# To my friend on FaceBook who has been spewing anti-healthcare-reform messages for the past 6 months **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 4, 2009, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-my-friend-on-facebook-who-has-been-spewing-anti-healthcare-reform-messages-for-the-past-6-months/516277 "2009-11-04T14:13:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![you\_with\_the\_face](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2009, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-my-friend-on-facebook-who-has-been-spewing-anti-healthcare-reform-messages-for-the-past-6-months/516277/61 "2009-11-04T23:38:13Z")
> [@Labrador\_Deceiver](#): > > False. The former example does not take into consideration the taxes taken from those who do not support healthcare, while the latter is actually done out of a desire to do something nice. Your statement is factually incorrect. This is my take: I wouldn’t want _any person_ to have to beg for money just so they or a loved one can receive medical care. Not even my worst enemy. I’d rather them keep their dignity, perserve their sanity, and focus their energy on something better (um, like their health) than street hustling for nickles and dimes. Would your rather people go through this rigamorole just so you can save a few dollars in taxes? How is this kind? ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2009, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-my-friend-on-facebook-who-has-been-spewing-anti-healthcare-reform-messages-for-the-past-6-months/516277/62 "2009-11-04T23:40:51Z")
> [@you\_with\_the\_face](#): > > This is my take: I wouldn’t want _any person_ to have to beg for money just so they or a loved one can receive medical care. Not even my worst enemy. I’d rather them keep their dignity, perserve their sanity, and focus their energy on something better (um, like their health) than street hustling for nickles and dimes. > > Would your rather people go through this rigamorole just so you can save a few dollars in taxes? How is this kind? That has nothing to do with the statement I challenged. I am in favor of healthcare reform, but I am not in favor of ridiculous statements. You may prefer to do things one way, while others may not. Or, others may prefer to take their chances. Or they can ignore the problem and hope it never happens to them. None of that changes the fact that successful taxation depends upon the contribution of people who do not want to contribute. ---
**Author:** ![Lightnin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lightnin/32/180_2.png) [@Lightnin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lightnin)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2009, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-my-friend-on-facebook-who-has-been-spewing-anti-healthcare-reform-messages-for-the-past-6-months/516277/63 "2009-11-04T23:50:20Z")
> [@Sateryn76](#): > > Seriously, the amount of Obama knob-slobbing vs. Right Wing blather I see on Facebook is ridiculously slanted toward the Left. It seems that when a Lefty posts their latest “Save the Children/Environment/Poor/Downtrodden” petition, it’s no big deal, because it’s the correct position, and all of the “GWB Eats a Dick” parody videos are nothing but hilarious. See, now that’s really strange. 'Cause I’m looking at the list of “hot polls” on Facebook right now, and we’ve got such gems as: Do you support Gay Marriage? _68% Yes (This, actually, surprised me.)_ Is the word “Christmas” offensive and should it be banned from phrases like “Merry Christmas” and should a Christmas tree be called a holiday tree? _65% No, I am not a Christian and it does not bother me._ Should a man have a say in whether or not his unborn baby is aborted? _69% Yes_ Should Balloon Boy’s parents go to jail? _74% Yes_ Do you hate the new Facebook News Feed? _87% Yes_ Will you take the vaccine for the H1N1 Flu? _79% No_ Do you believe Jesus is the Son of God, and that He suffered on the cross to pay for your sins? _67% Yes_ Do you think Global Warming is a Myth? _52% Yes_ What do you trust more, science or the bible? _52% Bible_ If a child dies from illness because the parents relied on prayer instead of modern medicine, should they be convicted on criminal charges? _70% Yes_ Should Americans be able to drink alcohol at the age of 18? _56% Yes_ If you were exiled from whatever country you live in now, where would you move? _18% Australia_ Should vulgar language be automatically blanked out by Facebook? _67% No_ Do you believe that individuals should be responsible for the consequences of their actions? _98% Yes_ Do you support Gay Marriage? (Repeat) _58% Yes_ Could you live without a cell phone? _54% Yes_ Should smoking be illegal? _57% No_ Movie Scenario: Push one little button and get 1 million dollars and walk away, there is one catch someone in the world will die. Would You Push That Button? _39% No way, no how_ Should the Obama Administration shut down Fox news? _68% It’s Unconstitutional_ Which President would you like to have in office now? _52% Ronald Reagan_ Should pot be legal in the USA? _72% Yes_ Do you smoke? _75% No_ Do YOU believe in GOD? _67% Yes_ Is our universe a product of the Big Bang or was it created by God? _49% God_ With the exception of the Gay Marriage issue, and possibly the Marijuana Legality issue, everything else is decidedly slanted to the Right. Congratulations, you’ve just demonstrated selective perception. ---
