as the Original Series Sulu, which means that if he’s gay now then he was presumably always gay starting with Original Series, but perhaps in the Original Series storyline he didn’t have a partner or child? Annnnd, now I’ve confused myself. I got nothin’. Sulu’s daughter was revealed in the movie _Generations_, so it’s canon that he had a daughter in the original timeline. They never definitely said if Sulu’s partner was a man or a woman, though. Although same-sex marriage wouldn’t be considered controversial or remarkable by the 23rd century. ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2016, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-boldly-go-where-no-star-trek-franchise-has-gone-before/759315/17 "2016-07-07T19:22:20Z")
> [@Peremensoe](#): > > That’s… not how this reboot works. These are all different characters than the Original Series versions, in a different universe. I recall Uhura almost breaking the 4th wall when she stated that things in their universe could be completely different. ---
**Author:** ![Death\_of\_Rats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a6a055/32.png) [@Death\_of\_Rats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Death_of_Rats)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2016, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-boldly-go-where-no-star-trek-franchise-has-gone-before/759315/18 "2016-07-07T19:32:20Z")
> [@Peremensoe](#): > > That’s… not how this reboot works. These are all different characters than the Original Series versions, in a different universe. …except for Old Spock… ---
**Author:** ![Merneith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/57b2e6/32.png) [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2016, 8:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-boldly-go-where-no-star-trek-franchise-has-gone-before/759315/19 "2016-07-07T20:09:55Z")
Yeah, I’m assuming that Sulu is always gay, just like Spock is always half-Vulcan, Scotty is always Scottish and Uhuru is still black. James T. Kirk is still aggressively heterosexual. There’s no reason that this Sulu isn’t the real Sulu. Man, I hate time travel stories. > [@Sampiro](#): > > Though if they really want to honor George Takei I think they should give John Cho a hot sex scene with his partner, played by Channing Tatum, but in green Orion makeup. Further, I think it’s what Gene would have wanted. I think it’s what we all would have wanted. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2016, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-boldly-go-where-no-star-trek-franchise-has-gone-before/759315/20 "2016-07-07T21:12:02Z")
> [@Peremensoe](#): > > That’s… not how this reboot works. These are all different characters than the Original Series versions, in a different universe. Oh right. Um, I forget why? Is it because the timeline-disruption reboot actually happened with Kirk’s **dad** , before most of the main characters were born? I told you I was confused. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-boldly-go-where-no-star-trek-franchise-has-gone-before/759315.md?page=2)