**Author:** ![you\_with\_the\_face](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2009, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-my-friend-on-facebook-who-has-been-spewing-anti-healthcare-reform-messages-for-the-past-6-months/516277/64 "2009-11-04T23:52:43Z")
> [@Labrador\_Deceiver](#): > > None of that changes the fact that successful taxation depends upon the contribution of people who do not want to contribute. So freaking what? That’s Taxation 101. You aren’t saying anything new by pointing this out. ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2009, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-my-friend-on-facebook-who-has-been-spewing-anti-healthcare-reform-messages-for-the-past-6-months/516277/65 "2009-11-05T00:07:37Z")
> [@you\_with\_the\_face](#): > > So freaking what? That’s Taxation 101. You aren’t saying anything new by pointing this out. Pay attention to the thread, and you won’t look so stupid in the future. I am not offering up any earth-shattering news, I am refuting the idea that taxation can accurately be referred to as “the kindness of strangers”. If the statement I made in post #62 is so obvious to you, then you’ve already contradicted yourself. ---
**Author:** ![whole\_bean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/96bed5/32.png) [@whole\_bean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whole_bean)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2009, 12:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-my-friend-on-facebook-who-has-been-spewing-anti-healthcare-reform-messages-for-the-past-6-months/516277/66 "2009-11-05T00:27:10Z")
> [@Labrador\_Deceiver](#): > > Pay attention to the thread, and you won’t look so stupid in the future. I am not offering up any earth-shattering news, I am refuting the idea that taxation can accurately be referred to as “the kindness of strangers”. > > If the statement I made in post #62 is so obvious to you, then you’ve already contradicted yourself. Let’ see, who is ultimately responsible for the tax laws? The voting citizenry (mostly strangers to you and me). Could the motivation for these laws be, at least in part, a sort of kindness? I see that as part of my motivation for supportiong tax funded services. So “kindness of strangers,” though a bit hoaky and hyperbolic, is still not as absurd as you make it sound, certainly not as absurd as marauders. ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2009, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-my-friend-on-facebook-who-has-been-spewing-anti-healthcare-reform-messages-for-the-past-6-months/516277/67 "2009-11-05T00:31:28Z")
> [@whole\_bean](#): > > Let’ see, who is ultimately responsible for the tax laws? The voting citizenry (mostly strangers to you and me). Could the motivation for these laws be, at least in part, a sort of kindness? I see that as part of my motivation for supportiong tax funded services. So “kindness of strangers,” though a bit hoaky and hyperbolic, is still not as absurd as you make it sound, certainly not as absurd as marauders. It is totally absurd, and factually incorrect. All taxes come, in part, from people who are unwilling to pay them. The Iraqi war was not funded through the kindness of strangers. Sentors’ salaries are not paid by the kindness of strangers. ---
**Author:** ![whole\_bean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/96bed5/32.png) [@whole\_bean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whole_bean)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2009, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-my-friend-on-facebook-who-has-been-spewing-anti-healthcare-reform-messages-for-the-past-6-months/516277/68 "2009-11-05T00:55:46Z")
> [@Labrador\_Deceiver](#): > > It is totally absurd, and factually incorrect. All taxes come, in part, from people who are unwilling to pay them. The Iraqi war was not funded through the kindness of strangers. Sentors’ salaries are not paid by the kindness of strangers. you do understand that tax laws aren’t handed down from on high, that with enough of your like-minded voting-age friends, taxes can be eliminated? you know that right? the fact that taxes haven’t been eliminated most likely means that a larger portion of strangers are either ok or indifferent to taxes and the related expenditures. the ones that are ok with taxes, those are the kind strangers. the collective society that endorses the system, it is the collection of kind strangers. ---
**Author:** ![Sateryn76](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a88e4f/32.png) [@Sateryn76](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sateryn76)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2009, 12:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-my-friend-on-facebook-who-has-been-spewing-anti-healthcare-reform-messages-for-the-past-6-months/516277/69 "2009-11-05T00:56:09Z")
> [@Lightnin](#): > > See, now that’s really strange. 'Cause I’m looking at the list of “hot polls” on Facebook right now, and we’ve got such gems as: > > …snip… Okay, well, I can’t even find a place to see the “Hot Polls” so I can’t comment on that. And, I don’t really care to participate in such unscientific polling, so I ignore those types of things. What I’m talking about is the seemingly constant “status updates” that contain some kind of call to action or defense of a position, which contain only those positions of my “friends”. The vast majority I see are generally considered Lefty, like when Obama won the Nobel, or that awfully annoying “If you believe someone shouldn’t die from having no health care (or whatever it was)”. That’s what I see most often. ---
**Author:** ![whole\_bean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/96bed5/32.png) [@whole\_bean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whole_bean)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2009, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-my-friend-on-facebook-who-has-been-spewing-anti-healthcare-reform-messages-for-the-past-6-months/516277/70 "2009-11-05T00:57:59Z")
> [@Sateryn76](#): > > Okay, well, I can’t even find a place to see the “Hot Polls” so I can’t comment on that. And, I don’t really care to participate in such unscientific polling, so I ignore those types of things. > > What I’m talking about is the seemingly constant “status updates” that contain some kind of call to action or defense of a position, which contain only those positions of my “friends”. The vast majority I see are generally considered Lefty, like when Obama won the Nobel, or that awfully annoying “If you believe someone shouldn’t die from having no health care (or whatever it was)”. That’s what I see most often. these are the friends you’re counting on populating your spaghetti dinner? ---
**Author:** ![Sateryn76](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a88e4f/32.png) [@Sateryn76](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sateryn76)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2009, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-my-friend-on-facebook-who-has-been-spewing-anti-healthcare-reform-messages-for-the-past-6-months/516277/71 "2009-11-05T01:01:34Z")
> [@Bosstone](#): > > If it makes you feel better, taxes are nothing like asking for help. Not even close. > > Frankly I would be mortified if I had to dump my medical emergency bills on my family. That shit’s expensive. So, you admit that asking for help would be embarrassing, and you’d rather get help from faceless strangers, so you can save face in front of your loved ones? Like it or not, having expenses paid by taxes is “help” You’d rather inflict economic pain on total strangers who owe you nothing, than ask for help from people who care about you, and would often be happy to help? So, taxation is actually better than charity? Your ego is more important than job loss, economic stagnation and wasting dollars on government administration. :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2009, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-my-friend-on-facebook-who-has-been-spewing-anti-healthcare-reform-messages-for-the-past-6-months/516277/72 "2009-11-05T01:02:46Z")
> [@whole\_bean](#): > > you do understand that tax laws aren’t handed down from on high, that with enough of your like-minded voting-age friends, taxes can be eliminated? you know that right? the fact that taxes haven’t been eliminated most likely means that a larger portion of strangers are either ok or indifferent to taxes and the related expenditures. the ones that are ok with taxes, those are the kind strangers. the collective society that endorses the system, it is the collection of kind strangers. Nope. It is a collection of people who believe that the particular tax is necessary, or that it improve upon society as a whole. Kindness doesn’t enter into it. We don’t have Senators out of kindness. We don’t fight wars out of kindness. If people all vote for healthcare reform, or No Child Left Behind because they think it will make their individual lives better, then kindness has nothing to do with it. Regardless, we were talking about a charity event vs. taxation. To think that it is _more_ appropriate to think of the _latter_ as an act of kindness is intellectually dishonest. ---
**Author:** ![Gala\_Matrix\_Fire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4da419/32.png) [@Gala\_Matrix\_Fire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gala_Matrix_Fire)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2009, 1:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-my-friend-on-facebook-who-has-been-spewing-anti-healthcare-reform-messages-for-the-past-6-months/516277/73 "2009-11-05T01:05:19Z")
> [@Merijeek](#): > > But the parents will be grateful, and the warm fuzzy that lasts until they actually do the math is worth more than all the insurance in the world! I’m starting to think this is the crux of the matter for those opposed to health care reform: if more people detect preventable diseases before it’s too late, there will be fewer opportunities to bask in the warm glow of righteousness you get after donating twenty bucks towards painkilling medicine that help dull the physical torment of the last months of someone’s life. Yay. ---
**Author:** ![whole\_bean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/96bed5/32.png) [@whole\_bean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whole_bean)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2009, 1:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-my-friend-on-facebook-who-has-been-spewing-anti-healthcare-reform-messages-for-the-past-6-months/516277/74 "2009-11-05T01:07:33Z")
> [@Labrador\_Deceiver](#): > > Nope. It is a collection of people who believe that the particular tax is necessary, or that it improve upon society as a whole. Kindness doesn’t enter into it. We don’t have Senators out of kindness. We don’t fight wars out of kindness. If people all vote for healthcare reform, or No Child Left Behind because they think it will make their individual lives better, then kindness has nothing to do with it. > > Regardless, we were talking about a charity event vs. taxation. To think that it is _more_ appropriate to think of the _latter_ as an act of kindness is intellectually dishonest. We’re not talking about taxes being used to fund wars or pay salaries as acts of kindness, we’re talking about implementing universal healthcare - I am telling you right now that there is at least one person (me) who supports universal healthcare, _in part_, out of kindness. I sure as hell don’t need it. None of my family needs it. It’s absence means better business for me, but I support it. I’ve given you one example of a tiny percentage of a tax dollar that could be borne of kindness. You’re wrong to say the claim is factually inaccurate. ---
**Author:** ![whole\_bean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/96bed5/32.png) [@whole\_bean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whole_bean)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2009, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-my-friend-on-facebook-who-has-been-spewing-anti-healthcare-reform-messages-for-the-past-6-months/516277/75 "2009-11-05T01:10:40Z")
> [@Sateryn76](#): > > Your ego is more important than job loss, economic stagnation and wasting dollars on government administration. :dubious: which of these is caused by UHC? ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2009, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-my-friend-on-facebook-who-has-been-spewing-anti-healthcare-reform-messages-for-the-past-6-months/516277/76 "2009-11-05T01:17:10Z")
> [@Gala\_Matrix\_Fire](#): > > I’m starting to think this is the crux of the matter for those opposed to health care reform: if more people detect preventable diseases before it’s too late, there will be fewer opportunities to bask in the warm glow of righteousness you get after donating twenty bucks towards painkilling medicine that help dull the physical torment of the last months of someone’s life. Yay. This is starting to describe Americans more and more, it seems to me. People who care about warm fuzzies more than actual results. How else to explain Glenn Beck, homeopathy, bountiful but malnutritious food, jingoism, “equal time”, and on and on… ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2009, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-my-friend-on-facebook-who-has-been-spewing-anti-healthcare-reform-messages-for-the-past-6-months/516277/77 "2009-11-05T01:23:08Z")
> [@whole\_bean](#): > > We’re not talking about taxes being used to fund wars or pay salaries as acts of kindness, we’re talking about implementing universal healthcare - I am telling you right now that there is at least one person (me) who supports universal healthcare, _in part_, out of kindness. And you couldn’t fund it alone. Therefore, it is not funded out of acts of kindness. ---
**Author:** ![whole\_bean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/96bed5/32.png) [@whole\_bean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whole_bean)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2009, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-my-friend-on-facebook-who-has-been-spewing-anti-healthcare-reform-messages-for-the-past-6-months/516277/78 "2009-11-05T01:28:26Z")
> [@Labrador\_Deceiver](#): > > And you couldn’t fund it alone. Therefore, it is not funded out of acts of kindness. jesus man, what part of “in part” eludes you? If something is funded 50% with donations and 50% with revenue, it is funded with donations, _in part_. It’s still fukcing funded with donations (along with revenue). To say it is funded with donations is accurate, though incomplete, but accurate nonetheless. ---
**Author:** ![MysteryFellow63427](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a88e4f/32.png) [@MysteryFellow63427](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MysteryFellow63427)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2009, 1:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-my-friend-on-facebook-who-has-been-spewing-anti-healthcare-reform-messages-for-the-past-6-months/516277/79 "2009-11-05T01:34:59Z")
> [@Equipoise](#): > > No fucking kidding. Why do people tiptoe around telling these people what idiots they are (perhaps more politely than that)? Why are they even on your friends list? Someone like that would last about 2 seconds on my friend’s list. Well, they wouldn’t be on my friend’s list in the first place, because I don’t know any people like that, but if someone suddenly went brain-damaged and started ranting like that, they’d be gone as fast as I could click the Remove button. > > These assholes-on-Facebook threads boggle my mind. Facebook status updates (on political issues) are the new bumper stickers. Some people will agree, some people will disagree, and many people will think you’re a moron or an asshole. ---
**Author:** ![woodstockbirdybird](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/woodstockbirdybird/32/7905_2.png) [@woodstockbirdybird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/woodstockbirdybird)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2009, 1:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-my-friend-on-facebook-who-has-been-spewing-anti-healthcare-reform-messages-for-the-past-6-months/516277/80 "2009-11-05T01:44:58Z")
> [@Sateryn76](#): > > You’d rather inflict economic pain on total strangers who owe you nothing, than ask for help from people who care about you, and would often be happy to help? So, taxation is actually better than charity? Your ego is more important than job loss, economic stagnation and wasting dollars on government administration. :dubious: You’d have to prove to me that UHC would “inflict economic pain”. From what I can see, Canada and Western Europe manage to maintain a fairly high standard of living. Anyway, I could just as easily accuse the other side of inflicting _physical_ pain to others due to greed and fear of nanny government. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-my-friend-on-facebook-who-has-been-spewing-anti-healthcare-reform-messages-for-the-past-6-months/516277.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/to-my-friend-on-facebook-who-has-been-spewing-anti-healthcare-reform-messages-for-the-past-6-months/516277.md?page=5)